My Concern About Feminism. Is it valid?

mewacketergi · 2020-01-07T01:33:31+00:00

I think you are right, and it is becoming more and more like a religion that doesn't realize that it is one.

Edit:

The feminist movement today has startling similarity to religious fundamentalism. There is the same dogmatism, the same zealous fervor, the same fear, the same clinging to certainty and the absolute conviction in one’s own correctness. Dissenters are marginalized, castigated, even cast out. The psychology is identical; all that differs are the goals. Another striking similarity is the hostility towards science.

What many feminists don’t understand when they complain about people refusing the “feminist” label is that it’s not about the ideas or the history. Most people don’t know much about feminist theory. It is everything to do with the feminists themselves. There is in feminism a tone of relentless grievance and antagonism. (Many feminists would tell me I’m a misogynist—a term bandied about so casually it has become self-parodic—despite the fact that I’d likely agree with them 75 percent of the time.) It is such an insular and dogmatic movement that, as with any similar milieu, people inside it can’t sense what is immediately apparent to others.

See this article in full: https://www.theatlantic.com/notes/2015/10/when-feminism-becomes-a-religion/409585/

Edit:

According to Gallup on feminist self-identification in US, linked from the same source: 30% in 1981, 33% in 1992, 26% in 1989, 25% in 2001. And then you can add the Vox firgure of 18% for 2015.

It seems reason and compassion are winning over feminism.

mtcapri · 2020-01-07T01:44:37+00:00

I agree that this is a trend stemming from feminist efforts and rhetoric, but I don't think they're necessarily doing it consciously. I think it's a consequence of an unconscious misandrist bias among feminists.

Also, I'd like to point out that feminists are only really pushing for men to be stripped of power in areas wherein they'd like to see women gain more power. When it comes to areas in which men have power that women don't want, they're fine leaving it in place. Examples include not pushing for gender quotas in industries like construction and sanitation, making men the only ones who have agency during sex, and providing more lenient prison sentencing schemes to women only/primarily.

Feminists only really care about upending gender norms when it benefits women; in areas wherein traditional gender norms benefit women, they give at best lip-service to ending them, but do nothing. In this way, they push at only one end of the scales of gender equality, which ensures that gender equality will never be reached via feminist efforts alone. And yet, they understand fully that a non-feminist men's movement will push back at some of their efforts to help women, and so they slander them any chance they get and try to impede their development.

I have often mused that some feminists are consciously aware that a lot of this stuff is about power, feel that men have had all the power in history up until modern times, and feel they have every right to try to wrest as much of that power from men as they can. If they go overboard, who cares? The Patriarchy will always fight back and cross the line too, so why shouldn't feminists?

I don't think most feminists think that way, but I'd reckon a small percentage of them do.

bkrugby78 · 2020-01-07T20:46:04+00:00

Only the radical feminists which, off social media, are very few.

plamplamthrow0321 · 2020-01-08T05:04:37+00:00

I think you are right and i think the effects are far reaching. Can't remember the name but htere's some radfem theorist that more or less has castration of 'warrior men' as the end game. In other words, the docile men are used to procreate as some kind of eugenic policy to 'breed out' ""toxic masculinity""

oldguy_1981 · 2020-01-07T16:38:26+00:00

I agree that it is happening but I do not think it is a permanent feature. Remember it’s all about feelings with these people, not about real problem solving.

At the end of the day, women are attracted to masculine men. If they get what they want ... they won’t like what they turn men into. Which means there is a boundary to how far this can go. Have we reached it yet? No, probably not.

genkernels · 2020-01-09T09:39:08+00:00

I mean, that's one concern about feminism as a whole, but it's a spectral one that seems to me to be based on two black arts: reading the future and trying to understand group psychology. Sure, some feminists have the idea that men shouldn't have power, Lois Waisbrooker talked about that a century ago.

But I think it would be more productive to focus on injustices that feminism can be demonstrated to be causing or have recently caused, such as the feminist response to the refuge movement that helped set back domestic violence response for both men and women alike, and would go on to decimate response for men by denying the mutuality of domestic violence for decades.

cromulent_weasel · 2020-01-07T23:56:15+00:00

It seems to me that the view, although it isn't expressely stated, is that any power a man has will be used to hurt a woman and thus men should not have power.

I think that there are certain strains of radical feminists who believe this, but they are hardly mainstream.

This leads to a push to replace our current masculine norms with a view of masculinity that centers on being soft, open caretakers who have little ambition, agency, strength or personal power.

What do you think 'current masculine norms' are? Because I think that ambition, agency, strength and personal power are fine.

Do others see this happening, or is it just me? If you do, what do you think the long-term effects will be, and what can we do to reverse it?

I think it's easy to conflate women with feminism, even though that's not true. There are women who aren't feminist and there are men who are feminists. And feminism itself is a very broad church with a range of opinions.

Similarly, I think it's easy to conflate men with masculinity and toxic masculinity, when those are three quite different things. Toxic masculinity specifically I think is a term which people have different reactions to. Patriarchal Masculinity (or anti-femininity) is probably the closest I can get to that.

Title	My Concern About Feminism. Is it valid?
Author	smeltaway
Upvotes	24
Comments	12
Date	January 7, 2020 1:11 AM UTC (6 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates/comments/el3qyg/my_concern_about_feminism_is_it_valid/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates/my-concern-about-feminism-is-it-valid.1064207 https://theredarchive.com/post/1064207

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