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AOC called out for divisive comments about patriarchy and anti-masculinity after Texas school shooting

Heavy_Grand2526

May 31, 2022

176 upvotes

/r/MensRights

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Post Information

Title	AOC called out for divisive comments about patriarchy and anti-masculinity after Texas school shooting
Author	Heavy_Grand2526
Upvotes	176
Comments	108
Date	May 31, 2022 10:34 PM UTC (4 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/v2229y/aoc_called_out_for_divisive_comments_about/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/aoc-called-out-for-divisive-comments-about.1117814 https://theredarchive.com/post/1117814

Comments

[–]throwawayincelacc 76 points77 points78 points 4 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

[–]Smooth_Ad_7227 31 points32 points33 points 4 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

It's really important that we understand the roots of this,' she said.

'The vast majority of mass shooters are young men that have a very troubling history with women almost every single time.

'There is violence against women that immediately predates the you know this violence. This shooter in Texas, shot his own grandmother.

'We've seen a pattern here with this.'

Check on the men in your life,' she said, 'Seriously because there's, it just feels like there's very few role models and examples of people talking about this in healthy ways.

'And it's a big problem because there are a lot of crises.

'And especially as we try to evolve out of a world that is predatory on women, gay, non-binary and trans-people because traditional regressive, you know patriarchal values, ... and uplift men's identity in relation to other things in relation to like, how women treat them, how much stuff they have.'

Young men, she said, were being radicalized in new ways.

'But there is such a thing as healthy masculinity that is not rooted in the subjugation of other people,' she said.

It's not just gun violence,' she said.

'There's so many different areas and issues where all of us agree - if not all, an overwhelming amount of us agree. And Congress still can't get their s*** together.

'It's really hard, and it's super frustrating. And it's frustrating for you.

'It's frustrating for me being a part of this. And I don't want to be one of those ding dongs that just tells you to vote harder because the solution is a lot bigger than that and it's going to take a lot more of us and from us to fix this.'

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The patriarchy means that it's men who have most of the power. Money generally equals power but I'm willing to set that aside. In the US the president has never been a woman. Only recently has the Vice President been a woman. Congress is mostly men. The Supreme Court is mostly men although it will only be a one person majority soon . Now before anyone says it yes "Brick layers are all men." Who's at the bottom doesn't change who's at the top. If men have the majority of the power it's considered a patriarchy as far as I understand. That's all I'm saying.

If you look at the top 0.001% and claim these people are "patriarchy"

Who else would we look at to determine who has power within a system if not the people at the top?

you must be at least intentionally blind to the waves of the general population.

If I am it's not intentional.

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Oh ok. I thought you meant it wasn't recognized because of the Taliban or something.

If Afghanistan doesn't meet the requirements for a patriarchy does any country past or present? Did people just sort of conjure up this idea of a society run by men, in your opinion?

Afghanistan is a pretty strong example of a patriarchy, to me. I mean, let's be honest, no matter how devout she is a woman won't be the leader of Afghanistan any time soon. I don't think it even happened during US occupation when women were actually gaining rights.

The US has come a long way and is nowhere near Afghanistan in that sense. But I do think there are residual effects of when we were more strongly patriarchal.

I've always found it astonishing that black men got the right to vote before women did. Like 50 years before. And everyone knows how we felt about black people for a couple hundred years. Women have only had the right to vote for a little over 100 years. There still hasn't been a female president. There has never been a female majority in Congress. There's never been a female majority in the Supreme Court. The first black woman JUST got nominated. The first woman was appointed to the Supreme Court in 81. I heard something on the radio today about the first female Commandant of the Coast Guard or something?

It's nowhere near the kind of patriarchy that Afghanistan, at least in my view, is. But I do still think it's a country primarily ruled by men.

I've been shown by many people today that that is not the universally accepted definition of patriarchy.

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Well I'm a man so I have at least a blind spot to my own priveleges compared to women. I thought maybe you were and we could compare.

The biggest one I can think of off the top of my head that's not even a legal thing but a universal one is that I'll never have to worry about getting pregnant and giving birth. That is just the way it is. All the dangers or judgments that come with that will just never apply to me. That is a uniquely female thing.

Ultimately to answer your question I don't really think men are afforded priveleges not afforded to women in this country. I don't think that disqualifies it as a patriarchy. I also think we can't look at the situation today in a vacuum. White men have always had the right to vote in this country for example. That's a good hundred years they have on black men(depending when you start counting) and 150 on women. I think there are lingering effects of that today.

Listen I've had to deal with biases towards me constantly. I get it. But I can tell you I'm pretty familiar with a male dominated society and the US is still one, in my opinion.

I realize that is not universally accepted.

[–]Fearless-File-36252 points 4 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

White men have always had the right to vote in this country for example. That's a good hundred years they have on black men(depending when you start counting) and 150 on women. I think there are lingering effects of that today.

That's not true actually, all white men didn't always had the right to vote. I don't about US but in UK only 3% of the population had the right to vote in 1800s. It slowly increased till after WW1 when everyone got the right but before that majority of men didn't have right to vote.

In WW1 over a million men died for Britain from all over the world (including India, Australia, Canada, New Zealand etc), most of these men didn't have the right to vote and they were conscripted against their will to fight in the second most deadliest war in the history. The situation was even worse in Prussia, Austria-Hungary, France and Russia. most men didn't have any say in the war and were still conscripted against their will.

When, in 1920s, everyone got the right to vote, the minimum voting age for women was 31 while for men it was 21 to offset the fact that there were a million more women than men. Even after this, men were obligated to fight to protect their country, while women weren't, and which they did in WW2.

In 1962, when conscription was abolished in UK, men got the same right to vote as women, a total of 41 years later. We still don't that today have in US.

Men have literally paid with their lives and still have to in many places to get a basic human right.

[–]FurryM171 point 4 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

Oh goodness. You're from the UK? I'd like to apologize. I did the classic American thing and assumed you were American.

Ok so at the risk of having my face rubbed in it I will openly admit that everything you just talked about is completely unfair, unjust and quite honestly inhumane. I really didn't know any of that about the UK. If a person is obligated to fight and possibly die they should have the right to vote. Full stop. Especially after WWI! That wasn't as much a war as it was mass human sacrifice much of the time. It honestly might be the most brutal war in human history. I mean, how is that not basically punishing young men just for being men? No wonder we were misunderstanding each other.

I hope you don't think I condone any of that because of my misunderstanding.

That...I don't even know what to call that.

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Do you get what I'm saying? Just because men are treated like dogshit doesn't mean it's all women treating them like that. Men mistreat other men all the time.

And women treat other women like dog shit. Like do you people just ignore all the GOP women in the same quantity as liberal women who regularly vote AGAINST what folks like you claim women need/want? Do you ignore Kay Ivey who was the one who basically shattered the record for signing an anti abortion bill into law SHE pushed for? What about the MN supreme court who said drunk women have responsibility with sex, which was unanimous with the majority being women (a recent event feminist circles tried VERY hard to ignore, including removing any post about it)? What about Devoss who wanted to gut title 9?

The only reason everything looks like a patriarchy to you and people like you is because you ONLY focus on men and ignore women when it comes to people doing wrong. You don't give a rats ass about women in power and what they do unless you can celebrate it. If you did it would ruin your patriarchy, male domination, and that men are the problem argument, so you ignore them. This is why any time we here or any other sub that uses as much info as possible you folks immediately make it about women and men being bad, you intentionally try to keep the subject as "men bad, they cause _______ (insert literally anything here, but ONLY the bad stuff).

The -archy is just whoever's at the top

Women vote more than men, you people pick them. In fact women voted in such massive number Biden won on Super Tuesday, that was due to a gigantic turn out of women. Women could have picked Hillary for example, for some reason you clowns blame shit on men even though at that time just as many women voted for Trump as Hillary, yet we gotta hear how sexist men are for not voting more for Hillary... when women had equal parts and power in terms of 1 person, 1 vote.

TL;DR You consider everything a patriarchy because you choose to completely ignore the women in power, the women who do YOU wrong, the women who are on the other side of the isle, and choose to only focus on the bad men and not the good men. Because when a man is good to for women, it's just "normal" and the way it should be to you, for no other reason than "because woman" while you spout off about dumb crap like patriarchy and change the definition constantly just to fit the point you are trying to make of "men bad".

This is why in this sub and much of reddit the joke about feminism is "women good, men bad" because nearly everything you people state fits that mold and practically never comes out as the inverse. You just default to patriarchy which has this definition that flows like water that is completely dependent on how you are trying to paint men as the problem.

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