As a woman trying to fight misandry, I'm feeling tired and alone.

Joe_Immortan · 2021-05-07T03:28:18+00:00

Yeah that’s Twitter... try not to get too worked up when you’re on there. A lot of the users are nuts and many aren’t arguing in good faith. Heck, that’s probably Reddit too.

Thanks for standing up for what’s right though and not demonizing an entire class of people because of their gender

DarthMeow504 · 2021-05-07T04:24:20+00:00

Never think what you're doing is useless or unappreciated. The hateful might not listen, but others whose minds are not fully closed can be reached. Even if they don't agree or change their minds right away, just hearing a different viewpoint than the one they're immersed in can plant a seed that might later spout and grow.

Your compassion for other human beings is a credit to you, refusing to indiscriminately hate and instead extend consideration and kindness to all who need and deserve it regardless of if they are the "right kind" or not according to some discriminatory beliefs. You've recognized the truth, that we are all people and not just a set of "us" who are people and "them" who are something less. That understanding is sadly more uncommon than is good for any of us.

Do your best, sure, but don't burn yourself out. No one person can change the world by their will and effort alone. Do what you can, but never fail to take care of yourself too. You deserve that, you've more than earned it.

Thank you again for being a goodhearted person who genuinely cares to do good in the world. There aren't enough like you, sadly, but we're grateful to all we do have.

a-man-from-earth · 2021-05-07T03:52:39+00:00

We get it. Most of us have similar experiences. Even trying to communicate with a relatively open group such as the FeminismUncensored sub is an exercise in futility most of the time. Most people are entrenched and not open to letting facts challenge their views.

BloomingBrains · 2021-05-07T07:16:00+00:00

As a general rule, I usually don't bother arguing with the other side because countless times, my experience has taught me it is an exercise in futility. It's like arguing with religious people (because that's basically what they are). They won't deviate from their convictions because their position isn't evidence/logic-based, but one of faith. Misandrists selfishly believe what they want to believe. At best they are simply idiotic, not aware or comprehending of your arguments, and at worst they are willfully engaging in their hate. If sound arguments worked on them, they wouldn't be misandrists in the first place.

Ever since adopting this rule my mental health has improved dramatically. I'll still argue on rare occasions, if it seems like the person I'm talking to is seriously attempting to discuss in good faith, but even then I usually end up regretting it and the conversations are seldom productive.

My experience is as a man though, and its possible that me taking an active approach will never help much anyway, given the suspect nature of the source. As woman, you might have more credibility with feminists who would outright refuse to hear anything a man would say. Or perhaps not, based on what you wrote.

It's tough though, because as tempting as it is to say "I give up and disengage, fighting is to hard", it's also true that nothing will change unless we confront them. But its a fine line to walk, because you don't want to give so much of yourself for the cause that you burn out or become an equally rabid ideologue either.

I definitely sympathize with your feeling, and I think you for fighting with us despite the obvious stress and frustration it is causing you. It sounds like you've more than earned a break! Hope you feel better soon.

Gamer_Jack_Gameson · 2021-05-07T04:51:36+00:00

Thank you for your support. It means a lot, and it shows great character that you are able to empathize with what men experience even though you haven't had those experiences yourself. I think if more women were able to understand existence as man then a lot of hate and anger and anguish could be avoided.

key_ · 2021-05-07T04:57:12+00:00

Yeah, it absolutely blows my mind that it's apparently not okay to push for equal rights and opportunities for all genders. The way I see it, radical feminism is blatant misandry and internalized misogyny.

amkmaker1754 · 2021-05-07T15:47:45+00:00

Welcome to the shittiest club on the internet: the Anti-Misandry Woman Club! For the past few months I've been striving to maintain the status of being a disgrace to women and feminism. It's exhilarating. And refreshing. People climb down our throats because how DARE we object to woman empowerment!

For real though, those of us who get your struggle suffer in silence too. The vast majority of people who don't see the light like we do, ultimately never will. Nor will they ever want to. These people, IMHO, will never be able to break away from their prejudices that women are oppressed by a male-dominated society.

I took feminism classes and women's studies in university about 9 years ago. Looking back, jeez, were they teaching people some really toxic stuff. "Let's blame men for all the world's problems. No one's looking, right?" Well, wrong. We are looking. And we're here to speak up, because this ideology is literally killing people.

The thing that gets me through the day is KNOWING I'm doing what's right. There's no agenda against anyone, either. Just good, old fashioned support and advocacy for our male friends. So if at the end of the day you're feeling defeated, just hold onto that. You doing the right thing. And people DO notice. Hugs friend

MelissaMiranti · 2021-05-07T05:04:02+00:00

It can be hard, but what I find helps is imagining a time when what we're arguing for does make a difference. That's the Dream as it were.

danielnogo · 2021-05-07T13:11:30+00:00

What you also need to keep in mind is that radical feminism is more of a cult than a simple ideology. It involves much more social pressure than alot of people realize. Even if you reach a radical feminist, the penalty for deviating from the groupthink is extremely harsh. Their entire lives, at least online, are entwined with other radical feminist, they would be ostracized, kicked out of the group, and painted as a traitor should they give even a hint of seeing your side of things.

2021-05-07T05:47:12+00:00

Its a hard thing to fight against hate and ignorance. Sometimes you just gotta take a step back for your own mental health and focus on just loving.

Online is jut terrible too, like its great for the access to each other it provides, before someone gets online the are already expecting the dopamine rush that comes with arguing debating, grandstanding to an echo chamber etc. Trying to interrupt that expectation with like nuanced actual human relation is a tall order.

I am trying to find ways to overcome division of all sorts these days, and I think in person communication is key in so many ways. Unfortunately the extremes of each spectrum isolate with like minded folks.

ByronsLastStand · 2021-05-07T06:26:35+00:00

Thank you for your support and your help. Women who are prepared to challenge the gender feminist norms are essential to the fight for equality, and among the people I admire most. Diolch yn fawr, ffrind

Quix_Nix · 2021-05-07T06:23:03+00:00

We are not alone we are just the first. Glad to have you on board and thanks.

StarZax · 2021-05-07T08:21:52+00:00

I feel you girl. I mean, I'm a man, but I've been thinking a lot about that kind of stuff. What if I was really a misogynist and stuff. Because there are times where we feel so alone you can't help but ask yourself this kind of questions.

Just remember why you are into this. It's not because you are a pick me, a misandrist or whatever ... it's because you truely want equality and you believe this is the right thing to do.

You are already thinking in a way that those people will not, they are just saying this kind of stuff because they don't want to think deeper about those kind of things. To them it's basically like if you were saying that the Earth is flat, so they will call you names because they don't want to bother. It's not smart, but that's what they do.

There are people like you tho. We are few, but there are. And I have to say it's always really really nice to see women acknowledging men problems and trying to move forward. We all strive for equality and it warmth my heart to see that there are more and more women including men in the conversation. It's really cool.

Tarver · 2021-05-07T08:36:36+00:00

Thanks for taking the time to make this post. I think for guys who came of age in the post Trump backlash era, it would be a blessing to be reminded that there are people like you out there.

Henry_Blair · 2021-05-07T11:14:40+00:00

Remember that we all appreciate what you're doing and support you here. And also that the benefit in these discussions is usually not in convincing a fanatic but in demonstrating her fanaticism to all those watching, which I promise you that you most probably have done beautifully. On behalf of everyone reading this, I wish to send you love and appreciation!

mhandanna · 2021-05-07T11:37:33+00:00

Gamma bias may go some way to explain some people's hesitation to view gender issues more comprehensively:

https://malepsychology.org.uk/2018/12/04/why-are-there-so-many-disagreements-about-gender-issues-its-usually-down-to-gamma-bias/

Plus they released a book. I dont know about anyone else, but I really like hearing mens issues disucssed in this academic, rational way.... and without the idealogical underpinnings, and as you said all these pick me internalised misogyny, boot licker of patriarchy mud slinging.

Just click the thumbnail to read most of it for free:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Perspectives-Male-Psychology-Introduction-Textbooks/dp/1119685354/ref=sr_1_6?dchild=1&qid=1618499621&refinements=p_27%3ABarry+John&s=books&sr=1-6

With the more radical types like your describing, its often bad experiences with male family and then relationships that then leads them to misandric elements and collectivist elements of feminsim..... the idealogy just is so appealing and in a non optimal way solves many of their needs.... just not well, like a drug addiction.... With men with similar experiences it may lead to their version of misogynistic generalisations.

MrElderwood · 2021-05-07T09:05:28+00:00

I wish I could say your experiences were unusual but, as you'll already know, they're sadly not.

The fact you try to fight and have your voice heard at all is something I would like to thank you for. Few women are aware enough of the issues facing men and boys to know there is something to be said in the first place. Thank you.

But you must, must, look after yourself first, physically and mentally. After all, I suspect that the 'fight' will not be over and done with after you have a well-earned snooze!

Rest well, in the knowledge that you are a very welcome ally.

danielnogo · 2021-05-07T13:05:55+00:00

You dont have to be a man to be in this fight, you're voice is just as important as everyone elses, maybe even more so.

You aren't a man, but misandry effects women too. The effects this misandrist culture has on men flows to the women in their lives.

KingRasmen · 2021-05-07T14:22:44+00:00

First, thank you. I don't even post on Twitter and it's often quite an overwhelming experience going there.

Take time for yourself to breathe.

Granted, I should have realized the radfem I was talking to wouldnt have her mind changed anyway and I should just leave be.

I'd like to give you the best piece of internet advice I know:

What you say in an argument on the internet is for the audience of readers, not for the person you are debating. The person you are debating is giving you opportunities to present your case to the silent readers.

If you change the mind of the person you're debating, great, but that's not the purpose, nor should it be expected. The debate is for the audience, even though you're "addressing" the other person.

I want the feelings of my own sisters thinking I'm a traitor, a misandrist, or a pick me to disappear

You're a person; a human.

Again, thanks :)

mrmensplights · 2021-05-07T13:27:56+00:00

Heya - i’m sorry you feel worn by your experiences. I really appreciate that you spend your time advocating for boys and men, but remember to take time to take care of yourself first and foremost.

It helps me when debating people online to keep in mind that the purpose isn’t to convince them, but rather the audience. When it comes to the internet, you’re on a stage and everyone else watching. You’ll no more convince your opponent than you would in an actual debate.

2021-05-07T14:12:36+00:00

Twitter feuds are horrible sorry to read you went through that.

Thank you for trying anyway! As a woman your voice as considerably more clout. It's a lot harder to typecast you as a toxic masculinity misogynist monster than the rest of us.

SylV3520 · 2021-05-07T14:37:43+00:00

I know exactly how you feel. It's so tiring and it feels useless. The way I see it, if I can change just one person's mind then its worth it. (Usually this is easier outside of spaces like twitter lol)

Tristan_D_C_Wintle · 2021-05-08T03:05:11+00:00

My advice would be to not get too emotionally invested in Internet arguments. I sometimes like to jump into arguments just to see where things go, but you have to realize that you probably aren't going to change the person's mind. Internet arguments are mostly about the audience. If you can keep your cool and remain rational while calling out and refuting refuting the nonsense and providing the facts, the readers will recognize that, and you never know whose mind you'll end up changing.

2021-05-09T15:26:06+00:00

Thank you for fighting for men. I really appreciate it. There's nothing wrong with taking breaks to recharge. Hell I wouldn't blame you if you took year long breaks lol. I agree with you about misandry contributing to male violence. That's how you know the misandry we face is incredibly powerful, because a person who only cares about men, but doesn't hate men, can easily see that dehumanizing men repeatedly will lead to more male violence.

2021-05-08T18:16:53+00:00

[permanently deleted]

Title	As a woman trying to fight misandry, I'm feeling tired and alone.
Author	CERTAINLYnotsoup
Upvotes	322
Comments	27
Date	May 7, 2021 3:17 AM UTC (5 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates/comments/n6p2yp/as_a_woman_trying_to_fight_misandry_im_feeling/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates/as-a-woman-trying-to-fight-misandry-im-feeling.1061396 https://theredarchive.com/post/1061396

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