"We rarely ask why men use more lethal methods. After all, a suicide attempt is a cry for help. And a cry for help shows a belief that someone will listen. But if you don’t believe anyone will listen then you don’t attempt suicide – you commit suicide."

-redditardation- · 2017-03-06T00:16:47+00:00

That quote is very, very fitting.

Also very unnerving because it rings very true.

samsc2 · 2017-03-06T03:47:17+00:00

No one really gives a shit when we kill ourselves. It's looked at as a sign of weakness as if we are a part of a herd that needs to be culled so the rest aren't burdened. With women however, they are looked at as something that needs to be protected and so people leap at the chance to help them. As a guy who tries to kill one's self it's basically better if we just succeed since we're just so damn disposable. Hell when I tried to kill myself a little bit ago I had the police come into my house break my computer and other shit in my room, throw me around, and hand cuff me all because I tried to kill myself.

AloysiusC · 2017-03-06T05:49:35+00:00

Also, feminists don't seem to realize that when they assume that suicide attempts in women are as genuine as in men, then women being so much less successful can only mean that women must be hopelessly incompetent relative to men. It's surprising how many of their beliefs imply that.

A common response from feminists is that patriarchy socializes women to use less dangerous methods. Naughty naughty patriarchy.

2017-03-05T23:35:50+00:00

https://archive.fo/Pm3Wl (You have to ask?)

iainmf · 2017-03-06T02:19:38+00:00

I get the authors point, but I think seeing suicide as a cry for help is just a way we soften it for ourselves. It's difficult to look hopelessness and despair right in the face.

splodgenessabounds · 2017-03-06T08:19:10+00:00

Excellent post - if the relative rate of male: female suicide isn't a men's rights issue, I don't know what is. The section you quote is the nuts-and-bolts of it: aside from suicide help lines (the Samaritans in the UK, Lifeline in Oz) and booking yourself into ECT/ the looney bin, there is about 3/5th of fuck-all support for males with suicidal tendencies. In that context, it isn't a case of "But if you don't believe anyone will listen" so much as there simply isn't anyone there: you're supposed to be the man, remember?

So, kudos to GMP for publishing an article that at least raises those factors that need to be pointed out. If only the author of this piece hadn't started off the next para with:

That people listen to men more than women is taken for granted.

Taken for granted maybe; but is it true?

Imnotmrabut · 2017-03-06T21:10:07+00:00

Please - any rational one liners from "The Good Rape Project" are only ever a coincidental collision of words that they can't twist into their usual misandric inanity.

JebberJabber · 2017-03-06T10:58:48+00:00

I mostly agree with the article and especially with OP's comments.

It would be very unfortunate if the idea took hold that non-fatal suicide attempts were not serious in the first place though.

From the Oxford study of people who survived attempts and were asked how strongly they wanted to die, the small group of people who strongly wanted to die contained a remarkably higher proportion of males.

It may seem strange that people who had just done something which realistically could have killed them, mostly considered they had had a low to medium wish to end up dead. But that is what they found. Mostly they wanted relief and could not see any other way out. Death was a method not a goal.

Methods favoured by women are highly unpredictable in their results. Whether the person ends up dead or not is often a meaningless result of chance.

Consider a hundred people who gobbled a bottle of pills. Two of them are dead, others have permanent damage to their liver, brain, heart.

Many of them have huge hospital bills (3-7 days is common, and a week in ICU is very feasible for painkillers).

Health insurance requires money, employment, or parents or a partner with those things. All of those are not so common among people with chronic mental health problems. So these bills can easily be life-changing.

What was the difference between the two who died, those whose life has been damaged badly by bills and maybe permanent organ damage, and those who just woke up with a headache? Very little probably. Maybe research, but mostly the pills available and normal human variability in the ability of their body to take the dose.

I talk to a lot of people online about suicide. The descriptions of plans or advice sought on methods clearly indicates incompetence rather than insincerity. Being severely depressed often makes people severely incompetent and extremely lacking in motivation. So much so that treatment causing an improvement in mood creates a suicide risk, because they are now more capable of killing themselves.

Attempters' reactions after finding themselves still alive again point to incompetence not insincerity. Some are disappointed. Many are blank and exhausted.
They seldom have the energy now, but plan to try again e.g. in a few weeks. Or they don't have a specific plan but feel it inevitable they will want to try again within a few months or years. (Usually what happens after a first attempt is they eventually get better and don't die by suicide).

BeefsteakTomato · 2017-03-06T20:00:43+00:00

The article doesn't do justice to the silence the boys of Boko Harem. Specifically they were silenced. Any time one would bring them up they were automatically branded as a misogynist for not talking about the girls.

Throwawayingaccount · 2017-03-06T12:42:48+00:00

Although this article brings up a good point, and I'm sure that this accounts for some of the reason behind the usage of more lethal methods in men, it skips over what I think the primary reason is: regaining control.

I see there being a major difference between putting a gun to your head and pulling the trigger, knowing one instant you will be alive, and the next you aren't; compared to taking a bottle of pills, falling asleep sometime later, and never waking up.

The difference is control. It is a last ditch effort to retain control over one's life, by controlling the exact instant it ends.

4man · 2017-03-07T05:40:40+00:00

I am not suicidal, but the times I have examined my thoughts on the topic, if I was going to kill myself I would want to make sure it worked. I suspect men and women "attempt" suicide for different reasons; I think the evidence is men are more successful. it isn't something to be proud of but I think it points to another case where one size does not fit all.

CurtisAxelmania · 2017-03-06T08:07:02+00:00

Women aren't incompetent so we should replace "attempt" with "fake attempt where I expect someone to pu.o my stomach in time and coddle me".

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