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[–]staggerlee718 74 points75 points76 points 3 years ago (10 children) | Copy Link
I like to take this to the basics of power dynamics. In the end of the day, the one who needs the least, he all the power.
If you are with a woman and you need her less than she needs you, you can call all the shots. Think about it. What can she do to get her way? Deny you sex? If you don't need sec that badly, she has no power. She can give you the silent treatment? Hey, more peaceful afternoons for me.
If you have a job and you don't need the money nearly as much as the company needs your expertise, who has the power? You of course. You can go on your own or go find another job easily, while your company struggles to replace you.
And on and on.
So lacking neediness signals that you have more interpersonal power than the other person. As you get less emotionally attached, all of a sudden you become more appealing to a woman. You don't need her therefore she doesn't have power over you. And because she doesn't, she actually feels safer with you.
Think about it along those lines. If the purpose of sexual attraction is to get us to mate and propagate the human race, a woman then has to consider certain adverts of her mate selection criteria. When she is pregnant and at her most vulnerable, unable to take care of her basic needs, do you think she'd want to be with a man who can't make decisions and lead? A man who is weaker than her and needs her more? She is literally at her neediest so the last thing she needs is someone who is as or more needy.
Hence why neediness is a turn off for women. It is for men to a certain extent too, because neediness from a woman means we have to bear responsibility for her fully. And who the fuck wants someone who can't carry their own weight.
[–]Capn--Flint 11 points12 points13 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
That's a great and precise explananation of the psychology the matter and power dynamics in general. It's probably also the reason why people often get what they want, when they don't need it.
[–]Resident_Afternoon48 4 points5 points6 points 3 years ago* (3 children) | Copy Link
Needing can also be translated into our needs not being met.I would say start by analyzing the neediness.If I attack great value to say communication as it by me considered a virtue.She on the other hand does not, it is easy to see how my needs are not being met.So how would a healthy person react to this?Either by drawing a line. Either by begging or by patiently accepting the other person and give them the opportunity to change.
Too often neediness is wanting something/forcing something from another person."Give me a response now please". Why the heck? Why are you even thinking about this.
On her part, she might not even understand your needs, thus any behaviour can be painted with her own experiences.
The issue I have with what you write is that it implies emphasize detachment over attachment. Not needing. What exactly? Her? Or something else that is important to me? Or could it be that I think I have a need as it fills a hole?
And dont forget. You are more than that. By "never being needy" it puts a strain on a person. Imagine someone who sees it simply as neediness and still loves you.
Some woman are in fact emotionally and intellectually capable of this.
Why then are you with a woman who does not fill your needs if they are not accepted or communicated in an equal way by herself communicating boundaries.
A woman who is in fact attracted and commited to you(!) would let you know when you go off course. But it can be unattractive if it is unreasonable which it often is.But sometimes there is a message within that feeling, the question is if we act on it or not, be it a lesson to be found for ourselves or her.
And how early and in what situations does neediness come out? Also enthusiasm could be missunderstood for it because of previous experiences.
So it all depends imo
[–]ZoeticLark 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
"She can give you the silent treatment? Hey more peaceful afternoon for me."
This reminds me of the idea that narcisism and codependence are a spectrum that touches us all, no one is immune, and in fact, we all need a little of both. Main stream talk about narcisism and codependence will have us believe its an either/or situation, but it isnt. We all need a little healthy codependence to build bonds and a little healthy narcisism to go out there and believe in ourselves to do what we came here to do and push past barriers. Both can be equally unhealthy as much as healthy and good.
If i felt so ignored that i had to give someone the silent treatment, and their response was to be happy about it, id have to really hate myself to stick around. Im all for independence and autonomy, but there is also the shell that two people build together and this person sounds like he enjoys the single life.
Jesus, being needed by somone is, in the healthy aspects of it, one of the greatest gifts one human can give another. To be asked for help can be an honor. It needs to be balanced, healthy of course, but not entirely thrown out, or you start to look like a psychopath and ones partner might find thenselves wondering where they fit into your life when you are the only one at the center of it.
Mark Manson is currently single, i think his marriage lasted 3 years and he wrote this at some point, presumably after his 20's.
"My obsession with my penis of course was merely an outcrop of my deeper insecurities around intimacy and commitment — namely, I was abso-fucking-lutely terrified to let myself get too close to someone, and so instead of fulfilling my need for love through quality relationships, I pursued quantity."
At the very least, needing love is just part of being human. Deny and diminish that core need at your own risk.
[–]Resident_Afternoon48 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Wish I vould upvote this more.
[–]MikeLPause -1 points0 points1 point 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
Why not just fall naturally in love instead of playing shit like this? It should be 50/50. I'd love to have a woman that I'd want just as much as she wants me. This mating shit is all in nature. We, as humans that are much more competent and intellectual than let's say monkeys or lions and are able to use that to our ability.
[–]Intelligent_Expert10 3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
Not trying to be rude, I have a friend that says the same thing and he's needy asf... but this is the typical good guys response "why things can't just be like I want them to be" because they aren't. And usually the problem starts on men, because of the needy guys.
[–]MikeLPause 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
I'm not needy. Women look at me, i just don't pay attention to them, at least i try not to. My point is that everything these days is too formulated especially in the dating scene.
[–]Intelligent_Expert10 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago* (1 child) | Copy Link
Yeah I understand your point, but it is what it is, our brain need so many years to adapt to things, and this internet revolution just came to fast, so people think they have all figured out but we are still adapting to new ways of living life .. and this stupid games are part of it now .. I don’t like them either and I refuse to play them too 😝
[–]MikeLPause 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
So what do you ? Out of curiosity. i just use my wit and charisma and it works 🤷
[+][deleted] 3 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link
[–]_ball_of_yarn 3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Completely agree with you
[–]Head_Harbinger 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
No woman chases me back. If I stop pursuing them altogether I will never hear back from them. What I do has rarely ever been reciprocated. And no, I’m not needy, and I’m constantly committed to my goals and own betterment
[+][deleted] 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]Head_Harbinger 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
I'm 27, currently in Mexico. I'm actually picky about my matches, and | never put them on a pedestal, even when I think they're super attractive. I'm not sure what my type is actually, I just match or approach girls | find attractive, and if we vibe l ask them out or for their contact information. As for your last paragraph, I'm not sure I can really answer the question. You see, I don't have enough experience to even distinguish the two types among my matches. I never get that close to the point I can differentiate the two.
[–]RedditsOlderBrah 17 points18 points19 points 3 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link
i'll try and expand on this because catch phrases on their own are easy to agree with and dismiss without thought.
you should be living a full life and be independently happy before entering a relationship of any kind. the prospect of being single should be something that you are perfectly happy with returning to. your partner will have no undue control over you when you are in this state of mind. your partner will have no leverage over you in any way if you are 100% prepared to return to being single the second you're displeased.
do not emotionally invest in any way, shape, or form until you have kissed her. if you are crushing on a girl from afar, fantasising about her, any of that shit, you will come across as needy and weak. don't do that shit.
[–]cmaroguy 5 points6 points7 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
Agreed. I recently got the balls to make moves on the girl I like and kissed her. It went very well but I can sense a stronger draw towards her. What advice do you have to keep that emotion from getting to strong? I’m not simping like waiting for her response or any of that shit. But I can feel a stronger connection to her now and want things to progress and work out.
[–]RedditsOlderBrah 8 points9 points10 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
as long as you have no fear of being single, now that you have kissed her some emotional involvement is appropriate. emphasis on 'some'. try to keep the emotions proportional to the stage of the relationship. now that you've kissed, feeling connected to her and a desire to spend more time with her is appropriate, and you'll non-verbally be communicating that to her. your emotions would be inappropriate at this stage if you had a constant impulse to text her and stayed awake at night composing poetry that you'd whisper to the wind.
[–]cmaroguy 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Yeah almost a week later now. She’s definitely less communicative and we don’t see each other as much. I feel kind of lost as to what to do. She still sends flirty messages here and there but won’t make as much effort to get together as she did before. What should I do?
[–]musclemaniac3 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Until you have kissed her
More like don't invest emotionally until you have smashed her
[–]Defc0n5_89 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Mmm, thanks for expanding…really good points
[–]Dakessian 3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
I meet people halfway. If they can’t do that, Im out.
[–][deleted] 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
It's like "I am so confident with my attractiveness and value that I don't really need anyone's approval". Which is a BIG trait in a life partner for women.
[–][deleted] 5 points6 points7 points 3 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
A man’s attractiveness is determined by the person he’s attracted to. There’s is no secret formula.
[–][deleted] 5 points6 points7 points 3 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
This is perhaps more accurate. I've had women who despise me as much as I've had women want to ride me in the bed. What's the common demoninator? I was the same person in every case. It was only the women who were different in what they were seeking and looking for - perhaps an issue of timing and so many other factors outside of my control.
[–]Keravnos- 7 points8 points9 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
well said, women are human too, different personalities preferences and tastes, a lot of comments here act like all women are universally the same that and factor in timing like you said
[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
I can only talk of probabilities and experience. It's not going to necessarily align with hard data, but you have to play with your odds and generalities of human behaviour - building up mental models of what is likely to happen, and then do what works most of the time *all* of the time - unless there are any negating factors.
[–]Ploikblah 3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
That's so daft. You can be non needy af and still get zero matches on tinder.
[–]Resident_Afternoon48 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
haha, yeah, I am happy for all unneedy people I meet on my way to work.
[–][deleted] 3 points4 points5 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
This blew my mind when i read it at first but i was still young and kinda new to game.
After reflecting a lot and studying a lot more, it's actually bullshit. Take 2 people, one is a fat fedora wearing, acne having, misogynistic dumbass that is not needy and has a i don't give a fuck attitude. Spoiler, he still not getting any women or any good women at least, maybe some girls with mental issues will be attracted to him since he reminds them of their father that used to beat them. ( even though patrice o'neal is really well regarded, he as a comedic genius but was far from understanding women. had some gold nuggets of insights bur overall he was wrong. funny, but wrong. )
The other guy is a nerd, but he goes to the gym, is fit, makes decent money, kinda shy but takes care of himself and is a good guy. He is "needy" since he didn't have a gf up till now but suprise, girls love him and make up excuses like " oh, i like virgins " or "i like that he is so quiet, he seems deep " etc. It's because he has value and the other guy doesn't. That's it. It's simple and easy.
Of course if you compare the 2nd guy to a 3rd guy that has all his qualities but is charismatic and funny and knows how to please a woman, the 3rd guy will win. But neediness is not the end all be all, it's the value of the person ( meaning the qualities and how well adjusted he is ).
So 1st guy has no value < 2nd guy has some but can improve < 3rd guy has most of his shit together and ladies love him.
[–]Environmental_Cress2 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Stupid quote. You ever met those nerds that genuinely don’t give a fuck about the opposite sex??? Just their books??
Or about those men who are authentically antisocial and all they want to do is watch anime and play video games???
Yea, they’re not needy. They got all they want. But they’re still not attractive….
I did get some pussy when I was a tall lanky nerdy kid most of high school. Because I was so socially unaware that I just talked to chicks. I figured I gotta ask them out if I wanna date them and it worked. I couldn't believe it myself.
[–]experiment_137 -1 points0 points1 point 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Shut the eff up...neediness has multiple meanings. I've been in multiple relationships and situations. Amd in case of being with a girl, it doesn't even matter. Only lesser men talk about such shite, if you're one of them you need to improve yourself instead of saying that the grapes are sour. And dude, mark mansion won't get you girls, a real world effort will do wonders. Work on your personality and physical improvement, just reading and quoting books will never lead you to a place where females are comfortable and willing to have fun. It's just you, believe in yourself.
[–]hairlossthrow4w4y 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
but what is the balance between not being needy and showing interest?
[–]Resident_Afternoon48 2 points3 points4 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
They are not the same.
Showing interest is not needy. It is how often, why and how you do it.
Think of showing interest like this: "You give because you have value to give". The problem is by not being needy we could end up not talking to strangers at all.
Or by stressing interest showing we end up doing it "too much". I think the key is to approach those you are genuinely interested in, and doing so in an acceptable way for them and you and the situation without demanding in return.
Show it, but dont push it down their throats. As an apple gives fruit, so should we. We do it because it is in our nature and it is meant to be eaten. Not by begging it to be eaten by one person, then and there.
[–]hairlossthrow4w4y 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
wow that was very insightful. This has helped me alot. thanks.
[–]epimpstyle 1 point2 points3 points 3 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Well... nobody knows the answer because it is exactly like knowing the balance when too much alpha attitude throws you in the jerk category.
In reality, it is just talking with another person, you don't need "rules" to follow when you talk to someone else because you know when too much is too much - it is common sense.
[–]hairlossthrow4w4y 0 points1 point2 points 3 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
agree i just like to hear other peoples perspectives
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[–]staggerlee718 74 points75 points76 points (10 children) | Copy Link
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[–]_ball_of_yarn 3 points4 points5 points (0 children) | Copy Link
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