Does transhumanism invalidate gender essentialism?

hyperrreal · 2014-06-24T22:26:09+00:00

The problem with this hypothetical is that, well, it's so hypothetical.

We have no idea what a trans-humanist world would look like. Maybe gender essentialism exists now but we would be destroyed. Or maybe it would continue to be operative in people's new consciousness, even without gendered bodies. Perhaps there isn't much merit to gender essentialism, and trans-humanism would have no observable impact.

Nick Bostrom has even argued that there is a not insignificant chance we are already living in a trans-humanist world as computer simulations of a period of history long since over.

While it's interesting to think about, in my opinion there are more productive ways to address the meaning of gender in our lives.

TehGinjaNinja · 2014-06-24T23:08:52+00:00

Would this invalidate the idea that the personality differences between people of each gender is completely down to sexual dimorphism?

No, because part of sexual dimorphism is psychological dimorphism. As any transgendered person could tell you, gender isn't simply a matter of your anatomy. Gender is part of your sense of self. If that self is preserved accurately, then the gender will be preserved as well.

Frankly, I would expect a transhuman scenario like you describe, to accentuate the differences between the genders. If people are able to "define their physical form" in anyway, then most men would rapidly adopt hyper masculinized forms with herculean physiques, while most women would adopt hyper feminized forms whose proportions would put Barbie to shame.

drok007 · 2014-06-24T21:43:16+00:00

I would say no, because you are no longer having or creating children. The generation that turns into robots would be the last. Also, if you are a robot I guess you don't technically have a sex anymore either, but I think the mental states would just carry over from how they were developed. Girls would be feminine robots, and boys would become masculine robots.

sh1v · 2014-06-25T02:52:03+00:00

Would this invalidate the idea that the personality differences between people of each gender is completely down to sexual dimorphism? Why or why not?

You did not adequately describe your hypothetical to the point where answering this would be possible. Specifically, you did not mention whether the transfer process would preserve psychological differences originating from sexual dimorphism.

Actually, the fact that the nature of this hypothetical transfer process, which you alone are responsible for/in control of, automatically answers your own question should be a warning sign that your post is... rather uninteresting, in terms of debate.

My second objection would be that no one believes personality differences between people of each gender are completely down to biological differences. The point of contention is to what extent those differences are biological, rather than a product of socialization.

myfriendscantknow · 2014-06-24T21:36:12+00:00

Would this invalidate the idea that the personality differences between people of each gender is completely down to sexual dimorphism?

IMO, that idea is already completely invalid. I think the differences between individuals far outweigh the personality trend differences between men and women in general.

Villaintine · 2014-06-24T23:08:46+00:00

Although not exactly what you asked, I think the biggest impact would be a lack of hormonal influence on thought. It would be most interesting to see the differences between the originally male and female [now] robots act on their own without that influence and even moreso how interactions would change if those that were female were no longer physically weaker and no longer had forms that formerly male robots desired.

roe_ · 2014-06-25T00:51:05+00:00

The whole gender/sexuality thing is hugely mal-adapted to modernity anyway - I expect the first thing trans-humanists would do is re-program it from the ground up.

Predictions are essentially useless for singularity-type events.

2comment · 2014-06-25T01:11:32+00:00

I think science will show more and more that we are our brains, that there is no clean software/hardware divide that the latest generations likes to apply based on their familiarity on computers (40+ years ago, they may have gone for a car or library analogy).

Exner2 · 2014-06-25T02:37:55+00:00

Interesting idea. I think we 're seeing a version of this in this sub - unless people use identifiers, it's not always apparent who is male and who is female.

StabbyPants · 2014-06-25T07:15:27+00:00

that allowed people to transfer their minds into robots/computer simulations/whatever

at that point, you'd have the answers to the question of gender essentialism, because it'd be in code. there might even be a slider for T and Estrogen levels.

GaiusScaevolus · 2014-06-26T04:50:24+00:00

If one's sex was just a matter of dangly bits, transexuality wouldn't be a thing.

[deleted] · 2014-06-25T01:21:50+00:00

Oooh time to break out some Asimov and William Gibson!

We ... we kinda had that. Remember Sadville, I mean Second Life? The place was wacked! I joined because my company had real estate there and we were having a "town hall". First person I met there was a hovering man/woman creature wearing clothes but had ears and a tail? I think? They were very nice but wtf was I doing?

"So God created mankind in his own image, in the image of God he created them; male and female he created them." Everything artificial we've ever made looks like us, or things we know, from ASIMO to AIBO and the robot cheetah. We can't conceive of anything else. We can't even imagine a life chemistry not based on carbon.

Title	Does transhumanism invalidate gender essentialism?
Author	Gamiac
Upvotes	7
Comments	13
Date	June 24, 2014 9:11 PM UTC (12 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/29013m/does_transhumanism_invalidate_gender_essentialism/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/does-transhumanism-invalidate-gender-essentialism.285447 https://theredarchive.com/post/285447

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