Inside agencies, men and women still struggle to deal with the fall out of #MeToo | Advertising agencies have gone gender-segregated: female clients are serviced by all-female teams, male clients by male teams. Male employees will not have lunch or drinks with female employees any more.

irrelevantmoniker · 2020-02-04T19:21:43+00:00

" “I find this absurd and disturbing. That says two things about you: Either you’ve done something you’re afraid you might repeat, or you think you’ll do something you shouldn’t. Either way, that’s unacceptable.” "

Or that you'll be accused of something that you didn't do and in this climate of knee jerk listen and believe where the accusation is the verdict you'll have your reputation and career destroyed. But strangely you seem unwilling to see that possibility.

Honestly the ongoing inability of them to address the elephant in the room is almost funny in its way.

rabel111 · 2020-02-04T20:43:51+00:00

Note that the article only shows empathy for women, translating women's experiences as victims of men's behaviour, just like the original #metoo mob.

Male experiences are all explained in negative terms without any empathy.

There is a gender problem in this article, and the problem is women.

2020-02-04T17:58:26+00:00

" “I feel like it has shifted from sexual misconduct to sexual exclusion,” says Sarah. "

No shit. They've placed men in the unenviable position of being solely responsible for both their own actions and every woman's possible interpretation of those actions and then setup a system where the man has no recourse when (not if) he is accused of something, truthful or not.

It's simply not safe for men to associate with women in this workplace enviroment. All the handwringing and finger pointing in the world isn't going to change that equation.

bufedad · 2020-02-04T20:38:34+00:00

“I find this absurd and disturbing. That says two things about you: Either you’ve done something you’re afraid you might repeat, or you think you’ll do something you shouldn’t. Either way, that’s unacceptable.”

Men's efforts to prove they aren't a witch is proof that they are obviously a witch.

skymonstef · 2020-02-04T22:12:17+00:00

Another article skipping the third reason. Women can and do lie.

So why should I risk my career to mentor women?

I actually believe we are heading towards gender segregation again

tenchineuro · 2020-02-04T18:14:59+00:00

“I’ve heard this first-hand—male leaders telling me they avoid one-on-ones with female members of staff, or that they always ensure there is someone else in the meeting,” says Simon Fenwick, 4A’s evp of talent, equity and inclusion.

I was going to suggest that Simon Fenwick was a name to keep an eye out for, since people who talk about this sort of thing often end up getting purged themselves, but based on his profile I'm going to guess that Simon is gay and therefore not at risk of being accused of making a pass at a female colleague.

“I find this absurd and disturbing. That says two things about you: Either you’ve done something you’re afraid you might repeat, or you think you’ll do something you shouldn’t. Either way, that’s unacceptable.”

Apart from the possibilities you list, the men could be responding rationally to a risk of ambiguity and misunderstanding, or to a risk of bad intent on the part of their female colleague (if we're allowed to say that women in the ad industry might be as ruthless and deceptive as the men). So amateur-psychologizing right back atcha, what does it say about you when you proclaim your confidence that a man's heart is an open book to you, that his true reasons for any decision are clear to you, and all you see in that heart is bad conscience and bad intent?

“Men have this sense of being accused, they’re like, ‘I’m not like that,’” says a senior art director at a creative agency. “There are little sarcastic jokes that are meant to be funny but are on the defense like, ‘Oh, it’s just the two of you in that conference room? Be careful!’ The casualness and the snarkiness that now exists between men and women, and among both groups separately, makes it feel like there’s this unresolved issue.”

They're responding to genuine risks to their livelihood and career. Are they supposed to take it passively?

2020-02-04T17:20:40+00:00

And this is how you go back in time. "Everything was better back in the day"-my ass

elebrin · 2020-02-04T19:10:15+00:00

No real surprise. We've gotten to the point where the most important thing to do if you want to keep your job is to not get accused of something. If none of the women know you, ideally they don't even know your name, they can't really accuse you. So you keep your head down, keep quiet, and socialize with your male peers outside of work, don't allow women in, and be highly selective of who you socialize with. Keep work strictly work and social time a bit more flexible.

I don't tell my boss what I do in my spare time. They don't need to know. All my co-workers know about me is that I like to tell terrible jokes and that I get all my work done on time. I don't offer them any more than that.

Consilio_et_Animis · 2020-02-04T19:12:06+00:00

"Some of the women said that it’s not as if they are humorless or can’t take a joke..."

Yeah. Right.

tenchineuro · 2020-02-04T20:50:59+00:00

In the two-and-a-half years since the movement transformed businesses and conversations around harassment all over the world, Sarah says she’s only had female clients; the art directors that she’s partnered with are female; that she hasn’t once been asked to lunch or drinks by her male colleagues and that the men she’d like to mentor her will barely answer her questions in the hallway, let alone spend any time with her. Post-#MeToo, Sarah says she’s missing out on opportunities because she’s female.

Jordan Peterson says that we are currently undergoing an experiment as to whether men and women can work together, it's becoming more apparent every day that the answer is no.

MagicTire · 2020-02-04T22:38:53+00:00

The title of the article is misleading. The reader is led to believe that it will illustrate how both women and men are genuinely struggling, presumably in different ways, but equal measure. As you continue reading the article, the point of the piece becomes more and more clear: once again, this is all men's fault. No real concern for men who are trying to protect themselves from possible (not likely, of course, but still possible) false harassment accusations; it's all about all those horrible sexist jokes that men are apparently cracking nonstop. So, are both women and men struggling, according to this article? Of course they are-- women for being laughed at and excluded, and men struggling to understand what in the world they're doing wrong, since they apparently don't have a clue.

throwlaca · 2020-02-05T00:40:45+00:00

I'm in some feminists chats (undercover) you wouldn't believe what happen there. Women talk about their daily job, writing any non-acceptable interaction with any of their coworkers, even conversations between coworkers that don't include them. They talk about them, hate them, and register everything, with name, position and the text. They have those "agents" in every conceivable business here. That's why they are so quickly to respond and cancel people.

If Norm Macdonald or Dave Chapelle were employees and told jokes from their stand-up, they would be fired in way, way less than a week.

daddymooch · 2020-02-05T06:55:31+00:00

Men get falsely accused and their lives are ruined. We have been saying this movement was going to lead to this kind of thing they just didn’t care and now want to cry about it.

NohoTwoPointOh · 2020-02-04T17:27:11+00:00

This is a true victory for women. I wish every company would adopt these pro women work programs.

Edit. Idiots. Yes it stopped the ugly guys from flirting with you but also stopped the cute guys. Boo hoo.

Given that some 16% of marriages start at work. Good luck gals.

2020-02-05T18:02:34+00:00

Hilarious world view

SsoulBlade · 2020-02-05T05:04:16+00:00

This is good news. Once these actions hits mainstream, we will have a segregated system, etc, ust like in some Arab countries.

This is what you wanted feminists. Now go lie in the bed you made.

BramblEdge · 2020-02-06T23:51:05+00:00

Female privilege backfires.

Uqtpa · 2020-02-05T12:11:40+00:00

It's crazy how women want the right to throw innocent men into prison without having a shred of evidence, and then they expect men to just accept it.

throwlaca · 2020-02-05T00:33:37+00:00

As it always was, and always should be.

We humans are not prepared to work with people of the other gender.

Comments