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Denmark Moves to Ban Circumcision of Boys Under 18

wasnew4s

January 31, 2018
279 upvotes
/r/MensRights
https://www.reddit.com/r/europe/comments/7u7lxd/ban_circumcision_for_boys_under18s_says_intact/?st=JD2ZCEVL&sh=2769395e
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Post Information
Title Denmark Moves to Ban Circumcision of Boys Under 18
Author

wasnew4s

Upvotes 279
Comments 68
Date January 31, 2018 11:21 AM UTC
(8 years ago)
Subreddit Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/7u983o/denmark_moves_to_ban_circumcision_of_boys_under_18/
Archive Link https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/denmark-moves-to-ban-circumcision-of-boys-under-18.906735
https://theredarchive.com/post/906735
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Comments

[–]Tedesche 26 points27 points28 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Good news, but we'll see if it passes.

[–]omegaphallic 13 points14 points15 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Excellent news!!!

[–][deleted] 10 points11 points12 points 8 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

I doubt it’ll pass. Several countries have done this again and again and it’s never gone anywhere.

[–]the_unseen_one 5 points6 points7 points 8 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

I've always wondered what kind of person votes against a bill to stop the mutilation of infants.

[–]spacegrayalien 4 points5 points6 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

A morally bankrupt and unethical psychopath

[–]93re2 3 points4 points5 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Or perhaps a deeply wounded person in denial.

[–]killcat 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

People who see it as an attack on religion/are paid to see it as an attack on religion.

[–]Spoonwood 6 points7 points8 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

This looks like a petition so far. It doesn't look like much else has happened, at least not yet.

[–]MRA-automatron-2kb 5 points6 points7 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

DO IT !

(but will they have the exception for Abrahamic religions?)

[–][deleted] 8 points9 points10 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

(but will they have the exception for Abrahamic religions?)

No.

[–]Drago1214 6 points7 points8 points 8 years ago (79 children) | Copy Link

Good for them, good luck with all the angry Jews saying this is anti-Semitism

[–]ipwr85 3 points4 points5 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Or the Muslims.

[–]Drago1214 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

True but people brush off angry Muslims much more then angry Jews.

[+]myspamhere -8 points-7 points-6 points 8 years ago (76 children) | Copy Link

As a Jew, it is 100% anti-Semitic. In history, the first thing a government that will oppress the Jews does, is ban circumcision. The Greeks did it, the Romans, many different countries during the dark ages, Russia, Poland...etc....

[–]Religion__of__Peace 14 points15 points16 points 8 years ago (62 children) | Copy Link

It's a barbaric practice that has no place in a civilized country. Period.

Just because it affects you and your religion doesn't make it anti-semitic...there are plenty of gentiles that are pro-circumcision so stop playing the victim card.

There is no benefit, it's very painful and traumatic, and just flat out making permanent body-altering decisions on someone that can't consent.

[+]myspamhere -6 points-5 points-4 points 8 years ago (61 children) | Copy Link

You can explain it anyway you want it, but to a Jew and to most Jews, any attempt or even talk of banning is anti-semitic.

[–]Religion__of__Peace 6 points7 points8 points 8 years ago (14 children) | Copy Link

You're choosing to take it that way so whatever offense you take from it is on you, not me.

Should we ban creation as fact and teach only evolution or would that be anti-chriatian?

Should we not ban tossing homosexuals off of rooftops or would that offend Islam?

[+]myspamhere -6 points-5 points-4 points 8 years ago (13 children) | Copy Link

No, however, in history as I said banning of circumcision is a herald of very bad times for the Jews in that part of the world. There is 3500 years of history backing it up.

[–]Religion__of__Peace 8 points9 points10 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

It's not compatible with civilized countries. You shouldn't be allowed to mutilate children's genitals without their consent. I don't care what your religion is/says or for how long you've been doing it.

We moved past slavery we can move past this.

[–]Drago1214 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

You can not be circumcised and still be jewish. I don’t understand how that’s a problem.

[–]killcat 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (10 children) | Copy Link

Are you saying that it IS anti-Semitic or that it will be perceived as such?

[–]myspamhere 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link

Both. The idea itself comes from an anti jew place. Then they use other people with other intentions to carry it out

[–]5th_Law_of_Robotics 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Both. The idea itself comes from an anti jew place.

No it doesn't. That's absurd.

[–]myspamhere -1 points0 points1 point 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

History proves otherwise. Just like the BDS movement, it comes from an irrational hatred of Jews.

[–]killcat 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

I disagree. I'm against circumcision but that has nothing to do with religion, it's about not mutilating babies.

[–]myspamhere 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

You would not even think it was an issue, until you starting reading about how evil it was. The people who planted that seed are most certainly anti-Semitic.

[–]try_____another 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

If it is anti-anyone it is anti-Islamic, jews are pretty much an irrelevance to those whose position is based on nationalism or cultural considerations.

[–]5th_Law_of_Robotics 5 points6 points7 points 8 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

If your religion can't survive after giving people the right to control their own body and recognizing consent as a thing that matters then it shouldn't survive.

Adapt your practices to the modern world.

[–]myspamhere -1 points0 points1 point 8 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

We have done well for 3500 years Thai you very much. Every time a group of Jews caved in to outside forces to become more like them, they lost their way.

[–]5th_Law_of_Robotics 3 points4 points5 points 8 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

So you will literally die if you can't hack off the tip of a baby's penis without his consent?

Think about that.

[–]myspamhere -1 points0 points1 point 8 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

think about how anti-semitic you are.

[–]5th_Law_of_Robotics 3 points4 points5 points 8 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

think about how anti-semitic you are.

Not at all.

Now can you address the topic at hand?

/Practice whatever religion you like and do whatever you want to yourself. I don't care. But that doesn't give you a right to do things to other people without their consent. That's true for Jews, Muslims, atheists, Christians, etc.

[–]myspamhere -1 points0 points1 point 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

So then parents have no rights to treat their kids in any way. Force your kids to eat veggies? How wrong you are!! Force kids to do homework? How dare you!!!.
Sorry, but to a Jew it is a commandment to do the Bris at the age of 8 days old, unless there is a medical reason not to, then it is put off, or in extreme cases, like, hemophilia, never done at all.

Any yes, by your phrasing of 'chop off' you are clearly using the worst language possible, and that makes you anti-Semitic.

[–]Oklawolf 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (27 children) | Copy Link

any attempt or even talk of banning is anti-semitic

How is it anti-semitic for Gentiles to not want your traditions to be forced upon them? Isn't Judaism supposed to be against that kind of thing? How do you think it looks to those outside your religion when your faith actively seeks to make sure this tradition keeps happening to those it does not and never will apply to?

[–]myspamhere 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (26 children) | Copy Link

We are talking about banning Jews from the practice. We could care less what the non-Jewish world does.

[–]5th_Law_of_Robotics 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

We are talking about banning Jews from the practice.

Nope. It's banning anyone from doing it.

We could care less what the non-Jewish world does.

You're clearly trolling so it's unlikely you'll respond but do you accept that this doesn't just ban Jews from mutilating children, but applies equally to everyone?

[–]myspamhere 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Yes, I know it applies to everyone, but to Jews it is a specific ban on a sacred practice. It is like banning the study of Torah for everyone. While it applies to the whole population, it affects Jews the most.

[–]5th_Law_of_Robotics 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Yes, I know it applies to everyone, but to Jews it is a specific ban on a sacred practice.

And Muslims. And anyone else who practices this.

It is like banning the study of Torah for everyone.

Yeah except not at all since that would target Jews and that is a harmless practice.

[–]Oklawolf 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (22 children) | Copy Link

Then perhaps you should speak up against your traditions being forced on other people, should you not? You don't want Judaism to be perceived as throwing Gentiles to the wolves for its own religious freedom, do you?

[–]myspamhere -1 points0 points1 point 8 years ago (21 children) | Copy Link

We never forced out traditions on others, it was the Gentiles that decided it on their own.

[–]Oklawolf 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (20 children) | Copy Link

So then would you support a ban that had an exemption for Judaism?

[–]myspamhere -1 points0 points1 point 8 years ago (19 children) | Copy Link

I would say a religious exception, as others noted, not only Jews practice it.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link

but to a Jew and to most Jews, any attempt or even talk of banning is anti-semitic.

Is fighting to end female circumcision anti-Islamic?

[–]myspamhere 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

Fgm is more a cultural practice. It is not universal among all Muslims. I understand some christans grin north africa do it also. it is not mandated in the koran or any other book I know of. I could be wrong as I am not an expert on Islam.

[–]93re2 4 points5 points6 points 8 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

You're right that female genital cutting is not mentioned in the Quran, but neither is male genital cutting either. Support for both MGC and FGC in Islam comes largely from hadiths. And no, FGC is not universal among all Muslims.

But it's near-universal among the communities that do practice it, which collectively would comprise a population of hundreds of millions of people. And it is widely considered a religious practice in societies that practice it, notably in Muslim societies that practice it but also in other societies that practice it.

It's been very common for supposedly humanitarian westerners to try to play both sides of the fence: "We tolerate all religions and their practices" and "FGM is wrong", by erroneously claiming that it's not a religious practice. The level of hubris is astounding. They are essentially telling millions of people (largely but not exclusively African and Asian Muslims) that "we know the tenets of your religion better than you do", without even attempting to offer a theological or other philosophical argument--simply by hand-waving and retconning. Then they turn around and pontificate about "tolerance" and "respect for other religions". They're trying to have it both ways and failing.

The Dawoodi Bohra are only one of many religious communities that practice FGC for religious reasons. There are many others. It is a mainstream practice---and a religious practice--among many Muslims in Malaysia, Singapore, and other parts of Southeast Asia, and in more extreme forms in Africa as well among various Muslim and non-Muslim groups.

My purpose in posting this was to share information and correct misconceptions. It isn't my intention to offend you or anyone else who happens to read this post, so don't take it the wrong way.

[–]myspamhere 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

But it is in the Torah

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

The Torah says slavery is okay too. Doesn't make it true.

[–]myspamhere 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

If you read the talmud you will find what is called slavery is a lot like a job. In fact if a slave does not have a pillow and the master does, then he had to give it to the slave

[–]Consilio_et_Animis 6 points7 points8 points 8 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

...100% anti-Semitic

LOL.

Theodor Herzl, the effective founder of the modern state of Israel (Home of the Jewish People™, Land of Milk & Honey™, The Promised Land™, Light unto the Nations™ etc. etc.), refused to circumcise his son Hans, because he considered it barbaric. Theodor Herzl is buried atop Mt. Herzel in Jerusalem. I guess folks want to dig him up and ship him back to Austria as he's "anti-semitic" eh?

Custom will reconcile people to any atrocity

Here's the sickening reality of this "practice":

WARNING: ALL LINKS AND IMAGES NOT SAFE FOR LIFE

You can watch an infant boy being sexually fondled and masturbated here by a mohel. He's given a forced erection, so then it's easier for the child sex-abuser to mutilate his penis:

https://youtu.be/yaaw7wivUN4?t=3m12s

And here is the proof that this is all deliberate:

In the "Surgery of Ritual Circumcision", Dr. Snowman states, "When the penis of an infant is in a state of erection the operation is more easily performed and the dressing more efficiently applied."

A PDF of the book can be found here:

https://www.15square.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2015/09/ND000946.pdf

Here a mohel describes how the point of circumcision is to damage the boy's sexuality:

https://youtu.be/XN65C9tbLP0?t=10m34s

And here he is again, showing the torture and rape tools he will use:

https://youtu.be/XN65C9tbLP0?t=4s

And here's the mohel applying his penis-torture clamp and then amputating the boy's foreskin and mutilating his penis. Turn your volume up to hear those screams! LOL:

https://youtu.be/TEJrYltJzi0?t=3m18s

You can watch a full mutilation here in a child-sex-abuse hospital. The little boy will be raped by having a metal probe forced in-between his foreskin and the glans of the penis. The foreskin is adhered to the glans and birth, and does not separate until he is older. The rape-probe tears the two apart — rather like having a needle forced under your fingernail.

Then the boy will be tortured by having a clamp applied to his penis and his foreskin crushed. Then the child sex-abuser will mutilate his penis by amputating his foreskin.

https://youtu.be/W2PKdDOjooA?t=3m2s

This lucky little boy then gets a "Happy Ending" — the child sex-abuser sucks his bleeding penis, gives him herpes and then the kid gets brain damaged for life or, SPECIAL BONUS, dies.

https://youtu.be/TEJrYltJzi0?t=3m40s

http://failedmessiah.typepad.com/failed_messiahcom/2013/03/15-babies-die-every-year-in-nyc-from-metzitzah-bpeh-herpes-hospitals-cover-up-deaths-leading-yu-rabbi-claims-567.html

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2304793/Two-babies-stricken-HERPES-ritual-oral-blood-sucking-circumcision-New-York-City.html

Photographs of infant male with herpes lesions on the penis and buttocks from infection via oral sex from a mohel:

http://i.imgur.com/ubxbSQA.png

"Primary Genital Herpes Simplex Infection Associated with Jewish Ritual Circumcision" Medical report from the Children's Center of Israel:

https://www.ima.org.il/FilesUpload/IMAJ/0/54/27431.pdf

Here, a Jewish man expresses his anger at having his penis mutilated by the Jewish community and having his bleeding penis sucked by a mohel. At 16, he meets the mohel who abused him and is overwhelmed with anger. He has difficulty masturbating; suffering bleeding and chafing, and he has difficulties with sex:

https://youtu.be/5DRsJXJop5I?t=1m27s

And note that Jewish ritual sexual mutilation specifically prohibits any attempt to reduce the pain of the amputation. These guys, are hard-core Taliban/ISIS types who specifically state that the fundamental point, or "commandment" (mitzvah) of the mutilation is to cause physical pain to the infant victim:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brit_milah#Anesthetic

"Most prominent acharonim rule that the mitzvah of brit milah lies in the pain it causes, and anesthetic, sedation, or ointment should generally not be used. However, it is traditionally common to feed the infant a drop of wine or other sweet liquid to soothe him."

"Eliezer Waldenberg, Yechiel Yaakov Weinberg, Shmuel Wosner, Moshe Feinstein and others agree that the child should not be sedated, although pain relieving ointment may be used under certain conditions; Shmuel Wosner particularly asserts that the act ought to be painful, as per Psalms 44:23."

"The bodily pain caused to that member is the real purpose of circumcision."

— Moses Maimonides (1135-1204). One of the greatest Jewish sages.

http://www.cirp.org/library/cultural/maimonides/

This poll shows the vast majority of Jews say no anaesthetic should be used:

http://www.thejc.com/poll/should-a-mohel-use-anaesthetic

Even the UK Jewish Medical Association states that no anaesthetic must be used by the child-sex-abuser:

http://jewishmedicalassociationuk.org/uk-jewish-medical-issues/circumcision

So pedophillia, sexual molestation, masturbation, rape, penis torture, genital mutilation, oral baby sex, herpes infection, brain damage, depression, PTSD, suicide and death.

All in the name of "religion".

Nice.

[–]myspamhere 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

Hertzl was not a religious hee. In fact he was anti religious. As fit a you other sources I don't care.

[+]Consilio_et_Animis1 points 8 years ago [recovered] (5 children) | Copy Link

I don't care.

A real Jew would care.

[+]myspamhere1 points 8 years ago [recovered] (4 children) | Copy Link

So I am not a real jew? Fu

[+]Consilio_et_Animis1 points 8 years ago [recovered] (3 children) | Copy Link

Yep. You are not a real Jew. You are a fake Jew.

[+]myspamhere1 points 8 years ago [recovered] (2 children) | Copy Link

Thank you head rabbi of Reddit.

[+]Consilio_et_Animis1 points 8 years ago [recovered] (1 child) | Copy Link

Thank you chief little boy penis skinner and sucker of Reddit.

[–]codaclouds 4 points5 points6 points 8 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

that's because the greeks thought the human body was a work of art, as opposed to jews who think it's okay for an old man to cut up a baby and then suck on his dick. if i ran a country i'd ban that shit too. honestly, who would be pro semitic if protecting an innocent human being from harm is considered "oppression" i don't care if you are a jew, a semite, a greek, a goblin, a fairy, w/e. if you support human baby mutilation i am anti-you

[–]Yndrd1984 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

As a Jew, it is 100% anti-Semitic

In exactly the same way that gay marriage is anti-Christian.

The fact that there are more actual anti-Semites than anti-Christians doesn't make the logic any less stupid.

The Greeks did it, the Romans, many different countries during the dark ages, Russia, Poland...etc...

Yes. For thousand of years, every time the chosen people come into contact with a more advanced society there's exactly one aspect of their culture that makes everyone else go "WTF dude!".

For G-d's sake, take the hint.

[–]myspamhere 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

More advanced??? The first people to say life has value? The greeks use to kill sick babies. Jews said all life has value. The gays are not forcing Christians to get gay married. The anti Semites want to force Jews to live the way they want them too. Your argument invalid. Too all people here. I'm done on this thread. I am on board with all other aspects of the men's rights movement, but the platform of anti circumcision is one I will be never agree with and I see several of you are so virulant that you hate any person wearing a kippah because of it. This make you Jew haters. End of story.

[–]Yndrd1984 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

The first people to say life has value?

Holy s***, you actually believe that.

The anti Semites want to force Jews to live the way they want them too.

All I want is for you to live non-violently and allow other people (including your children) to have freedom of religion.

That includes the freedom not to have other people's religious symbols carved into them.

I am on board with all other aspects of the men's rights movement, but the platform of anti circumcision is one I will be never agree with...

...because your religion is more important to you than men's rights.

This make you Jew haters. End of story.

And supporting the presumption of innocence makes me a misogynist. /s

Too all people here. I'm done on this thread.

LOL See you in two minutes.

[–]Drago1214 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

This may be true like 2000-3000 years ago. Stoping living in the past it’s 2018. This does nothing to effect it, it’s just another dying religion.

[–]mwobuddy 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

So there's boys OVER 18?

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Jag är stolt över er danskjävlar!

[–]jimmywiddle 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Good !!

[–]WizardCarter -2 points-1 points0 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Wrong tag?

[–]wasnew4s 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

In-tact-ivism not in-act-ivism.

[–]LittleJohnnyNations -5 points-4 points-3 points 8 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

Serious question, why? I was circumcisized as an infant and I'm happy I was. I have two boys that received the same. No issues.

[–]wasnew4s 9 points10 points11 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

There are a few reasons people oppose it. My personal reason is about body autonomy. While a few cases do exist where it is necessary, circumcision is largely a cosmetic surgery at best. As such circumcision should be an option not a mandate. The boys that go under the knife are often too young to make a rational decision. Circumcision robs children of their autonomy and thus should not be done on children.

[–]93re2 9 points10 points11 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I would suggest taking a half hour to watch, with an open mind, Child Circumcision: An Elephant in the Hospital. (NSFW)

After watching this fairly short educational video, if you have further questions I'm sure a lot of people here would be willing to discuss them with you.

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