A Guy asking a question!

pearlsandstilettos · 2020-06-18T16:56:52+00:00

FYI: We don't usually allow men to ask questions but this (to me) is more a topic for discussion than a question that typically belongs on askTRP. OP as a rule, we aren't here for you to study 'what women think' but as long as the women decide to participate in this thread, I'll leave it up.

werthtrillions · 2020-06-18T07:05:56+00:00

Interesting. Definitely ideas worth entertaining here.

Paul wrote in Ephesians 5:33 that a husband must love his wife and a wife must respect her husband.

As a woman, I used to feel annoyed at this idea, but through my experience, I know that in order for me to really be attracted to and fall in love w/ a man, I have to respect him first. But maybe that's just me.

Femininity has really been demonized by our society which is partly why I think feminists are out for vengeance. Masculinity was/is respected whereas femininity was/is trivialized. I fear that until men can accept and value their own femininity and see it as a strength, toxic femininity will continue to be a force of self-destruction in and across society.

kittxxn · 2020-06-18T10:33:40+00:00

It’s likely a positive feedback loop. It wasn’t effeminate men -> masculine women, it was both happening at the same time, reinforcing one another. For example, the advent of the BC pill allowed women to act like men, decades of Hollywood glorified casual sex, women entered the workforce, having been liberated from the constraints of child rearing, and began telling men to be more sensitive and supportive. Men, with their reproductive success prospects hanging in the balance, began to comply, affirming and supporting women’s empowerment (and ended up getting a ton of low-cost sex in the process). Sex itself was devalued from a marital bond to a bunch of people gratifying one another in cheap contractual encounters, and the age-old family dynamic began to break down.

I think it’s possible that feminism is somewhat of a shit test, but I think that women have always needed men for safety and security, and no longer do. So we can get away with a lot more BS than we could have 100 years ago. That’s not man or woman’s fault, just a product of modern comfort.

My point is, what has happened to the genders over the last 70 years is deeply complex and multifaceted. I’ve spent the better part of the last 6 years seriously aimed at understanding it. Your theory is a pretty good model but it just barely scratches the surface.

jonathaninfresno · 2020-06-18T09:25:02+00:00

Wow i love it here❤️ this is the only place on the Internet that we actually get along. Im not leaving

Flatwormmm · 2020-06-18T10:35:40+00:00

I do think that men as a whole have lost their frame, and that when you combine this with the devaluation of femininity, it makes sense that women are pushing further and further into feminism. Just like in a relationship, it's unwise to surrender and show your softness when you can't trust a man to lead competently.

I think that a lot of the bitterness we see from men toward women comes from a place of weakness. They don't feel strong enough to lead/direct a woman, they get angry and sour over it, women sense this and turn further away from male authority.

Look at the capable, masculine men out there who love their women, and you'll find women clamoring to follow them. Look at the weak, negative complainers and you'll find disrespect and a dead bedroom. This is true on the personal and the political level I believe.

ThorsdaySaturnday · 2020-06-18T08:55:37+00:00

I don’t agree completely but you may be onto something. I once dated a feminine man and indeed I resented being the masculine one.

I wouldn’t say that modern feminism is a giant shit test. It’s more an overreaction to women having unequal rights. The pendulum swung too far in the opposite direction and there are confused women walking around with the belief that the way to correct the sex inequality is to become more masculine and beat the man at their own game. Sadly, this results in heartbreak.

I’ve read The Way of The Superior Man and it is spot on from the female perspective. I even gave it to my brother to read after seeing his struggles with women. He is now happily married :)

Edit: Shaunti Feldham’s books are also insightful reads if you enjoyed TWOTSM

HappilyMrs · 2020-06-18T11:00:52+00:00

Lots of good answers already, just something I wanyed to pick up on.

I'm not sure the ManChild stuff necessary is connected to the balance. Too many men do not own their shit, and this results in them adding to the workload. Given that women are still disproportionately doing the housework, even those who also work full time, this breeds a resentment and lack of respect. Go into any mainstream female space, and there will be a lot of anger over the division of labour in households. Women frequently feel like their husband is an extra child, and it is a libido killer, for good reason! This is why I think what is labelled Choreplay on Deadbrdroom subs is often a symptom of a bigger issue, and not just about how he never vacuums. If he isn't owning his shit, and she feels like his mum rather than his wife, she won't want sex.

The advertisers have played on this laziness to create what we call in our house Incompetent Man Syndrome. The solution is for men to get their acts together and challenge this.

I don't think it stems from women emasculating them, it stems from laziness that has become more pronounced as women have taken on a working outside the home role on top of everything else.

19_LadyScarlet_90 · 2020-06-18T17:40:26+00:00

I can definitely agree with the part about men who lack integrity & a strong will end up pushing their wives into more masculine roles & eventually, resentment. I can say that because, well, a few years ago, that was me.

My ex husband struggled with depression & his sexuality, both of which I was somewhat aware of when we married, but he assured me he'd dealt with both. Well, he hadn't, & it made him into a man who lacked leadership skills, ambition, & overall masculinity. I had to step up & take on more masculine roles in the home, because he refused to get help for his problems. Eventually, I lost all respect for him & began to resent him, & looking back, I can say that me having to almost be the man of the house turned me into someone I didn't like, or even recognize. As a woman, it's near impossible to submit yourself to someone you don't respect and who has no desire to step up to his masculine role.

After we divorced, I spent some time working on myself, researched the roles of husbands & wives & the dynamics that exist in healthy marriages, & gained a much better understanding of marriage as a whole (Christian perspective here). I am now remarried to a wonderful man who I absolutely adore & have the utmost respect for.

BrainOil · 2020-06-18T07:21:23+00:00

I'm a guy and I actually found this sub by clicking the random button one day. It's pretty interesting and I'm all about learning perspectives.

2020-06-18T15:02:27+00:00

No offense, but this is not a new idea, and it isn't unique to the 21st century either. Have you read DH Lawrence? He sets out this idea very clearly in Lady Chatterley's Lover.

HappilyMrs · 2020-06-18T18:03:14+00:00

Thank you :)

I don't think feminism helps itself in this. We hear a lot about Emotional Labour and Mental Load. Women say they want men to do more housework, but I would place money that what most really want is to be able to respect him because he isn't making her life harder, and shows some gratitude and acknowledgement. A "House looks good, babe!" or "Having you make my lunch gives me more time to grope you" with an ass grab goes a long way. I don't think it is the chores at the root of it, it's feeling unseen and disrespected, and breeds resentment and a loss of respect for him.

I also think it is one of the reasons having kids damages a lot of relationships. She has an extra layer to her workload, whereas his workload in the home is often perceived to be unchanged. The resentment of husbands (or more often boyfriends) in groups of mums is shocking. And again, respect is lost. The men are not leading the family at a time when it is vitally needed.

HappilyMrs · 2020-06-19T08:20:05+00:00

I think you could well be on to something there.

We like a man who is competent, controls himself well, is emotionally resilient against the world, but has a tender spot where we are concerned, and is expressive about his love and adoration. But it needs to come from a place of strength, not weakness.

Being able to read what we need when we need it is good, and takes a level of emotional intelligence that isn't commonly hailed as an alpha trait. He needs to be emotional enough to be able to have empathy, but not so much that it feels like we have to hold his hand and baby him.

Some of that I think comes down to the Disneyfication of romantic relationships. We are now told that out relationships must provide everything we could possibly need, and if they don't, we choose the wrong person. A husband should not just be the breadwinner, he should also be a father figure who takes care of us, a best friend we tell everything to, a girlfriend who will spend hours looking at clothes and interiors with us, a boyfriend who still courts us like it's a new relationship, a personal assistant, a handyman, and a co-parent. As women's relationships with each other have become more competitive and less cooperative, we have been taught to fill that gap with our spouses. In my opinion, that's not healthy. My husband does not want to spend 4 days looking at different light features for our living room, where as my best friend and I will happily do that with each other. My husband doesn't need to hear my constant body anxieties, but my best friend has her own, and we can work through that together. Sure, I want him to.see me in new jeans, tell me I'm sexy and grind up behind me :D I don't need to tell him in minute detail which bits I think they don't flatter.

We want men to be emotionally expressive with how they feel about us, and so we can support them. We also can't use men as our emotional trash can or sole source of emotional outlet/validation.

Thanks for coming to my TED talk (rambled on a bit there!)

Title	A Guy asking a question!
Author	LinenMonk
Upvotes	15
Comments	43
Date	June 18, 2020 6:32 AM UTC (6 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/RedPillWomen
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/RedPillWomen/comments/hb9a36/a_guy_asking_a_question/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/RedPillWomen/a-guy-asking-a-question.696768 https://theredarchive.com/post/696768

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