Is concern about toxic masculinity linked with concerns about warfare?

poison-fang-blade · 2018-09-29T13:14:03+00:00

"Toxic masculinity" is everything that renders men out of control of women.

Getting rid of "toxic masculinity" basically makes you some spineless soyboy who bends over at every whim to please women. A castrated servant, in a sense.

Ascimator · 2018-09-29T12:32:56+00:00

Why does everything about humanity have to be gendered?

TheGreasyPole · 2018-09-29T13:23:25+00:00

There are lots of things I’d like to dispute about your OP.

For a start the assumption that “Toxic Masculinity” is an agenda that’s primarily developed and pushed by men (whatever their motivations). It’s true it was originally coined by a male group, but I’d contend that it’s further development, popularisation, and current specific incarnation were all done by women to support their own ends (making men less dangerous to them and their goals).

Supposing we ignored that point and assumed it was men. Even then, I’d dispute it was created out of fear of any wider societal development at all, that doesn’t seem to fit either. Even if we accept that (for the sake of argument) too... I’d go further and argue it certainly wasn’t developed in response to “threat of war” or “threat of nuclear war” in particular.

I don’t know if you’ve noticed, but males in general are very pre-disposed to be pro-conflict and pro-war. So much so that, in general, anti-war feeling among men generally doesn’t develop until several years into a war causing massive casualties to that nations men.

This whole thing seems to me to be the post hoc ergo propter hoc fallacy (“It happened after, so it was caused by”).

Which particular way that I think this is wrong did you want to talk about ? The comments will stay shorter if we go one at a time...

theambivalentrooster · 2018-09-29T13:33:30+00:00

Women like masculinity less and less when the core functions of masculinity (aggression, bravery, impulsiveness, decisiveness, physical strength, probably more I'm forgetting) when there is less need of it.

When your town/city/country is under threat of invasion masculine men are highly valued. When your biggest concern is upvotes/likes/thumbs up on social media, getting your kid to school on time, buying the latest smart phone, masculinity seems like a gross relic of a sexist past.

iLLprincipLeS · 2018-09-29T13:58:18+00:00

is connected with their unspoken fear of cuckolding

To understand better, just have a look at who's behind the CORRECT THINK website that raped TheRedPill's sidebar:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Kimmel

http://www.rolereboot.org/family/details/2012-09-raising-feminist-sons-a-conversation-with-michael-an

When I asked Michael what made him proudest about Zach, he named his compassion, his happiness, and his strong conscience. He pointed out that he and his wife hadn’t raised their son to be a feminist advocate. “We wanted him to find his own interests,” Michael says, “but we also wanted him to have a strong moral compass.” The Kimmels are secular Jews; “we don’t have the religious faith that serves as a quick shorthand to determine right and wrong.” But feminism has served as part of that moral compass for Michael, and it increasingly informs how his son sees the world. “That wasn’t something we foisted on him,” Michael notes, “he’s chosen this for himself.”

As fathers to sons, Michael and I are at least as concerned with prevention as with redemption. By encouraging our boys to understand that they are as capable of emotional depth and kindness as girls, by showing them by our actions that their male biology is not an impediment to empathy, we can raise up a generation of young men who won’t make the same kind of sexist and destructive mistakes for which so many in their fathers’ generation need to atone. That’s not just wishful thinking; it’s what Michael and Zach Kimmel are living out. As a dad to my beautiful four-month-old David, their example fills me with tremendous hope.

The concern about Toxic masculinity is the fear of the males of a matrilineal group of being cucked. What these people call Toxic Masculinity is actually Competition that can cuck them. The Red Pill embraces Alpha Masculinity which the males of matrilineal group calls Toxic Masculinity. The male group that fears it could be cucked by the Alpha Chad opposes Toxic Masculinity and promotes Feminism as a way for women to resent the Alpha Chad and see him as privileged male that is part of the patriarchy which is responsible for all the unhappiness of the feminist female; it also promotes for males "Positive Masculinity" or "Feminism", which as Kimmel said in the interview, serves as a moral compass, a slave mentality of Beta Masculinity. It is no wonder this group which puts women on a pedestal and glorifies the single mother, offered America the most school shooters.. You're worried about nuclear warfare? Be worried about real Toxic Masculinity - Beta Masculinity - the beta son of a feminist mother will use the nuke to take out competition, The Red Pill Alpha Chad will just fuck your wife.

MisterJose · 2018-10-01T01:54:58+00:00

Yes and no. Trump is a massively insecure person with severe mental problems. His need to not be shown up and to look tough is going to be way larger than the average man. Men who are actually tough and secure do not behave like that. Hate to make it a direct left/right link, but Barack Obama was very much a contracting example of a very secure guy. It's funny and sad that Trumpers have walked themselves into that being the case - loving a guy who is so insecure while the guy they hated is a clear example of the exact opposite, but hey, they did it to themselves.

The idea that male leaders in general are more aggressive than female leaders has not been shown to be true in practical reality. Actual female leaders historically have been quite aggressive. Whether women who rise to the top are that way because rising to the top necessitated being that way is something to consider, but one must be careful not to just assume, "Oh, we'll just get women of a different temperament in power." How? You don't want or get power by being passive.

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abaxeron · 2018-09-29T14:12:11+00:00

Historically, female leaders were more likely to wage wars than male leaders. "Wzamzen arth goott" is a myth. Current warfare is less severe and less bloody than any other military conflicts in any point in human history; and has highest survivability of military personnel and wounded-to-killed ratio.

Is it a coincidence that RP became especially popular only after the Cold War ended in 1991 (about 20 years later, when kids were maturing who had not experienced the Cold War)?

Yes; RP became popular in 2000s, not in 1990s, and not in 2010s. Neil Strauss' "The Game" got published in 2005.

What about the fact that hippies with long hair (men rejecting conventional masculinity) were the first kids who had not experienced the world before nuclear weapons?

What about them?

Is it a coincidence that concerns about MeToo surfaced, and TRP has been quarantined, at the same time democrats are trying to restrict Trump’s ability to fire a nuclear first strike?

Yes. MeeToo surfaced some time earlier. And prior to MeToo, there was "Yes Means Yes". And prior to that, there was "1 in 4" and "bystander intervention". Feminism is a non-stop bullshit factory; some of its output will inevitably coincide with global political events.

Title	Is concern about toxic masculinity linked with concerns about warfare?
Author	AlanHalworth
Upvotes	2
Comments	62
Date	September 29, 2018 12:30 PM UTC (7 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/9jw8pn/is_concern_about_toxic_masculinity_linked_with/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/is-concern-about-toxic-masculinity-linked-with.260652 https://theredarchive.com/post/260652

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