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Feminism is Good for Human Evolution

femidarwin

July 19, 2015
4 upvotes
/r/PurplePillDebate
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Post Information
Title Feminism is Good for Human Evolution
Author

femidarwin

Upvotes 4
Comments 77
Date July 19, 2015 9:15 PM UTC
(11 years ago)
Subreddit Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/3dvf6d/feminism_is_good_for_human_evolution/
Archive Link https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/feminism-is-good-for-human-evolution.280900
https://theredarchive.com/post/280900
Red Pill terms in post
feminism

Comments

[–]Atlas_B_Shruggin🔪Yeetus that Feetus🔪11 points12 points13 points 11 years ago* (45 children) | Copy Link

In recent history, patriarchy, through the institution of marriage, restricted alpha men to one woman only. This made it so every man could mate. But this is unnatural and it stifles evolution.

And caused the unnatural thing we call "advanced technological civilization"

this is why camille paglia famously said "if civilization had been left up to women, we'd all still be living in grass huts"

QED

[–]rafay_M 3 points4 points5 points 11 years ago* (2 children) | Copy Link

Coincidentally, the only societies known which are even mildly left to women are living in grass huts.

I'm not even kidding. As much as feminists like to say that patriarchal gender roles are only cultural, and culture changes, they neglect to mention 99.99% of humanity that has ever lived has had this particular aspect of culture in common.

The only exceptions we have to patriarchy are contemporary backwater and irrelevant tribes. None of them developed writing, and apparantly, none of the ones that existed before were significant enough to be written about by patriarchal civilizations, even as they were doubtlessly destroyed.

[–]Atlas_B_Shruggin🔪Yeetus that Feetus🔪1 point2 points3 points 11 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

yeh why are you telling me i agree with you. tell it to the people who dont agree with you

[–]rafay_M 3 points4 points5 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Oh sorry, i use theme off and dont recognize anyone. On the other hand, other people can read it. its a general post.

[–]InterversityPurple Pill, Blue Tribe1 point2 points3 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Can you explain the purpose behind that? Is it to limit the damage of 'fatherless' children from the rolling stone alphas, or something else?

[–]PetticoatRuled 0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (26 children) | Copy Link

You mean, if civilization had been left up to the people whom nature kept pregnant and taking care of small children all their lives? Tell me again how men faced those kinds of restrictions?

If men were the ones to get pregnant and women not, people who believe what Camille does would have had to eat their words. The world would probably be less tech-advanced, yes, but I'd also argue the world would a lot more beautiful and less ruined.

[–]h887b21 point2 points3 points 11 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

If men were the ones to get pregnant...

In what sense would they be men then? You mean a world where people give birth through their penises and shot sperm out of their vaginas would be so much more beautiful?

[–]PetticoatRuled 2 points3 points4 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Draw me a picture of that and I'll tell you.

[–]PrimePussyOverRancidRP0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

What the fuck does she even mean by "more beautiful"?

If mattress carrying is what's considered art, fuck that "beauty".

[–]Atlas_B_Shruggin🔪Yeetus that Feetus🔪1 point2 points3 points 11 years ago (10 children) | Copy Link

"if" it were a different world everything would be different. women are like women because they have babies

[–]PetticoatRuled 0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link

Not in entirety.

"female humans have been the chief engine in the unprecedented high level of human sociability; were the inventors of the most useful of tools – called the String Revolution; have shared equally in the provision of food for human societies; almost certainly drove the human invention of language; and were the ones who created agriculture.”

Olga Soffer, a professor of anthropology at the University of Illinois

[–]Atlas_B_Shruggin🔪Yeetus that Feetus🔪0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

None of which is "civilization" aside from agriculture

[–]PetticoatRuled 0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

Had to start somewhere. Women started it and would have continued it, had they not had their necks stepped on.

[–]Atlas_B_Shruggin🔪Yeetus that Feetus🔪0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

thats why the mosuo stop at huts?

[–]PetticoatRuled 0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

Oh, you mean the group of people who are part of the 300,00+ groups of people called the Nakhi people?

They all live as subsistence farmers and the Nakhi (apart from the Mosuo) are all patriarchal. I have no idea what geographical or cultural things led to them remaining this way.

[–]TheJollySatandropping truth bombs since 840 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

To bad about those biological differences that make one gender better at team based hunting, hand eye coordination. It's the masculine bell curve's bias towards maths, systems and makes them play well in hierarchy. Ignore the value of these traights and you will get deystroyed by engineers who are better strategists and build much better weapons than you. Pretty much all of ancient and contemporary human history.

[–]PetticoatRuled -1 points0 points1 point 11 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

What in the who in the hey now???

I'm talking about the NAKHI. I have zero idea what you are talking about.

[–]TheJollySatan1 point 11 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

I'm talking about your emphasis on invention from women, it's short sited when looking at humanity as a whole.

[–]TheJollySatandropping truth bombs since 840 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Priests were the group of people mapped astrological movements so they could predict seasons and when to plant crops. Those agrarian tools can't do squat without astronomy.

[–]PetticoatRuled -1 points0 points1 point 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Nothing like doing things hands-on to work out how things like crops and crop rotation work.

[–]cra1pill the color of heartiste's shiv1 point2 points3 points 11 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

If nature kept men

pregnant and taking care of small children all their lives

.. maybe even a significant chance that these men die in pregnancy right?

Then these men would have evolved a sexual psychology to be a bit coy and selective about mating because of the huge energy investment they are making relative to women. But women would evolve a psychology that jumps at the offer to mate since it's a relatively small opportunity cost for them right?

In fact the women might be so eager to mate that maybe the women start competing with each other. So an aggressive nature would help. The women could also compete based on ability to protect and provision for the relatively helpless men who are raising children. A venturesome instinct and relatively large muscularity compared to men would help with all this competition and provisioning the women are doing.

And these helpless men would likely evolve neotenous features - mimicking the features of children of the species like having less hair and higher pitched voices, to tap into the instinct species generally have to protect their young. When a pregnant man or child starts crying in their high pitched voice, it would pierce the heart and grab the attention of any women who could hear it and they would be naturally predisposed to come help.

Since men are doing all this nurturing presumably they would evolve a highly nurturing instinct and high levels of sociability since they are dependent on others in the community to a larger extent than the women.

tl;dr Just replacing men with women and women with men doesn't make any kind of argument that changes the evolutionary logic of sexual dimorphism.

[–]PetticoatRuled -1 points0 points1 point 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Ok, this wasn't meant to go too deep.

Imagine then that women remain the ones getting pregnant but men did a lot of the caretaking of those children. If we're taking it as seriously as you took my last hypothesis, then it wouldn't work either, because of the high ratio of death that women faced in pregnancy and childbirth. Any scientific/tech work they had commenced would come to an abrupt end.

This is the first age that women have become a little more free in terms of the amount of babies they have (or whether to have any at all).

The argument is that women have been restricted by nature in the past, and restricted by men. They had the capacity to achieve other thing all along.

[–]PrimePussyOverRancidRP0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link

more beautiful and less ruined.

So grass huts?

No thanks.

[–]PetticoatRuled 0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

"female humans have been the chief engine in the unprecedented high level of human sociability; were the inventors of the most useful of tools – called the String Revolution; have shared equally in the provision of food for human societies; almost certainly drove the human invention of language; and were the ones who created agriculture.”

Olga Soffer, a professor of anthropology at the University of Illinois

[–]h887b21 point2 points3 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

This seams like one academic's speculation. If you google "String Revolution" you find it's supposed to have happened over 30,000 years ago, and language even earlier than that. What kind of evidence supports that it was all women doing these things?

[–]PrimePussyOverRancidRP0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

And technological advancements were necessary to put those contributions to full use.

[–]PetticoatRuled 0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

Men started taking over after the age of agriculture began. Then the fatcat men moved in. Women and most men were shoved to the side, and used as slaves. Women lost any opportunity to advance, as did most men.

[–]Onirou0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Wow, God is telling us the truth. Come and see!

[–]PetticoatRuled 0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

So it shall be written.

[–]TheJollySatandropping truth bombs since 840 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Karl Marx called, he wants his theories back. Enough with the conflict theory based bs. Pull off your blinkers. There is much more complexity to society than a bunch of groups struggling for power. There are more reasons as to why things turned out the way they did. Id start with reading some structural functionalism and combine that with evo psych.

[–]PetticoatRuled -1 points0 points1 point 11 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

You want complex essays on PPD?

This from one of the AWALT people. Get a grip.

[–]TheJollySatandropping truth bombs since 840 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

What you've said in no way refutes the connection between Marxism and feminism which I am explaining in further detail.

[–]HappilySingleWoman 0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (13 children) | Copy Link

this is why camille paglia famously said "if civilization had been left up to women, we'd all still be living in grass huts"

I'm not saying you're wrong but what does it have to do with what OP is saying. She didn't say civilization should be left to women, she's talking about the end of patriarchy and the sexual revolution.

Modern societies that are non patriarchal like Norway etc. are significantly more developed than some others .

[–]Atlas_B_Shruggin🔪Yeetus that Feetus🔪3 points4 points5 points 11 years ago (12 children) | Copy Link

Patriarchy=civilization

[–]HappilySingleWoman 0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (11 children) | Copy Link

So the feminist nations of Germany , Norway and Finland are less civilized than the patriarchal nations of The Middle East and Africa ?

[–]cxj75% Redpill Core Ideas2 points3 points4 points 11 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

Straw man. The feminist nations could never have happened without a Patriarchy to begin with. Even Marx, whose ideas are the root of feminism, admitted Capitalism was necessary for Socialism to happen. Feminism is a byproduct of abundance and technology that have only ever been created by patriarchal cultures.

[–]HappilySingleWoman 0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

Even Marx, whose ideas are the root of feminism

Marx himself never advocated for feminism.

[–]cxj75% Redpill Core Ideas1 point2 points3 points 11 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Irrelevant, his ideas are the root of feminism whether he wanted it or not.

[–]HappilySingleWoman 0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

I doubt it , feminist writers existed before Marx.

[–]TheJollySatandropping truth bombs since 840 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

The concept of equal genders has been around since the stoic philosophers in about 300 bc.

Feminism's theories use exactly the same structure as any conflict theory. The core focus is on conflict as a result of power struggle between groups. Marxists jumped into feminism back in the 60s when they created the second wave. Those academics are the same ones that created gender oppression theories. They just replaced elite with patriachy. It's simplistic unfalsifable nonsense.

[–]Atlas_B_Shruggin🔪Yeetus that Feetus🔪1 point2 points3 points 11 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

the middle east and africa arent patriarchal, they are mascularchal (my terminology). Patriarchy is rule of beta fathers

scandinavia is coasting on the fumes of patriarchy like all of the west, its not breeding to replacement and is importing its replacement/doom

[–]HappilySingleWoman 1 point2 points3 points 11 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

Low birth rates aren't only a result of feminism though . Technological development is also a huge factor .

[–]Atlas_B_Shruggin🔪Yeetus that Feetus🔪1 point2 points3 points 11 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

its feminism

[–]HappilySingleWoman 0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I don't know about that . What inceptives would people have to have a lot of kids even if feminism didn't exist ? I mean with contraception , urbanization and social security (that isn't necessarily related to feminism) , there is no reason for humans to have lots of kids anymore.

[–]TheJollySatandropping truth bombs since 840 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Realistic sex robots and artificial wombs aren't far off. The reset these will cause will be massive.

[–]HappilySingleWoman 0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Yea , I've been saying this for ages.

[–]ToshiroOzuwaraDread Pill5 points6 points7 points 11 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

Nothing man does is unnatural. Man is from nature. What he does is as natural as an ant hill or a beaver dam.

[–]rafay_M 1 point2 points3 points 11 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

True enough, but that is a philosophical argument.

"Naturally arising" and "intentionally man-made" are practical distinctions.

[–]ToshiroOzuwaraDread Pill3 points4 points5 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

All arguments are philosophical.

[–]HappilySingleWoman 0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Can you please say that to people who claim altruism is unnatural?

[–]InterversityPurple Pill, Blue Tribe1 point2 points3 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Altruism is genetically mandated.

Also who claims altruism is unnatural?

[–]PetticoatRuled -1 points0 points1 point 11 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

And ant hills are made by females.

[–]ToshiroOzuwaraDread Pill0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Looks like your ant-sisters have achieved the glorious feminist utopia!

[–]PetticoatRuled -1 points0 points1 point 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Bow to your glorious overlords!

[–]HappilySingleWoman 2 points3 points4 points 11 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

The thing is that it causes some problems on a social level (a lot of men get excluded from the dating pool), so even if you're right (I'm not saying you are) , it will take some time for humans to adapt to these changes.

[–]femidarwin[S] 0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

it will take some time for humans to adapt to these changes.

What do you think we need to do to adapt?

[–]runitonce007 2 points3 points4 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Darwinism is survival of the fittest. Not survival of the most attractive.

This is great until all non-alpha (in an attractive sense) males gradually cotton onto the fact that they're being used, overlooked, & settled for. A large portion of such men remaining unmarried is a disaster for society, which is why society has begun to introduce laws where a woman can still bleed a man dry in court regardless of marital status.

[–]scrantonic1tyNot BP1 point2 points3 points 11 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

Civilisation operates outside of darwinian imperatives. It is artificial, and it is built on the backs of the exploited lower classes (beta males). Thing is, they only accept exploitation if you throw them a treat every now and then, pat them on the head and tell them they're a good boy. That's where the wife comes in.

The betas have a breaking point. The danger comes when a disenfranchised alpha sociopath organises them, they violently overthrow the Government and dust off the guillotines.

[–]femidarwin[S] 1 point2 points3 points 11 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

Thing is, they only accept exploitation if you throw them a treat every now and then....That's where the wife comes in.

Porn to masturbate to or if they're lucky-being a cuckold should be good enough.

[–]PrimePussyOverRancidRP0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

This is off topic but /u/beautiful_red, is that you?

[–]salmon691 point 11 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

Also reminds me of /u/cvcv1991.

[–]meehan6661 point 11 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

Its thinking like that which will lead to women being mere property again.

[–]smokingmonkey420 1 point2 points3 points 11 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

Alphas today are not necessarily what we would consider "quality sperm." Many so called Alphas are as dumb as a bag of rocks but get by on good looks and aggressiveness. Others just don't give a fuck and are literal sociopaths.

On the other hand, you have Isaac Newton who literally died as a virgin and created Calculus all on his own. Nikola Tesla worked day and night to create his inventions. Bill Gates was likely the epitome of a beta until he created Microsoft and became one of the most powerful people on the face of the earth.

So the answer is a big resounding NO. What is considered Alpha today is not what's good for our evolution because our survival depends on the intellect of our people, not its aggressiveness, charm or good looks.

Maybe what's good for evolution is to do away with sluts who cause nothing but chaos amongst men. Maybe men should be focused on finding "quality eggs."

[–]OlBastardRP|She said she was 18.1 point2 points3 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

You can drink all the alpha semen you want in a technologically regressed and chaotic society. Oh, wait, you won't, because you'd likely be raped and perhaps killed or taken to another harem.

[–]Xemnas811 point2 points3 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Oh what a hilarious troll. Yes we should completely eradicate betas from the gene pool to increase the genetic potential of the human race. I'd invoke Godwin's Law but I know you want me to do that.

[–]wazzup987Blue pill, you can beat me black & blue for it later[🍰] 0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago* (2 children) | Copy Link

probability of troll: troll2 out of troll

Assuming not a troll, Even rp say the alphas are bad for society and while usefull in prehistory as far as modern society is concerned should be a genetic dead as pure alphas are really bad for society.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6kkAauZJp5A

[–]femidarwin[S] 0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago* (1 child) | Copy Link

Pure alphas used to be bad because they don't commit to women. But technological society allows women to raise kids on their own now, so that's no longer a problem. Short term flings for good sperm is all that's needed.

[–]wazzup987Blue pill, you can beat me black & blue for it later[🍰] 1 point2 points3 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

what you miss here is how 'alphas affect the rest of society. they are typcialy the worst kinds of people. from drug lord to evil ceo or corrupt politician.

[–]wtknightHardcore Romantic0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Using Red Pill terminology, I don't think most feminists are picking alpha men to have sex with. Most are picking betas because they can have more power in those relationships. Even if a feminist is very sex positive and also having sex with Alpha Chad, she is likely demanding that he use protection or using some form of birth control during these trists. She is having her kids with the Beta, though.

[–]h887b20 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

I'm not a red pill supporter at all, but I have to disagree with this. If you look at the impact of women entering the work force on who has children, you find that more educated women have fewer children because they put off having children to advance their career. For example, according to the census, among women past child bearing age, those with advanced degrees are more than twice as likely to be childless as those who never finished high school, with the childless rate going up at every increment of education (source).

And the "alpha" men having children aren't necessarily the fittest. The red pill men are trying to have as much sex as possible, not as many children as possible. With the widespread availability of contraception, they opt to separate the two, and you usually hear them arguing against marriage. The only ones having children are the ones not planning ahead, or the "betas" who want to settle down and have children.

[–]femidarwin[S] 0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago* (1 child) | Copy Link

the "betas" who want to settle down and have children.

If women are having children with low value men, it's only because of left over patriarchial influences. Women can take care of themselves and their children on their own. No need to settle for betas.

you find that more educated women have fewer children

This makes it all the more important that women have free choice to choose alpha sperm. France has banned paternity testing, this should happen everywhere.

[–]h887b21 point2 points3 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Both of your responses assume some sort of ideal response to these changes rather than looking at the actual effects in the real world with human nature as it really is.

Most intelligent well educated women want to raise children with the biological father. When this is the way society works, women will look for a good provider, so good providers are selected for in a darwinian sense. Feminism is causing this family structure to decline.

Among less educated women, single motherhood is more prevalent. Pregnancies are much more likely to be unplanned in these situations. The men who end up fathering children with these women tend to be promiscuous men who are too stupid to use protection and end up being forced to pay child support. They are much more likely to be on government assistance. People with high levels of foresight and planning don't have many children in these arrangements. Feminism has made these arrangements far more common.

[–]AmericanHistoryAFBBI'm Back0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

It's probably doing some good for the casual sex, hook up market, but at what cost? Light you said, it's fighting long term monogamy. To me, thats a problem. The problem with feminism is that it's now harder to get girls to commit to you than ever before.

[–]femidarwin[S] -1 points0 points1 point 11 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

The problem with feminism is that it's now harder to get girls to commit to you than ever before.

Commitment is selfish. It's a restriction on alpha sperm. That's the point of my post.

[–]gavinok 1 point2 points3 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

The desire for Alpha sperm is selfish, why does one need to have it? You have women starving in Africa who need clean water more than anyone's sperm.

[–]PrimePussyOverRancidRP0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Then alpha sperm needs to collected. Get alphas to volunteer by opening blowjob clinics for sperm donation.

[–]meehan6661 point 11 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

So BP, tell me again how feminism isn't about screwing over the average "low value" man?

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