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PierceHarlan
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[–]5th_Law_of_Robotics26 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link
Given the nature of such crimes we keep the accusers identity a secret.
And I think this is correct.
I just wish we'd do the same for the accused until after a verdict.
Being accused of murder (then being found not-guilty) is less damaging to your reputation than being falsely accused of rape. Which is really fucked-up. But I guess that comes from decades of propaganda that A) most men are rapists and B) rape is the worst crime humanity ever dreamed up.
[–]blueoak96 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link
"Given the nature of such crimes we keep the accusers identity a secret. And I think this is correct."
Yes, during that investigation. Now it's time for another investigation. And in that investigation the accuser in the first investigation is the accused. Time for her name to come out if she is convicted.
Convicted? HA! Her secret is safe forever.
[–]TracyMorganFreeman4 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link
Honestly I'm a bit on the fence whether their identity should be kept secret. I just want there to be consistency.
[–]Bodertz1 point 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link
People have been making the point that keeping the accused anonymous may increase the likelihood of an unjust trial, it not being in the public eye and all.
Do you think that is a concern?
[–]PierceHarlan7 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link
http://www.cotwa.info/2013/02/the-case-for-anonymity-for-men-and-boys.html
[–]SpanishGuy5 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link
A UK newspaper reader summed up the feeling when she wrote: "Yes sometimes women lie but an overwhelming number of rape cases result in no sentence so there are men getting away with rape and the least they deserve is for their names to be dragged through the mud." The chilling implication is that the "few" innocents who might also be dragged through the mud are acceptable collateral damage in the war on rape.
This reminds me to the infamous Time Magazine article quoting Caterine Comins:
Comins argues that men who are unjustly accused can sometimes gain from the experience. "They have a lot of pain, but it is not a pain that I would necessarily have spared them. I think it ideally initiates a process of self-exploration. 'How do I see women?' 'If I didn't violate her, could I have?' 'Do I have the potential to do to her what they say I did?' Those are good questions."
[–]alaysian3 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link
Oh? Guess we better go tell rape victims to learn from their pain.
[–]real-boethius2 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link
Turn it over and see how it sounds:
Comins argues that women who are raped can sometimes gain from the experience. "They have a lot of pain, but it is not a pain that I would necessarily have spared them. I think it ideally initiates a process of self-exploration. 'How do I see men?' 'If I didn't lead him on, could I have?' 'Do I have the potential make a false rape claim?' Those are good questions."
[–]5th_Law_of_Robotics4 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link
Well it's not like they're going to be whisked off to a secret jail and disappear.
They'd still have all the same protections of a regular court.
And if they chose to announce the case themselves that would be perfectly legal.
[–]notnotnotfred-2 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link
says who?
While the slow erosion of our civil liberties (particularly the law standard applied to men accused of rape) is a great concern we are far from the soviet gulags when it comes to the average crime.
/terrorism is a whole 'nother bag of worms however.
[–]SilencingNarrative1 point 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link
The anonymity of the defendant would only last until there was a conviction. If charges were dismissed, the records would then be open.
I don't see how that is a slippery slope leading to secret jails and accused men disappearing off the streets.
[–]notnotnotfred2 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link
in the McNicol case, it took a year between indictment & dropping charges. Should he have been held secretly in jail for a year?
That's a good example. It may be that there is no practical way to keep a defendant's identity secret. I would still say that a lot of effort is put into keeping accuser's identities secret, and that until as much effort is put into keeping the accused's identity secret, we should continue to bang this drum.
It's not like the accuser's identities are kept secret at all costs, BTW. It's just that society puts a good deal of effort into shielding their identity.
[–]shady8x4 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link
The accused should have a right to a private trial, a right they have no requirement to take advantage off. So they should be allowed to reveal their name if that is their personal choice.
That seems like a good compromise.
[–]kencabbit3 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link
I don't think it's a valid concern in the case of rape particularly, where putting the case in the public eye almost always creates more unjust judgment that ultimately bleeds into the trial proceedings in many cases.
edit: If the concern is that biased prosecutors will hang more accused rapists out to dry with impunity, that gives me a moment to pause, but then I wonder if that problem would really outweigh the effect of public media shaming.
[–]murphymc1 point 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link
Uh, how?
Considering the court of public opinion should have zero effect on a trial, how does not releasing the accused name make any kind of impact at all?
[–]MS2point01 point 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link
I say, if the accuser is anonymous, so should the accused, otherwise both should be named.
I agree.
[–]TheDongerNeedsFood5 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link
Here's a question, when did females decide that it was ok to accuse men of sexually based crimes in order to "get back at them" or things of that nature?
[–]SilencingNarrative3 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link
Since there are plenty of men who don't think false accusers should be punished, I think your question should have been:
since when did society decide that it was OK to accuse men of sexually based crimes to get back at them
And I think the answer to that is: shortly after the dawn of time.
[–]Bla341124 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link
And he would probably not show up in the statistics as a falsely accused or convicted....
[–]SpanishGuy3 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link
In these cases there is a parallel trial where the people -fed by the mainstream media- are the jury and judge.
They are angry, they want someone to be punished, and they make all kind of mistakes. It's a form of lynching in times of political correctness.
[–]Clauderoughly3 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link
Yeah this is what happens when you automatically believe an accuser.
What the police should have done, was quietly go around and talk to former members of the team, and discretely asked questions.
Instead they took the lazy option, and let the media do their fishing for them, and in the process pretty much destroyed a mans life.
They need to look at every accusation with a certain amount of objectivity. Not just put someones life through the meat grinder, on the accusation of single person.
[–]coffeeisforwimps3 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link
Since his name was release so other "victims" could come forward, why don't the authorities release her name so others she's "falsely accused" can come forward? Shouldn't that be a two way street if she either recants her statement or is found to be lying?
[–]Always_Doubtful2 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link
False accusations need to be dealt with.
Accusers should be forced to pay the legal bills of the accused if the "rape" is proven to be a lie AND the accuser should be forced to pay compensation to the accused. if the accuser can't pay then they should be jailed for x number of years i don't mean that bullshit suspended sentence or home arrest.
Mens lives are ruined because some women thinks it would be great to put a innocent man into jail. Its time to fight back.
[–]Volundarkvioa1 point 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link
Wow...That is just completely messed up. While I don't think we should necessarily damage the accuser's life (though they should still get a hefty fine and some jail time for wasting everyone's time and damaging someone's reputation), that's completely messed up that it's going to stigmatize him for life.
Someone like Michael Vick is able to get his career back even after being found guilty of forcing animals to fight each other, but a man like this has to find a whole new career because one simple Google check brings up plenty of red flags that employers do not wish to see in a potential employee.
The swim associations should recognize that he wasn't found guilty and should let him teach again. If any parents have any problems, he and/or his bosses can explain that he was accused but the case never went to trial as there was no evidence. Of course most parents would still most likely not trust him as simply being accused is seen as a red flag ("well if you didn't do it, why would someone accuse you in the first place?").
[–]blueoak92 points 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link
"While I don't think we should necessarily damage the accuser's life "
Would presecution and imprisonment for her crime not "damage the accuser's life"? And what would be wrong with that?
She damned sure "damaged" someone else's life.
By damage the accuser's life I mean make it public knowledge via the news. "Hey everyone! Look! See this person! They made a false rape allegation!" Of course via the charges laid out on the person it may become public knowledge and that will harm their life, but rather I meant the media shouldn't go spouting it out necessarily. We should seek high penalties for something like this as punishment for what they did, but an eye for an eye isn't always the best solution. We're supposed to have a rehabilitative prison system, not a retributive one (even though that's how ours in the US is pretty much designed).
I say charge her with perjury, slander/libel, falsifying police reports, and whatever else we can tack on to help increase her sentence.
[–]sizzletron1 point 13 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link
No one can accept the dirty truth: We are ruled by self-proclaimed victims. We live in a Violence By Victimhood Culture.
Seems like a very easy defamation case.
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