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Judge Orders Rape Victims to take a polygraph test.

TIFUbyregistering

August 29, 2015

40 upvotes

/r/MensRights

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Post Information

Title	Judge Orders Rape Victims to take a polygraph test.
Author	TIFUbyregistering
Upvotes	40
Comments	71
Date	August 29, 2015 8:12 PM UTC (10 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/3ivp8k/judge_orders_rape_victims_to_take_a_polygraph_test/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/judge-orders-rape-victims-to-take-a-polygraph-test.972338 https://theredarchive.com/post/972338

Comments

[–]Piroko 10 points11 points12 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]The_Def_Of_Is_Is 10 points11 points12 points 10 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]Captaincastle 1 point2 points3 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]ocasionallymisspeld 28 points29 points30 points 10 years ago (33 children) | Copy Link

[–]DevilishRogue 8 points9 points10 points 10 years ago (31 children) | Copy Link

[–]Neo_Techni 7 points8 points9 points 10 years ago (20 children) | Copy Link

[–]DevilishRogue 11 points12 points13 points 10 years ago (19 children) | Copy Link

[–]Neo_Techni 5 points6 points7 points 10 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

[–]DavidByron2 2 points3 points4 points 10 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]Neo_Techni -2 points-1 points0 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]DevilishRogue -3 points-2 points-1 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]NixonForBreadsident 0 points1 point2 points 10 years ago (14 children) | Copy Link

[–]DevilishRogue 0 points1 point2 points 10 years ago (13 children) | Copy Link

[–]NixonForBreadsident 0 points1 point2 points 10 years ago (12 children) | Copy Link

being strapped to the polygraph makes you more likely to tell the truth.

That is blatantly false. The opposite occurs with polygraphs, which are more likely to put an innocent person in jail than to get a guilty person to state the truth about their guilt.

It is no different than claiming that "only guilty people take plea deals".

You are deliberately making shit up for your bullshit claim.

http://wrongfulconvictionsblog.org/2012/02/23/the-polygraph-and-false-confessions/

http://www.cvsa1.com/polygraphfailures.htm

http://www.fas.org/sgp/othergov/polygraph/ota/index.html

http://www.apa.org/monitor/julaug04/polygraph.aspx

http://www.nap.edu/openbook.php?isbn=0309084369

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/the-human-beast/201303/do-lie-detectors-work

http://www.people.com/people/archive/article/0,,20079233,00.html

http://www.justicedenied.org/polygraphs.htm

http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/tomchiversscience/100173508/the-awkward-truth-about-lie-detectors/

http://news.yahoo.com/polygraphs-dont-why-still-them-130002387.html

[–]DevilishRogue 1 point2 points3 points 10 years ago (11 children) | Copy Link

You are STILL talking about the results of the polygraph. The placebo effect of lie detectors is well known:

http://mindhacks.com/2012/04/22/the-lie-dectector-paradox/

http://blog.practicalethics.ox.ac.uk/2013/09/polygraphs-placebo-or-trial-by-ordeal/

http://www.apa.org/research/action/polygraph.aspx

https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=UXQQNJrGmHYC&pg=PA148&lpg=PA148&dq=lie+detector+placebo&source=bl&ots=ut9VkJ4Ujb&sig=6fkbg0MWCaggoyaZVog7aB-j2og&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0CFcQ6AEwB2oVChMIjNTKwLzQxwIVxlcUCh3OWwZU#v=onepage&q=lie%20detector%20placebo&f=false

Now had you argued that researcher bias skewed results we could have had a discussion but dismissing the firmly established fact that people who think they will be caught if lying are less likely to lie just makes you look dishonest.

Also, I haven't disagreed that the results are used to cast aspersions on innocent people's testimony. I don't know why you cling to that as if it is relevant to what I actually have been arguing. Plus your rudeness, ignorance and downvoting for disagreement don't warrant further engagement.

[–]NixonForBreadsident -1 points0 points1 point 10 years ago* (10 children) | Copy Link

You are STILL talking about the results of the polygraph.

No, I directly refuted your claim. That you would flat out lie about what i've just posted is pathetic.

Innocent people are MORE likely, as shown by every reliable study, to admit guilt on a polygraph. That's the opposite of telling the truth.

It's even apparent with your deliberate lying that you didn't even read the sources that just refuted you because you even managed to present a "counter" to me by posting one of the SAME links I JUST used to refute you.

I'll take the words of lawyers, the American Psychological Association, the U.S. Congress Office of Technology Assessment, the National Research Council and major media outlets over...

"Mindhacks" a blog that believes in ghosts, psychics and hypnosis.

Your only other provided sources all refute your own claims and don't once back up what you're saying.

researcher bias

I've specifically addressed the fact innocent people will confess to things they didn't do, so you can throw that failed desperate strawman right back up the same hole you pulled it from.

The researcher bias is overwhelmingly documented. I directly addressed your absurd and baseless claim that lie detectors are likely to make people tell the truth, when they do the exact opposite.

All we have here is you unable to grasp that lie detectors don't work in any remote way and still desperately clinging onto them with some pathetic justification for their use, no different than right wing conservatives cling to torture as working in some twisted way.

You've been refuted. If more innocent people are admitting to crimes they didn't do than guilty people are admitting to crimes they did do while under a polygraph then for you to claim people are more likely to tell the "truth" is flat out bullshit.

That you've continued to claim so even after you were overwhelmingly refuted is showing you're deliberately lying.

That you even either didn't read my links (showing you again bullshitting) or deliberately ignored my links and then posted my own link that refuted you against me is showing you have no clue.

as if it is relevant

Innocent people admitting to crimes they didn't do under a polygraph is DIRECTLY relevant. Which is why you even had to start ranting about "researcher bias results" in a deflective strawman.

your rudeness

Get off your really ridiculous high horse. You don't come into this sub and start spouting off pure nonsense that has been known in the public for decades to be false in defense of locking innocent people up and then get pissed off and cry about "rudeness" because people called you out on your bullshit.

You certainly don't then proceed to flat out lie about both my posts and my specific arguments when you are.

Hiding behind "rudeness" is just incredibly sad at this point.

ignorance

You were refuted with scientific, legal and journalistic sources. Pretending you're not the only ignorant person here isn't going to work either.

d-downvoting

You've been repeatedly downvoting every comment I made, including the one that refuted you. Other users downvoting you isn't an argument against anything i've said, kid.

Now run along until you can actually counter any of the facts presented.

[–]DevilishRogue -1 points0 points1 point 10 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

[–]NixonForBreadsident0 points 10 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

I haven't downvoted you

Yes, i'm suuuuure you haven't. But good job at deliberately not addressing anything at all I have said and immediately again basing your argument on "you d-downvoted meee".

you are strawmanning

Sorry, after you've already been directly quoted trying to strawman in the previous post I don't think that is going to work out either.

obnoxious

You've really run out of arguments this fast?

i'm not trying to counter

This was obvious when you reposted my own link that refuted you and began spewing fallacies rather than actually countering all the evidence that refuted you.

if you understood what I am saying

I have. I have directly addressed your claims. They are wrong. That you are continuing to push them despite them being factually false shows you are deliberately pushing bullshit you know to be bullshit.

semantic arguments

This is the tactic you're trying now?

You made a claim. It was thoroughly refuted. You then flat out lied about what I had said (despite directly addressing your claim) and then tried to strawman by ranting about "researcher bias" even though I directly addressed innocent people lying about crimes they never committed, which is not the researcher but the very subject you are talking about.

That you think desperately pretending this is an argument of "semantic" now is just hilarious, as your entire claim has been refuted.

A innocent person will be more likely to lie about committing a crime than a guilty person under a polygraph.

This is the exact opposite outcome you claim happens, that people are more likely to tell the truth under a polygraph.

You have been refuted. Come back when you have a counter to the evidence provided.

[–]DevilishRogue0 points 10 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]NixonForBreadsident0 points 10 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

Your counter claim:

No, my counter was to provide a large pile of sources directly refuting your claim.

So pretending one thing I said is what my counter was is just reeeeeally desperate at this point.

not seen anything

Again, i'll take psychologists, lawyers and journalists over you simply saying so.

doesn't necessarily negate my claim

When reliable study after study repeatedly show that people are LESS likely to tell the truth under polygraph then YES it directly negates your claim.

semantics!

No, it's not semantics. You made a claim that was directly refuted by the facts. Not "some people under a polygraph will sometimes tell the truth because of it" but that they are more likely to.

It's a factually false statement backed up by absolutely nothing and refuted by repeated reputable sources in scientific and legal fields.

was supposed to refer to guilty people

not innocent people

Sorry, i'm afraid that you don't seem to grasp that ignoring incidents of where your claim falls apart also isn't an argument for your claim being true.

Guilty people are more likely to lie and deny their guilt on lie detectors. Innocent people are more likely to lie and claim guilt on lie detectors.

It is demonstrably false that you are more likely to tell the truth.

That you continue to fallaciously pull the "semantics" cards desperately trying to dismiss where your argument has been completely shut down still falls apart because you just full on claimed it was "supposed to refer to guilty people" even though guilty people LIE more than admit guilt.

incivility

Still clinging behind your sad little fallacies? No, sorry, spew forth absolute bullshit you clearly (at this stage) knew to be bullshit and then lying when you're refuted doesn't get you a hug box, kitten.

Run along and come back when you have evidence to counter the refutations of your claims.

[–]Kyrile -2 points-1 points0 points 10 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

[–]NixonForBreadsident1 point 10 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

I really dont care less about any of your points even if I believed you which I dont.

Did you forget to log out of your alt account, eh Devlish?

Whoops. Though i'm sure it'll now be "b-but I was just..."

You "not believing me" has absolutely no bearing on anything. The claim is false, is has been refuted by major psychological organizations, lawyers and mainstream media sources alone. Not to mention the countless more studies over the last few decades.

You "not believing it" holds about as much weight as you "not believing" the Earth is over 6000 years old.

These polygraphs are not being used against the accused they are being used against the accusers.

What a wonderfully irrelevant comment that has absolutely nothing to do with their claim that "being strapped to the polygraph makes you more likely to tell the truth."

[–]Kyrile0 points 10 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]NixonForBreadsident0 points 10 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

Not my claim. Stop AMOGing.

Geez, Devlish you could at least try to be a little less fucking obvious.

Especially since i've not ONCE stated it was your claim in that post, directly referring to the claim and replying specifically to thing you actually said.

This would be just levels of absurd behaviour from you even if you hadn't been obvious and were "totally not the same user".

That you think screaming "OMG YOU'RE AMOGING!" is actually an argument against sourced facts refuting the claim is showing how truly clueless you are about this sub. Take your desperate fallacies somewhere else.

but against the accusers

Another completely irrelevant statement from you that was already addressed in another post against Devlish.

An innocent accused is still included. So that strawman isn't going to work either.

Innocent people are LESS LIKELY TO TELL THE TRUTH under a polygraph. As that claim has been thoroughly refuted with earlier.

STOP AMOGING!!!

No-one is doing that. Facts aren't magically going away because you think screaming fallacies over and over are an argument. If it doesn't work for feminists on /r/MensRights it's certainly not going to work for you.

[–]Kyrile0 points 10 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

I don't care about your unlikely 'facts'. Its the aggressive way you spam them counter to reasoned discussion that made me decide not to even bother looking at your sources and take devilishes at face value.

Add to this your slanderous claims of me being a sockpuppet which is against the rules (thus the slander), the pattern of aggressive spam, source spam, constant ad hominen and accusations against everyone you disagree with across multiple threads.

You are AMOGing. You are a BETA a failure who is making up for your failures IRL by taking on an Alpha Male Of Group persona on the internet where there are no or little consequences for your rude abusive behavior.

I understand IRL you are feeling powerless and are abusing people on the internet because it makes you feel in control and powerful but honestly to the people watching your downwards spiral its sad.

If you need help I can listen to your problems. Incel perhaps? Woman troubles. Or perhaps I can get you numbers of some help lines where you live.

Its okay bro. Here's a shoulder to cry on.

[–]NixonForBreadsident0 points 10 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]NixonForBreadsident 4 points5 points6 points 10 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

The point is that being strapped to a polygraph gets people to tell the truth much more than they would without it.

That is completely fucking false.

Edit:

http://wrongfulconvictionsblog.org/2012/02/23/the-polygraph-and-false-confessions/

http://www.cvsa1.com/polygraphfailures.htm

http://www.fas.org/sgp/othergov/polygraph/ota/index.html

http://www.apa.org/monitor/julaug04/polygraph.aspx

http://www.nap.edu/openbook.php?isbn=0309084369

https://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/the-human-beast/201303/do-lie-detectors-work

http://www.people.com/people/archive/article/0,,20079233,00.html

http://www.justicedenied.org/polygraphs.htm

http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/tomchiversscience/100173508/the-awkward-truth-about-lie-detectors/

http://news.yahoo.com/polygraphs-dont-why-still-them-130002387.html

No, it is flat out false that you are "more likely to tell the truth if you take a polygraph".

The opposite is true.

An innocent person is more likely to admit to a crime they didn't do under a polygraph than a guilty person is to admit to a crime they did do.

At this point people ITT claiming it "still totally has people tell the truth" are no different than those still defending torture to gather information despite it being overwhelmingly shown to be useless in their logic.

[–]ocasionallymisspeld -1 points0 points1 point 10 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

[–]TIFUbyregistering[S] -3 points-2 points-1 points 10 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

[–]ocasionallymisspeld 3 points4 points5 points 10 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

[–]TIFUbyregistering[S] 2 points3 points4 points 10 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]PunxTatto 1 point2 points3 points 10 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points1 point 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]DevilishRogue 0 points1 point2 points 10 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]ocasionallymisspeld -3 points-2 points-1 points 10 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]DevilishRogue -1 points0 points1 point 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]bakedpotato486 1 point2 points3 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]Neo_Techni 16 points17 points18 points 10 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]brownman83 -1 points0 points1 point 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points7 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]SkeptiSys 2 points3 points4 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[+]Ransom_Stoddard 10 years ago [recovered] (1 child) | Copy Link

It's about time. Now, lets get rid of the rape shield laws.

[–]xNOM 5 points6 points7 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[+]TIFUbyregistering[S] -9 points-8 points-7 points 10 years ago (27 children) | Copy Link

[–]rg57 9 points10 points11 points 10 years ago (21 children) | Copy Link

[–]TIFUbyregistering[S] -1 points0 points1 point 10 years ago (20 children) | Copy Link

[–]Neo_Techni 5 points6 points7 points 10 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

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[–]The_Def_Of_Is_Is 1 point2 points3 points 10 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

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[–]The_Def_Of_Is_Is 3 points4 points5 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

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