[FR] 2nd date k-close and 3rd date no k-close with HB7

theawesomeone · 2011-05-17T21:14:55+00:00

You're totally fine. I see nothing wrong with anything besides you being way too outcome dependant, and over analyzing everything, which means being in your head way too much. She's in a dating frame, which is normal. You're in a I need to quickly escalate to sex frame. Which is normal, for a club hooch. Relax, she seems like a cool girl, and she seems into you. Just because you didn't Fuck her when she went into your room to change out of her scrubs does not mean you failed. Just remember to have fun, lead the interaction, be high value, draw her into your life. Do things that promote positive emotions and fun. Don't judge your rate of escalation by absolute standards. Push forward until she pushes back, rinse and repeat. Whatever pace this ends up being is fine. More importantly, be in the moment and enjoy whatever you guys do together. If you're always focusing on now I should do this, ok now this, that's when she'll feel like you're being weird or try hard.

intjpua · 2011-05-17T18:59:22+00:00

You've been friendzoned, friend.

Nearly all the things you're calling mistakes in your FR probably aren't that important in the big picture. But, not escalating from the first date definitely is important, and you obviously didn't do it, since your kiss came on the second date. First kiss should generally come an hour or two into the first date, long before the date is over. I say "generally", because some cases are special...I did a field report about a girl that it took me several instances of going out as friends, and "not a date" meetings, to get to the first kiss and even longer to get to sex...but she'd had a sexual assault in her past and was fucked up because of it. But it's usually safe to assume this is not the case, if a girl is on an actual date with you and she hasn't revealed any emotional problems that require you to go slow. I don't see any reason to think this is true with this girl. First kiss probably shouldn't be a heavy makeout...just establishing the pace of the relationship (whirlwind romance is the feeling you want to engender here).

So, you're focused on a lot of stuff that doesn't really matter that much, while missing the really vital stuff.

For example, you can be flexible if you need to be when setting up dates. Just don't be too available/needy, and remember the frame is that you're time is in demand and that you are assertive and can take the lead. So, if you need to let her set the time to make the date happen, that's fine; you can pick the place (and you can even ask if she can make it to said place at that time). This is not where you broke the attraction.

It doesn't matter if she drives. I don't own a car. I get laid all the time after the girl drives me around. This is not where you broke the attraction.

So, here's the deal: She likes you, or thinks she should like you and is trying to power through until she actually likes you. We know one of those things is true because she keeps going out with you. But, she isn't sexually attracted to you. We know that's true because she "doesn't kiss on the 2nd date". This chick (like every other chick) will have sex on the first date, if the attraction is strong enough. That's not to say if she doesn't have sex with you on the first date, there is no attraction; just that it may not be strong enough, and it will build with time.

I don't think she was looking for a hookup when she changed out of her scrubs, but I do think your energy was probably wrong and it further hurt attraction. This was a case where you probably should have been less available; if you know you're no good in the morning, and she set all the terms of engagement, it's probably a recipe for reduced attraction.

To salvage the situation, the first thing I thought of was just, 'hey, I'm just saying hi, at least gimme a hug'.

Ouch. This did not salvage the situation. This is you accepting the friendzone consolation prize. When a girl refuses a kiss, don't make it awkward and don't make it a big deal, and never apologize or explain yourself. I just say, "No? OK." and move on as though nothing happened.

The problems in your game are almost certainly in the minutiae of your in-person interactions with her, rather than any specific tactic you didn't implement. I'm guessing you were tense, nervous, and not aggressive enough early on. Now that you've had three dates, with basically no sexual contact (even the successful kissing was forced and awkward), you're starting from less than zero with this girl. She might still like you, but I'm thinking it's more of a friendly liking, which is harder to build into a sexual relationship than going from first meeting to sex with a new girl. In short, if you want a sexual relationship with someone, I suspect you can get there faster by going outside and meeting someone new than continuing to pursue this girl.

So...you're doing right by going out with other girls. You need more practice, more confidence, and better calibration. If she's the girl you really want, you'll need to step up your game to get her. What you've done so far has resulted in negative gains...you're further away from sex with her than on your first date. If she's not the girl you really want but you still enjoy spending time with her, put her into second string status, and invite her out less often and prioritize other girls you like more.

It's not all bad, though. You've gotten a lot of practice. You'll do better next time because of it.

frogma · 2011-05-17T17:28:58+00:00

Also I was too goal orientated in thinking we had to get to breakfast, rather than chilling out at our place and talking some more, since we were talking about my place (I have roommates). Third mistake was that I guided her into my room for her to change, but didn't stay to show her random things in the room and then to see if I could k-close (or maybe f-close) her then.

Ouch dude. I bet you could've done something there. Lead her into the room, chat for a bit, sit on the bed while you're doing it, get her on the bed with you or something.

Then she said that she doesn't usually kiss on the 2nd date

That's a lie.

I think you were just too timid and the escalation was virtually nonexistent. Might as well hang out with her again, but completely change direction this time. Kino early and often, push/pull and physical push/pull, tease her and shit, then make something happen before the end of the night. I'd rather have her come "hang out" instead of going on a date.

mada_wakarimasen · 2011-05-17T18:20:45+00:00

She came over to my place first, in order to change out of the scrubs. My first mistake was not being 'in state', and being more energetic in the morning (though it wasn't too bad, but it didn't help). Also I was too goal orientated in thinking we had to get to breakfast, rather than chilling out at our place and talking some more, since we were talking about my place (I have roommates). Third mistake was that I guided her into my room for her to change, but didn't stay to show her random things in the room and then to see if I could k-close (or maybe f-close) her then. By the time she came out and changed, she seemed geared up to eat.

Thanks for breaking this down like that. It is important to learn from mistakes, so just know more for next time.

stayhigh · 2011-05-17T18:41:42+00:00

"Between the first and 2nd date, I sent her some texts, joking about whether she's come up with a nickname for me when talking about me to her friends..."

Supplicative. Don't do things like this.

jamonman · 2011-05-17T20:19:43+00:00

[permanently deleted]

yokhai · 2011-05-17T21:34:21+00:00

You are moving too slowly and the girl is loosing interest. Up your wow factor next time. Shock and awe my brother.

Whisper · 2011-05-17T22:13:46+00:00

Mistake number four could have been that I paid for brunch. She pouted a little, and then put away her wallet.

I like to deal with this by saying "We'll take it in turns. You pay next time" (and then holding her to that).

This breaks you out of the frame of a provider (because she's paying her share) without making you look cheap by splitting a cheque, and also shows confidence because you assume there will be a next time.

2011-05-18T07:05:37+00:00

She said she felt a little awkward, and I asserted that I didn't feel awkward at all (good or bad move, I don't know).

I think you should have approached this as an incongruence in your frames.

She feels awkward, so you should say something that implies resonance between your two states (e.g. "I didn't before, but now I definitely do."), then rebuild to a more comfortable state.

Title	[FR] 2nd date k-close and 3rd date no k-close with HB7
Author	jamonman
Upvotes	8
Comments	14
Date	May 17, 2011 4:58 PM UTC (15 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/seduction
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/seduction/comments/hdhlw/fr_2nd_date_kclose_and_3rd_date_no_kclose_with_hb7/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/seduction/fr-2nd-date-k-close-and-3rd-date-no-k-close-with.1318357 https://theredarchive.com/post/1318357

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