Basic question about debates

milquetoastmf · 2023-12-27T13:48:18+00:00

This is not relevant to PPD. Take it to the daily thread.

AngeCruelle · 2023-12-27T08:32:37+00:00

I'm arguing with some little kid on tick tock

Surely there's a better way to spend your time

Purple_Cruncher_123 · 2023-12-27T08:18:06+00:00

When it comes to speaking for their own perspective, sure. If it's in general, then no.

I'm Asian. I don't want a random academic nerd who thinks mayo is too spicy to be offended on my behalf regarding the right/wrong way to eat certain dishes. So in that sense, my perspective as an Asian person matters more in this specific context. But you are free to debate the merits of whether Asian cuisine is the best, or if something else is better.

Also, don't argue with randos on the internet. Life will sort them out.

-Shes-A-Carnival · 2023-12-27T09:59:22+00:00

that's nice, what does it have to do with this sub

ConanTheCybrarian · 2023-12-27T09:11:04+00:00

if you're arguing with a little kid on tiktok, perhaps a more prescient question is: why?

Quiet_Firefighter_65 · 2023-12-27T09:49:36+00:00

Well, depends on what your saying. Epistemologically an argument is not more valid on account of who is says it, however someone with a particular experience can reveal a dimension of a debate not otherwise considered. In either case, the argument needs to be assessed independently of the person presenting it.

Tywinlol · 2023-12-27T10:07:29+00:00

As a matter of science experience is different from expertise. The fact that the person had experienced some event or lived certain lifestyle does not mean that they are an expert on the subject. Expertise on the matter are only gained though the application of scientific method to issue at hand usually, but not necessarily, under supervision of other scientists who can criticize the process of study.

It is also worth remembering that experience can create bias and blind as opposed to inform. So no in the scientific sense experience alone would not entitle someone to the claim of expertise.

WilliamWyattD · 2023-12-27T10:12:09+00:00

It depends on what the debate is about. If it is raw facts, then nobody's voice matters more. If it is about the subjective experience of a given group, then yeah, the voice of someone in that group might carry a bit more weight. But within reason. Someone not in a given group who reads widely might have a better take on the average opinions of that group than a group member who is also a nutter.

Gravel_Roads · 2023-12-27T11:39:44+00:00

It depends on what you mean.

If you mean morally, representationally or in terms of who should lead policy decisions regarding a specific demographic (ie the 'LGBTQ' block), generally the members of that population should be the ones speaking for and making decisions for themselves, as they are the ones such decisions would affect.

However, in structured debate, like... actual debate tournaments, who is making a claim is irrelevant, because it's just a matter of supporting claims with logic and facts.

In example - In one of my debate classes, I was assigned a position to defend, and was expected to defend it regardless of whether I even agreed with that stance. Much like how a lawyer will defend their client regardless of whether they actually think their client is innocent or not.

tl;dr - No one should be calling you "stupid", and that's probably a sign that you're wasting your time trying to talk to them. But they aren't wrong - WHO is making a claim is is less important in debate than the evidence supporting that claim.

januaryphilosopher · 2023-12-27T09:51:30+00:00

What kind of debate are you talking about? There are topics where it would matter and topics where it wouldn't.

Independent-Mail-227 · 2023-12-27T11:07:40+00:00

"You cannot reason a person out of a position he did not reason himself into in the first place."

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peteypete78 · 2023-12-27T09:19:18+00:00

Depends on the context.

Does the topic affect non lgbtq people? If yes then they get a say if not then the don't.

SamuraiGoblin · 2023-12-27T12:36:51+00:00

Yes, of course we should take people's lived experience into account, especially when talking about subjective issues, but it doesn't necessarily mean people are the most qualified to decide issues about their group merely by being a member of it.

The answer is, it all depends on the people, the issue, and the context.

If a woman is an expert on testicular cancer, then I would take her advice more than I would take the advice of a random man. A male gynaecologist is more qualified to talk about women's medical issues than most women.

"voice matters more"

I don't even know what this means or how it would work? Are you keeping score? Are you weighting opinions based on identity? Facts are facts and good ideas are good ideas regardless of who has them.

Title	Basic question about debates
Author	MasterSpellcaster
Upvotes	1
Comments	19
Date	December 27, 2023 8:09 AM UTC (2 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/18rvmw6/basic_question_about_debates/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/basic-question-about-debates.1241622 https://theredarchive.com/post/1241622

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