Male Shaming

[deleted] · 2014-02-10T15:05:56+00:00

A hundred years ago, boys were actually preferred babysitters. They were seen as responsible and looking to prove themselves, and teenage girls were seen as flighty and irresponsible with a young life (especially if it wasn't their child).

The only reason 'male shaming' is a thing with children is because of irrational pedo-fear that is not based on reality.

Shaming males for being around children is by no means hard-wired.

lokidemon731 · 2014-02-10T17:12:17+00:00

I was about to say that I wouldn't be bothered, but I was thinking about a teenage boy or a college aged man. I would be ok with them babysitting my child, but I do think I would have reservations about an adult man babysitting my child, more so than an adult woman. I can't even put my finger on why, I just would. I'd also be happier with a young person overall rather than an adult, which also seems silly. You'd think I'd want the person more likely to be responsible(the adult) but I guess adults babysitting kids, especially male adults, is less common so I'm less comfortable with it?

I guess I have some ingrained prejudices as well.

fiat_lux_ · 2014-02-10T18:36:14+00:00

OP is being hammered, and I'm admittedly laughing at her expense. From what OP has said in the title post as well as the comments, she's definitely being discriminatory… but I still like her. It's refreshing to at least hear some honesty over this.

Don't get me wrong. For a lot of problems, my go to answer has just been, "Just have to roll with the punches." I'm just assuming that this kind of thought would actually be quite well received in trp from my exp there. I remember there was even a thread where a feminist was praised for her honesty when she wrote a blog about how "men's rights does not belong in feminism."

nninja · 2014-02-10T16:19:59+00:00

would it change your mind to consider that an unsupervised woman could put the child in contact with her boyfriend whom you haven't screened?

polyhooly · 2014-02-10T20:31:04+00:00

His gender would not be an issue in him babysitting my children. As a matter of fact my daughters has been cared for by a male babysitter, before.

I think you have been raised in a society that says men are not supposed to be caregivers for children, and if they do, there could be something "funny" with them.

weirdlemonade81 · 2014-02-10T23:02:43+00:00

I think a distinction needs to be made between, for example, 'if I am out alone at night and a person approaches me I would be more nervous if that personw as male than if they were female' and 'men are across-the-board more threatening than women'. As a female, the threat of sexual violence from men is a fact of life. The threat of sexual violence from another woman, while it exists, is much, much lower than the already-low threat from a man. Men also tend to be stronger than me and therefore I am more vulnerable to them than to other women of around the same size. None of this, to my mind, is a reason to include all male members of the species in the category of 'threat' and I don't do that.

As for babysitting my (currently nonexistent) children I wouldn't let anyone I didn't know, male or female, watch them, so that situation doesn't apply. The people I would allow to watch them would be chosen based on how well I knew and trusted them, not on their sex - I'd be happy to have a trusted male friend babysit.

Kareem_Jordan · 2014-02-10T23:49:45+00:00

Am I a male shamer?

You're clearly giving into stereotypes that not only negatively affect men, but negatively affect the way they interact with people and how open they feel they can be. You're also admitting to outright gender discrimination.

sh1v · 2014-02-12T07:10:07+00:00

I'm not letting any strangers watch my kids. That's what family, relatives, close friends are for.

If I had no choice but to hire a babysitter I don't think I'd discriminate based on gender. I'd screen as carefully as possible, but at the end of the day I'm just looking for a certain type of person (very honest, open history, professional, has credentials, friendly, and knows their way around kids) and whoever fits that best gets the job.

[deleted] · 2014-02-11T20:37:14+00:00

[permanently deleted]

redwhiskeredbubul · 2014-02-10T23:58:28+00:00

The trouble with the concept of 'male shaming' is that it's not really well-defined. What exactly are we shaming here? Traditional masculinity? Men in general? What would be an instance of male shaming? What you give is an instance of gender discrimination (in the broad sense, I have no idea about the legalities) but not really shaming.

Here's the thing. If you hire a babysitter with no explicit agreement about their gender, the guy shows up and is a guy, yeah, of course that's discrimination. You're also bilking him out of his pay for the night and being a deceptive and unethical employer. But I'm not sure how his masculinity is at issue for anybody in this situation besides you. You're mistreating him as an employee and only incidentally as a guy.

If you tried to build an affirmative argument about why men should not be allowed to babysit, or a concerted campaign against them, that would fall into shaming territory...but I haven't seen anybody do that.

yasee · 2014-02-10T17:09:18+00:00

Well, yeah. You kind of are.

This doesn't mean you're a bad person, but you're definitely being sexist. And it sucks, because you (and you're not alone, this is a common stereotype) are contributing to a culture where men are often steered away from engaging with children. I think that's a big loss, both for men and for kids.

What you want to do with this knowledge is up to you.

trabant00 · 2014-02-10T17:55:51+00:00

So discrimination is understandable when we're talking about men being trusted with the safety of others solely based on their sex. You think it's ok to do that because hey, it's your child's safety, your choice. But how is it different from a business owner who fears for his company's future and hires only men because women are not to be trusted with rational things or whatever of the kind? Or a father who wouldn't accept a female driving instructor for his son? Or voters with a female for president? Every bigot out there feels he has the right to have prejudices on things that affect him.

I'm not red pill, but if I would be I'd feel more than justified to call hamstering on this one.

[deleted] · 2014-02-10T19:21:54+00:00

[permanently deleted]

shitlordlucy · 2014-02-10T20:49:46+00:00

I think the danger of men has been way overblown. Men are around me all day, and so far none of them have raped me. I think there's something to be said for being wary of a man in an alleyway who looks high, shifty, etc...but the same can be said of a female methhead looking for a fight.

To be honest, I may be more inclined to hire a female babysitter, and I also wonder if that's male shaming. I think that people are very open to the double standards against women in our society but are very very blind to the double standards against men- how many TV shows do you see where the woman is constantly disapproving of/rolling her eyes at her husband, making jokes about his lack of fashion sense/weight/looks, and people find it cute and sassy? Meanwhile, the reverse would be branded as "abuse"

By the way my personal opinion (yes a bit off topic here) is that both partners have the right to make their physical preferences known...however in the media, seemingly only women are allowed to do that.

nninja · 2014-02-11T12:54:39+00:00

I don't think it's sexist. I would tell my daughter to be more careful around men, and would not want her walking around alone at night. I also think women should be much more careful with drinking. The babysitting thing, I dunno I wouldn't hire an agency, only someone I knew.

[deleted] · 2014-02-11T18:03:52+00:00

I wouldn't want any stranger alone with my child male or female but I have no problem with male midwives or men working in day care centers. They do background checks on both men and women.

lbspredh · 2014-02-14T11:46:23+00:00

I wouldn't and interestingly neither would my husband. Am I a male shamer? Thoughts?

yep

[deleted] · 2014-02-10T20:11:38+00:00

[permanently deleted]

[deleted] · 2014-02-10T15:09:30+00:00

[permanently deleted]

Title	Male Shaming
Author	[deleted]
Upvotes	1
Comments	75
Date	February 10, 2014 1:51 PM UTC (12 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/1xio2j/male_shaming/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/male-shaming.286231 https://theredarchive.com/post/286231

Comments