A tubmlr feminist's view of men's rights, a list of men's issues and a solution for each.

Lion_amongst_gods · 2019-04-20T06:31:38+00:00

Every line here is a men's rights problem with a flavour of feminist "solution".

problem_redditor · 2019-04-20T09:46:26+00:00

This list is so fucking stupid. It assumes that all of men's problems are caused by men and that we should be employing "solutions" that take no action to directly solve inequalities against men.

You’re angry about men dying in wars? Then protest against wars.

Yes, because I'm sure wars stop simply because a group of people says it should.

You’re angry about the number of men who commit suicide? Then protest against the belief that bullying is a natural fact of life. Demand that healthcare for disabled people be more accessible.

You what?

Do you have any idea what causes the number of men who commit suicide to be so high? Do you think "bullying" plays any major factor in it?

You’re angry about circumcision? Then protest against the belief that children are the property of their parents instead of autonomous human beings.

Or better yet, directly oppose the belief that circumcision is "morally defensible" and "has health benefits", because a huge amount of the time parents literally think they're doing it for the benefit of their child. Get people to see it for what it really is which is non-consensual mutilation of a body part which can have long-term adverse health effects on a person. Target the bodies such as the UN who outright promote MGM as a solution in places such as Africa.

You’re angry about men being labeled as dangerous? Then protest against racism, ableism, and homophobia. Men of color, disabled men, and gay men are labeled as dangerous on a regular basis and are frequently threatened because of it.

Ah, yes. So we shouldn't address a men's issue as a men's issue and instead address it as an issue of sexuality or race.

Or maybe, just maybe, we should be replacing the feminist models such as the Duluth Model, that outright tells police to automatically identify the man as the abuser in domestic violence solutions, with more egalitarian ones. Maybe we should push for reform to a justice system that gives men longer sentences than women for the same crime. Maybe we should target the feminists who reinforce this viewpoint by continually degrading men as being toxic, dangerous, rapists who need to be taught how not to be violent.

You’re angry about society not caring when a man is assaulted by a woman? Then demand that people stop making fun of boys for “fighting like a girl”, “losing to a girl”, or “getting beat up by a girl”.

Again painting this as an issue of muhsoggyknee. Or maybe we should address the idea that assault is more justifiable when a woman perpetrates it, and that assault is more acceptable when perpetrated against a man.

You’re angry about society not caring when teenage boys are raped by grown women? Then tell other men to stop high-fiving each other and calling him “lucky”.

See above. And maybe we should be also changing the laws, which in some countries currently makes it so that women essentially can't be rapists, to include "made to penetrate" in its definition of rape.

And guess what. You wouldn’t be alone, because those “evil social justice warriors” who you hate so much would 100% agree with you.

No, these evil social justice warriors would attack us for trying to "punish" women and for being misogynists who don't like the advances that women have made. They've already been doing it for a while due to the fact that we actually want to directly help men, instead of helping women and hoping that helps men as a side effect.

iainmf · 2019-04-20T06:12:27+00:00

This was posted here by another user an hour ago with the title 'thoughts?' it was removed by mods while i was typing my comment, and rather than waste a perfectly good comment I have decided to repost it with a (hopefully) acceptable title.

each item on the list is a misandric feminist talking point, on the list as a whole i have some observations.

let me call out the 7th item on this list

You're angry about men being the most common victims of violence? Then demand that people stop making fun of men for refusing to fight or for showing emotions other than anger.

The entire list assumes that the only emotion a man might feel is anger, each article on the list begins with this assumption, and each one suggests a target to be attacked.

In order, here are the modes of attack suggested.

protest , demand, demand, protest, demand, protest, demand, protest, demand, tell society to stop, tell other men to stop, protest.

Note that when considering 'modes of attack' or 'ways of bringing change' the actions of protest and demand are actions that can be taken by powerless person or group. these are actions that can be taken by a child. these are not actions, in this context, that can be undertaken by a 'patriarchy' or an 'oppressor'.

The writer of this list sees men as a huddled mass of starving rabble, cowering outside the gates of feminism. The writer recommends no action, or very little action directly in support of men, but rather focuses on helping women and girls, in the belief that this will solve all of men's issues as a byproduct, in a sort of 'trickle down theory of human rights'.

the_annoying_one1 · 2019-04-20T12:42:05+00:00

Something tells me this girl has not been in ANY mens rights protests

Treeclimber3 · 2019-04-20T17:46:40+00:00

You’re angry about men dying on the job? Then demand safer working conditions.

Says the modern Millennial woman so utterly divorced from the history of the labour movement to even know where she got the 40 hour work week, sick days, holidays, the fact her kids don't have to work with her, OHS legislation, etc. that she enjoys in her air conditioned office, while men build shit, maintain shit, climb shit, descend into shit, fix broken shit, scrape off shit, farm shit, truck shit, ship shit, pack and unpack shit, so that she can work the safe and easy jobs that depend on all that shit.

All of these are terrible, but this one is inexcusable. Thousands of men DIED worldwide, to get us our work situations. She might as well have just pissed on their graves.

ignigenaquintus · 2019-04-20T18:32:36+00:00

https://becauseits2015.wordpress.com/2017/07/16/trickle-down-equality-and-framing-mens-issues-as-really-being-about-women/

Ninja_Arena · 2019-04-20T10:21:26+00:00

Aren't those what MRAs are already trying to do? I'm personally all about protesting wars etc.

The problem with the so called "social justice warriors" is that they usually deny that male-specific problems exist. They focus almost exclusively on women's problems and even in the rare occasion that they address an issue that affects men more, they still almost never focus on men and make it gender neutral even if those affected are 99% male. That is male erasure. For example, most homeless people are male, yet all of the gender-related research on this issue focuses on women. Interesting, isn't it?

iainmf · 2019-04-20T08:52:42+00:00

Please, consider posting the image of text as actual text next time.

For your convenience in this thread.

You’re angry about men dying in wars? Then protest against wars.

You’re angry about men dying on the job? Then demand safer working conditions.

You’re angry about most homeless people being men? Then demand that society help the poor so no one is homeless.

You’re angry about the number of men who commit suicide? Then protest against the belief that bullying is a natural fact of life. Demand that healthcare for disabled people be more accessible.

You’re angry about “ladies’ nights” at bars? Then demand that men stop lusting after drunk women. That’s literally the only reason why ladies’ nights exist.

You’re angry about circumcision? Then protest against the belief that children are the property of their parents instead of autonomous human beings.

You’re angry about men being the most common victims of violence? Then demand that people stop making fun of men for refusing to fight or for showing emotions other than anger.

You’re angry about men being labeled as dangerous? Then protest against racism, ableism, and homophobia. Men of color, disabled men, and gay men are labeled as dangerous on a regular basis and are frequently threatened because of it.

You’re angry about society not caring when a man is assaulted by a woman? Then demand that people stop making fun of boys for “fighting like a girl”, “losing to a girl”, or “getting beat up by a girl”.

You’re angry when women don’t trust men? Then tell society to stop blaming rape victims for trusting men too much.

You’re angry about society not caring when teenage boys are raped by grown women? Then tell other men to stop high-fiving each other and calling him “lucky”.

You’re angry about no one caring when men are raped in prison? Then protest against the belief that prisoners forfeit their basic human rights. Also demand an end to laws against victimless actions that put them in prison in the first place.

And guess what. You wouldn’t be alone, because those “evil social justice warriors” who you hate so much would 100% agree with you.

14b755fe39 · 2019-04-20T22:05:04+00:00

golly, protesting never crossed my mind,

2019-04-20T13:04:16+00:00

complain!

- a woman

alclarkey · 2019-04-20T14:18:09+00:00

You’re angry about men dying in wars? Then protest against wars.

I'm not angry about men dying in wars. I'm angry about men dying in wars and not getting due credit for it. I'm angry about men coming back from wars after watching a comrade die, and getting shit on and told how awful he is as a man and a soldier.

You’re angry about men dying on the job? Then demand safer working conditions.

There are plenty of people out there demanding safer working conditions, and it's slowly getting better. But no, we're not necessarily mad about that, we're more mad about going through that, and then being told that we're "privileged".

You’re angry about most homeless people being men? Then demand that society help the poor so no one is homeless.

Again, not really mad about it, just mad at being called privileged while this is happening.

You’re angry about the number of men who commit suicide?

Again, it's just to illustrate that we are NOT privileged.

Then protest against the belief that bullying is a natural fact of life.

I can agree with that, but bullying is only one facet of why men commit suicide, there's whole host of reasons why men commit suicide, from feeling useless and unwanted, to having crushing child support/alimony duties, to not being able to see their kids, to being emotionally abused by the people who are supposed to support them unconditionally.

Demand that healthcare for disabled people be more accessible.

Oh, I'm sensing a little bit of Socialism plugging here, but beside that, disabled men who commit suicide are only small part of the whole picture.

You’re angry about “ladies’ nights” at bars?

Actually, I'm not really. More angry at the double standard than anything else. If we can have ladies nights at bars, then maybe we can have things that encourage men to join typically female activities, like drives to get more men to choose nursing. Especially since health care is a field that is always in demand and pays well.

Then demand that men stop lusting after drunk women.

Yeah, sorry that is an immutable biological characteristic of what it means to be a man.

You’re angry about circumcision? Then protest against the belief that children are the property of their parents instead of autonomous human beings.

They're not autonomous human beings, not yet, they still need their parents to care for them until they are old enough to care for themselves. Circumcision is not caring for them.

You’re angry about men being the most common victims of violence? Then demand that people stop making fun of men for refusing to fight or for showing emotions other than anger.

Again, it's simply another point against the idea of the privileged male.

You’re angry about men being labeled as dangerous? Then protest against racism, ableism, and homophobia. Men of color, disabled men, and gay men are labeled as dangerous on a regular basis and are frequently threatened because of it.

Minorities and gays have plenty of support RN. Men on the other hand are demonized as being inherently dangerous, even when that's a provably false assessment, and everyone just eats it up. The vast majority of us would not harm a fly, and the idea that we are dangerous comes from an ignorant mindset. Women remember the individual guys that have caused them grief, but the thousands and thousands of consummate gentlemen that they pass on the street, the guys who would not even dream of harming them, the guys who would jump on a grenade for them, are invisible to women.

You’re angry about society not caring when a man is assaulted by a woman? Then demand that people stop making fun of boys for “fighting like a girl”, “losing to a girl”, or “getting beat up by a girl”.

No man would ever get assaulted by a girl if they were allowed by society to defend themselves. It would be nice for a man defending himself to not be descended upon by a horde of white knights when they do. Women would quickly realize that assaulting a creature that is minimum twice as strong as them, does not end well for them.

You’re angry when women don’t trust men?

Actually I'm not angry about this. It's actually prudent for both sexes to not be trusting of anyone at all, until that person shows themselves to be trustworthy.

Then tell society to stop blaming rape victims for trusting men too much.

Society does not blame rape victims for trusting men too much. This is a specious argument, and needs to be backed up with evidence.

You’re angry about society not caring when teenage boys are raped by grown women? Then tell other men to stop high-fiving each other and calling him “lucky”.

I'm not angry about that. I'm angry about the double standards. Rape is rape, man or woman. And if the offense is not bad enough to punish a woman severely for it, it's not bad enough to punish a man that way for it. It's time to stop demonizing male sexuality, it might help slow the male suicide rate.

You’re angry about no one caring when men are raped in prison? Then protest against the belief that prisoners forfeit their basic human rights.

They do forfeit some of their basic rights, but not all of them. There are very few crimes that merit a punishment of being raped, IE men who are raped in prison are having the right to be not be subjected to cruel and unusual punishment, violated. Prison wardens and administrators need to make more effort to protect their prisoners from being violated this way. But, and I'm beginning to sound like a broken record here, it's yet another point against the idea of male privilege.

Also demand an end to laws against victimless actions that put them in prison in the first place.

So you're with me then? Repeal all laws against solicitation of prostitutes?

And guess what. You wouldn’t be alone, because those “evil social justice warriors” who you hate so much would 100% agree with you.

No, they wouldn't.

DJ-Roukan · 2019-04-20T13:28:47+00:00

Yawn...

UltraD00d · 2019-04-20T18:44:53+00:00

As opposed to setting an example, voting for the favorable things, boycotting, and all the other ways we change things? Women really are too privileged for their own good.

2019-04-24T14:40:03+00:00

Note how none of those "solutions" are not intended in any way to help men but to use them.

It boils down to "Oh, if you'll be good allies for women I'm sure Feminism will get to you eventually!".

Well last century was an absolute bust, anyone thing Feminism will change it's stripes in the next 100 years? (Hint: No.)

Criket · 2019-04-20T15:54:33+00:00

In response to her

-to women to be raped, stop putting yourself in harm way, stay home.

-tired to be looked at, put more clothes and less makeup.

-single mom? Stop fucking chad.

-less income... then work more you dimwit!

fra_n_ff · 2019-04-21T17:09:45+00:00

Men of color, disabled men and gay men are labeled as dangerous on a daily basis

I'm sorry...what?

bhullj11 · 2019-04-22T17:58:13+00:00

Angry about women getting paid less than men? Then demand an end to wages.

Justathrowawayoh · 2019-04-21T05:18:29+00:00

most boys are circumcised because their mothers approve of it

Title	A tubmlr feminist's view of men's rights, a list of men's issues and a solution for each.
Author	headingtoshore
Upvotes	78
Comments	42
Date	April 20, 2019 6:09 AM UTC (7 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/bf97gq/a_tubmlr_feminists_view_of_mens_rights_a_list_of/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/a-tubmlr-feminists-view-of-mens-rights-a-list-of.879288 https://theredarchive.com/post/879288

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