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DonMelbourne Archive

View 62 posts and 1,317 comments by DonMelbourne on TheRedPill subreddit and various other subreddits related to The Red Pill community.
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Upvotes Title Category Author Subreddit Date (UTC)
51

DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW202/08/19 05:41 AM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW229/06/20 01:29 AM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW216/06/19 01:41 AM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW207/08/19 07:31 AM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW215/07/19 11:47 AM
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FeelsDonMelbourne/r/MGTOW28/12/15 07:48 AM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW216/02/19 03:25 AM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW213/03/19 09:39 AM
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ArtsDonMelbourne/r/MGTOW23/10/15 08:54 AM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW205/07/20 11:37 PM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW203/09/19 04:56 AM
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SongDonMelbourne/r/MGTOW08/10/15 11:52 AM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW214/05/19 05:12 AM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW219/11/20 09:27 AM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW219/05/20 06:14 PM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW223/06/20 12:38 AM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW209/04/19 10:47 PM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW205/02/20 01:10 PM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW226/10/20 06:55 AM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW219/09/20 02:29 AM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW216/10/18 02:24 AM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW217/12/18 05:13 AM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW216/12/18 10:26 AM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW215/12/18 03:13 AM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW204/08/20 12:01 PM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW223/10/20 11:08 PM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW207/12/18 02:51 AM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW206/12/18 02:08 AM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW216/09/20 01:14 AM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW201/12/20 06:44 AM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW202/10/18 02:41 AM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW201/07/20 11:29 PM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW213/02/19 11:00 AM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW224/11/18 03:09 AM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW201/07/20 09:52 AM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW211/05/20 09:04 AM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW221/10/20 05:28 AM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW201/08/20 12:13 AM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW211/07/20 07:46 AM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW211/08/20 03:55 AM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW227/11/20 09:53 PM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW222/02/21 01:20 PM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW204/01/19 02:16 AM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW208/03/20 09:39 AM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW213/11/18 03:47 AM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW211/11/18 10:36 PM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW210/11/18 07:01 AM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW217/10/20 02:39 AM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW205/11/18 09:40 AM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW203/11/18 11:24 PM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW208/08/20 04:07 AM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW207/07/20 04:24 AM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW230/10/18 03:06 AM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW208/01/20 02:02 AM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW217/08/20 08:23 AM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW225/10/18 11:27 AM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW212/11/20 05:40 AM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW217/08/20 03:25 AM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW229/01/19 08:05 AM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW225/07/20 03:29 AM
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Pinhead DancingDonMelbourne/r/MGTOW31/12/15 12:52 AM
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DonMelbourne/r/MGTOW216/08/19 06:59 PM
Showing the 1,000 most recent of 1,317 comments.
Upvotes Comment on Subreddit Date (UTC)
1

Contradictions for the sole sake of riling someone up is the biggest cancer of the internet and nobody seems to object to it. God, yes. But now it is also about getting clicks. The more division, the more hatred one can stir up, then the more clicks. Division and hatred has become a business model, and it is FUCKING EVERYWHERE. I've never seen so much hatred expressed as a virtue as it has in the last few years. It's Orwellian. If the devil exists, then he is out there bathing in it. Quite a few…
/r/MGTOW206/04/21 12:00 AM
1

Bear Grylls as well as Jerry Lewis. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BgAEFmv4Y9M https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DvxLml0RzD0
/r/MGTOW203/04/21 11:46 PM
1

Yep. There are good women and bad women, good men and bad men. Don't marry any of them.
/r/MGTOW213/03/21 11:23 PM
12

If you think about it: MGTOWs are helping to reduce the human population, thereby helping the planet. We are the real heroes!
/r/MGTOW205/03/21 12:00 AM
1

That's probably because most people aren't aware of the difference, unfortunately. The limits of our language are the limits of our mind.
/r/MGTOW204/03/21 11:58 PM
1

CS Lewis wrote a famous book called "The Four Loves", based on words used in ancient Greek philosophy. From the Wiki article: "Storge" – empathy bond Storge (storgē, Greek: στοργή) is liking someone through the fondness of familiarity, family members or people who relate in familiar ways that have otherwise found themselves bonded by chance. An example is the natural love and affection of a parent for their child. It is described as the most natural, emotive, and widely diffused of loves: It is …
/r/MGTOW204/03/21 11:12 PM
8

Well said. Nowadays "love" seems to mean "sexual attraction". If Captain Kirk loves Mr Spock, why, it must mean that Kirk wants to have sex with Spock! I love my father. I don't want to have sex with him.
/r/MGTOW204/03/21 11:05 PM
1

:) We probably have had this discussion before. Apologies if I've forgotten it. I'm happy to agree to disagree about whether having girlfriends is good for a man, since that is an individual decision. I just don't see how it is relevant to MGTOW. I see MGTOW as about making common sense and rational decisions. Marriage has legal implications which disadvantages the man that makes marriage a bad deal, so marriage is not for me. I just don't see the same situation with having a girlfriend. It's no…
/r/MGTOW204/03/21 10:54 PM
1

I'll try and say this as respectfully as possible: Shut the fuck up. I disagree with frenchlouve's point, but I think these are the kinds of discussions that are worth having so I appreciate his comment. Lastly, Going your own way is living your life in away that makes you 100% happy and benefits you 100%. That is exactly it. MGTOW is making rational and common sense decisions based on one's own needs. "Don't get a girlfriend" might suit some people and not suit others. MGTOW is about what makes…
/r/MGTOW204/03/21 10:47 PM
2

Yes, good point. "All women are evil" is about as emotionally attached to women as you can get. Women are living in your head rent-free. Women are just people trying to get by as best they can. They aren't supernatural creatures trying to fuck with our minds. They are just normal people trying to fuck with our minds. Once you realise they aren't evil, it's up to you how much you let them fuck with your own mind. Your mind is still yours. (Note: I also post as Grandpa_MGTOW)
/r/MGTOW204/03/21 10:40 PM
1

There is no leadership. There are no real hard rules. I'm as much for "men going their own way" to really mean "own way". But I think "no marriage/no cohabitation" are real hard rules for MGTOW. That is, marriage is one of the bad deals that MGTOWs as a group reject based on a rational and common sense consideration of each individual's needs. But I call MGTOW "pro-individual", not "anti-marriage". Marriage isn't for me, but it might be for you. I applaud any man who, after due consideration of …
/r/MGTOW204/03/21 10:33 PM
1

Why? I can understand no marriage/cohabitation, because of the legal implications. But why no girlfriends? I'm not so much arguing against your opinion as much as trying to understand it. Sure, you have to be careful of certain things with girlfriends, but that has always been the case. Getting into a car and driving can be potentially dangerous, but I do it. If you are careful, why is having a girlfriend inconsistent with MGTOW? (Note: I also post as Grandpa_MGTOW)
/r/MGTOW204/03/21 10:22 PM
1

MGTOW isn't just no marriage/no cohabitation. It's about also about not emotionally attaching yourself to a woman. I'm a stickler for wording, I'm afraid. "Not emotionally attaching yourself to a woman" -- what about your mother, your sisters and other female relatives, what about women friends? I'm not going to marry any of them but I certainly have an emotional attachment. Do you think that MGTOW means emotionally detaching from them as well? Because that sounds like something a cult would ask…
/r/MGTOW204/03/21 10:17 PM
1

What's the main point of MGTOW, such that you can't have a girlfriend?
/r/MGTOW204/03/21 06:23 AM
4

I wonder if this is a work by an anti-feminist group to make it sound like some women are deliberately throwing false allegations against men in order to destroy them. The problem is... I can't tell if the author is expressing genuinely held views or not. It is Poe's Law in action. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poe%27s_law
/r/MGTOW204/03/21 06:22 AM
1

Are there any community activities that you can be involved in? I know you've said that you have ghosted society, but if you have any interactions with groups that benefit you, it might be helpful for you to contribute to those groups some how.
/r/MGTOW204/03/21 06:14 AM
4

Why can't you be MGTOW if you have a girlfriend? What is your definition of "MGTOW"? On r/MGTOW2, "MGTOW" is defined as: Men walking away from marriage and any other relationships with women that subject them to the punishments of a gynocentric society and court of law. Choosing instead to use the resources and talents you would otherwise have spent on maintaining a relationship to improve your life, finding happiness and satisfaction." A "girlfriend" relationship currently don't subject you to …
/r/MGTOW204/03/21 06:08 AM
1

No. Never married, no kids. I'm not interested in either. But that's me. You do you. Don't worry about what's MGTOW and what's not MGTOW. Learn what you can and then make choices based on that knowledge.
/r/MGTOW226/02/21 10:08 AM
-1

Once they learn more about the nature of women, and can look inward at themselves to see what their roles were in allowing women to shatter their lives, they can accept the responsibility for their actions. If only that were true. MGTOW used to be like that. But now it is about avoiding introspection and avoiding responsibility for one's own actions. It has a hive-mind as strong as anything that feminism has (again, I'll note that r/MGTOW2 is an exception) I could easily go over to r/MGTOW and p…
/r/MGTOW226/02/21 03:47 AM
3

I decided to not get married for the reasons you state: it's just too big a risk. You are not alone! But that is just one part of MGTOW. The desire for kids needs to be factored into your other needs and hopes. The mistake within MGTOW nowadays is that MGTOW is only "about the women"! But it isn't. It's about common sense. If your need for kids is so strong, embrace it! Work towards your goal. You know about MGTOW and have red-pill knowledge, so you are ahead of the curve! Continue educating you…
/r/MGTOW226/02/21 12:24 AM
1

I have been sent my own way. You haven't been sent on YOUR own way, you have been sent THEIR way. If you don't want to go that way, how can it be YOUR way? My friend, go YOUR own way. Then you are MGTOW. You just need to work out what path represents YOUR own way. It's a lifetime journey. Good luck!
/r/MGTOW225/02/21 11:39 PM
7

Honestly I don’t want to hurt her , but I can’t keep this relationship. Would appreciate some advice from my brothers Break up with her in the kindest way possible. You owe it to her. You have an obligation to her. My recommendation: text her that "you want to talk". Then set up a meeting in a public place (so she won't wreck your furniture) and tell her gently how you feel. End with giving her a hug. Good luck!
/r/MGTOW225/02/21 11:27 PM
3

Kids thrive best in a two-parent family. If you want kids, get married. MGTOW is not for you, but so what? It's just a label. Some men will be happier being married with kids than being MGTOW. It depends on your own needs and hopes. Marriage and kids isn't for me, but it might be for you. Weigh up your needs and hopes and do your cost/benefit analysis and decide accordingly. MGTOW isn't about telling YOU what to do. It is about me using red-pill knowledge to decide what I should do. Don't let an…
/r/MGTOW225/02/21 11:22 PM
4

MRAs are a movement. They are trying to move society from one position to another. MGTOW is a philosophy/life-style choice. A philosophy is where you stand. We aren't trying to move society. We are trying to get a better standing for ourselves, and not be the disposable cogs of society. Having said that: there is nothing stopping someone from being both MGTOW and MRA. You can be part of a movement and still work on improving yourself.
/r/MGTOW225/02/21 05:31 AM
2

Also: don't marry/cohabitate.
/r/MGTOW225/02/21 05:16 AM
7

Reading through the subreddit, and I have to shake my head. Imagine blaming one gender for your problems. There has to be something wrong with them! Why do they spend so much time crapping on the opposite gender? What a waste of time. Losers! Now let me read r/askfeminists.
/r/MGTOW225/02/21 05:13 AM
3

NEVER TAKE CARE OF ANOTHER MAN'S SEED. If I don't swallow and spit it out, can I still be MGTOW?
/r/MGTOW225/02/21 04:54 AM
1

I appreciate the problem. The mods on r/MGTOW2 have a difficult job, and they can only work with what the contributions that come in. So I don't blame them. The trouble is that the definition of "MGTOW" seems to centre around women-bashing. And women-bashing posts attract women-bashing posters. Women-bashing is against the principles of MGTOW, or at least the MGTOW that I remembered. They would have been laughed at, and for good reason: it's against MGTOW ideals. It's a question of definitions. …
/r/MGTOW225/02/21 04:52 AM
2

Thanks ScrewJita. It's a side of things I've never heard of nor even considered. Did you get any positive take-aways as a man from Pagan Feminism? Anything that MGTOWs or men in general might find useful to know?
/r/MGTOW225/02/21 04:45 AM
2

Women are not a part of MGTOW. Or at least, they weren't a part of it when I encountered MGTOW and realised it described me perfectly. Marriage certainly is a part of MGTOW. That's ONE of the bad deals that MGTOW used to be about avoiding, i.e. the laws around marriage and cohabitation. That's because the laws disadvantage men, while simultaneously society pushes men towards it. But the paranoid view of women that MGTOW now has would have been laughed at in the old MGTOW. Like the Incels and PUA…
/r/MGTOW225/02/21 04:43 AM
2

Great list! It's about men. I think if we could tag posts on the r/MGTOW2 page like I've seen on other subs, it might make it easier for people to see which posts are relevant to what they want to see.
/r/MGTOW224/02/21 10:50 PM
5

The legal implications of cohabitation often take effect after 2 years in many Western countries.
/r/MGTOW224/02/21 10:30 PM
11

I remember when MGTOW was about men. When I came across MGTOW around 2015, MGTOW was about men using red-pill knowledge to recognise the bad deals that society tried to sell men. Bad deals like "get that big house", "get that fancy car", "get that fancy job and work half a lifetime doing something you hate". And yes, one of them was "don't marry/cohabitate" because you shouldn't make a contract with someone who can benefit from breaking that contract. Those things were all bad deals. MGTOW was a…
/r/MGTOW224/02/21 10:24 PM
2

including forcing the Boys Scouts to accept girls No, as far as I know Boys Scouts weren't forced into accepting girls by feminists. Numbers had been dropping, so they did that to increase participation. Girl Scouts groups were against it, since they feared opening up Boys Scouts would cut into their numbers. https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/boy-scouts-will-admit-girls-allow-them-earn-eagle-scout-n809836
/r/MGTOW224/02/21 05:44 AM
2

It's important for men to make social connections and friendships for good mental health. Lots of men get married because it is easier for them to marry than to make a friend. I recommend keeping in contact with your uncle and cousins, as long as it doesn't compromise your own needs.
/r/MGTOW224/02/21 03:13 AM
4

Indoctrinated in Pagan Feminism (which I can tell you much about), I came to Believe in a Great Goddess, and most specifically, that every each and single woman was a Divine reflection of this Goddess (as is stated in the texts.) Interesting! I have to ask: how did they view men? No divine element in men?
/r/MGTOW224/02/21 03:10 AM
3

What MGTOW views are you having problems reconciling when talking to them? Start with not trying to marry your nieces and daughters. That about covers it from a MGTOW perspective.
/r/MGTOW223/02/21 05:41 AM
2

But are you really "anti-marriage"? Marriage isn't for me, but it might be for others. Some people will be happier being married than being MGTOW. It's like the lottery: I think it is a waste of money, so I won't play. But some people will win the lottery. I'm not "anti-lottery". If a friend of yours has thought about the pros and cons of marriage, understands what he is getting himself into but decides that marriage is best for him and his needs, would you be against him making that decision fo…
/r/MGTOW228/11/20 09:35 PM
1

I don't think you've failed yourself, based on what you've written. Have you married, or have you been cohabitating long enough so that common law legislation is now in effect? Then that is a potential problem. But dating, on your own terms and with your own needs in mind, is okay. If that means the MGTOW label no longer applies, who cares? You do what makes most sense to you. The issue is when the relationship makes you start going against your own needs. Then it is best to walk away. Otherwise…
/r/MGTOW228/11/20 06:14 AM
5

Why? Can you give a brief description please?
/r/MGTOW227/11/20 08:55 AM
31

avoid wasting time, money, and energy on women. Well said, but it's not just on women. I describe MGTOW as "pro-individual". We are not "anti-women" or "anti-marriage". That is, society tells men that they can get their validation by getting married, but since marriage is now a bad deal for men, MGTOW is the RATIONAL decision to not marry/cohabitate. MGTOW is common sense. MGTOWs get their validation from what they accomplish themselves. We don't rely on validation from society. But society want…
/r/MGTOW227/11/20 12:01 AM
2

No. Learn from the wisdom of the past: "When you seek revenge, dig two graves." "Revenge, like young chickens, always comes home to roost." "The best revenge is living well." "If you sit by the side of a river long enough, you will see the body of your worst enemy float by." Your bully is living in your head rent-free, which means your bully still has power over you. Why do you allow your bully to have power over you? Don't waste your time on getting revenge. Shake the dust off your boots and go…
/r/MGTOW226/11/20 10:03 PM
5

No, "they" don't know anything of the sort. MGTOW isn't even a mere bleep on most of "their" radar, if you mean women in general. Where women have heard of MGTOW, they have usually heard that we are a bunch of incels who hate women, and they are dismissive of the whole idea. Please don't place MGTOW in the middle of a conspiracy theory of "us" against "them". "Othering" is what cults do. MGTOW is a rational choice based on reality, not a cult.
/r/MGTOW226/11/20 09:56 PM
4

Some men are just arseh*les. They use MRA, MGTOW or any other group identity as an excuse to treat people badly.
/r/MGTOW226/11/20 06:16 AM
4

Good points! People need to celebrate mgtow, not accept it out of spite. Yes, exactly. MGTOW is about making good rational choices for oneself.
/r/MGTOW225/11/20 01:37 AM
0

If MGTOW is a community r/MGTOW2 is a community. Men with common interests come here, exchange comments and discuss MGTOW2 issues. When I say we reject women I mean they do not hold sway in our personal decisions which affect our lives That's what I thought you probably meant. Framing it as "we reject women" though is a little too stark. I've already been ruminating over the idea of dropping the moniker Yes, me too, many times. Too much toxicity on MGTOW forums that doesn't reflect what MGTOW us…
/r/MGTOW224/11/20 06:45 AM
10

our rejection of women I don't reject women; I reject marriage. That is a HUGE difference. I don't reject my mother. I won't marry her, but I'll certainly help her where I can. I don't reject good women friends who can add value to my life. I'd be crazy to do that. MGTOW is a RATIONAL choice, not a dogmatic one. Maybe that's what you meant, but words and definitions matter. And r/MGTOW2 is a community. See the side-bar: "a community for 3 years" and "community options".
/r/MGTOW224/11/20 03:30 AM
47

"No marriage, no cohabitation" -- yes, because these are now bad deals for men due to legal implications. "No long-term relationships" -- nothing wrong with them if you can avoid the legal entanglements in my opinion. Society wants men to marry. Society tells men that they get their validation from entering into a legal arrangement with the state called "marriage". But marrying is now a bad deal for men. So MGTOW is about men saying "sorry, society, I'm going my own way. I'm getting my validatio…
/r/MGTOW224/11/20 02:09 AM
12

To give an example, the statements "I don't want to become a mother/housewife " and "I don't want to become a father / provider" do not sound the same to our current mainstream culture. Yep! Woman: "I don't want to get married." "You go girl! You are a strong and independent woman!" Man: "I don't want to get married." "Peter Pan Syndrome! Grow up!"
/r/MGTOW223/11/20 09:18 AM
8

I'm a feminist, if by "feminism" you mean equal opportunity for women, which is the classical definition of "feminism". But if you look at surveys, only about 20% of women in the West call themselves "feminist", even though nearly all believe in equal opportunity. (https://www.huffingtonpost.com.au/entry/feminism-poll_n_3094917?ri18n=true) Why? Because "feminism" doesn't seem to mean "equal opportunity" anymore for most people. I'm an "anti-feminist" when it comes to ideas like "all men are evil…
/r/MGTOW223/11/20 08:52 AM
7

Sex: not important. Intimacy: important.
/r/MGTOW223/11/20 06:32 AM
9

Thank the mods! They keep a lot of the women-hating and blackpill incel stuff away from here. If it's a good sub, it's probably thanks to good mods.
/r/MGTOW223/11/20 05:15 AM
28

It's not a realisation, it's how MGTOW actually used to be. I joined the MGTOW1 sub very close to the start, and that is what MGTOWs believed: we aren't a movement, there is no agenda, no leaders, we aren't fighting anyone, we aren't anti-women, we aren't misogynists. It was all about men going their own way in a society that wished they wouldn't. Gradually though MGTOW1 changed. It's all a story we know well, so I won't go over it. Most of us early MGTOWs got banned, me included. So I came here…
/r/MGTOW223/11/20 03:27 AM
51

We will fight on our terms and we will win on our terms. What are you trying to win? Validation? If you are a man going his own way, then you've already won. MGTOW isn't a movement or a tribe. There is no agenda, no leaders. There is no "other" that we need to fight against. Don't tell anyone that you're MGTOW and you don't need to do anything else except go your own way. Don't turn MGTOW into dogma. That makes it a cult. We have no enemies, we have no dog in any fight. Let MSM call us what they…
/r/MGTOW223/11/20 01:34 AM
68

Wikipedia has fairly strict rules about what can appear in their articles. The content can't be original research, and must come from verifiable sources. Usually this means articles from newspapers either in-print or on-line. (I know this because I've edited some articles based on my own areas of interest.) The article is an accurate reflection of what you'll find on-line about MGTOW in the MSM. Keep that in mind when you read other articles on controversial topics that you aren't familiar with!…
/r/MGTOW223/11/20 01:01 AM
3

What a great idea! They look fantastic.
/r/MGTOW222/11/20 11:28 PM
15

My advice: have children. Seriously. Don't worry about what "MGTOWs believe". It's about YOUR needs and YOUR hopes. If you feel strongly that the purpose of your life is to have children, THEN HAVE CHILDREN. Marriage and having children is not for me. That makes sense with regards to my own needs, and at age 60, I am happy with my decision. But you have to do you. If MGTOW means anything, it is to strive for your own happiness without worrying what others say, even if that means making decisions…
/r/MGTOW222/11/20 03:09 AM
1

I see where you are coming from, and I don't disagree that it requires will power and resisting environmental pressures. But developing will power isn't a "sacrifice", and resisting environmental pressures isn't a "sacrifice". I guess I'm quibbling over that particular word. If you choose to not get married, then you lose the benefits of that institution. I guess you could say that's a "sacrifice" for someone who really wants to get married. However, I don't see it as a sacrifice because I under…
/r/MGTOW222/11/20 02:04 AM
2

What "sacrifice"? MGTOW is freedom, not sacrifice. I guess for some the plantation offers steady work, and so leaving the safety of the plantation looks like "sacrifice". But freedom comes with a price: the price of emancipation. In no way does that make it a sacrifice.
/r/MGTOW222/11/20 01:43 AM
9

If no women wanted you, you're not mgtow. Why not? This is the definition of MGTOW on this subreddit (see the sidebar): "Men walking away from marriage and other relationships with women that subject them to the laws of a gynocentric court. Choosing to use your talents to improve your life, finding happiness and satisfaction." How does "no women wanting you" clash with that definition? Don't hold your self-value hostage to how women feel about you. Women aren't supernatural creatures. They have …
/r/MGTOW222/11/20 01:41 AM
1

What if the state decided to reintroduce women (or men), because it decided that is best for society? Is that possible conclusion that a sexless and classless society could make?
/r/MGTOW221/11/20 11:08 PM
1

Isn't that more like a virus that's grown sentient? I was always sympathetic to the criticisms against humanity by Agent Smith in "The Matrix".
/r/MGTOW221/11/20 10:58 PM
2

Everyone is educated about the state Who educates the state? That's the problem with these kinds of utopian visions. Once you set the boundaries around the diversity of thought, evolution of ideas stagnate. Removing women entirely won't help. Society needs active and creative women just as it needs active and creative men. It does society no good to become unisex.
/r/MGTOW221/11/20 10:54 PM
7

Everyone thinks they're Batman, but really they are a Batman villian. Even Batman.
/r/MGTOW221/11/20 10:08 AM
2

Kenjataimu: "Kenja Time" (Noun) ( slang) Japanese word meaning : Period of clear thoughts when a man is free from sexual desires after having an orgasm [via sex or masturbation] Think of masturbation as a kind of meditation. Clear your mind, then use your Kenjataimu wisely.
/r/MGTOW221/11/20 03:54 AM
1

If you are making a serious comment, can you link to the studies please? If not, never mind.
/r/MGTOW221/11/20 01:03 AM
0

Some men will be happier being married than being MGTOW. Educate yourself, determine the costs and benefits, and make your decision accordingly. Just separate the fantasy that society pushes and the reality of what might (probably) happen. I think if you want children, then marriage may be your best option since children should have two parents to raise them. Best wishes brother.
/r/MGTOW220/11/20 09:03 PM
1

Thanks, that makes sense. Good idea!
/r/MGTOW220/11/20 10:15 AM
50

"Men can be depressed too" "Men have emotions too" "It's OK for men to share their feelings"... If we really care so much about men, why aren't we celebrating MASCULINITY?? Why is nobody celebrating masculine traits like ambition, courage, strength, assertiveness? That is so true, but it never struck me until you mentioned it how International Men's Day has become all about the weakness of men. Brilliant observation! Boys get treated as defective girls, and men get treated as defective adults.
/r/MGTOW220/11/20 06:35 AM
1

Sure, there are crazy people out there, on all sides. I think there is a culture of seeing men as disposable, but that is a far cry from there being a culture where they want men to kill themselves. The point you make in your post about men supporting each other is good, you don't need to over-egg the pudding.
/r/MGTOW220/11/20 03:44 AM
8

The simple fact is the misandrist/feminist/sjw culture WANTS MEN TO KILL THEMSELVES. No they don't. Suicide of men can be devastating for families and communities. To say they want men to kill themselves is conspiracy theory level cr*p. AS leaders of Men - (that's what we are) No we aren't. We are men choosing our own paths, whether that be as leaders or something else. Being MGTOW is a statement of self-ownership. If you want to be a leader, be a leader. If you don't, then don't. Nothing to do …
/r/MGTOW220/11/20 01:53 AM
2

Sugars result in bloating. Drinking water is good! But if your body isn't able to pass the water, your stomach will bloat. Here's a short video on the topic: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mRj1RKh4xyY
/r/MGTOW219/11/20 06:56 PM
3

Avoid sugars. Sugar makes you retain water, amongst other things.
/r/MGTOW219/11/20 06:16 PM
2

Thank's for that, Solo_and_Simple. Good stuff there. Going through the insecurities and feelings of inadequacies on dating when young is an excellent topic, I've added it to the list. Thanks for the feedback!
/r/MGTOW219/11/20 06:03 PM
1

Is a MGTOW lifestyle possible in Turkey? Or is there too much pressure on men to get married? I honestly don't know too much about the situation in Turkey.
/r/MGTOW219/11/20 08:52 AM
2

who are we? guys who lives in middle east countries. like turkey like iran like middle east turkish republics etc... Some people think that marriage in Middle Eastern countries is better for men, because the women are more traditional. Is that true, in your opinion? Also, what do men do in those countries to improve themselves, other than making working and making money?
/r/MGTOW219/11/20 07:23 AM
3

I've never listened through a sandman video. There's something about the voice he uses. But I did hear him being interviewed once on another MGTOW channel and he sounded much better. Do you really need to see a video revealing the true nature of women everyday? I'm not being sarcastic -- at some point there has to be more to MGTOW than that? Or maybe not?
/r/MGTOW219/11/20 05:49 AM
-8

Yay! Men good! Women bad! --> MGTOW1 Here's a question: should people ghost? Is it necessarily a bad thing? I think ghosting is probably socially acceptable where the relationship hasn't progressed past the initial dating stage. It may even be a good thing at that point. What do people here think?
/r/MGTOW218/11/20 09:09 PM
8

Can we please stop trying to define MGTOW as having something to do with women??? "Incel" defines itself in relation to women. "PUA" defines itself in relation to women. "MGTOW" is men going their own way. Yes, that includes not getting married and not cohabitating with women. But that is as a RESULT of walking our own path. It's raison d'être isn't about "rejecting women". Or, at least, it shouldn't be.
/r/MGTOW218/11/20 09:06 PM
16

That's a factor, certainly. But vaccines usually go through a protracted period of testing, since side effects may take months to show up. So will enough testing be done? Or will they rush it through, resulting in side effects down the track? That's what concerns a lot of people. It's not paranoia to say that politics and science aren't complementary at times.
/r/MGTOW218/11/20 04:42 AM
58

i dont know if im being paranoid or just healthy skeptic The difference between the two is that with the first, you distrust the evidence based on who is giving it, while with the latter, you distrust the evidence based on the strength of the evidence. At this early stage, there is no way to distinguish between the two, since we don't know who is providing the evidence and we don't know how strong the evidence is. Probably best to wait and see at this stage. But given that most vaccines take yea…
/r/MGTOW217/11/20 11:10 PM
3

"Think critically before you do anything" is a guide rule-of-thumb.
/r/MGTOW217/11/20 04:57 AM
8

The way I heard it, is that Vasalgel has had problems with getting funds for research. The reason is that pharmaceutical companies don't want to sell a cheap product that men only need to take once every 5 years. They want to sell a pill that men have to take every day. And in fact such a pill is being developed at the moment. God help the hormones of men in the future. Vasalgel will at least allow women to stop taking hormone pills, which I suspect is screwing up minds as well as bodies.
/r/MGTOW217/11/20 03:05 AM
5

Vasalgel! Cheap and easily reversible vasectomies. Once that becomes a reality, and 100% reliable contraception is in the hands of males, you will see some real shit happen. Sex robots! Robots that provide a number of home-help functions, including sex.
/r/MGTOW217/11/20 02:56 AM
7

I think that Pook's criticisms are relevant, at least about a certain strand of MGTOW. When he writes: There are no celebrations about being 'free' but complaining about... something. ... that's the blackpill version of MGTOW, which I loath. It definitely exists, and it ought to be criticised. If you don't think that MGTOW is freedom, then you are doing MGTOW wrong and it isn't aligning with your needs. Besides that, I agree with Solo_and_Simple: MGTOW isn't here to change society. Movements try…
/r/MGTOW216/11/20 08:34 PM
6

"Behind every great man there is a woman".-Anon quote I like: "Behind every great man appears a woman".
/r/MGTOW216/11/20 08:23 PM
1

MGTOW is a RATIONAL choice, based on one's needs and hopes, and taking into account how the world really is. It is about as opposite to metaphysics as you can get. You don't get married because marriage is now a bad deal and not suitable for the life you personally want to live. MGTOWism, on the other hand, is dogmatism. You don't get married because you don't get married because you don't get married because all women have cooties. You can get metaphysics out of that.
/r/MGTOW216/11/20 08:16 PM
9

That's not because of how our society really is but because of what she assumes our society is. In reality there are many negative stereotypes associated with the male gender that she herself actually is 100% convinced are true. Let's say for the sake of argument that's true. What do we, as MGTOWs, do about it? I'm not saying we should or should not talk about it. I'm genuinely asking: is this something that MGTOWs should be concerned about? And if we should be concerned, what should our reactio…
/r/MGTOW215/11/20 04:06 AM
3

Can anyone enlighten me on this. If you have a look at the statistics, young people tend to be lonelier than older people. This from a Jan 2020 article: https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2020/01/23/798676465/most-americans-are-lonely-and-our-workplace-culture-may-not-be-helping Loneliness appeared to be more common among men. The survey found 63% of men to be lonely, compared with 58% of women. ... Social media use was tied to loneliness as well, with 73% of very heavy social media users…
/r/MGTOW215/11/20 01:17 AM
3

There is an assumption that being in a long-term relationship 'automatically' leads to marriage. It's like it's supposed to be a gift to women, so that men are 'sacrificing their freedom' because they love their partner. But why do we have to think like that? Why can't men be in a loving relationship without the legal bits? I remember 40 years ago women being told that marriage was 'patriarchal oppression'. Lots of women vowed to have relationships but never marry. They were seen as strong indep…
/r/MGTOW213/11/20 09:00 PM
14

That's great! As I always say, we need to acknowledge that some people will be happier being married than being MGTOW. Sometimes people win the lottery. Sometimes marriages work out. It doesn't mean that MGTOW is wrong. MGTOW is an individual choice. Marriage isn't for me, but I'm not "anti-marriage", so I'm happy when it works for others. Thanks for sharing, casra888! For some reason happily married men are heretics in some MGTOW circles. That you are happily married and still see the truth in …
/r/MGTOW213/11/20 08:55 PM
3

As I am mainly doing the kids thing for her at the moment and because she is a decent human being I would feel a bit like an ass to deny her that. Let me repeat: Make the right choice for YOU, based on YOUR needs and hopes.
/r/MGTOW213/11/20 10:47 AM
17

It sounds like you know the potential costs and the potential benefits, so you have enough information to make your decision. Without knowing your needs and hopes, it's hard to evaluate what someone else should do. Marriage is not for me, but it may be for you. Some men will certainly be happier being married than being MGTOW. My 2 cents: MGTOW is not anti-marriage, but rather pro-individual. I'm not going to get married, not because I am against marriage, but because I think I'll have a better …
/r/MGTOW213/11/20 08:46 AM
2

I don't think it will be a problem for many years to come. More single people means more tax dollars for the government. Population may dip, but that's a good thing. Besides, migration will solve population issues for a long time. Someone has already proposed a UBI for women only. That would be interesting! But it will be a long time before MGTOW growth makes any changes in society. MGTOW is about the individual anyway.
/r/MGTOW212/11/20 08:22 PM
2

"Never make a contract with someone who can benefit by breaking that contract", whether that 'someone' is male, female or trans.
/r/MGTOW212/11/20 08:17 PM
3

Actually, the comments are overwhelmingly positive and congratulatory. I think it's because society loves a man who works on himself and becomes his own man. But note that the guy doesn't say "I'm now happier without a partner so I'm never going to get married". If he'd add that little sentence right at the end, I think the bulk of the comments would be negative. That's why I liked CuriousIncel2's earlier comment. Women are okay with a man who chooses to be single, as long as they aren't blaming…
/r/MGTOW212/11/20 08:14 PM
9

Can you explain further, please? I'd like to understand this. To me, spending time with friends beats the loneliness. I think that men should invest time into making friends, just as they invest in their finances. Does that not work?
/r/MGTOW212/11/20 10:31 AM
8

women don't have a problem with men who choose to remain single. They only have a problem if the men blame women... Unfortunately, examples like the one mentioned in op are the minority. I'm seeing swathes of men embracing the Black Pill instead. Both excellent points.
/r/MGTOW212/11/20 08:51 AM
4

No, the scorn comes from the idea that MGTOW MUST be misogynistic because criticism of women in any way must come from misogyny. From there, it's easy to find examples on MGTOW forums of misogyny, so the scorn is not unwarranted. The thing is: when people start actually looking into MGTOW, they'll say "You know, MGTOW has a point..." I've seen it over and over. But there is no fear from women that MGTOW threatens women's control of men. That's cultish thinking: "They know secretly that we are ri…
/r/MGTOW211/11/20 11:49 PM
1

We're demonized because a lot of toxic cr*p gets posted on MGTOW boards, and that's what people see. Sorry.
/r/MGTOW211/11/20 10:59 PM
2

Walking away from marriage is just a result of the sexist laws and judgements that happen quite often and is just one small aspect. That's it exactly! I walk away from society's expectations because I realise I am not a disposable cog in society's machine. Society wants me to do a lot of things that aren't to my benefit. One of them is marriage. I am MGTOW because I do what is best for me. That's what my MGTOW is about. Marriage is one of the things that I think is not best for me.
/r/MGTOW211/11/20 10:54 PM
8

It depends on why you are dating. If it is to get validation, then it feeds into your insecurities. If it is to get sex, then getting a sex worker is simpler, as you point out. But there is nothing more freeing than being MGTOW and dating. Nothing rides on it. Rejection becomes a learning opportunity rather than a dagger into the heart. Of course, always use both caution and condoms. Don't stick xxxx into crazy, whether xxxx is your penis or your nose. And enjoy yourself. Or don't date. It's up …
/r/MGTOW211/11/20 10:49 PM
1

People see MGTOW as toxic because a lot of MGTOW is toxic. Look at a lot of the posts on MGTOW1. But MGTOW doesn't have to be toxic. Look at MGTOW2. I'm MGTOW because MGTOW makes sense. I'm not going to excuse the toxic stuff just because someone slaps a "MGTOW" label on it. That's being part of a cult. So make no mistake: MGTOW is seen as toxic because there is a lot of toxic stuff being vomited out on various MGTOW forums and Youtube channels. People seeing that stuff will come to a reasonable…
/r/MGTOW211/11/20 08:50 PM
6

Elam is wrong. Most people don't know about MGTOW at all. Women who have heard of MGTOW don't hate it because "it frees men from women's control". They hate it because they've read that MGTOWs are misogynistic male supremacists. Men don't hate it because "they don't have the balls to grab their freedom", they hate it because they've read that MGTOWs are pathetic weasels who blame women for not sleeping with them. Let's not descend into paranoia and conspiracy theory here. Society generally still…
/r/MGTOW211/11/20 08:40 PM
8

Your Dad wants you to be happy: chase women, have some fun and then get married. That may even have been a worthwhile pursuit in his time. Sounds like he is thinking of what is best for you. Keep in mind that MGTOW ideas DO seem dystopian for those outside looking in. I'd cut him a little slack.
/r/MGTOW211/11/20 12:53 AM
2

Incels: "Women don't care about me." MGTOW: "I don't care about women."
/r/MGTOW210/11/20 10:55 PM
1

Aren't there some countries that are trying to introduce legislation that will allow the man to 'opt out' in certain situations, i.e. have nothing to do with child, not even child support? That might be a solution for pregnancies arising from one night stands. As for me, I dreaded the thought of getting a girlfriend pregnant. I always used condoms, even though some of my girlfriends wanted me to not use them on occasion, which I found weird. We need to have Vasalgel -- an easily reversible vasec…
/r/MGTOW210/11/20 10:54 PM
1

Basically what kind of personality and traits should I adopt to be successful Work hard, invest in education, invest in good physical health, invest in good mental health, invest in good financial health, and finally, leave the women alone. Success is guaranteed!
/r/MGTOW210/11/20 08:56 PM
10

It sounds like a good idea, with noble intentions. But then that's how totalitarianism starts. Who decides what constitutes harassment, hate speech, etc? Given that the Southern Poverty Law Centre has labelled MGTOW as a hate group against women, we will be in the firing line for sure. Gentlemen, it's been a pleasure serving with you.
/r/MGTOW209/11/20 06:20 AM
10

"Falling Down", with Michael Douglas. Striking movie on how men who follow all the rules are treated.
/r/MGTOW209/11/20 03:27 AM
3

Can you give a few examples of either?
/r/MGTOW208/11/20 11:53 PM
2

This!
/r/MGTOW208/11/20 08:11 PM
6

Assorted raw nuts are healthy and make a nice treat.
/r/MGTOW208/11/20 09:45 AM
23

That's the secret with being friends with women: zero sexual attraction, or at least zero expectations beyond friendship. It's a form of zen.
/r/MGTOW208/11/20 04:18 AM
8

I don't think the end goal of the biological drive is reproduction, it is having sex. If a man couldn't reproduce, he would still want to have sex. I would like a romantic relationship, entirely on my own terms. I don't want to reproduce.
/r/MGTOW208/11/20 04:14 AM
2

It's an achievement that should be noted and celebrated. She is an inspiration to other women who might be thinking of doing the same. Also, who cares that the media is reporting this? Why spend one minute thinking about this at all, much less create a post about it?
/r/MGTOW208/11/20 12:23 AM
3

I've had great women friends, and I recommend men to make good friends with good people, men and women. Sorry. Invest time in friendships, just as you invest resources into finances and physical health. It just seems crazy to remove half the population as being a source of friendship. It's cutting off your nose to spite your face. I call it "MGTOWism": MGTOW as dogma rather than a rational conclusion. It sickens me that MGTOW is gradually devolving into dogma. naturally amoral people (aka "all w…
/r/MGTOW207/11/20 12:01 AM
13

MGTOW is freedom! And knowing that other men feel the same is validating. Welcome, brother!
/r/MGTOW206/11/20 11:54 PM
2

As a MGTOW, I have a responsibility to myself, to be the best me as possible. As a part of society, though, there are also broader responsibilities that I believe I am called on to accept. That includes politics. I worry about the future, and I feel I should be involved. The latter is very important, but MGTOW forums aren't usually the place to express them.
/r/MGTOW205/11/20 10:26 PM
7

A trope is that when women say "a man should be encouraged to express his emotions", they mean "a man should be encouraged to express his emotions about me". And usually only the good emotions, like how much he likes her, and how he would die if he didn't have her in his life. Crying while saying those things is considered sweet. Non-girlfriend related fears and crying, however, tend to be considered less sweet. Here is a clip of the Most Sensitive Man In The World is talking to his girlfriend (…
/r/MGTOW205/11/20 09:20 AM
1

Men see women as objects. Women see men as subjects.
/r/MGTOW205/11/20 02:41 AM
4

It's 0.65%. That is, 6.5 people per 1000 people got married in that year (2018), which is a historic low, according to the webpage.
/r/MGTOW205/11/20 02:38 AM
19

"I thought a vasectomy would stop my wife from having kids, but it only changed the color of the baby."
/r/MGTOW205/11/20 02:33 AM
1

Cons: You are still adjusting your behaviour based on what other people think.
/r/MGTOW204/11/20 10:10 PM
1

How to get around young women essentially all having unfair standards for the men they date? Take two steps to your left; take three steps forward; then take two steps to your right.
/r/MGTOW204/11/20 09:52 PM
5

It's a good idea to have a philosophical structure to support MGTOW. Not to change what MGTOW means at the moment. MGTOW is a statement of freedom, a declaration of going one's own way in a society that wishes men don't. I'd hate to tie that statement of freedom to any particular philosophy. So it would be something that builds on a MGTOW foundation. I think of it like Ubuntu: Linux is the open source base, and Ubuntu is built on top of that. I think it is inevitable that we'll get different fla…
/r/MGTOW204/11/20 01:03 PM
3

I've visited several here in Melbourne Australia. Costs are minimal, usually to cover weekly coffee and bikkies. They have workshops with tools and carry out projects that are usually to help the community. One was building a boat for disadvantaged children to use. But often it is just a group of older men playing cards and doing things in a relaxing atmosphere. Unfortunately in recent years there has been a move to incorporate women in the Sheds. It appears to be 'sexism' to only allow men to b…
/r/MGTOW203/11/20 09:49 PM
6

Please don't post when you're drunk. The two-drink limit applies to both cars and keyboards.
/r/MGTOW203/11/20 09:40 PM
3

What other reason is there to be mgtow other than being upset with women generally? MGTOW is freedom. Freedom is good. You're not free if you are upset with women generally. You've put them on a pedestal by doing that, just a different type of pedestal. Women are just people trying to get by as best they can. They take advantage of social norms because those social norms are offered to them. That's not the fault of women; it's how men and women have set society up. Both men and women have advant…
/r/MGTOW203/11/20 09:35 PM
5

All great questions! Thinking randomly: I thought it should be easy for me as a MGTOW to say "F*** it. I don't care, let me just go my own way." I know my life would be better not thinking about many of those things, but even though I'm 60 years old, and even though I'm happy to never date again, it seems my mind often turns back to these topics. Either I fight to try to understand, or I fight to try to not be interested. Either way it's a fight. God help the young MGTOWs.
/r/MGTOW203/11/20 11:36 AM
3

If the transmen fit the definition of MGTOW, then sure: MGTOW is defined in r/MGTOW2 as: Men walking away from marriage and other relationships with women that subject them to the laws of a gynocentric court. Choosing to use your talents to improve your life, finding happiness and satisfaction. Here, mgtow is discussed from a philosophical and lifestyle standpoint, focusing on how it can (and has) been a good life decision. If the transmen don't fit the definition, welcome anyway. But note that …
/r/MGTOW203/11/20 07:07 AM
2

Ah, I see now. Sorry, my mistake. I should have read your post before commenting! What you have there is pretty comprehensive and well thought out.
/r/MGTOW202/11/20 10:42 AM
2

JYoungSocial, why get married at all? Because marriage is not an inevitability. Is it because you yourself want to be married?
/r/MGTOW202/11/20 06:47 AM
16

I think that is mixing two things: Hatred of the family court and all that feeds into its power to take away a man's access to his children with little or even no evidence against the man Hatred of women generally I've never had kids, but I hate what happens in family court. A MGTOW recently asked "Are your kids really yours?", but not in a biological sense, rather how can a man really say his kids are his if a court can so easily take them off him? There's no disinterest there; I loathe what ha…
/r/MGTOW201/11/20 01:22 AM
6

Why does a LTR necessarily mean marriage or cohabitation AT ALL? The woman might say "If you really love me, you should marry me." Why can't the man say "If you really love me, why get married at all? Isn't love enough?" The man then finds out if love is enough. Similarly with co-habitation. If it's a deal-breaker for her, then that's fair enough. But then the man will know that marriage is more important for her than her love for him. "She's not yours, it's just your turn."
/r/MGTOW231/10/20 10:14 PM
11

I still do believe theres a good looking girl out there who will respect me and who wont have a bunch of plan B's in her back pocket. That's certainly possible. If you find that woman, you will be happier being married to her than being MGTOW. No doubt that there are potential benefits. And you've read this sub, so you know the potential costs. You're coming at this with knowledge. Good luck in your search. Marriage isn't for me, but it may be for you. Best wishes, brother.
/r/MGTOW231/10/20 10:00 PM
30

Doesn't this apply to MGTOWs who hate women as well? Those women are living rent-free in some MGTOWs' minds. Those MGTOWs don't even get the benefit of a relationship. Best to cultivate disinterest. Worship, hatred, both are playing the blue-pill game. The only winning move is not to play.
/r/MGTOW231/10/20 09:52 PM
16

LibreOffice. Free open-source software that replicates Microsoft Office.
/r/MGTOW230/10/20 02:35 AM
2

Statistics, please? It doesn't give a break-down by gender, but according to Psychology Today (not the most reputable of sources): https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/contemplating-divorce/201709/are-you-among-the-growing-number-unhappy-married-people In his 2012 book, You Can Be Right or You Can Be Married, Dana Adam Shapiro wrote that as few as 17 percent of couples are content in their partner. Vicki Larson, journalist and co-author of The New I Do, Reshaping Marriage for Skeptics, Realis…
/r/MGTOW229/10/20 03:36 AM
2

So no, removing marriage wouldn't change my calculus. I had already removed marriage. Ah, I see. Sorry, my mistake. I understand where you are coming from, then. Good post! It's interesting to see different perspectives.
/r/MGTOW229/10/20 12:45 AM
2

For me: it's not red-pill rage, it's blue-pill rage. The person is angry because they are having trouble swallowing the red-pill. They are having problems letting go of the expectations of their blue-pill world. Once they have swallowed the red-pill completely, the rage disappears. So the rage is the remaining blue-pill being worked through the system, thus "blue-pill rage". My 2 cents!
/r/MGTOW228/10/20 11:57 PM
2

That's a good post, so upvoted. But there is an underlying assumption there that I'd like to question. For me, MGTOW is a rational decision, based on: "Don't make a contract with someone who can benefit from making that contract." So marriage is not for me. But LTRs? That I might do, if I found someone I think would add benefit to my life. Why not? I'd be crazy to turn a benefit down just for some ideology. The underlying assumption that I refer to is that "LTR == marriage." Remove that assumpti…
/r/MGTOW228/10/20 11:50 PM
3

Along the same lines: "You never know your wife until you meet her in divorce court."
/r/MGTOW228/10/20 09:21 AM
12

As I always recommend when this topic comes up: speak to men from that country and ask their views on the benefits of marriage and the women there. This is from the Bible, and written in a more traditional culture probably around 2500 years ago: Proverbs 21:9: Better to live on a corner of the roof than share a house with a quarrelsome wife. Proverbs 21:19: It is better to dwell in the wilderness, than with a contentious and an angry woman. Proverbs 25:24 It is better to dwell in the corner of t…
/r/MGTOW228/10/20 06:29 AM
2

Well, you work hard, you stay in shape, you're smart. I hope you find the woman that treats you as you deserve.
/r/MGTOW227/10/20 09:09 AM
-2

I have hobbies and i deserve better. What do you deserve, and why?
/r/MGTOW227/10/20 07:55 AM
6

Can we ban the black-pill stuff somehow? I get it, black-pillers: you get your validation from women, and because you are short and/or fat, women don't value you, so you don't value yourself. Somehow agreeing with WOMEN's valuation of yourself as a zero is a good thing. "Women value me as a zero, therefore I'm a zero! I agree with them! Hahaha! That's a good thing! I'm facing reality by basing my value on women's valuation of me!" It isn't a good thing. It's a terrible thing. It's putting women …
/r/MGTOW227/10/20 04:48 AM
1

Just like afterlife. That's an interesting parallel, and I think there is something to it. I'll have a think about that.
/r/MGTOW227/10/20 01:10 AM
3

That's why I asked "tell me what's happening on the inside." That's also why I added "tell me to f*** off". He doesn't need my validation either way. But becoming a Chad doesn't tell me anything about how he is going his own way. How does transforming into a Chad turn you from a slave into a free man?
/r/MGTOW226/10/20 11:53 PM
5

Because the "usual manosphere lingo" doesn't make it good. The words you use matter. "Incel" is a label that defines itself in relation to women. "PUA" is a label that defines itself in relation to women. "Simp" is a label that defines itself in relation to women. "Chad" is a label that defines itself in relation to women. I like the label "MGTOW" because it does NOT define itself in relation to women. Let's keep it that way for as long as possible. Losing weight and getting into shape is a grea…
/r/MGTOW226/10/20 11:30 PM
9

I guess i still need more work No, you don't. Just tell me to f*** off! You've done the work. I know how hard it is to lose weight, and I know how great it feels to accomplish something like that. Because losing weight and keeping it off is so damn difficult. You've done well! My comment was about relating terms like 'simp' and 'chad' to physical appearance. That seems like Incel talk, which I hate. So that's why I asked "what's happening inside?" That's where being MGTOW exists. Leave outside a…
/r/MGTOW226/10/20 10:57 PM
3

If showing pictures of yourself is how you are labeling yourself, then you aren't free. What's happening on the inside? Well done on the weight loss, though.
/r/MGTOW226/10/20 10:38 PM
1

How you work now depends on how you want to live in your future. Getting work after age 50 becomes progressively harder. So make your money before then! It's not a question of a lot of money; the happiest man is the one who has enough money. Once you have enough money, you'd be crazy to work at a job you don't enjoy. "Don't be crazy" should be part of the MGTOW creed.
/r/MGTOW226/10/20 10:31 PM
2

I have trouble coping with the loneliness. I miss having a companion in life. But why be lonely? Why can't you have a companion in life? I don't understand this question. MGTOW is "no marriage/co-habitation". It isn't "you can't have a companion in life". Can you explain why you can't have a companion in life please, to help me understand?
/r/MGTOW226/10/20 10:11 PM
47

This is sub for you to focus on YOUR journey and where you are headed, not all the bullshit you left behind. That's it exactly! Probably a not-so-well-thought-out suggestion, but: would it help to have post flairs containing categories that the post falls into? The poster has to select from the category in order to post. This might help to keep to topics that we want. Possible categories could include: Why I went MGTOW What I'm doing as MGTOW to improve life Interesting relevant article Also, I …
/r/MGTOW226/10/20 03:00 AM
3

it has to happen that men demand a segregated society. Personally I feel that would not be of benefit to men and MGTOW. Women bring benefit to our lives, so we'd be worse off without them. It's crazy to ignore a benefit just because of ideology. I call that "MGTOWism" -- MGTOW as dogma rather than a rational decision. it's getting to be not just something that runs as an undercurrent where it's ok to hate men but it's actually expected within certain circles, that if you don't hate men you won't…
/r/MGTOW225/10/20 09:57 PM
2

"Why do famous people wear sun-glasses? It's because they spend the first half of their life trying to be recognised, and the second half trying not to be recognised." Choices lead to consequences.
/r/MGTOW225/10/20 09:52 PM
7

I wish my friends the best of luck, and sincerely hope that marriage works out for them. Marriage is not for me and I am very happy being single. But some men will be happier being married than being single. Whatever their choice, I wish the best for everyone. As long as men know the potential costs as well as the potential benefits, then it is up to them. The problem is that society hides the potential costs and only gives us the potential benefits. Society is a shady used car salesman.
/r/MGTOW225/10/20 09:31 PM
14

I'm 60 years old, life gets better and better. I mean, am I going to be 50 and still all by myself? Why will you be by yourself? There are lots of married people who are lonelier as a married man than as a single man. Have a look at the r/deadbedrooms. Talk to older married men who are 50. Go to Aged Care Homes and see how often children visit their elderly parents. The thing is, whether single or married, you need to invest in friendships. If you are going to be lonely without marriage, you'll …
/r/MGTOW225/10/20 09:14 PM
1

"The Black Pill is what happens when you leave a Blue Pill in a damp mouldy environment too long". I couldn't agree more! The Black Pill is just a stale Blue Pill. It has nothing to do with the Red Pill, and therefore nothing to do with MGTOW.
/r/MGTOW224/10/20 11:21 PM
2

That's a good question, and one I'd like to see addressed also. Not that I want children for myself, but, as you wrote, for some men having children is a very important goal. I'm guessing that you'd need to have some kind of financial independence so you can spend time raising your children. You might be able to find a woman who is happy to have your child and hand it over for you to raise, but the legal implications are significant. As someone on MGTOW asked, "are your kids yours?" Not in the b…
/r/MGTOW224/10/20 11:09 PM
18

Exactly. "MGTOW is despair" is like the slave being in despair because he is now free. I hate that "MGTOW is black pill" bullsh*t.
/r/MGTOW224/10/20 12:56 PM
5

Argue about what? Perhaps you may learn something of value. I'd listen first. Your friends are quite open minded in accepting what you have to say, it may be worth adopting that some attitude for the "Medicine and Feminism" class.
/r/MGTOW224/10/20 12:52 PM
4

Women can still have children. As long as there is freely available sperm, humanity won't go extinct.
/r/MGTOW224/10/20 04:31 AM
3

Well said! I agree with pretty much all of that. We associate with women based on need. We neither associate nor disassociate because they are women. That's the healthy attitude MGTOWs should have. I've seen posts on MGTOW1 where posters seem to have to believe all women are evil. It's why they get so many questions like "I want to be MGTOW but I love my mother." MGTOW is slowly turning into dogma.
/r/MGTOW224/10/20 03:09 AM
2

That is why I don't associate with women. And to be fair, I don't associate with men who create drama and expect me to pay their bills for their presence in my life. It has nothing to do with gender. I've met very few women who were good people and pulled their own weight. And I don't hate those women either. I just leave them alone. Perfect! Well said. It's the MGTOW addendum to Briffault's Law: "The MGTOW determines all the conditions of association. Where the MGTOW can derive no benefit from …
/r/MGTOW224/10/20 02:37 AM
3

If you're not planning to start a family and reproduce with a woman, then there is no real reason for association. Friendship? Advice from those with experience, like doctors? Hobbies and social groups? "No real reason for association" seems overly broad, and is consistent with the type of attitude I'm criticising.
/r/MGTOW224/10/20 02:35 AM
2

I'm more than happy for MGTOW is a boys club. My problem isn't that part, it is about MGTOW becoming a club where you have to pay allegiance to the idea that "all women have cooties." You can see the kind of piling on that happens in MGTOW1. The article by the radical feminist is a reflection of what I see more and more in MGTOW forums. Women, just as men, are a resource that should be used as any other resource. Holding an ideological view of them -- whether that be "women are evil" or "women a…
/r/MGTOW224/10/20 01:30 AM
2

Is it possible to create small steps along that path of healing mentally? Remember "Failing to plan is planning to fail!" (with apologies to the superhero The Sphinx https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=62Ty1JfdQuA)
/r/MGTOW223/10/20 10:06 PM
9

That's great! Just be mindful about going too far in the other direction. Do what is best for you in your life, and avoid the dogma of "all women bad!" Only the Sith deal in absolutes. MGTOW is freedom!
/r/MGTOW223/10/20 11:33 AM
3

I'm sorry to hear that. Sounds like blaming the victim.
/r/MGTOW223/10/20 05:40 AM
4

No. Is there an argument that a sign of weakness is having trauma? I've never heard that.
/r/MGTOW223/10/20 05:26 AM
5

You need to build self-esteem, by building self-confidence; that is, you need to grow to trust yourself. No-one can give you self-esteem; it is something you have to get for yourself through accomplishments. Start small: set small goals, then accomplish them. Then set bigger goals, then accomplish them. If you start with big goals (marriage, children), they will overwhelm you and you won't get anywhere. So small steps. Think of it like gym work: start with the smallest weights, do it everyday or…
/r/MGTOW223/10/20 05:09 AM
1

I'd love to know what MGTOW-related advice pdiggs1500 thought he gave. Maybe it was more MGTOW1-related advice rather than MGTOW2?
/r/MGTOW222/10/20 12:13 PM
9

I'm confused. You told your employee not to get married?
/r/MGTOW222/10/20 06:37 AM
2

Shane Warne bowling to Sachin Tendulkar -- heaven! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L1CE09RKhJA Money spoils everything. Politics spoils everything. :( No advice, I'm afraid, other than sympathy for your plight.
/r/MGTOW222/10/20 12:05 AM
2

I did intermittent fasting, and lost a heap of weight. During COVID19, I stopped intermittent fasting, and put back on heaps of weight. :( You've raised an issue that has been mulling over my mind for a while: what does MGTOW mean with regards to the individual? I've always described MGTOW as "pro-individual" rather than "anti-marriage". Marriage is not for me, because marriage is now a bad deal for men. So I'm not getting married. But it may be for other men. As long as they understand the pote…
/r/MGTOW221/10/20 11:55 PM
2

For me, I'd rather be a man than a woman. There are both costs and benefits to being either in today's society. Still, being a man is all I know. Also for me, being a single man is better than being a married man. Society tells us the potential benefits of marriage but not the potential costs. To my mind, society is lying to us. I think that is worthy of complaint. It's certainly worthy of education.
/r/MGTOW221/10/20 11:43 PM
2

Trumpreagan, are you superior, inferior or equal?
/r/MGTOW221/10/20 11:39 PM
2

Can you update your question in that case, please? "Inferior" can mean so many things, all you'll be left with is a poll where people's response may mean anything.
/r/MGTOW221/10/20 11:37 PM
1

Because many men can be pretty awful.
/r/MGTOW221/10/20 11:34 PM
1

Activism towards making society a better place is a good idea, but I just don't see it as a MGTOW issue. MGTOW is about the individual. I think everyone should be an activist, but more as like "I want to live in a good society, therefore activism" rather than "I am MGTOW, therefore activism."
/r/MGTOW221/10/20 11:33 PM
1

Good for you for investigating this for yourself, poobastunk! Upvoted.
/r/MGTOW221/10/20 11:27 PM
2

Thanks pinewoodpine. I guess we'll have to agree to disagree about calling them "chains"! If I have a choice between either A or B, and I choose A and so I can't do B, then I am not "chained" to A. The consequence of my choice is that I don't get the benefit of doing B. Anyway, I think I understand what you meant, so it's all good! Thanks for your response.
/r/MGTOW221/10/20 10:07 PM
5

I agree, but I wouldn't call them "chains", but rather "consequences". There are consequences for every choice. The idea that marriage necessarily means no loneliness and no isolation is wrong. If you go to r/deadbedrooms, you will see lots of lonely and isolated married people, craving physical affection and sex. In fact I'd say a part of the rationale of being MGTOW in the first place is that marriage is not the solution to that problem! I definitely agree with you that people need a plan for …
/r/MGTOW221/10/20 09:59 PM
1

It is? I thought it was avoiding a bad business deal. The idea of "biology is destiny" is the blue-pill narrative that men naturally should get married and have children because men are born to provide resources. That's their "natural" role. MGTOW is about avoiding the bad business deal of marriage. "Never make a contract with someone who can benefit by breaking that contract." It's common sense. Never saw those, do you have a link? I haven't kept any, I'm sorry. But there appear to be more and …
/r/MGTOW221/10/20 09:51 PM
1

Freedom = "unconstrained".
/r/MGTOW221/10/20 09:48 PM
4

I understand where you are coming from, but this seems close to the mindset that I call "MGTOWism", which is about dogma rather than rational decision making. I agree with "no marriage, no cohabitation". But it isn't a "rule". It is a rational conclusion based on my knowledge of the costs/benefits of marriage/co-habitation. Society tries to tell men that marriage is a good thing (usually by emphasizing the benefits and hiding the costs). I'm MGTOW because I recognise that marriage is not for me.…
/r/MGTOW221/10/20 10:22 AM
2

What are the set of chains with regards to MGTOW?
/r/MGTOW221/10/20 09:33 AM
5

Yes, I think that can be summed up with the word "Integrity". https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Integrity Integrity is the practice of being honest and showing a consistent and uncompromising adherence to strong moral and ethical principles and values. Never lie to women, never lie to yourself, and never lie to yourself about women. Be true to yourself. And in order to be true to yourself, work on working out who you are.
/r/MGTOW221/10/20 05:53 AM
6

I suspect that you'll find your next purpose to be "how do I get back to Earth?"! :)
/r/MGTOW221/10/20 05:23 AM
5

Yes, I've often thought along similar lines. I think men need a purpose in order to thrive rather than merely live. For some men, getting married and having a family is a worthy goal; for others, it is simply a place-holder in absence of something else. But whether we are MGTOW or not, we need a purpose to thrive, and we need to discover that purpose. In the Larry Niven sci-fi "Ringworld" series, he had an alien species called "The Pak", a race which was actually precursors to humans. They had t…
/r/MGTOW221/10/20 05:21 AM
24

are they really your kids when she can just say "I'm not haapppy," That's a powerful statement. "Are they really your kids?" Forget the whole question of biology for a moment. "Are they really your kids" if the government allows the woman to take your kids away from you at any time?
/r/MGTOW220/10/20 09:56 PM
7

If the world collapses it will be far worse than female tyranny. And guess which gender is gonna suffer the most. I agree completely! The "let it all burn!" mentality is naive. Being MGTOW in the current world is freedom. If this current world burns, a lot of that freedom will be lost.
/r/MGTOW220/10/20 07:22 AM
9

he shares his opinion that MGTOW are simply risk-averse I'm risk-avese. I'm also rational. If the potential risk exceeds the potential benefit, then my course is clear.
/r/MGTOW219/10/20 02:55 AM
3

The benefits of marriage for men: He has someone to grow old with (*) He won't die alone (*) He has a soul-mate to help raise a family (*) Children to raise, leave a legacy (*) A friend to go out with, meet other couples (*) Economic benefits (*) Health benefits -- married men tend to see doctors more often (*) Mental health -- married men tend to have less mental health issues (*) And of course, sex whenever he wants it. (*) (*) Note: may not happen
/r/MGTOW218/10/20 10:47 PM
2

I don't see what's wrong with being bitter about women. It's unhealthy, and therefore not good for you. If MGTOW is anything, it is about doing what is good for one's self.
/r/MGTOW218/10/20 10:40 PM
3

I kind of understood where Peterson was coming from when he called MGTOWs "pathetic weasels", and I agree with his point. Think of MGTOW1, and how it tends to encourage "red-pill raging" and younger MGTOWs' ranting about women. The existence of MGTOW2 itself as a reaction to MGTOW1 somewhat validates Peterson's comment. Peterson walked back his comment because he also recognises that, while there may be "pathetic weasels" amongst the MGTOW community (and he is right about that), MGTOWs in genera…
/r/MGTOW218/10/20 06:17 AM
1

Since a lot of men don't have problems with all their interactions with women (whether it's their mother, sister, relative, cousin, acquaintance, neighbor, classmate, or even a stranger), then the problem is probably you. Sorry. How are your interactions with men? And are there any differences in your interactions?
/r/MGTOW218/10/20 05:37 AM
1

However, I don't believe that in the realm of social dynamics, there can be an "objective reality". Everyone's reality is entire subjective Yes, I agree. Everyone thinks that their view of reality is the correct one. In that sense, everyone generally believes that they've "taken the Red Pill".
/r/MGTOW217/10/20 09:53 AM
2

Fair comment!
/r/MGTOW217/10/20 05:47 AM
11

Perhaps I over-reacted. I agree that some women will probably be "chameleon" women in the sense you describe. It would be interesting to see analysis of actual examples of that here. But to associate women agreeing with MGTOW ideas as somehow trying to trick men just seems paranoid. It has more to do with dogma ("any woman who agrees with MGTOW is automatically suspicious") than analysis. Dogma has to do with blue-pill thinking. If women agreeing with MGTOW ideas is a danger to someone's "MGTOWn…
/r/MGTOW217/10/20 05:11 AM
25

FFS, "Chameleon women"??? This is sheer MGTOWism. "Look out, those women are coming to get you! If they agree with you, they must be lying! They must be wanting to date you!" That just sounds paranoid. Can a woman not agree with MGTOW ideas without it somehow being a trick? If MGTOW has validity -- and it does -- then some women are going to agree with it. On the bright side, I sorta see this as a mgtow’s trials and tribulations to see who is truly going there own way or is just as the saying go…
/r/MGTOW217/10/20 04:52 AM
2

lol I like the idea of the Honk pill for this current Clown World. But how would you define it?
/r/MGTOW217/10/20 04:43 AM
1

Good idea! I'll do that. (I'd never heard of Purge Week before, sounds like fun.)
/r/MGTOW217/10/20 03:11 AM
2

I'm 60 years old, and I can tell you MGTOW ideas long preceded feminism and social media! In fact, MGTOW ideas have probably existed ever since civilization created the marriage contract. For example, 2000 years ago the Roman Emperor Augustus wanted a bachelor tax put on Roman men to force them to marry and have children. Roman men simply didn't think it worth it.
/r/MGTOW216/10/20 08:37 PM
2

Sure, I understand. I should have stressed that my comment was just a nitpick only, because I agree with all the reasons you listed in your excellent OP.
/r/MGTOW216/10/20 08:33 PM
1

I am never even gonna have a first date and I don’t really care. Then why call it a "pessimistic" view? That's what I don't understand. If you don't care about getting a date, and you don't get a date, how can that be a cause for pessimism? "Oh darn, I won't get that thing that I don't care about. That's bad!" Do you see what I mean?
/r/MGTOW216/10/20 06:38 AM
1

So if you could get laid, would you then be just regular MGTOW? That is, you wouldn't worry about whether you can get laid or not? Your value is no longer tied to women? That's why I believe that the black-pill is just the blue-pill, only more so. If a black-pilled person could form a relationship with a woman, they would do it. Or am I wrong?
/r/MGTOW216/10/20 02:31 AM
4

I'm 60, and I agree with everything you wrote. But I disagree with how you framed it though: "Reasons why I lack motivation/desire to pursue a relationship." Imagine an article about "Reasons why I lack motivation/desire to smoke" or "reasons why I lack motivation/desire to gamble". I don't think anyone would write that. They would write "reasons why I don't smoke" or "reasons why I don't gamble." So I would reword your post title as "Reasons why I don't pursue a relationship." There is no "lack…
/r/MGTOW215/10/20 10:46 PM
1

The pills are just labels. Whatever path you choose -- whether MGTOW or marriage -- just keep moving forward along that path. Invest, invest, invest. Invest financially, invest time into making friends, invest time into hobbies. Let others worry about labels.
/r/MGTOW215/10/20 10:10 PM
1

You'll need to define "feminism" first. If you mean "equal opportunity for women in social, economic and political spheres", then I'm a feminist. However, "feminism" often means something else to people, which is why few women call themselves "feminists": https://www.huffingtonpost.com.au/entry/feminism-poll_n_3094917?ri18n=true According to the survey, just 20 percent of Americans -- including 23 percent of women and 16 percent of men -- consider themselves feminists... But asked if they believ…
/r/MGTOW215/10/20 09:52 PM
3

Being sent your own way is NOT going your own way. It's not a pessimistic version of MGTOW. It's not a version of MGTOW at all. MGTOW is freedom. The black-pilled are slaves who are sad that their masters don't want them. I honestly don't understand the thinking involved there. "Accepting that fact and forgetting about women in general" is either a good thing or a bad thing: MGTOW says that this is a good thing, because value comes from one's self and not from women. The blue-pill says that this…
/r/MGTOW215/10/20 07:03 AM
7

"Smoking is bad for you." "Well, my Grandfather smoked everyday and lived until he was 90!" Marriage is not for me, since marriage is now a bad deal for men. But I understand that some men will indeed be happier being married than being MGTOW. "You pays your money and you takes your chances."
/r/MGTOW215/10/20 03:44 AM
3

Is your happiness based on having a sex-filled life? If so, then the answer is probably no. Then again, if your happiness is based on having a sex-filled life, then being attractive probably isn't going to make you happy for long anyway. The question is: if your happiness is based on sex, then how much sex is enough? Once? Twice? You might as well ask a drug addict how many hits are enough to be happy. Think of it this way: Brad Pitt, Jeff Bezos and Will Smith have all had women problems. So you…
/r/MGTOW215/10/20 03:27 AM
6

Yep. Once your self-worth, your self-validation, is tied to something external -- whether that be women, or lack of women, or wealth, or lack of wealth -- then you are no longer going your own way. You're being dragged along the way, tied to something that is not bound to you and cares nothing about you. You go where it wants to go, and not your own way.
/r/MGTOW215/10/20 03:10 AM
16

The red pill is a popularization of two aspects of evolutionary psychology, sexual relationships and female mating strategies. No, I don't think that is quite right. It's a metaphor. The "Blue Pill" is viewing the world through a narrative being pushed by mainstream society. The "Red Pill" is seeing things as they are. I've seen the metaphor used in politics and economics. The metaphor itself doesn't have anything to do with sexual relationships. It's an easy way to say "you are deluded, I'm see…
/r/MGTOW215/10/20 12:32 AM
5

Welcome!
/r/MGTOW215/10/20 12:27 AM
0

I want to quit porn, I want to stop compulsively masturbating, but I don't know how to handle these feelings... Does anyone have any advice? Why not get a girlfriend, and have sex?
/r/MGTOW214/10/20 09:26 PM
1

I've lost my drive because I've got no one besides myself I want to impress, and living and dying alone sounds like a waste. Although I really don't mind being alone. Why are you living and dying alone? Make friends, get a pet. Is there a reason you can't do these things?
/r/MGTOW214/10/20 09:23 PM
2

Well said.
/r/MGTOW214/10/20 09:21 PM
2

I think that it's the blue-pilled, the incels, the PUAs: all who determine self-value by how women see them, rather than how they see themselves. Those MGTOWs who think "MGTOW" means "men going their own way away from women" ("MGTOWAFW") are the same.
/r/MGTOW214/10/20 09:16 PM
5

Don't incels put women up on a pedestal though? Their very name is a reference to how they value women as part of their identity.
/r/MGTOW214/10/20 09:52 AM
2

All I wanted was someone to love me and not give up on me because that's the way I love. Is there anything else you feel passionate about? E.g. hobbies or enthusiasms?
/r/MGTOW213/10/20 01:49 AM
-4

"Me". I'm a male, if that's what you're asking.
/r/MGTOW212/10/20 10:55 AM
-6

If she didn't consent, then she was raped. The guy should be found and charged. The ABC report is an important message to women on the dangers of Tinder.
/r/MGTOW212/10/20 07:27 AM
1

See the definition for "MGTOW" on the side-bar: MGTOW is defined in r/MGTOW2 as: Men walking away from marriage and other relationships with women that subject them to the laws of a gynocentric court. Choosing to use your talents to improve your life, finding happiness and satisfaction. Is that you? If so, then you are MGTOW. If not, it doesn't matter. It's just a label. Still choose to use your talents to improve your life, find happiness and satisfaction. Welcome to MGTOW2!
/r/MGTOW211/10/20 09:45 PM
2

What is the black pill, in your opinion?
/r/MGTOW211/10/20 09:41 PM
2

Tell them to take the red pill. Stop putting women on a pedestal. MGTOW is freedom.
/r/MGTOW211/10/20 09:40 PM
3

I wish him the best of luck. He may be happier being married than being single. I hope it works out for him.
/r/MGTOW211/10/20 12:52 AM
9

I've always stressed being on good terms with family members. Investing time into good relationships with family and friends is as important as investing into your financial future. Having said that: don't do it if it compromises your needs. It sounds like what you are doing now by removing yourself from a toxic relationship is the best thing for you at this time. Just don't burn bridges that you might want to re-cross years down the track, on your own terms. Get strong now and then re-evaluate.…
/r/MGTOW210/10/20 11:34 PM
4

Only 4 is a problem for me. Not because I think feminism is bad (I'm a feminist in that I believe women should have equal opportunity) but because I just don't think the evidence supports the idea that first world nations are better off with a female leader. It might be true, but I haven't seen evidence for that claim. I'm happy to change my mind based on the evidence though. (One feminist joked that if the world had women leaders, there'd be no wars... just groups of countries not talking to ea…
/r/MGTOW210/10/20 02:36 AM
1

To be honest, I don't know what you mean by "Red Pill aware". For me, 'taking the Red Pill' means that you are looking at things as they are, rather than how society tells you they are. For example, the Blue Pill narrative is that 'men need to get married, otherwise they will be lonely.' The Red Pill narrative is that loneliness isn't solved by marriage, and a lot of men will probably be happier and less lonely being single. Even new MGTOW posters have swallowed that particular Blue Pill, asking…
/r/MGTOW209/10/20 11:44 PM
2

I think you may be worrying too much over what other people call themselves and what other people may call you. Women should have equal opportunity to men. For my part, I treat women like I treat men (which is sometimes viewed as "misogyny"). You're not going your own way if you are still worrying about labels. Don't worry about how others define "MGTOW" and "feminism". Let it go. Live the best life you can live.
/r/MGTOW209/10/20 02:32 PM
1

Feminism has actually given men an excuse for freedom from the traditional role they were expected to play. Exactly. Feminism played the important and necessary part in telling women that they didn't have to play the traditional role of stay-at-home married house wife, while MGTOW plays the important and necessary part in telling men that they don't have to play the traditional role of stay-at-work married man. It's just that society tells one side "you go, girl!" and the other side "Peter Pan s…
/r/MGTOW209/10/20 12:25 PM
1

BTW, is the idea of a feminist MGTOW even feasible? I'm a feminist MGTOW, but I use the classical definition of "feminism", which is equal opportunity for women in social, political and economic areas. I'd also add "equal responsibility" and "equal accountability", though I rarely see that added by feminists. Nearly everyone in the West agrees with the idea that women should have equal opportunity, though only 20% of women in the West call themselves "feminist", suggesting that the common defini…
/r/MGTOW209/10/20 11:17 AM
3

You could call me a simp, but I think that's oversimplifying. Why would someone call you a simp?
/r/MGTOW209/10/20 12:56 AM
8

Yep! The moral is: to be safe, keep it wrapped, so nothing nasty gets in and your nectar doesn't get out!
/r/MGTOW208/10/20 07:03 AM
6

The definition of MGTOW on MGTOW2 is on the sidebar: MGTOW is defined in r/MGTOW2 as: Men walking away from marriage and other relationships with women that subject them to the laws of a gynocentric court. Choosing to use your talents to improve your life, finding happiness and satisfaction. If you fit into that definition, then you are MGTOW. If you don't, who cares? It's just a label. It's all good. Still choose to use your talents to improve your life, find happiness and satisfaction. Welcome…
/r/MGTOW207/10/20 11:25 PM
11

Sure, and my rule is "don't lie to women and don't lie to yourself about women." Tell her what kind of relationship you want, and if she's okay with it, then all is good. If she isn't okay with it, then that's fine as well. We both move on. Unfortunately most guys think that in order to have regular sex, they HAVE to offer cohabitation and eventually marriage. I know I did. I would have married my first long-term girlfriend, even though I didn't love her and she was a walking red flag, and I eve…
/r/MGTOW207/10/20 12:48 PM
19

Is it high libido that's the problem, though? Nothing wrong with having sex, other than perhaps its availability when you want it. The problem of sex is that it leads to bonding and 'catching feelings', whereby you want to enter into a government mandated contractual relationship that severely disadvantages you. What we need is not a pill that lowers a man's sex drive, but two things: An easily reversible vasectomy (e.g. Vasalgel). That would eliminate unwanted pregnancies. All men being educate…
/r/MGTOW207/10/20 11:31 AM
5

You don't see it often on MGTOW2, but it is common on other MGTOW forums. My guess is that it is an actual quote from mgtow.com. According to the study, it is an expression of misogyny: Online Misogyny: A post that directly mentions specific women/men, groups of women/men or women/men in a misogynistic way. This can be expressed through slurs attacking women (‘slut’, ‘bitch’) or feminine/emasculated men (‘cuck’, ‘soy boy’, ‘white knight’, ‘blue pilled’) and LGBTQIA+ people. It can also be expres…
/r/MGTOW206/10/20 11:51 AM
1

And stop to watch news and comment on political events it is all cheap theatre . Remember the old saying: "Don’t attribute to malice what you can attribute to incompetence." Yes, the media is full of fake news nowadays, but it seems to be driven by a business model that requires clicks rather than shadowy world-wide groups. So be careful about accepting what you read, but also be careful not to see conspiracy theories everywhere. Because that way lies madness.
/r/MGTOW206/10/20 07:35 AM
5

The paper's very interesting. It talks about the "official" MGTOW website, which is obviously mgtow.com. While it mentions Reddit and Twitter MGTOW sites, the results seem to be based on mgtow.com. According to the conclusion section: While this study has yielded insights into the nature of MGTOW group dynamics and the central topics of conversation on the relatively closed MGTOW forum, it is limited by its focus on one site. I haven't looked at mgtow.com in a long time, so it may be an accurate…
/r/MGTOW205/10/20 10:58 PM
1

Yes, of course.
/r/MGTOW204/10/20 11:44 PM
1

Yes, I've thought for a while that maybe a name change for r/MGTOW2 might be in order, to separate it from the toxicity of r/MGTOW. But I agree with what colttaine wrote: it doesn't matter what you rename the sub, it will always be tarred as "toxic". It raises the question of what we want from the name "MGTOW" (or whatever we call ourselves). Social change? Respect of our peers? Non-MGTOWs to appreciate the good points we bring up instead of just "MGTOWs are incels in denial"? All of that is how…
/r/MGTOW204/10/20 11:11 AM
2

I'm an actual MGTOW man, not a teenager that hates women. There's the reason you were banned, I suspect. I wouldn't waste too much time worrying about them. MGTOW2 doesn't recruit from MGTOW1, we just watch them arrive. :)
/r/MGTOW204/10/20 03:28 AM
16

Does it get boring without having anyone? Think about what you are implying there. Does being married automatically mean "you have someone"? You know it doesn't. There are lots of lonely married people out there. Go to r/deadbedrooms, for example. So why frame it like that? It's wrong from the get-go. You need to take those blinders off. Whether you are married or single, you still need to invest time into your relationships, e.g. friendships and social groups. And that includes marriage. I susp…
/r/MGTOW202/10/20 12:45 AM
-3

Well said.
/r/MGTOW201/10/20 05:53 AM
6

Yep. Like with a handgun, chainsaw or anything useful and dangerous, you need to read the manual before using. Education, education, education.
/r/MGTOW201/10/20 05:51 AM
10

I wonder how much of it is nurture, and now much is nature. Nature tends to focus nurture, and nurture seems to build on nature. Wanting sex is natural, and there seems to be chemicals released in the sex act that make us want to pair-bond with a woman, for at least a couple of years anyway. That much is natural. Pair-bonding for life seems to be nurture building on nature. It's good for society, and men are encouraged to do what is good for society even at the expense of their own needs. Thus t…
/r/MGTOW201/10/20 05:46 AM
3

I definitely did. There is a great freedom in leaving all that behind. It's why I hate what has happened on MGTOW1. All that women-hating is just the other side of the coin of wanting to be validated by a woman's-approval. Calling it "red pill raging" doesn't stop it from acting the same way: trapping us by defining ourselves around women. Women are people just trying to get by as best they can. Understanding that is freedom.
/r/MGTOW230/09/20 11:13 PM
2

I just wanted to share this with other men because I used to be very disturbed by a lack of acceptance from women when I was really trying (with bad strategy) to get together with a woman. Life is a million times better after jettisoning that crap and just not giving a damn about it. Amen. I'm sure that this is in the Bible somewhere, maybe Ecclesiastes. If not, it should be. MGTOW is freedom.
/r/MGTOW230/09/20 10:57 PM
1

"Real men"? MGTOW is not about "real men". MGTOW is about "real me", going my own way. It's hard enough to be ourselves. We are not "real men", we are not "kings", we are not "alphas". Avoid labels, otherwise MGTOW descends into dogma. MGTOW is freedom from those labels, or it should be.
/r/MGTOW230/09/20 10:21 AM
20

The way you treat women would also be how other men would treat your daughter. Don't marry your daughter, don't marry other people's daughters. Don't mistreat your daughter, don't mistreat other people's daughters.
/r/MGTOW229/09/20 03:09 AM
3

Conservatism generally supports "family values", like getting married and having children. MGTOW doesn't really fall into that type of conservatism. Liberalism generally supports social welfare programs, which never gets discussed on MGTOW forums that I've seen. Both sides of politics are about what happens within groups. But MGTOW is pro-individual. It is apolitical.
/r/MGTOW228/09/20 05:47 AM
1

You list four experiences. The first two just sound like life as normal: you were interested in the girls, they weren't interested in you. The 3rd and the 4th experiences were with women who had drug issues, including one whom you describe as having "crackhead vibes" BEFORE you got involved with her. Is my description fair?
/r/MGTOW228/09/20 01:46 AM
2

I second givenchyboy's advice. Just be totally honest with the woman about what you want, and leave the rest up to her. Never lie to a woman, and never lie to yourself about women. Don't lose your integrity. Also, keep copies of texts and emails from you and her where you have been honest, just in case.
/r/MGTOW227/09/20 11:17 PM
3

Every experience I’ve had thus far with women has been unpleasant, I’ve been left on read, ignored, lead on, played with, and let me tell you it sucks. "If you meet an arsehole before breakfast, then you've met an arsehole. If you meet five arseholes before breakfast, then you'd have to consider that maybe you are the arsehole." Might it be that you are still expecting something from women that they aren't giving? Something that you think they should be giving you? If that is the case, then it i…
/r/MGTOW227/09/20 11:04 PM
4

Personally, I think that men need a purpose to their lives in order to thrive. Marriage and a family is an attractive and easy option for that reason: it gives men a reason to go to that crappy job everyday, etc. Is there something you are interested in that you'd like to pursue? Some social cause, for example?
/r/MGTOW227/09/20 12:21 PM
3

You might find more suitable answers on /r/relationship_advice/. Best wishes.
/r/MGTOW227/09/20 07:47 AM
5

I want a family, but will I get one? We just want to be happy. That reminds me of this: "You know, my Dad had an unhappy marriage. And my uncles, they had unhappy marriages. Also my friends' dads and uncles had unhappy marriages. But I want to get married." "Why do you want to get married?" "So I can be happy." You might want to talk to significant men in your life to see what they think of marriage. Marriage isn't for me. I'm perfectly happy with friends and family members. But if you need to g…
/r/MGTOW226/09/20 09:42 PM
3

Yep, me also. MGTOW is freedom!
/r/MGTOW226/09/20 09:32 PM
3

I think the poster is Benjamin Button.
/r/MGTOW226/09/20 01:03 PM
20

The Japanese have a word "Kenjataimu" ("Kenja-time"): Kenja-taimu (Noun) ( slang) Japanese word meaning : Period of clear thoughts when a man is free from sexual desires after having an orgasm
/r/MGTOW226/09/20 12:51 PM
26

I'll tell you a story that was a red-pilling moment for me. Like many young men, sex with beautiful women was all I thought about when I was young. When I was in my 20s, I finally had a beautiful girlfriend whom I liked very much. One time, I was sitting on a couch, semi-naked. My beautiful girlfriend was standing in front of me, naked and smiling at me. And I wanted her to move out the way, because she was standing in front of the TV and the sports news was about to start. I really wanted to se…
/r/MGTOW226/09/20 12:34 PM
5

From what I've read, marriage is becoming something that only rich people will do. If MGTOW ideology spreads among the poor, nothing much will change. If MGTOW ideology is adopted by the rich, I don't know what will happen. I wouldn't rule out some form of bachelor tax. Sex androids and easily reversible vasectomies will be game changers for men.
/r/MGTOW226/09/20 11:44 AM
46

Sex is over-rated, but it is all tied up with self-identity and self-validation. Incels, for examples, identity themselves by their inability to get sex -- it is right there in their name. But really the only way to understand that sex is over-rated is by having sex. It's like what they say about money: when you are poor, you understand what money can buy. When you are rich, you understand what money can't buy. Women are the most fascinating creatures, until you get to have regular sex with them…
/r/MGTOW226/09/20 11:39 AM
1

What are your passions, your hobbies? Any way of being able to spend more time on those?
/r/MGTOW225/09/20 11:43 PM
3

i just want you to watch 2-3 of her videos (they are usually not long) and i want to hear your opinion. Sorry, I'm just not interested enough to spend time on that. I hope you find what you're looking for.
/r/MGTOW225/09/20 11:40 PM
3

i don't know if you guys heard about Chloe Roma/Roma Army... she still bring up the valid points Never heard of her. I'm always interested in new perspectives. What are her valid points? What have you learned from her that MGTOWs should know?
/r/MGTOW225/09/20 10:24 PM
1

Women are just people trying to get by as best they can. I'd get rid of the speck out of your own eye before worrying about the plank in the woman's eye. I know that it isn't what you want to hear, but it is the truth. She's living rent-free in your head. Going your own way means leaving something behind. Don't pick up that icky thing and take it with you.
/r/MGTOW225/09/20 10:15 PM
1

what should I do? You're doing it right now and exactly what you should be doing: asking questions, and trying to make sense of what you've learned. If there is a male version of "The Wall", this is it: when blue-pill illusions smash into the hard wall of reality. That you are doing this now, at 17, rather than at 30, is fantastic! I know that might not be any comfort at the moment, but believe me, you are far ahead of the curve of most men. SO, keep going! Invest, invest, invest. Invest in good…
/r/MGTOW225/09/20 10:06 PM
1

Self-respect has to be the number one priority of any man. This is done through achievements, setting and attaining goals, integrity and morality. Respect from others is nice but secondary.
/r/MGTOW225/09/20 06:25 AM
4

And having achieved greater biological value: what does the man do then? What does he do with a greater biological value that he wouldn't do with a lower biological value?
/r/MGTOW225/09/20 06:21 AM
14

"Biological value"? Do you mean Sexual Market Value? That is the value that OTHER people put on to you. That is not why it is great to be a man. That's just looking for your validation from outside sources. So you get more validation from others in your 30s: so what? You're still looking in the wrong place. MGTOW is about increasing your own self-worth, by what you do for yourself. Whether you are a teenager, or in your 20s, or in your 30s and beyond: you should always work to improve yourself f…
/r/MGTOW225/09/20 06:13 AM
2

It's interesting that it's pronounced "mig-tao" or "mig-tau". It seems that "Tao" and "Tau" have meanings that complement the meaning of MGTOW. According to the first paragraph of the Wiki entry, "Tao" means "the way" (often symbolised by ☯): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tao Tao (道)... is a Chinese word signifying the "way", "path", "route", "road" or sometimes more loosely "doctrine", "principle" or "holistic beliefs".[1] In the context of East Asian philosophy and East Asian religions, Tao is…
/r/MGTOW223/09/20 11:31 PM
2

What did Arthur Schopenhauer say about men?
/r/MGTOW222/09/20 11:10 PM
8

I apologise. I hope things work out for you.
/r/MGTOW222/09/20 04:11 AM
3

I been looking at escorts and most of them don't bb and I been thinking of just getting one and slipping it off during it That seems like a nasty thing to want to do. Why do you want to do that?
/r/MGTOW222/09/20 02:08 AM
15

I can't wage war on women by doing my work and not their work. You are giving women WAY too much power over your mind. She was just being lazy and opportunistic in asking me, so I told her no and kept on walking. Boy, was she offended. It felt so good to not do that for her. WAY too much power over your mind. My issue is that the power of women and simps are much greater than me. WAY WAY too much power over your mind. People like incels and PUAs put women up on a pedestal. A woman's approval/dis…
/r/MGTOW222/09/20 01:59 AM
6

It can be good but for most men they are too weak or not self aware enough to see why they seek platonic female relationships Then surely the problem isn't platonic relationships (which can be good), but those men who are too weak or not self-aware enough? And men who are too weak or not self-aware are going to have a lot of problems in other areas of life as well! So, if you are against platonic relationships with women, does that mean you are a man who is too weak or not self-aware enough? And…
/r/MGTOW221/09/20 10:12 PM
6

What's wrong with platonic relationships with women, in your opinion?
/r/MGTOW221/09/20 09:51 PM
15

Of course it's a red flag. They see tattoos as attractive so when they get older they get them to stave off the inevitable Wall. Haven't you heard the old saying: "The writing is on the Wall"?
/r/MGTOW221/09/20 04:18 AM
11

Yes, I've had good women friends over the years. They have definitely been a plus in my life. That's why I hate the "MGTOWism" (as I like to call it) dogma that "all women are evil." Yes, nowadays marriage is definitely a bad deal for men. But to extend that to friendships with women is antithetical to MGTOW in my opinion, since MGTOW is about living the best life possible, and women friends have been a plus in my life. Why should I cut out something that has been a positive in my life, just to …
/r/MGTOW220/09/20 09:51 PM
1

Oh, I'm definitely the same. I love reading statistics and surveys, though I know there is a lot of bias in them. Analysis of the behaviour of both women and men would be beneficial. And having a resource of links to government-derived stats might be helpful in MGTOW-related discussions. What topics do you have in mind?
/r/MGTOW219/09/20 11:39 PM
2

Yeah, I can just see a group of MGTOWs protesting: "What do we want?" "Not to get married or to cohabitate!" "When do we want it?" "Now!"
/r/MGTOW219/09/20 11:19 PM
1

Protest against what? What are you trying to change? MGTOW is about changing yourself. Perhaps once you've got yourself in order, then it's time to protest. But it's harder to conquer yourself than to conquer the universe. That's why most people try the second option first.
/r/MGTOW219/09/20 11:17 PM
3

SomeRandomLua, you should be a writer. Seriously. Your explanation really pulled me in. I don't know what to say, my friend. But I'm sure you come out of the other side a stronger man once you've processed what happened. Best wishes, brother.
/r/MGTOW219/09/20 11:13 PM
4

I don't disagree, but what would you like that education to consist of? To me, there are two central ideas to MGTOW: (1) Marriage (and the legal situation around relationships with women) is now a bad deal, and (2) men are not disposable and should live their best life possible. There are lots of things in the modern West we can discuss: domestic violence against men; high suicide rates; high homelessness rates; the impact of fatherless in homes; other things like that. But those are more MRA is…
/r/MGTOW219/09/20 10:53 PM
3

"MGTOW" is just a label, it isn't a dogma. You do you. Some men will be happier being married with kids, than being MGTOW. It just depends on your own needs. You know the potential costs and the potential benefits, so make your decision. The rest is just luck.
/r/MGTOW218/09/20 11:51 PM
2

It's an interesting idea. But I can foresee that both men and women would have to pay into that scheme somehow. What we need are easily-reversible vasectomies, like Vasalgel. That would be the real game-changer, in my view.
/r/MGTOW218/09/20 11:47 PM
1

Don't waste your time "learning about MGTOW". You understand the problems of relationships with women, so your apprenticeship is complete. That part's done, finished, no more thought needed. Now it's time for you to put that aside and get on with your life. If you are interested in fishing, learn about fishing. If you are interested in programming, learn about programming. If you are interested in a better job, seek out the education that will take you there. Are you really asking us to tell you…
/r/MGTOW218/09/20 11:33 PM
2

The "red pill" didn't even "change my life". It's not fucking Jesus. This should be a meme! "Taking the red-pill" isn't conversion. It just means recognising what you are seeing.
/r/MGTOW218/09/20 11:22 PM
5

I think that, like a lot of men, it wasn't that I read about MGTOW and decided to become "MGTOW". I read about it and realised that I'd found the label that suits me. I'd had no real bad experiences with women in relationships, fortunately. I had been MGTOW for many years before I'd even heard the term. I had had a few long term relationships, and came to realise I was happy by myself, doing my own things. I did feel a little odd in deciding to go my way as a single man, since society is so adam…
/r/MGTOW218/09/20 11:16 PM
1

Thanks for your response. Very interesting!
/r/MGTOW217/09/20 10:56 PM
3

"Keep my head up moving forward." Great answer!
/r/MGTOW217/09/20 09:41 PM
6

It was foolish of me to get these feelings but I couldn't help it. Wish me luck Gentlemen. Not foolish at all. I'm afraid you fall into the category of "human". If you fall into the category of "smart human", you will learn from this, and you will in time see your experience as a good thing that helped you grow. Good luck my friend.
/r/MGTOW217/09/20 09:39 PM
10

MGTOWs don't say that you end up having to pay for every random sexual encounter, as far as I know. Have sex, don't have sex, it's your decision. Just be careful. Is there a particular comment from a MGTOW that you are thinking of that you can share?
/r/MGTOW217/09/20 09:30 PM
4

"A man who picks up a cat by the tail, learns a lesson he cannot learn any other way" -- attributed to Mark Twain.
/r/MGTOW217/09/20 02:06 AM
1

how do i have confidence in my self?? One step at a time. It's the same way as you build muscles, or build knowledge. Set small targets for yourself, and then achieve them. Then set bigger targets and achieve them. There is no other way, I'm afraid. Confidence in yourself will come when you can rely on yourself, if you know what I mean. riding my bike to places i never been and talking with a group of guys just because i thought why not That's great! That's more than I could have ever done when …
/r/MGTOW216/09/20 10:07 PM
1

I have heard that the food in Turkey is wonderful. Thanks. Fascinating!
/r/MGTOW216/09/20 10:01 PM
3

Shhh! You aren't allowed to say that on a MGTOW sub. "All girls have cooties", don't you know. :)
/r/MGTOW216/09/20 09:57 PM
2

It's worth pointing out that you can -- to some degree -- escape #2 by getting out of large cities and finding a home in a smaller college town in a more traditional, conservative parts of the country. Yes, that's another option I've considered. I always thought that I'd want to live in a big city, but as I get older and closer to retirement age, that idea doesn't appeal as much. Moving to a more rural part of Australia might be best, though most rural parts of Australia are a mess of unemployme…
/r/MGTOW216/09/20 09:55 PM
1

Sounds interesting. What do you like about life there? And what's living in Turkey like for foreign men?
/r/MGTOW216/09/20 11:29 AM
5

lol
/r/MGTOW216/09/20 05:37 AM
3

Nice insight.
/r/MGTOW216/09/20 03:52 AM
4

Why the Congo?
/r/MGTOW216/09/20 03:47 AM
3

Why Nepal? I'll admit I know nothing about it.
/r/MGTOW216/09/20 03:47 AM
4

I commend you on your approach: you are making positive steps to improve your life rather than doing nothing. I agree with 3020forever that sex is over-rated, but you are right in that until you have sex, how will you know? One comment is that visiting prostitutes is a good way to get sex, if lack of sex is the problem. But I understand that for many incels, the problem isn't so much sex but the lack of intimacy and lack of relationship with a woman. I know from experience that prostitution does…
/r/MGTOW216/09/20 01:35 AM
1

I'm active in the incel community I have to say, that sounds a little like an oxymoron. I'll go away now.
/r/MGTOW216/09/20 01:23 AM
16

I'm an Australian. The PC nonsense painting men as villians has permeated throughout society here, including politics. I don't see things getting better. I want to live in New Zealand, where things seem to be better.
/r/MGTOW216/09/20 01:19 AM
26

MGTOW itself has nothing to do with misogyny, but look at r/MGTOW and other MGTOW content creators. Misogynists are attracted to MGTOW, probably because MGTOW has the reputation of being misogynistic. It's a vicious circle. That would affect any movement, but MGTOW is not a movement. It's an individual decision. My recommendation is: Yes, MGTOW has the reputation of being misogynistic. Nothing we can do about that. Probably best to not worry about it. At worst, don't tell people you are MGTOW. B…
/r/MGTOW216/09/20 12:55 AM
13

... being caught (in a bluepill world)
/r/MGTOW215/09/20 01:44 AM
3

i know i dont need a GF, how can i make her happy if im not happy? STOP THAT CRAP RIGHT NOW. You CANNOT make a woman happy. You can't make your friends happy. We can barely make ourselves happy. Those moments of happiness come through our memories of doing things. We are rarely aware of being happy at the time. We can only be content in the present. Do you know the best way of making other people happy? It's by having confidence in ourselves. Think about it. Imagine a man who does everything to …
/r/MGTOW214/09/20 10:53 PM
1

i keep questioning my self worth based on how others react to me. One of the great lies my generation (I'm 60) promoted was that self-esteem is something that can be given to a man. It can't. Self-esteem, self-respect, self-worth, can only come through the self, and can only come by doing things. Think about it: why should YOU have any self-worth? What have you done for yourself that is worth something? Actually I'm sure you have done things that you're proud of. Build on it. Exercise. Study. Se…
/r/MGTOW214/09/20 10:34 PM
2

Yes, you are real, therefore life is real. "Life is what happens while you are making other plans." Best wishes brother.
/r/MGTOW213/09/20 09:17 PM
15

Ouch! Roids are terrible. I had to have an operation to get rid of mine. I couldn't sit down for a week.
/r/MGTOW213/09/20 12:24 PM
15

I don't believe MGTOW has any kind of position on that. We are very much pro-individual. "You do you" is our motto.
/r/MGTOW213/09/20 09:37 AM
8

"Be the lion, not the house cat". I'm sorry, that's a meme. The title: "Women telling men how to be men is like a housecat telling a lion how to be a lion". That's not "good content". It's barely content at all. I'm sorry. I'm not a mod, but that particular post deserved to be removed. Perhaps if you'd added how you yourself had acted in some situation as a 'lion' instead of a 'house cat' after becoming MGTOW, that might have been interesting.
/r/MGTOW212/09/20 11:49 PM
2

Maybe the mods could try to write what rule was actually broken. How does one improve if they don't know what they did wrong. I kind of agree, but readers should familiarise themselves with any subreddit rules before posting. The mods get a heap of content that breaks the rules by posters who clearly haven't read the rules. The onus of understanding the rules is on the reader. The mods shouldn't have to spend time explaining rules that are clearly posted on the subreddit. I've been involved in m…
/r/MGTOW212/09/20 11:34 PM
4

Doesn't that break the "no memes" rule? No Cartoons, Anime, Memes: No anime, cartoons or memes as submissions. Did you add written content, or was it just the image?
/r/MGTOW212/09/20 11:30 PM
14

What kind of 'good content' do you mean? Is it content that is against the MGTOW2 subreddit rules? Perhaps you could provide some examples from memory to see if they pass the MGTOW2 Subreddit rules or not. Here's the Subreddit rules: No Women-hating, hate, and negativity in general: Keep the misogyny to a minimum. This is a place for focusing on positivity of mgtow for men, not for focusing on women or their bad behavior. If you feel the need to bring up "the nature of women", it needs to be in …
/r/MGTOW212/09/20 10:22 PM
25

The one raised by the woman (his ex-maid) is fit and strong. The other one, raised by Arnold and Pam, is quite overweight.
/r/MGTOW212/09/20 06:15 AM
13

Holy crap: Under Ontario law, an unmarried couple are considered common-law spouses if they have cohabited – lived together in a conjugal relationship – continuously for at least three years. But that doesn’t necessarily mean living in the same home, the court found. “Lack of a shared residence is not determinative of the issue of cohabitation,” the Appeal Court said. “There are many cases in which courts have found cohabitation where the parties stayed together only intermittently.” ... Through…
/r/MGTOW211/09/20 12:42 PM
12

I know that lots of others will make this comment, so I hope I'm the first: The lesson learned in watching Love Island is not to waste time watching Love Island. Sorry. Here's an interesting topic: sadbasturd99, what productive thing could you have spend time on in order to improve yourself rather than watching Love Island?
/r/MGTOW211/09/20 01:16 AM
6

I don't know if you've read the Subreddit rules for the r/MGTOW2 sub, but it starts like this: No Women-hating, hate, and negativity in general: Keep the misogyny to a minimum. This is a place for focusing on positivity of mgtow for men, not for focusing on women or their bad behavior. If you feel the need to bring up "the nature of women", it needs to be in a dispassionate, objective context that is directly relevant to YOUR mgtow journey. This is a positive space for male progress and life out…
/r/MGTOW211/09/20 01:11 AM
4

--> r/MGTOW
/r/MGTOW210/09/20 10:48 PM
5

I understand. I call it "MGTOW3". The three stages of MGTOW: MGTOW1 -- join a MGTOW sub and complain about how men should go their own way because "women are evil!" MGTOW2 -- join a MGTOW sub and comment on how men can go their own way and live a good life. MGTOW3 -- don't comment on any subs or talk about MGTOW, just go my own way and live a good life. Best of luck to you!
/r/MGTOW210/09/20 09:35 PM
1

Happiness is not a question of having a lot or a little money. The happiest man is the one who has enough money.
/r/MGTOW208/09/20 09:48 PM
2

I'd die for my mother. She was a wonderful parent, though I didn't appreciate it at the time. Growing up, I was as blue-pilled as a blue-pill inside another blue-pill. She filled my head with the 'all men are evil' trope, and when I realised this it made me resent her enormously for a while. It wasn't until I became an adult that I started to have honest discussions with her on the topic. What I found was that she had had a pretty horrible upbringing with her mother. Not that my grandmother was …
/r/MGTOW208/09/20 09:36 PM
4

There are women who 'GTOW'. That is, rejecting the blue-pill narrative. These are women who decide they don't want children. They get as much cr*p as MGTOWs do.
/r/MGTOW208/09/20 08:45 PM
12

You might as well say "The high price we pay in being poor." The answer to that is to be careful with money, invest, etc. It isn't to just sit there, or accept the first poor paying job that comes along and keep to that. Invest your money, invest in your training, invest in your education. Similarly, "the high price we pay for loneliness". The solution is: invest time into your hobbies and passions, invest time into making and keeping friends. Male friends, female friends, friends with benefits.…
/r/MGTOW208/09/20 03:59 AM
1

I've had great women friends. I encourage all men to invest time into making good men and women friends. However, "never make a contract with someone who can benefit from breaking that contract." It's simply common sense. So marriage/cohabitation is not for me. Interesting typo! 'Ploutos' comes from the Greek word meaning 'wealth', thus "plutocracy" for example means "rule by the wealthy". So a "plutonic relationship with women" would mean a relationship based on money. Your question, as written…
/r/MGTOW208/09/20 01:20 AM
1

Just ignore them. Don't you have anything better to do?
/r/MGTOW207/09/20 11:35 PM
6

There are men who simply blame others for their own problems. It is much easier to try to fix the problems of the world than to try to fix the problems within one-self. In the MSM, if MGTOW is mentioned at all, it is referred to as a misogynistic movement -- men who hate women that won't sleep with them. This attracts certain men to MGTOW -- that is, it attracts men who hate women that won't sleep with them. You can see lots of posts on MGTOW1 (r/MGTOW) from such men. So the reputation that MGTO…
/r/MGTOW207/09/20 11:13 PM
5

You did the right thing. But make sure you read what Bourbonandcigars06 wrote. Read it 10 times if you have to, until it sinks in.
/r/MGTOW206/09/20 10:03 PM
3

It's both MGTOW and common sense: "Never make a contract with someone who can benefit from breaking that contract." Yeah I know this, but the society here isn't that open about that... Iive in is frowned upon See her everyday, have occasional sleep-overs. But don't marry her, don't move in with her. Simple. If she loves you, she should be happy with that, shouldn't she? If the forces of society are too strong for that arrangement, then the red flag isn't so much her but the society you live in. …
/r/MGTOW205/09/20 10:37 PM
5

Well said. I agree completely.
/r/MGTOW205/09/20 10:15 PM
3

Do you mind if I ask: Why marry her? Why not just have a relationship with her without marriage? Isn't just having you in her life and her in your life enough? So why marriage at all? The cynical MGTOW thought is: "I love you so much that I want to get the government involved."
/r/MGTOW205/09/20 10:06 PM
11

Good post! I'm glad it all worked out for you. Best wishes. So I decided to take a new approach to life. I was sick of being a bystander, someone that things happen to, I wanted to be someone who made things happen. Wise words for all men, married or single.
/r/MGTOW205/09/20 12:06 PM
2

It's very important to invest in yourself: (1) invest in your physical health through regular exercise, (2) invest in financial health through not getting married and making actual regular investments, and finally (3) invest in good mental health. The last one means investing time to make good friends (male and female), being on good terms with family and participating socially. The only way to avoid the problem of loneliness is by being with people who respect you. Marriage does not necessarily…
/r/MGTOW205/09/20 11:57 AM
6

If and when MGTOW goes mainstream, you'll see the opposite: a pandering to get the MGTOW buck. Single men with a work ethic and disposable income are going to be an attractive market. You'll see advertisements for "MGTOW holidays", "MGTOW vitamins", "MGTOW investment opportunities", etc. "Because you're worth it!"
/r/MGTOW205/09/20 10:00 AM
2

Determine what kind of relationship you want, and go out and get it. Marriage/cohabitation is now a bad deal for men, so avoid that. Find a nice woman and explain what you want (never lie to a woman and never lie to yourself about women) and if she rejects that, so be it. If she accepts, then you are good to go. I saw a Youtube clip of a woman complaining about MGTOWs not marrying. She said she understood the dangers of marriage, but said the problem was that men weren't marrying good trust-wort…
/r/MGTOW205/09/20 03:18 AM
8

I've had many managers over 40 years, including women managers. The best manager I ever had was a woman. She was wonderful. The worst manager I ever had was a man. Nice guy, but he did the minimal work, the lazy bastrd. However, overall, the male managers tended to be easier to get along with. They weren't necessarily better managers of work, but the interpersonal relationship was easier. If I could choose, I'd prefer to work with a manager who was a man. But my experience is that women can make…
/r/MGTOW205/09/20 02:37 AM
2

Good cautionary story, thanks for sharing. I suspect that at some point most MGTOWs will be tempted to think they've found their unicorn, so you're not alone.
/r/MGTOW204/09/20 09:06 AM
0

The report has nothing to do with "women do not lust after men". In fact, it actually states that they do. It simply confirms that men and women in general are affected by different visual sexual stimuli: ... variability in sex differences observed in response to visual sexual stimuli. Factors include participant variables, such as hormonal state and socialized sexual attitudes, as well as variables specific to the content presented in the stimuli. But I agree with R1cky_Spanish: even if it is t…
/r/MGTOW204/09/20 02:54 AM
3

How is dokuringo20 blue-pilled? He seems complete right.
/r/MGTOW204/09/20 02:48 AM
3

It probably would have been better to ask how MGTOWs interpret the word, then. Unfortunately the word "love" has been abused enormously over the last 50 years. Eighty years ago, "making love" meant "wooing", as in chatting up women. Nothing at all to do with having sex itself. Now if you say you love someone, it seems to mean wanting to have sex with them. We've lost something I think. Apologies for the digression. It's a particular bugbear of mine! Erotic/romantic love disappears over time. A s…
/r/MGTOW203/09/20 09:08 PM
1

Who are you to care what Pat Mahomes does with his life? Seriously. MGTOW is pro-individual, not anti-marriage. MGTOWs decide not to marry because they realise that marriage is a bad deal for themselves. I'm against marriage for myself, I'm not against marriage for other people. Pat Mahomes may have found his soul-mate, and will live happily ever after. If so, good luck to him! I'm still not going to get married.
/r/MGTOW203/09/20 08:52 PM
1

do any of you guys still believe in love? i'm talking about men and women of course. Nor friends, pets or your parents. Of course. You can love a woman just as you love your friends, pets and your parents. Why couldn't you? (I'm not going to marry my friends, pets and parents either.) Or do you mean something else? The problem is that there is an implied meaning behind words like "love" and "loneliness" that is assumed rather than stated. What does it mean to "love a woman", such that it is diff…
/r/MGTOW203/09/20 08:38 PM
1

Finally: I have a daughter who is approaching the age of noticing boys, why shouldn't I point to you lot as a group (as I am currently inclined) and saying that lot are the sort you should avoid? Do you mean, you'd advise her to stay away from a particular group since engaging with that group wouldn't be in her best interests? So in a sense, she should decide to 'go her own way' from that group? It sounds like good sensible advice.
/r/MGTOW201/09/20 11:25 AM
2

It's not the moral of the story, but it is the lesson of the story: I knew I didn’t pull out many times before It's a good lesson for all men. Thanks for sharing.
/r/MGTOW231/08/20 11:52 PM
8

Scared to death? Good. All alone? Good. Time to go all in, balls out. Time to say "I'm 100% alone, no support. Fuck it, I'm 100% committed." Then show people 100% of who YOU are. Because this won't be the first time you'll feel scared to death, if you are lucky.
/r/MGTOW231/08/20 11:01 PM
1

Well said!
/r/MGTOW231/08/20 10:52 PM
4

I'm afraid you have a severe case of "life at 20". :) It looks like you are doing the right things: questioning your life, working out what you want to do, looking for advice from others. Talk to your dad, talk to other older men who seem to have their stuff together, learn from others' life experiences, invest in yourself through exercise, education and finance, those are my tips. You are on the right path! Keep walking it, my friend. Best wishes.
/r/MGTOW231/08/20 10:47 PM
56

The rule is: 80% of women want to get with 20% of men. The other 80% of men are invisible. When women say that "there are no good men", they are usually talking about the men in that 20%. There are no men outside that. But so what? It shouldn't worry you. Think of Brad Pitt, Jeff Bezos and Will Smith. All three have had women problems. So you could be as good-looking as Brad Pitt, as rich as Jeff Bezos and as charismatic as Will Smith, and still have women problems. So the rule is more like: 100…
/r/MGTOW231/08/20 10:30 AM
1

True, but from what I've read on incel boards, "success in life" tends to revolve around being able to get a woman to love them. Maybe I'm wrong, but are there incels who say "I'm too short to make a million dollars" or "I'm too ugly to become an expert in my field"?
/r/MGTOW231/08/20 04:05 AM
3

The "pills" are an analogy about how the pill-taker sees 'reality' as it really is, while believing that others who don't see things the way they do are somehow deluded. The red-pilled believe they see the reality whereas the blue-pilled do not. The blue-pilled believe a narrative being pushed by society. The blue-pilled are deluded. The black-pilled believe they see the reality whereas the red-pilled do not. The red-pilled like MGTOWs use 'copes' to pretend that they are not black-pilled. The r…
/r/MGTOW231/08/20 03:56 AM
8

The "black-pill" is the 'reality' that due to circumstances (physical or otherwise) you will never succeed with women because women will never love a person like you. It isn't about sex so much -- so visiting prostitutes isn't a solution -- but tying your value into being able to get a woman to love you. I hate the idea of the black-pill. I hate it even more that incels sometimes associate MGTOW with it, i.e. "I was forced to go MGTOW!" MGTOW is about finding value within yourself, and not tying…
/r/MGTOW231/08/20 03:32 AM
12

It looks like it may have come from a study done by the Institute for Family Studies (IFS): https://ifstudies.org/about/our-mission The mission of the Institute for Family Studies (IFS) is to strengthen marriage and family life, and advance the well-being of children through research and public education. Known for its objective and impeccably researched studies that attract attention and respect from all across the ideological spectrum, IFS’s programs and platforms focus on a number of trending…
/r/MGTOW230/08/20 03:21 AM
46

Sex is over-rated. It's as simple as that. But you need to have sex in order to know it is over-rated. I mean, when you're not getting sex, it seems like the most important thing in the world. But when you do get it, it's like "okay, that was nice, but now I want to do something of value." That epiphany is why so many Chads end up going MGTOW.
/r/MGTOW230/08/20 12:50 AM
2

I think I would be happier with a family, I want children. Then MGTOW is not for you, and that's fine. It's just a label, after all. You are still my brother.
/r/MGTOW229/08/20 11:56 PM
3

Sounds like you've thought this through. I'm impressed! The truth is that some men will be happier being married than being MGTOW. Best wishes, brother. Edited to add: Don't listen to the nay-sayers on this thread. The most important principle behind MGTOW is to live your life your way. The problem is that society tells men all the benefits of being married and none of the costs. You understand the costs, so you are making an informed decision for yourself. I hope it works out for you.
/r/MGTOW229/08/20 10:53 PM
6

MGTOW is freedom!
/r/MGTOW229/08/20 01:43 AM
5

"To Alcohol! The cause of... and solution to... all of life's problems!" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hUVwR0rw5fk
/r/MGTOW228/08/20 11:11 PM
4

Reason #1: Yes, that's the reason. MGTOW is seen as anti-women. Reason #2: No, most businesses don't care. IIRC women make 80% of the purchasing decisions. Men aren't that big of a market. MGTOW will have to grow mightily before businesses care. And when they care, what will they do? They'll start marketing products towards MGTOW. "Be a real MGTOW! Buy this shaving cream!" or "Real MGTOWs travel to Thailand! Fly with us, MGTOWs!" That's when you'll know that MGTOW has gone mainstream. Reason #3:…
/r/MGTOW228/08/20 11:00 PM
1

A beta male is someone who cares whether or not he is a beta male. Just be yourself, and let others worry about your label.
/r/MGTOW228/08/20 10:46 PM
1

Ouch! Good point. That is becoming true, unfortunately. Interactions between men and women are slowly being regulated, which is killing romance. When a man can be arrested by looking at a woman incorrectly, then romance is dead.
/r/MGTOW228/08/20 09:48 PM
5

The internet relies on clicks. The more clicks, the better. What better click-bait than politics, sex and religion? That's part of what is driving this division, in my opinion. Forty years ago I used to read newspapers cover to cover, and I usually believed everything I read. Nowadays I can't stand to watch or read the news, because I don't believe any of it. This in an age where we have more access to information than at any time in history. I fear for the future.
/r/MGTOW228/08/20 02:24 AM
3

It depends: is the government involved in the romantic relationship?
/r/MGTOW228/08/20 02:17 AM
2

I know Mgtow is woman avoidance period, but I don't feel i'll be content late in life without a child to pass my life skills onto. MGTOW is pro-individual, not "woman avoidance". You know the potential risks, you know the potential benefits, the rest is up to you. The truth is that some men will be happier being married with children than being MGTOW. Best wishes, brother.
/r/MGTOW227/08/20 09:08 PM
4

Yes, that's understandable. I hope it all works out for you. Best wishes.
/r/MGTOW226/08/20 10:13 AM
1

If which part were to happen to you?
/r/MGTOW226/08/20 10:11 AM
6

Yep! I've had great women friends, worked with some wonderful women. Haven't you?
/r/MGTOW226/08/20 10:09 AM
18

I'm sorry to hear what you went through, pangfy. I'm guessing your boyfriend was influenced by MGTOW ideas around the disadvantages of marriage for men nowadays. Since I probably also believe the same things as he does ("never make a contract with someone who will benefit from breaking the contract"), I can understand his concern. I don't think it is because he wants to enjoy a sex life with multiple women, but rather his concern is that after marriage, getting a house and having children, he ca…
/r/MGTOW226/08/20 09:59 AM
12

No, they're not. Women are great! But never make a contract with someone who can benefit by breaking that contract. Because now, more than ever, women are being encouraged to break that contract.
/r/MGTOW226/08/20 09:49 AM
21

I actually think it's the other way around: MGTOW is not a young man's game, but an old man's. I'm 60 now, and things settle down after you are 40 or so. But in my 20s, all I thought about was the need to pair up and get married. So those years, from 40-80, spent living alone, won't they feel lonely and empty? You know, I really really hate this "lonely" cr*p. You don't mean "lonely", do you? Because there is nothing stopping you from living with friends, or getting a pet, or having an active so…
/r/MGTOW226/08/20 09:43 AM
1

DangZagnut, do you mind if I start a new thread on this topic? I do understand that you are not saying "rape is okay", but then again I'm not sure where you are coming from, and I'd like to understand. So a longer discussion here or via DM would be appreciated.
/r/MGTOW226/08/20 12:13 AM
5

It reminds me of a wall poster that was briefly displayed on bulletin boards at Coastal Carolina University in 2008: https://www.dailydot.com/irl/anti-rape-poster-reddit-conversations/ Jake was DRUNK. Josie was DRUNK. Jake and Josie hooked up. Josie could not consent. The next day JAKE was charged with RAPE. A woman who is intoxicated cannot give her legal consent for sex, so proceeding under these circumstances is a crime. It only takes a single day to ruin your life. Think About it! Be respons…
/r/MGTOW225/08/20 10:07 PM
7

The video seems to be advice to woman about how they can attract a good man by not chasing him and playing hard to get. "Let him earn your love!" That's not what MGTOWs say about women. Yes, there are a lot of bad men out there, but so what? MGTOW isn't about "all men good, all women bad." MGTOW is about a man making a decision at an individual level. No agenda, no leaders.
/r/MGTOW225/08/20 08:50 AM
3

Sounds like a way to get a date with HR. Yes, definitely this. Never give any feedback on looks or grooming to women at work, either positive or negative.
/r/MGTOW225/08/20 12:43 AM
5

MGTOW is the RATIONAL decision to avoid legal entanglements with women based on a cost/benefit analysis of marriage/co-habitation. What are the potential costs of marriage/cohabitation? What are the benefits? If you feel that the benefits outweigh the costs, then you should get married. The first step is to understand what the potential costs are. Because society will gladly tell you the potential benefits. You can understand the costs by reading these subs and talking to married, divorced and s…
/r/MGTOW224/08/20 11:18 PM
127

If she's a friend: the truth. If she's not a friend: the truth, but quicker.
/r/MGTOW224/08/20 12:34 PM
5

You understand the risks, so you can make a cost/benefit analysis. If marriage and children are important to you, then you should get married and hope for the best. Best wishes brother.
/r/MGTOW224/08/20 11:28 AM
7

Just a nitpick, but: what do you mean by "a high-value man"? High value to whom? To oneself? To society? If so, then "high value" may not be the right word, since it brings to mind ideas like "sexual market value", etc, which relates to improving one's value in order to attract women. Also: I understand that obsessing about women is counter-productive. But also obsessing about NOT talking about women is just as bad. MGTOWs need to learn to navigate a world that contains men and women, so some di…
/r/MGTOW224/08/20 01:53 AM
1

Women should be treated equally to men, socially, economically and financially. They should be given the same opportunities as men. They should have equal rights to men. But "women are equal to men" is so broad as to be meaningless, I'm afraid. There are general gender differences that are reflected through physical differences, social differences, etc. These are looking at women and men as groups, of course. Not talking individually. But you must know all that already. Can I ask: what kind of r…
/r/MGTOW223/08/20 03:06 AM
3

Is this one of those troll things? Where you put in a low-content post which gets removed since it is against the rules (see "Effort and Quality" in the Sub-reddit rules on the side-bar), and then the poster goes off and claims "I got banned for saying 'women are equal to men'!"? XY999, would you like to expand on your point? Because trolling isn't allowed. Thank you.
/r/MGTOW223/08/20 02:41 AM
4

Good video! You have a nice pleasant style. I agree with your view: The Self-help industry is over-saturated. Educating yourself is important, but it is action that is necessary. We need less self-help, and more self-do!
/r/MGTOW222/08/20 05:32 AM
3

Sounds great! Is there a blog where you will describe how you live? If not, I'd love if you can update us here on MGTOW2! Also, what passive income streams have you found to be the easiest to set up?
/r/MGTOW221/08/20 01:55 AM
3

I'm in a situation where I'm forced to go my own way. You're not going your own way if you are being FORCED to go away. "Going your own way" is exactly that. Going YOUR own way. I'm in my 20's, I have a lame job, no money, no car, I'm depressed, bitter, angry, and I have no six pack... so obviously no woman wants me. I'm already working on that tho. I WANT to have that option. That's perfectly understandable, and I hope you succeed. Just make sure you don't pin your validation on getting that da…
/r/MGTOW220/08/20 12:06 PM
1

I threw in the towel for good today. You haven't thrown in the towel, my friend. You've thrown away the rags covering your eyes. "When I was a child, I talked like a child, I thought like a child, I reasoned like a child. When I became a man, I put the ways of childhood behind me."
/r/MGTOW218/08/20 10:29 PM
1

What would you define as "undue attention", for you individually?
/r/MGTOW217/08/20 08:11 AM
16

I have absolutely no issues with gay men or lesbians, but I am reluctant to see them posting here about gay or lesbian issues. MGTOW is about men and their issues with women when trying to go their own way, and I'd hate to see this board try to expand beyond that. Similar to the bar drinker in the movie "Sister Act", who said: "If this turns into a nun's bar, I'm outta here!" I come here to understand about straight men's issues. Having said that: Welcome! I'm sure there are times when your pers…
/r/MGTOW217/08/20 08:04 AM
1

Sure, and I'm not after a discussion about what a "real" MGTOW is. I'm just wondering what the views of MGTOWs here are on an individual level.
/r/MGTOW217/08/20 04:42 AM
2

exposing yourself to liabilities and above your risk tolerance I think that's as good a description of the line as any right there. For you personally: let's say you meet a woman who ticks all your boxes. At what point in your interaction with her do you think "I am no longer being MGTOW"?
/r/MGTOW217/08/20 03:40 AM
50

In the goldfield rushes in the mid-19th Century, a few people discovered gold and became rich. Most didn't. But the people who really made money were those who set up stores and sold basic supplies to the prospectors. You know what game NOT to play. This puts you ahead of most other men. Now go out and play your own way. The answer isn't to become nihilistic, it is become proactive. MGTOW is freedom.
/r/MGTOW216/08/20 10:17 PM
1

There is no "next step" to MGTOW. MGTOW is freedom. The next step is for you to use that freedom. That's up to you, as an adult man with the freedom to choose his own path.
/r/MGTOW216/08/20 01:09 AM
1

I sympathesize. But as long as you don't lie to the woman or to yourself, you can still have a relationship. Tell her straight out that you don't want to get married or cohabitate. The rest is up to her. If it is a deal-breaker for her, then fair enough and you can move on. There is the idea that a relationship automatically leads to marriage, cohabitation or legal entanglement. It's part of the blue-pill narrative. If you are going your own way, then don't be bound by that narrative. Find a wom…
/r/MGTOW216/08/20 12:54 AM
1

I'd like to understand the idea more. Can I ask you to give some MGTOW-related black-pill truths?
/r/MGTOW216/08/20 12:47 AM
7

Enjoyable movies: Aliens Terminator 2 Alita, Battle Angel
/r/MGTOW215/08/20 07:29 AM
7

The black-pill has no place in MGTOW. MGTOW is freedom, the black-pill is defeatism.
/r/MGTOW215/08/20 07:27 AM
3

I don't really understand the concept of 'cope'. Is that the same as 'lying to oneself'?
/r/MGTOW215/08/20 12:28 AM
6

They can do prostitutes but with protection of course You misunderstand what most incels want: it isn't the sex (which they can get easily from prostitutes, as you noted), it is the validation from forming a loving relationship with a woman. They've been sold the idea that women will love them if they are nice to them regardless of what the incel looks like, and they are angry when they find out that that isn't so. It's "black-pill rage" I suppose.
/r/MGTOW215/08/20 12:26 AM
2

What are the MGTOW themes?
/r/MGTOW215/08/20 12:20 AM
12

MGTOW is freedom. But freedom makes some people uneasy, if they don't understand a life beyond what they've been taught to live.
/r/MGTOW215/08/20 12:15 AM
1

The trouble with the human race is that, even if you win, you're still a human.
/r/MGTOW215/08/20 12:05 AM
2

No worries, I understand where you're coming from. My question comes from the often-made claim that attractive women have 'life in easy mode'. While that is true, incel-types seem often jealous of that fact. So I was wondering what MGTOWs thought of it. Some wished to take advantage of it to live a good life which is fair enough, but as I expected, nearly everyone preferred a life that wasn't in 'easy mode'. Hopefully those who are jealous of the life that attractive women lead have taken note o…
/r/MGTOW215/08/20 12:01 AM
1

I think people are confusing MGTOW with incel. Everything they describe applies to incels but not MGTOW. Nah, it applies to MGTOW1 as well. It doesn't mean that it is a reflection of you yourself though.
/r/MGTOW214/08/20 05:54 AM
8

For those who haven't seen it: from here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xgiLm9bCxrU
/r/MGTOW213/08/20 12:32 PM
2

It is only a paradox if you listen and watch their action. If you ony watch there is no paradox anymore Perfect!
/r/MGTOW213/08/20 05:27 AM
29

"When the pain of remaining the same exceeds the pain of changing, people will change."
/r/MGTOW213/08/20 02:04 AM
9

Good times create weak men Weak men create hard times Hard times create strong men Strong men create good times. Society is dumping lots of fertilizer on the male seedlings of today. Hopefully we are about to get a new batch of strong men.
/r/MGTOW212/08/20 10:16 PM
10

I'm 60 years old, and only started to eat healthy and exercise regularly (walking and mild strength training at a gym) in the last couple of years, for the first time in more than 30 years. The change is remarkable. I wish I had invested the small amount of time to do it regularly when I was younger, but it is never too late. ALWAYS spend time to invest in your physical and mental health, as well as your financial health.
/r/MGTOW212/08/20 10:13 PM
1

I've always wondered: if you are going to test a placebo's effectiveness, what do you use for the control group? (/j)
/r/MGTOW212/08/20 07:16 AM
4

AWALT doesn't mean all women are such and such all the time. It's akin to treating every gun as a loaded weapon. As you don't know if a gun is loaded, you should always treat any gun you pick up as loaded and start with that base assumption. Great analogy.
/r/MGTOW212/08/20 07:12 AM
1

You've made a mistake, which happens to everyone. You've learned from your mistake, which is rarer and to your credit. Well done! Keep the tattoo as a reminder of what you've learned and a reminder to not make the same mistake again. Because sometimes the mind forgets that the hand burns in the fire.
/r/MGTOW211/08/20 10:54 PM
5

A man is happiest when he has, not a lot of money, but enough money.
/r/MGTOW211/08/20 10:45 PM
3

Women are great! Invest time into making good women friends and good men friends. Women can't possibly understand, nor genuinely care about men's rights... That's stupid "MGTOWism", where MGTOW is used as an excuse to spout dogma. The harsh truth is that there are a lot of great women out there that you can learn alot from, including on the topic of men's rights. The harsher truth is: who cares what women think on this subject? Just treat each woman on an individual case. If there are women you …
/r/MGTOW211/08/20 10:35 PM
1

Yes, great point. In fact, my question in the next thread was going to be "extremely attractive man but blue-pilled, vs, average-looking but red-pilled." But I think the answers would follow along the same lines as in this thread.
/r/MGTOW211/08/20 10:25 PM
6

Trans women are real women. That brings a thought... I wonder how long it'll be before we see something like: "Trans women are the only real women, because they chose to be women. While cis women are only women because they were born that way, so women 'by default'."
/r/MGTOW211/08/20 06:25 AM
3

So you'd rather have the life of an attractive woman than the life of a man?
/r/MGTOW211/08/20 06:22 AM
18

If I may ask: why? Received red-pill wisdom is that women get a much easier run at life than men. At least, that's the complaint often seen on red-pill and black-pill boards.
/r/MGTOW211/08/20 06:08 AM
15

Yes, this is along the lines of what I was thinking. 'Life on easy mode' makes for an easy life, but it doesn't make for a good one. A man needs something to strive for, if only to improve himself so that his self-validation comes from his accomplishments. An attractive woman who relies on her attractiveness has nothing to fall back on when the Inevitable Wall comes.
/r/MGTOW211/08/20 05:59 AM
2

Are there countries where men (perhaps living separately) are required to pay alimony or child support while they are still married?
/r/MGTOW210/08/20 01:08 AM
14

This is a great post! Personally I'd love to see more discussion around why MGTOW makes sense in our world that goes deeper than "marriage is a bad deal for men". While that is perfectly true and is enough reason for a man to go MGTOW, for those coming across MGTOW the first time it sounds like conspiracy theory level stuff. My nitpicks: The legal system has skewed marriage so much in favor of women That's very true when it comes to divorce. But marriage? I can't think off-hand where the legal s…
/r/MGTOW210/08/20 12:27 AM
7

I see. I'm sure there are the odd MGTOW with intolerant views on a range of things, including anti-LGBT views. But the idea of MGTOW is basically "no marriage, no cohabitation, work to improve yourself". So no intersection with LGBT at all. I'm sorry you came across that homophobic post on the other MGTOW sub. Still, I'm going to downvote your post for forming a view about an entire group based on a small sample. Isn't that what the LGBT community has complained about happening to them for many …
/r/MGTOW208/08/20 10:41 PM
10

Back before the 1990s, there were more men than women in universities. Feminists complained about that, since it went against the principle of equal opportunity. Since the 1990s, there have been more women than men in universities. (*) And in the USA, feminists are now complaining... ... about how much debt that women graduates end up with. So I'd say yes: alimony rules will be judged as unfair to women if the scenario you describe is played out. Those laws will then be changed appropriately, un…
/r/MGTOW208/08/20 01:47 PM
79

I feel like most guys who identify with this movement are extremely resentful, or even hateful, of gay/LGBT men... I think it's sad that movements like these hate us as well (at least that's the impression I get). Really? Why? I've never seen any hate towards gay men on MGTOW2, so I'm surprised that you'd think that. Just wondering. What kinds of resentful and hateful things are MGTOWs saying about gay/LGBT men that you've read? Edited to add: Out of curiosity, I haven't visited any LGBT forums,…
/r/MGTOW208/08/20 01:26 PM
6

Marry her. Then those fantasies will implode and you'll lose your crush! More seriously: why not date her? MGTOW is "no marriage, no cohabitation", not no dating. Make sure you don't lie to her or to yourself. Tell her that marriage and cohabitation is off the table. If she is willing to date under those circumstances, it is a win-win. If she isn't willing to date you under those circumstances, then you'll have an idea of her attitude towards you and it might settle your crush.
/r/MGTOW208/08/20 07:40 AM
5

I had a vasectomy. I thought it would stop my girlfriend from getting pregnant, so I didn't use a condom. Turns out that a vasectomy doesn't stop a woman from getting pregnant, it just changes the color of the baby. (*) (*) Dramatisation. May not have happened.
/r/MGTOW208/08/20 06:23 AM
1

Yes, well said. Women are just people trying to get by. They are not some evil collective out to screw men (well, not an evil collective, anyway). It's just that, as things are today, marriage is now a bad deal for men. MGTOW2 is slowly changing from "MGTOW as enlightened self-interest based on internal validation", to "MGTOWism, the dogma of 'all women have cooties'". I'm not enjoying the decline.
/r/MGTOW208/08/20 06:12 AM
10

A Christian met a Buddhist. The Christian said to the Buddhist, "Jesus said that the love of money was the root of all evil." The Buddhist said, "I see. So Jesus was obsessed with money." "What do you mean?" "There are two ways to be obsessed: Obsession with having it, obsession with not having it." The power of going your own way is that you get to decide everything on a case-by-case basis, based on what benefits you.
/r/MGTOW208/08/20 06:03 AM
11

Yep! Women are great! Make friends with good men and good women, this will enrich your life. Avoid bad men and bad women, this will also enrich your life. But never marry or cohabitate. It doesn't matter how good the woman is, you should always follow the age-old advice: "Never make a contract with someone who will benefit by breaking the contract."
/r/MGTOW208/08/20 05:44 AM
3

Good points. If I was younger and sexually active, I'd definitely have a vasectomy.
/r/MGTOW208/08/20 05:40 AM
2

I second intermittent fasting. It rests the liver, giving it time to recuperate. It means you can still eat the same amounts, but a more efficient functioning liver processes the food better rather than dumping it into the bloodstream to be turned into fat.
/r/MGTOW206/08/20 10:33 PM
5

I've never felt happy being alone and I don't really know how to get women out of my mind. You're aware of the problem, and that's half the battle. Most men never even get to that point, so you are ahead of a lot of other men. You've made a great start! Put a name to it, and you can fight it. Measure it, and you can control it. Best wishes brother.
/r/MGTOW206/08/20 10:27 PM
8

"Women worry about their future until they get married. Men don't worry about their future until they get married." Marriage is seen as something for men to aspire to, to prove themselves. Single life for men is seen as 'life on easy mode', something undesirable for some strange reason. As men usually need a challenge to thrive, I think you might be on to something. Most challenges don't have as much of a downside as a marriage gone wrong, though.
/r/MGTOW205/08/20 11:58 PM
2

The stories are all the same, they get bored, they loose attraction and feelings and simply move on. And it is just so simple for them. Society even encourages them to move on. "Love, eat, get divorced." I wish we could educate all men on this. "Never make a contract with someone who will benefit from breaking the contract." Best wishes, brother.
/r/MGTOW205/08/20 11:40 PM
1

I'm sure that some men really do mean loneliness, i.e. they have no friends. In that case, it's a legitimate question. My point there is that their question shows they are associating 'lack of friends' to MGTOW, implying that MGTOWs don't have friends and have to deal with that. But why would a MGTOW not have friends? On the other hand, if they do mean 'lack of an intimate partner', better to help them acknowledge that to themselves.
/r/MGTOW204/08/20 12:16 PM
2

My bad, they debate about pologomy. Forgot to include it in the title Sound advice for MGTOWs: never get married while riding a horse and playing sport. :)
/r/MGTOW204/08/20 12:57 AM
4

"Fap like a man" -- what a great song that would make! Fap like a man Oh, how you tried to cut me down to size Tellin' dirty lies to my friends But my own father said "Give her up, don't bother The world isn't comin' to an end" (He said) Fap like a man, spank it like a man Fap like a man my son No woman's worth crawlin' on the earth So fap like a man, my son Bye bye baby, I don't-a mean maybe Gonna go my own way somehow Soon you'll be cryin' on account of all your lyin' Oh yeah, just look who's …
/r/MGTOW202/08/20 03:28 AM
3

If someone thinks you are lying, there isn't much you can say to them. Perhaps the only thing you can do is point the person to a source where they can get more information, and hope they visit it.
/r/MGTOW201/08/20 06:48 AM
7

Every day, I make it a point to not marry or cohabitate. Practice makes perfect!
/r/MGTOW201/08/20 06:44 AM
12

I would tell Incels the truth, and the conversation would go like this: Me: "Incels seek validation by forming a relationship with a woman. A MGTOW seeks validation from within himself. Don't put your happiness in the hands of others. Make yourself happy." Incel: "F*** off. That's just a cope."
/r/MGTOW201/08/20 02:42 AM
2

Me too! (no pun intented) Anyone know of a good simple way of doing this? I suppose a mobile phone would be useful, but I'm not tech-savvy so I'm pretty clueless there. I've often wondered if there is something built for that purpose.
/r/MGTOW201/08/20 01:39 AM
1

I've never married so never had the pleasure of experiencing divorce, but from what I understand there are a lot of divorce lawyers who won't represent the man's best interests. Can anyone recommend how to find a good divorce lawyer who will actually be on the man's side?
/r/MGTOW201/08/20 01:37 AM
6

Did you learn from your past? If so, treasure it.
/r/MGTOW201/08/20 12:48 AM
3

↑This. This is such good advice for men nowadays, that it should be part of every man's education as an item on a list, like "ABCDE" for first-aid advice. I might start a separate thread on this.
/r/MGTOW231/07/20 11:53 PM
2

Perhaps you're right, and I should have been more tactful in my response. I certainly wasn't trying to provide him peace of mind, but as a rule I try to be as positive and as encouraging as possible when I post on MGTOW2. I could have done better there.
/r/MGTOW230/07/20 10:24 AM
18

It's not a competition. Life can be hard for men, it can be hard for women. Does it matter from a MGTOW perspective whether men have it easier or women have it easier? Marriage is now a bad deal for men. Don't marry. That's true regardless of who has the better life. The OP is living in some kind of incel dream-world. That isn't healthy for him. MGTOW should be about encouraging people to face reality, not sink into some fantasy world where "WOMEN ARE EVIL!" Taking the red pill is about acceptin…
/r/MGTOW229/07/20 11:38 PM
7

Good post! If you want the advice of an old man coming to the end of an interesting life, here it is. If you don't want that advice, well you're getting it anyway. Listen up, young fella! Here is the secret of life!: Invest, invest, invest. Invest in good physical health, invest in good mental health and ESPECIALLY invest in good financial health. You won't feel the returns until you get older, but you will definitely feel the LACK of returns when you get older if you don't. Don't wait, start ri…
/r/MGTOW229/07/20 11:21 PM
122

Meanwhile women are enjoying themselves all day long, and being idolized by some simps, our life is horrible in comparison. No, women are just people trying to get by. They have their own sets of problems, many real, some imagined. The type of feminism that instils fear and hatred into women *every.single.fcking.day today is their enemy. That's why women look across the gender divide and envy men. Don't let MGTOW instil the same level of fear and hatred into YOU.** Blue pill guys put women on a …
/r/MGTOW229/07/20 11:04 PM
2

You can love your mother and sisters, just don't marry them. Look, it's a silly question you ask, though one that keeps coming up. Marriage is now a BAD deal for men. Having a loving family and good friends around you is a GOOD deal for men. MGTOW is about "no marriage/no cohabitation." It's NOT about "all women are evil". Love your family, make friends with good men and good women, don't marry or cohabitate. The end.
/r/MGTOW229/07/20 10:33 PM
6

The three stages of MGTOW: MGTOW1 -- join a MGTOW sub and complain about how men should go their own way because "women are evil!" MGTOW2 -- join a MGTOW sub and comment on how men can go their own way and live a good life. MGTOW3 -- don't comment on any subs or talk about MGTOW, just go my own way and live a good life. Obviously I'm stuck on MGTOW2! Trying to move to MGTOW3 though.
/r/MGTOW229/07/20 10:23 PM
1

I would differentiate between "integrity" and "morality". They overlap, but they aren't the same.
/r/MGTOW229/07/20 09:55 PM
1

I think you should care, because you are a human being; but hell, I completely understand where you are coming from. If you see a person determined for self-destruction and they refuse your help, at a certain point there is nothing you can do but let it happen. Otherwise it'll drive you crazy. Society seems determined for self-destruction at the moment. Like you, I'm going to ground. But I feel like a coward doing it.
/r/MGTOW229/07/20 09:32 PM
11

Ignore it.
/r/MGTOW229/07/20 02:10 AM
12

This person thinks it's as simple as "don't marry the wrong person". Sound advice! If you're going to play the lottery, just don't choose the wrong numbers. Simple! ... "but why would you even marry someone you don’t trust enough. the whole point of a relationship is that you trust that person, so of course you wouldn’t legally marry a person you don’t trust. why would you be with them in the first place?" The mystery of MGTOW solved. I wonder how she feels about the idea "why does the marriage …
/r/MGTOW229/07/20 01:58 AM
3

Well said. Integrity is important. It's the "sleep well at night" principle. Never do anything that would stop you sleeping well at night. Don't lie to women, don't lie to yourself, because both are bad for yourself. Look for validation from within yourself, not from outside. That's the way to happiness.
/r/MGTOW229/07/20 01:12 AM
2

My friend, you have set yourself on a hard path, and I wish you the best of luck. You have much more courage than me, and you put me to shame. I know I should speak out more on what I believe to be the truth, but I'm a coward. "All it takes for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing." I'm a good man who does nothing, sadly. My recommendation: don't call yourself "MGTOW", because that will automatically assign a list of ideas to your cause that probably don't apply, at least from the persp…
/r/MGTOW229/07/20 12:13 AM
7

I hate this question, because usually it isn't about "loneliness". Make a friend. Get a house mate. Get a dog. Then you won't feel lonely, if that's what you mean. Do you mean "lack of an intimate partner"? Then why not say "How do you deal with the lack of an intimate partner"? Then at least the question is clear. The problem is that the sense of the question leads to the false assumption that people who are single are lonely, while people who are married are not lonely. But we all know that th…
/r/MGTOW228/07/20 04:09 AM
2

I've never let the shaving foam sit for a few minutes, but that makes sense. Good advice, thanks!
/r/MGTOW226/07/20 09:18 PM
1

No worries, thanks for your response.
/r/MGTOW225/07/20 11:31 PM
3

Invest in mental health by making good friends, both male and female. Always use a condom.
/r/MGTOW225/07/20 10:56 PM
1

Good post! Whenever I shave, I end up with tiny hairs on the sides of my mouth that I don't feel until later when I try to eat. Darn annoying! Any views on shaving foams or gels? E.g. are expensive ones worth the cost? I use both expensive blades and gels, but I hurry through the shaving process. Also, I've used a razor all my life, but recently I've been thinking of shifting to an electric shaver. If anyone has made the change, any thoughts?
/r/MGTOW225/07/20 10:55 PM
5

If you want MGTOW to be completely acceptable in the mainstream, let's change our ways. I'm not sure MGTOW needs to be "acceptable" with the mainstream, since it is what it is. But I do want MGTOW to be understood. I agree that we shouldn't focus on women generally, since MGTOW is not anti-woman nor anti-feminism, but rather pro-individual. It is best for each man to go his own way, and that includes "no marriage and no cohabitation", since these are now bad deals for men. Since it is not obviou…
/r/MGTOW225/07/20 01:06 PM
0

Thanks for your response, but I'm not asking whether women do have equal opportunities. I will refer you to Point 2 in my OP: "I'm NOT arguing one way or the other about whether women now have equal opportunity or not. I agree that they already do to a large if not complete extent." Down-voting means you are against women having equal opportunities with men. Thanks.
/r/MGTOW225/07/20 11:36 AM
1

:) Thanks!
/r/MGTOW225/07/20 08:48 AM
1

I definitely agree! "Equality of outcome" is a shockingly bad idea that is in fact counter to equality of opportunity.
/r/MGTOW225/07/20 06:11 AM
1

That's true of course, but this is more about the principle of equal opportunity. I'd be surprised if there are many votes against the principle, but I could be wrong.
/r/MGTOW225/07/20 06:09 AM
1

Actually, all men didn't get the vote in the West until just a few decades before women. Until mid-19th Century, only property owners and a few other groups could vote in most Western democracies. In Australia, poor people couldn't vote, while some wealthy landowners were permitted up to four votes each in elections.
/r/MGTOW225/07/20 06:05 AM
12

Vote position: FOR "I am MGTOW and I am for equal opportunity for women." Please upvote if you agree. (You may need to scroll up or down to find the option to vote "against").
/r/MGTOW225/07/20 03:31 AM
1

Vote position: AGAINST "I am MGTOW and I am AGAINST equal opportunity for women." Please upvote if you agree. If you have time, please give your reasons below to show you aren't brigading. Thanks. (You may need to scroll up or down to find the option to vote "for").
/r/MGTOW225/07/20 03:31 AM
1

My post comes from certain Youtubers and such saying that women are "way liberal" and "feminism is the worst thing to happen to relationships in the last 40 years" and I am just looking for clarification. What did they mean by "liberal"? What did they mean by "feminism"? That's the question. I've seen some comments on other boards that women shouldn't have the right to vote, for example, but those are rare from my experience. And I no more agree with them than I agree with every comment by liber…
/r/MGTOW225/07/20 02:54 AM
4

I'm a self-described liberal (centre-left leaning) and a feminist. The problem is how you define "liberal" and "feminism", since nowadays these terms seem to have changed. (Heck, "MGTOW" is the same as "incel" for most people in the mainstream.) For example: I'm for free speech, which somehow -- and it still shocks me -- seems to now be a conservative position rather than a liberal one. A lot of liberals now will say "I'm a liberal, BUT I'm for free speech" rather than "I'm a liberal, THEREFORE …
/r/MGTOW225/07/20 02:17 AM
20

One thing I read on a MGTOW sub that put it all into perspective for me: "Attention is to women as porn is to men."
/r/MGTOW225/07/20 12:29 AM
7

Don't assume that MGTOW is right for you. Think for yourself. Look at the lives of the men around you, both married and single. Are they happy? Are they doing what they want? Talk to them, ask them questions. Two important rules: Education, education, education. Continue to learn throughout your life, both formally and informally. Learn as much as you can. Focus on your enthusiasms, not on your dislikes. Invest, invest, invest. Invest time and resources into the three healths: good physical heal…
/r/MGTOW225/07/20 12:07 AM
6

Thanks kylevk02, that makes sense. It sounds like you have a good head on your shoulders. As you've learned, being "MGTOW" is about going YOUR own way, rather than the way people, even on MGTOW subs, tell you to go. And you're only 18 -- impressive! Best wishes brother.
/r/MGTOW223/07/20 12:03 PM
5

That's interesting, kylevk02. Can you explain a little on why learning about MGTOW at 16 would have made you into an incel, and what you learned from your later relationship that allowed you to understand the real meaning of MGTOW at 18? (I've always thought that MGTOW was "an old man's game", in that young men need to experience a bit of life, at least enough so that MGTOW makes sense. So what you describe sounds along those lines.)
/r/MGTOW223/07/20 10:04 AM
3

The "red-pill" means awakening to the harshness of reality. The "blue-pill" is going along with the comforting narrative of the mainstream (which necessarily is not based in reality). I've seen it refer to politics, economics, health, lots of things. On the political side, there are a lot of liberals who have said that they have "taken the red-pill". They are certainly not right-wing or Republican, but they get called right-wing which annoys them.
/r/MGTOW223/07/20 07:11 AM
3

i don't really know the answer and i don't know what to do. i don't want anybody else, this has just been on my mind for a long time and i am not able to see a way out of this. Can you break off the formal relationship and tell her you only want to be friends? You can still care about her, help her out, since she sounds like a good person. But it sounds like your current relationship is "FWithoutB" anyway, so why not just say "F" this relationship?
/r/MGTOW222/07/20 11:53 PM
3

What do you marry for then ? "You know, my Dad had an unhappy marriage. And my uncles, they had unhappy marriages. Also my friends' dads and uncles had unhappy marriages. But I want to get married." "Why do you want to get married?" "So I can be happy."
/r/MGTOW222/07/20 11:43 PM
2

It’s time for our standards. "It’s time for our standards." This should be added to the MGTOW List of Mottos. E.g. "The juice is not worth the squeeze" and "It's time for our standards".
/r/MGTOW222/07/20 11:39 PM
3

Stoicism.
/r/MGTOW221/07/20 06:05 AM
1

There is no such thing as "female friends". C'mon, that's not true at all. Why go over the top like that? The red-pill should be about reality, not dogma. Certainly the social dynamics in female friendships are different than between male friendships, just as both are different to the dynamics between men and women. But to say that women can't be friends is ridiculous. If you have hard data to back that up, I'd be very interested in reading it.
/r/MGTOW221/07/20 06:04 AM
2

I always recommend cultivating good relationships with women as well as men. Invest time into making and keeping friends, because they can add real value into your life. Having said that: you don't HAVE to be their friends. It's not a one-sided obligation that you have. Friendships do have obligations, but they are mutual. If, as you say, "it seems now they are not interested in me as a friend", stop being their friends. Or at least, step away the appropriate amount while they determine what the…
/r/MGTOW221/07/20 05:56 AM
8

For those men whose financial problems are due to women, it is due to the men. A recent post here was educational: do a credit check before marriage.
/r/MGTOW220/07/20 01:28 AM
1

I have sex.
/r/MGTOW218/07/20 10:27 PM
5

It's the 24/7 news cycle. I remember 40 years ago: reading the daily newspapers in the morning, then watching the evening news on TV. And that was about it. The newspapers and TV gave you sensationalised stories to get you to subscribe or watch, but you weren't marinated in it. Nowadays the news is on TV and the Internet 24 hours a day, and EVERYTHING gets sensationalised so that they get their clicks and views. That's where the ad revenue comes from. Add to that the ubiquitous social media, and…
/r/MGTOW218/07/20 10:19 PM
1

If we follow the Calhoun Mouse Utopia experiment results, population decline will continue until extinction. In those experiments, population density led to a change of social interaction behaviours by the mice. Calhoun called it "the Behavioral Sink". https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Behavioral_sink The changed behaviour led to more aggressive females, less aggressive males, less mating and fewer micelets, and to the rise of those called "the Beautiful Ones" (Mice Going Their Own Way?) But even wh…
/r/MGTOW215/07/20 09:41 AM
3

Wow, great post! I completely agree with the major steps you laid out to improve psychological health. But at the same time, do not buy into the retarded Red Pill ideology that you have to completely alter your personality just to be able to have sex, since this still caters to women. Exactly so. The blue pill is the narrative that society tells us, i.e. men should get married and conform to their role of being disposable cogs (and be happy about it!). The red pill is seeing things as they reall…
/r/MGTOW215/07/20 03:58 AM
1

The main reason for alot of my anger is not towards females themselves,but at the fact that alot of people knew these things about female nature, but NOBODY, NOBODY shared this knowledge to me. I had to find out the hard way in family court. Yes, I hear you. I'm the same. I've never married thankfully so never experienced family court, but it makes me mad also that that kind of knowledge is not shared. Whenever you see videos on the benefits of marriage (like the infamous one from PragerU), they…
/r/MGTOW214/07/20 10:56 AM
3

Sounds good! I also love women. Marriage is not for me, and I know that men are considered disposable by women and other men, so I keep that in mind in my interactions. But women are just people trying to get by, and I judge each one on their individual merits, just like I do with men. It's crazy (and a sign of the times) to treat them as a class rather than as individuals. Take advantage of their friendship, in the nicest possible way, to improve your own life is my thought. The danger, of cour…
/r/MGTOW214/07/20 09:36 AM
2

I agree that MGTOWs would not seek self-validation through dating, which is the problem with some PUA-thinking. But what's wrong with LTRs? If there are no financial or legal implications, why would it be a MGTOW issue?
/r/MGTOW214/07/20 02:21 AM
5

MGTOW is "no marriage and no cohabitation" for the very reasons you suggest: keeping the government out of your relationship. MGTOW isn't separatism. You can still date, have sex, even a committed relationship. Just avoid legal entanglements. Don't make a contract with someone who can benefit by breaking that contract.
/r/MGTOW213/07/20 10:53 PM
3

Have you ever felt so overwhelmed that you wished you could just “reset” your brain with a snap of your fingers? (Shout out to Thanos) Actually, if it is Thanos, then you'd lose half your brain when you snap your fingers. And then you'd get married. After which, without even needing to snap your fingers, you'll lose half of the rest of your stuff.
/r/MGTOW213/07/20 10:42 PM
3

It’s like signing up for a minimum-term gym membership - it’s a document that doesn’t change anything day 1 except to say you’ve made the LEGAL commitment. It’s up to you to make the most of it, and there are consequences if you change your mind and try to pull out. :) Nice analogy! Now imagine if the gym can break that membership agreement any time for any reason, and still make you pay for half the membership fees. Not a good contract to sign!
/r/MGTOW213/07/20 10:30 PM
2

Back in my blue-pill days, I would have married my first long-term girlfriend. Did I love her? No. Was she a good person? No, she was toxic. Did I know she was toxic at the time? YES. But marriage is just something you did with a long-term girlfriend. It's weird now that I didn't think that marrying a toxic person whom I didn't love was a bad idea then. All I can think of is the urban legend of lemmings throwing themselves from cliff-tops: "Of course I will throw myself from the cliff-top. Why w…
/r/MGTOW213/07/20 10:22 PM
3

My recommendation: Don't do it. "The best revenge is living well."
/r/MGTOW212/07/20 10:49 PM
4

Apparently I’m pretty hot from the eyes up, man, being a hot dude must be the best. :) I hate it when women stare at my chest: https://pics.me.me/thumb_arri-arr-me-eye-be-up-here-pirate-bob-hated-43108305.png
/r/MGTOW212/07/20 08:45 PM
0

I agree in the main with you but where I disagree is that mgtow is very much anti-marriage, very much anti-cohabitation, in fact they are the very first things about mgtow... The point here is that, in this sub at least, we say as long as you know the risks of what you're letting yourself in for then it's down to you, it is your way after all. Hi akihonj, thanks for your response. I think it is very important to be clear on MGTOW2 that MGTOW is a rational choice, and not a dogmatic one. It is to…
/r/MGTOW211/07/20 11:06 PM
6

Sounds like you are on the right track. Remember to keep working on yourself, and invest, invest, invest: For good physical health, invest time into exercise. For good mental health, invest time into family, friendships and hobbies. For good financial health, invest money and resources. For good overall health, invest time in your community. Best wishes brother.
/r/MGTOW211/07/20 04:40 AM
7

"Feminism. MAGA. Social justice. Black Lives Matter. MGTOW. Let's now have a good respectful conversation." It's simply impossible to do, because people associate labels with definitions that are created by antagonists. Don't use labels, express ideas. Choose your battles and spend your time wisely.
/r/MGTOW211/07/20 01:29 AM
5

No worries. It'd only be selfish if you expected them to spend time with you, or expected them to eat where you want to eat or hang out with your friends. Still, human relationships require some give and take. Investing time in families and friends, doing some things that you might not want to do, is probably a good idea as it will benefit you long-term. So your approach is possibly doing damage to yourself. But it's not selfish if what you are doing isn't an imposition on others.
/r/MGTOW211/07/20 01:17 AM
11

TigPlaze, what would you do if you met a woman who was ethical? Marry her? Of course women can be ethical people. It's a silly question. I'm guessing that they are ethical in the same numbers as men. But so what? Just to rant a little: These kinds of "women are basically evil" type posts make me despair. To me, they are the antithesis of what MGTOW is all about. MGTOW is not anti-women or anti-marriage, it is pro-individual. Do what is best for you. Regardless of whether women are ethical or not…
/r/MGTOW211/07/20 12:00 AM
17

I’m just way too selfish to want to deal with anything that comes from them. Does anybody else feel the same way? You are completely wrong! That's not being selfish at all, that's coming to understand your own needs. Men simply don't need women. Sex with women is good, being friends with women is good. But we don't need them, and it is not selfish to realise that and build your life on that realisation. So you're not being selfish, you are being rational. Best wishes brother.
/r/MGTOW210/07/20 11:30 PM
5

I hear you. Sounds like you have had good talks with him, which is good. You're an atheist and bisexual. He's a fundamentalist who believes that same sex relationships are wrong. These are fundamental differences in values. Is it possible to agree to disagree with him? Ask him not to raise these topics in front of you, and you not to raise these topics in front of him? I know that might not be possible, in which case the only other adult solution is separation. Still, I think relationships with …
/r/MGTOW210/07/20 12:49 PM
2

It may sound blunt, but: you don't want him to be authentic?
/r/MGTOW210/07/20 12:34 PM
1

What do you want from your father? What does your father want from you?
/r/MGTOW210/07/20 12:25 PM
-1

The reason this is an issue is that im addicted to authenticity... Can you give me any advice for moving on and ending my friendship with my father? I'm not sure I understand your dilemma. If you are addicted to authenticity, why aren't you sitting down with your father and telling him how you feel? Not to get his approval, not to validate yourself, just to tell him. Tell him how you feel, and what you expect from him. Ask him how HE feels, and what he expects from you. Make it a discussion, lik…
/r/MGTOW210/07/20 12:07 PM
11

MGTOW is the RATIONAL decision to avoid legal entanglements with women based on a cost/benefit analysis of marriage/co-habitation. You build your world your way. For me, MGTOW isn't anti-marriage, it's pro-individual. Some marriages work out. Some men will be happier being married than being MGTOW. Marriage isn't for me, but you do you. You know the facts about marriage/cohabitation. Make that cost/benefit analysis. Decide what is best for yourself. Do it (marriage or no marriage) because YOU th…
/r/MGTOW209/07/20 09:44 PM
3

Eh??? What an odd question. How would we know? Perhaps it might be better if you ask the guys you know whether their marriages work? Maybe those marriages do work. Maybe Indian guys living in Australia with good jobs and arranged marriages is the best way forward. If you have statistics on this, let us know. But as a non-Indian guy myself, marriage is not for me, even if it does work for Indian guys living in Australia with good jobs and arranged marriages.
/r/MGTOW209/07/20 11:44 AM
2

Thanks for your response, vetiarvind. Very interesting! Just a couple of questions: Overall, I think the state of marriage is much more solid than the west in the sense of lower divorce rates, traditional gender roles being maintained, etc. In India, is there a divide on the desirability of marriage between rural/urban, wealthy/poor or educated/non-educated, etc? In the West I believe that wealthy people are still getting married, whereas poorer people are reluctant (possibly because poorer men …
/r/MGTOW208/07/20 10:18 PM
2

I think we need a MGTOW alternate to "Who hurt you?" To wit: "Who healed you?" "MGTOW!"
/r/MGTOW208/07/20 05:51 AM
1

willing to know the ugly truth behind it all and joins the cause The ugly truth is that marriage is a bad deal for men. The "cause" is self-improvement.
/r/MGTOW207/07/20 10:14 PM
1

being part of LGBT+ is ok Nothing wrong with being LGBT+ and being taught that there's nothing wrong with being LGBT+. It's the move to seemingly make being LGBT+ compulsory that's the problem.
/r/MGTOW207/07/20 09:30 PM
8

Sounds like a noble path if it is one you want to go down. Best wishes brother. But if you are thinking of having children, either naturally or adopting, then you will need to have good support from an extended family, including good male and female role models. Would you have the support necessary to do this?
/r/MGTOW207/07/20 09:24 PM
1

Holy cow! A lot of country music seems to be all about complaining over not getting a woman, or complaining over a woman that you've gotten, or complaining over a woman that you haven't gotten over. Having said that, I do love country music.
/r/MGTOW207/07/20 09:19 PM
9

Eating extremely clean since I don't have another person to worry about appeasing. I can eat the same optimized meals every day and it doesn't bother me, as long as I know the fuel is top quality I'm happy. I think that this is so important. It's not just a question of avoiding obesity. What we eat affects not just health, but moods and even cognitive ability. Depression, sleep, allergies, lots more, can be resolved to some extent by eating less and eating well. I see a convergence of many facto…
/r/MGTOW207/07/20 09:14 PM
4

This question comes up fairly often. Maybe we need a sticky thread where people can give their stories? It might make for a good resource for new people coming to MGTOW2.
/r/MGTOW207/07/20 09:03 PM
5

Thanks for the response, HedonisticNik. Thailand gets mentioned a lot as the "I'm going to quit the West and live in Thailand the rest of my life where I will marry an old-fashioned woman and be happy" go-to plan for some men who are disappointed with Western women. What are the chances of that happening to the average reasonably well-off Western 40 year-old man? Also, what is the impact of divorce on Western men living long-term in Thailand?
/r/MGTOW207/07/20 11:07 AM
6

Yes, that's a good point. The more "man-friendly" a country is, the less likely it is to find MGTOWs, thus there will be no representation on this board from that country. Still, I suspect there are few modern countries like that, even countries traditionally considered man-havens.
/r/MGTOW207/07/20 10:54 AM
1

There is this thing called "funa" that a lot of women practice here, basically you cancel someone on IG and the like... Is "funa" the same concept as ghosting, or something different?
/r/MGTOW207/07/20 10:49 AM
1

She's family. Help her if you can, without compromising your own needs.
/r/MGTOW207/07/20 03:45 AM
22

How did/do you prevent "going their own way" to turn into "becoming isolated"? Why on earth does going your own way turn into becoming isolated? MGTOW is about "no marriage, no cohabitation" since these are now bad deals for men. It isn't about "no friends, no family". You should always invest time and resources for your own well-being whether you are MGTOW or not: For good physical health, invest time into exercise. For good mental health, invest time into friendships, family and hobbies. For g…
/r/MGTOW207/07/20 03:27 AM
2

"I think, therefore I am... not married."
/r/MGTOW206/07/20 11:24 PM
5

Marriage may have made sense in ancient cultures, where you had a tight community that supported men. I suspect most men in those days tended to work and hang out in groups of men, and women hung out in groups of women, and that kind of support helped make for satisfactory marriages. That MGTOW understands that marriage is a bad deal now for men in the West doesn't mean that we have to recast history and judge other places and times and cultures by modern sensibilities. There is too much of that…
/r/MGTOW206/07/20 11:07 PM
3

"A man in love is incomplete until he has married. Then he's finished." -- Zsa Zsa Gabor
/r/MGTOW206/07/20 10:58 PM
13

Hi Indian-Punjabi-Goth. I hear stories about how marriage is for men in India now: namely, bad news! I know India is a big place, but what's the view among men there now generally with regards to the need to getting married?
/r/MGTOW206/07/20 11:11 AM
1

Good for you, ZenitGG, well done! Good for the soul to help someone in need.
/r/MGTOW206/07/20 06:14 AM
1

That's a fair enough definition. Do you think they have a life harder than you, and do they treat you like an equal, or do they expect you to do more in certain areas?
/r/MGTOW205/07/20 11:47 PM
3

How do you and they define the word "feminist"?
/r/MGTOW205/07/20 11:26 PM
1

Well, I am not a best example you guys can take from... I learned things hard way... Learning from other men's painful experiences IS the best example a man can take from. Thanks for that. Best of luck brother.
/r/MGTOW204/07/20 02:19 AM
2

What is stopping you from going out and making friends? You can join a club, share a hobby with others of the same interest. Lots of things you can do to not being alone. Is "loneliness" the right word here?
/r/MGTOW203/07/20 03:32 PM
2

MGTOW is a not the opposite of feminism but a direct result of it. People need to understand this. No, the ideas behind MGTOW have always been around, since before even Roman Empire days. And that's because the expectations on men to be disposable resource-providers have always been around. But the ideas being pushed nowadays by the gender ideologues under the name of "feminism" has put things into much clearer perspective for men. MGTOW is more relevant today than ever before.
/r/MGTOW203/07/20 01:08 PM
3

As you've found when talking to your relative, you need to define "feminism". If you use the dictionary definition -- women should have equal opportunity to men -- then I think nearly everyone agrees with that. The problem is that feminism seems to mean something different now. I believe only 20% of women in the West call themselves feminists even though nearly all believe in equal rights. So your answers may vary depending on how the person you are asking defines "feminism". I call myself a fem…
/r/MGTOW203/07/20 12:44 PM
7

Thank God! I thought this was more "blackpill" rubbish. I think you mean "appreciate negative experiences", for their teaching value. That's excellent advice. "Embrace negativity" is something different, and something you definitely don't want to do.
/r/MGTOW201/07/20 12:14 PM
7

For good physical health, invest time into exercise. For good mental health, invest time into friendships and hobbies. For good financial health, invest money and resources. For good overall health, invest time in your community. With regards to the idea of "Let it burn", I'll paraphrase an old saying: "First I let a stranger's place in the next town burn, but I did nothing because I didn't know the stranger. Then..." We all know how and where and with whom that ends.
/r/MGTOW201/07/20 10:14 AM
7

For sure. MGTOW ideas can be traced back to old Roman times, when Augustus imposed a bachelor tax on Roman citizens because men were reluctant to marry. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bachelor_tax And of course, there are passages in the Old Testament warning about getting married to a 'quarrelsome' woman. This was back in the days when there really was a patriarchy. But some people do seem to think that MGTOW is a reaction to modern-day feminism, so I thought the clip from 1960 would be educatio…
/r/MGTOW201/07/20 10:10 AM
1

Get out of the US while you can... Question is: where do you go? I'm an Australian, and I'm thinking of getting out of Melbourne, a city of over 5 million people. But where to go? Maybe a country area? Maybe another country? I'm not keen on Thailand or other south east Asian countries. I thought maybe the USA might be the best place to flee to. Not to the big cities of course, but there appears to be a lot more choice of easy living country areas. I hope that's true? I watched this TV program ma…
/r/MGTOW201/07/20 06:18 AM
5

I'd like to see this post pinned to the top of every Incel sub (if there are any left after the recent reddit sub purge). A classic cautionary tale of "the incel to Chad/Tyrone", where being able to get women at will doesn't result in the happiness that Incels think it will. Well written and great contribution, ZariusValtollo. Thanks for sharing!
/r/MGTOW201/07/20 01:51 AM
1

I'm 60. My feedback: Can prostitutes heal me or will they add to my pain? Depends on you. I went to a brothel in my 20s to try it out. The woman I selected was gorgeous. I didn't enjoy it, though that had nothing to do with her. I just couldn't enjoy sex without any kind of connection. That's just me. Before trusting this guy who says my pain will DISAPPEAR, I thought I'd get more opinions. I think that guy is wrong when he says that loneliness goes away when horniness goes away. Loneliness isn'…
/r/MGTOW201/07/20 01:36 AM
1

Thing is I am not MGTOW, yet. In what way are you not MGTOW? What do you need to believe before you call yourself MGTOW?
/r/MGTOW201/07/20 01:22 AM
4

Anything else? Are there any toxic elements? Toxic elements: "Women are evil" Never help a woman. Don't have female friends. Loving your mother and sisters is somehow not MGTOW Don't get married. Not because marriage is a bad deal for men (which is a good rational reason), but because marriage is somehow evil and bowing to the matriarchy! They're the main ones off the top of my head. But you won't find those toxic elements on this sub (MGTOW2) very often, thankfully. Welcome!
/r/MGTOW201/07/20 01:18 AM
2

And the problem is that, while there are unicorns out there, too many of them eventually morph into rhinoceroses. You just have to cross your fingers and hope. Even better, not need one at all. A man needs a unicorn like a bicycle needs a fish.
/r/MGTOW201/07/20 01:07 AM
3

Some marriages work out. There are some MGTOWs who don't like to hear it, but some men will be happier being married than being MGTOW. Marriage is not for me, since I regard it as a bad bet and I'm very happy to be single. I don't play the lottery for the same reason: it's a rational decision based on the odds, an analysis of potential costs vs potential benefits. But if you've married and things are going great, then you've beaten the odds. It happens. What is the MGTOW stance on finding the MG…
/r/MGTOW201/07/20 12:52 AM
3

Well, yes you were naive. Now you are less naive. You've learned from your experience. That's a good thing! You survived, you're alive and now it's time to thrive! Also, don't get married or cohabitate.
/r/MGTOW201/07/20 12:28 AM
1

But what if you compelled to "freely" go against nature? :) The whole "do we have free-will" thing is a rabbit-hole with a black-hole at the bottom from which there is no escape. If one has free-will at all, best to exercise it by staying out of free-will debates!
/r/MGTOW229/06/20 01:12 AM
2

From that story, I think your question shouldn't be "is she a prostitute", but rather "is she an amateur or a professional?"
/r/MGTOW229/06/20 12:55 AM
1

A man walks up to a Buddhist monk and asks, "Who is the Buddha?" The monk replies, "Who is asking?"
/r/MGTOW229/06/20 12:48 AM
1

According to science, free will is not existential. I don't think that view is "science". IIUC, there has been research suggesting what we think are our free-will decisions are actually made at a more sub-conscious level, and therefore aren't necessarily "free". But it isn't settled science by any means. One problem is defining what constitutes free-will in the first place.
/r/MGTOW229/06/20 12:29 AM
1

Good stuff! I've also started to try growing my own vegetables, especially bok choy and beets. I started modestly with pots and a small green-house. I'm almost ready for my first harvest!
/r/MGTOW229/06/20 12:22 AM
1

Don't hate people you don't know. That kind of paranoia is not good for your soul. Women are human beings trying to get by the best they can. Yes, marriage and cohabitation rules can become nightmares for men. Best avoid. Don't add paranoia to the picture.
/r/MGTOW227/06/20 04:45 AM
2

From my point of view you are welcome here. LGBT issues are important, and I don't doubt that there are issues that transcend men and transmen where your contribution would be important. But I doubt that LGBT forums would be happy to have heterosexuals wanting to add a heterosexual perspective to every thread about LGBT issues. So it's nothing to do with being against the LGBT. I just don't want this sub to lose its focus on men's issues around marriage. Believe it or not, I've found few places …
/r/MGTOW227/06/20 02:13 AM
3

I don't think so, personally. The "M" stands for "men", and it's good to have a sub dealing with issues for men around marriage and cohabitation. Perhaps you could create a LGBTGTOW sub? Or a NBGTOW sub? Then you can focus on marriage issues relating to LGBT or NB people.
/r/MGTOW226/06/20 06:58 AM
1

Why on Earth should it have to be the case that in order for marriage to be a bad idea for me first it must be proven a bad idea for all men? That's some emotionally weak-ass bullshit right there, I say. You make your own decisions and you live with them, and if different men make different decisions, that's their business. Well said, that's exactly right! Marriage isn't for me, since any objective look at it shows that nowadays it is bad deal for men generally, and for me specifically, with the…
/r/MGTOW225/06/20 10:08 PM
1

Sounds right. Thanks for the response!
/r/MGTOW225/06/20 08:54 AM
0

The benefits of a man getting married: He as someone to grow old with He won't die alone He has a soul-mate to help raise a family Children to raise, leave a legacy A friend to go out with, meet other couples Economic benefits Health benefits -- married men tend to see doctors more often Mental health -- married men tend to have less mental health issues And of course, sex whenever he wants it. And all of the above are true, at least for some lucky men. We need to acknowledge that. Some marriage…
/r/MGTOW225/06/20 04:10 AM
1

I'm not a minimalist, but I'd like to move in that direction. I can see the benefits, but what are the drawbacks of minimalism that you've found? What are some of the things you'd recommend to avoid those drawbacks?
/r/MGTOW225/06/20 12:20 AM
2

It's the dramatic increase of boys and girls being raised without fathers so they have no positive male role-models in their lives. "Toxic masculinity isn’t the problem. Lack of masculinity is." https://www.fatherly.com/health-science/toxic-masculinity-fake-male-insecurity/ In August, author Rollo Tomassi tweeted “Children from single-parent households (overwhelmingly single mothers) account for 80% of rapists motivated by displaced anger. Congratulations feminism, you’ve literally bred and rais…
/r/MGTOW225/06/20 12:03 AM
1

Feminism's bullscrap about the gender pay gap is their geocentric model. They're completely wrong. We have all the evidence we need that proves it's wrong. No, the "gender pay gap" exists. If you compare the full-time earnings of all women with all men, there is a gap of around 20% or so. The problems are: The wider public believes that the gap is a comparison between comparable jobs and hours worked, when in fact it is all men compared to all women for all jobs. The gap is assumed to be because…
/r/MGTOW224/06/20 11:12 PM
2

The findings from the Calhoun Mouse Utopia experiments do seem to be more applicable nowadays. :(
/r/MGTOW224/06/20 10:39 PM
4

Women are human beings who are trying to get by as best they can. MGTOW is the RATIONAL decision to avoid legal entanglements with women based on a cost/benefit analysis of marriage/co-habitation. A healthy life includes good relationships with family, friends, men and women. If MGTOW means having an issue with forming friendships with women, then it has become dogma. Do you think that being MGTOW means avoiding friendships with women?
/r/MGTOW224/06/20 10:01 AM
8

Because when you think about it many men do confuse horniness with loneliness I'm convinced that many young men want to chase women when really all they want is to make a friend. They really are lonely, and it's not for sex. Those men who can get sex easily understand the difference. Friendships with women are important. There's more to women than just sex, though women try hard to hide that for some reason.
/r/MGTOW224/06/20 08:25 AM
17

It's not being led by the government. The government is straining behind the ideological mob, struggling to catch up. George Orwell foresaw the government implementing group-think to control the mob. I think he would have been surprised to see that the reverse is actually happening. It's hard to define who is leading things without descending into conspiracy theory territory. Personally I don't think there is any conspiracy, which in a way makes things worse, since there is no-one guiding this. …
/r/MGTOW224/06/20 06:15 AM
1

Don't care what people think about you No, DO care what people think about you. We all need mirrors, since feedback is an important component in improvement strategies. Feedback from friends and family is particularly important. But you need to understand yourself enough to objectively evaluate the feedback. The truth is that most people don't think about you at all, beyond some trivial surface level interaction. They are too busy going on with their own lives to care to think about you five sec…
/r/MGTOW224/06/20 12:47 AM
2

Sounds good! Would you give them up if a woman (say for example she's your dream girl) made it a condition of having a relationship with her? Because those kinds of things do happen. Or would that be a deal-breaker for you? But it always at nightfall the realization hits me that I'm alone, I try to avoid those thoughts but it always in the back of my mind. Normally I can sleep it off and feel better the next morning, but some night it's a real struggle. Funnily enough, just the other night I was…
/r/MGTOW223/06/20 04:06 AM
2

I have been, and am depressed, not for the fact I'm single no, it's because of what I've been through. You're right. I didn't mean to suggest that you couldn't be MGTOW and depressed (even though that's what I literally wrote!) Apologies, I should have been clearer. Depression and pessimism may develop for many reasons, biological or environmental. So they can happen to MGTOWs as well as anyone else. Thanks for the correction. My point was that I can't see how MGTOW itself can result in pessimis…
/r/MGTOW223/06/20 02:49 AM
1

What is the purpose with having a ton of money but living alone? Travelling, living in a foreign country, learning a foreign language. And why do you have to live alone? Live with friends. If you can't make friends, then your problem isn't MGTOW. I think too many men want to marry in order to make a friend. Far better to cut out the middle man and invest in the time to make friends.
/r/MGTOW222/06/20 10:38 PM
19

After watching that video, my passion is now NOT mountain biking. Looks fun, but very dangerous! I'll add it to my list of other passions: Not skydiving Not bungie-jumping Not going into a tiger park to pat tigers
/r/MGTOW222/06/20 11:52 AM
1

MGTOW is the RATIONAL decision to avoid legal entanglements with women based on a cost/benefit analysis of marriage/co-habitation. That decision will differ based on how each man defines the costs and benefits to their own lives. MGTOW is not about being anti-woman or pro-man. It is about being pro-individual. Learn as much as you can, question as much as you can, and use that education to find your own way. To go MGTOW: Focus on the three 'healths': Good physical health -- exercise and eat well…
/r/MGTOW222/06/20 11:44 AM
8

I still crave for a partner but sadly will never have one. Leaving aside your craving for a partner: what interests you? What are you passionate about?
/r/MGTOW222/06/20 06:04 AM
2

-------> r/MGTOW
/r/MGTOW221/06/20 09:02 PM
1

Not sad at all. MGTOW is freedom. If MGTOW isn't freedom for you, you're doing MGTOW wrong.
/r/MGTOW221/06/20 08:51 PM
1

That's an interesting thought. I became MGTOW not long after the dawn of the Internet, though I didn't hear the actual term 'MGTOW' until much later. I remember the Internet before there were even browsers, when everything was terminal input. After the Internet, everything became about 'on-line shopping'. Not just for clothes and for white goods, but for people and ideas as well. So blue-pilled before the Internet, red-pilled afterwards. I now wonder how much causation to take out of that correl…
/r/MGTOW221/06/20 08:45 PM
1

Also check out: /r/DeadBedrooms/
/r/MGTOW221/06/20 01:25 AM
1

Some men like the plantation, because they want to be happy and live a good life. The benefits: Someone to grow old with, so they won't die alone A soul-mate to help raise a family Economic benefits A friend to go out with, meet other couples Health benefits -- married men tend to see doctors more often Mental health -- married men tend to have less mental health issues And of course, sex whenever they want it. And all of the above are true, at least for some lucky men. We need to acknowledge th…
/r/MGTOW221/06/20 12:57 AM
1

It depends on how much input you have into your own life. Do you have agency to change your life? That's a gift. If you don't have that agency, then it may indeed be a curse. If you can change your life -- e.g. stop drinking; lose weight; don't invest in health, wealth and education; avoid marriage; stop worrying what others think -- and you don't, that's not a curse. That's something else.
/r/MGTOW221/06/20 12:05 AM
1

Bachelor, never married.
/r/MGTOW220/06/20 11:58 PM
1

The New Testament teaches that it is better to not get married. That's because, as the New Testament tells us, Jesus is returning very very soon -- words that are as true today as they were 2000 years ago.
/r/MGTOW220/06/20 07:34 AM
3

Let them vent, let them rage, give them a place to be mad. And help guide them to the next level; MGTOW2. They are not being helped to the 'next level', though. Other posters pile on, encouraging their red-pill rage. I call it 'red pill rabies'. If you try to help them out of their red-pill rage, you will almost certainly be banned as a concern troll. XGHOW, how would you help someone out of their red pill rage over there? What advice would you give? Try it out over there. Give (as you put it in…
/r/MGTOW220/06/20 07:15 AM
1

Nice! Also by Tom T Hall: Old Dogs, Children, and Watermelon Wine. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vVA1hbF-pz4
/r/MGTOW220/06/20 06:53 AM
1

Life is a gift. If everyone else is being encouraged to throw away their gift, it doesn't mean you have to. You don't have to live in that hive-mind. I can't name a single person who has some end goal or real direction to their life. What about Frinkst21? What's stopping you from naming him? Name him! I'm 60 years old. I worry about the future, with what is happening in the world. But I recognise that life is a gift, and I don't plan on throwing it away even if everyone else is doing that.
/r/MGTOW220/06/20 06:42 AM
8

Yes. Me! That's the right person for me. I'll add non-cohabiting female company if and as required.
/r/MGTOW219/06/20 04:03 AM
1

Here's a great idea for a MGTOW movie (12 mins 26 secs): A man going to McDonald's for a hamburger. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rvQ9DjJNal0
/r/MGTOW217/06/20 09:00 PM
2

Well... it sounds more like an Incel movie idea rather than a MGTOW one. Incels are the ones who seem to be interested in the adventures of Chads and how they glide through life. What makes this a MGTOW movie, in your view? A good MGTOW movie might be: a man doesn't get married, he pursues his own interests and lives a happy life, finally dying while being surrounded by friends. Make him a spy or an assassin to add a little interest.
/r/MGTOW217/06/20 11:14 AM
3

It's also "don't cohabitate". The reason is that that is the same as marriage in the laws of some countries. (Though I do see you wrote that you weren't cohabiting in your original post.) What would you do if she got pregnant?
/r/MGTOW217/06/20 10:58 AM
117

I'm 60 and I am very happy that I never got married. I think MGTOW is more of an old man's game though. At 19, you should be dating and getting to know women. Women are great! Just don't marry, don't cohabitate (common law marriage) and always use condoms. Also be aware of red flags. If a woman seems crazy, stay away. (Same for crazy guys as well, for that matter) So, be aware of the risks, and date! Have fun. (Edited to add) I saw your response to someone else. Make sure you invest time into fo…
/r/MGTOW217/06/20 10:42 AM
2

I don't think you get it. The photo tells us everything we need to know about MGTOW. The OP title is "I'm hiding". That is obviously referring to the poster, whom we can't see in the photo (because he is hiding), and not to the dog, which is clearly not hiding. It is a clever existential take on the human condition, intersecting with MGTOW, in that the poster is not appearing in the photo, thereby showing us that he has 'gone his own way'. I infer from the lack of a woman in the photo and the on…
/r/MGTOW217/06/20 10:05 AM
2

Someone commented that red pill rage falls into the path outlined in Kubler-Ross's "Five Stages of Grief and Loss" model: Denial – The first reaction is denial. In this stage, individuals believe the diagnosis is somehow mistaken, and cling to a false, preferable reality. Anger – When the individual recognizes that denial cannot continue, they become frustrated, especially at proximate individuals. Bargaining – The third stage involves the hope that the individual can avoid a cause of grief. Usu…
/r/MGTOW217/06/20 12:51 AM
1

I second learning intermittent fasting. Learning about why we put on weight and why we drop it when we minimise carbohydrates was half the battle for me.
/r/MGTOW216/06/20 10:44 AM
6

as a social creature I still wonder if life would be any better with any friends around. Wonder no more! Apparently there are health benefits in having friends. So as a general rule, life would be better. How that applies to you personally is up to you. Just as you should invest time and money to improve your financial health, you should also invest time in improving your physical health and mental health. Part of that is making friends and being involved in family and social groups.
/r/MGTOW216/06/20 04:16 AM
7

However, If one applies a strong discipline of self improvement, achieves money, status, and betters their looks, then he will be able to secure a women who will not leave him. Do you have statistical evidence that this is the case? That someone as good looking as Brad Pitt, as rich as Jeff Bezos or as high status as Prince Charles are more likely to secure a woman who will not leave him? Because I think the evidence suggests otherwise. But I'm happy to be shown that you are right.
/r/MGTOW216/06/20 02:27 AM
2

True to some extent, especially after the Great Incel Invasion of 2019 on MGTOW1. Do you think that reply describes you? If so, take the criticism seriously. If not, don't take the criticism seriously.
/r/MGTOW216/06/20 02:10 AM
0

I have this FOMO in getting a girlfriend and enjoying sex while I still possibly can Best solution: Get a girlfriend and enjoy sex while you still possibly can. Just don't lie to the woman and don't lie to yourself. MGTOW is "no marriage/no cohabitation" (because of devastating legal implications), not "no girlfriend". And if you are certain you don't want children, then get a vasectomy first. Good luck!
/r/MGTOW215/06/20 01:25 PM
1

Discussing other subs here is a rule breaking offence, but I hope that I'm allowed to show one thread with that trope, as a good example of the piling on that I mentioned: "Are all women really that bad? It just seems hard to believe that all women are devious creatures. Is it just in their nature?" https://www.reddit.com/r/MGTOW/comments/996ssj/are_all_women_really_that_bad/ "Yes" "They are all like that." ... "This this a thousand times this!" "I want to say no, but reality kicked me in the te…
/r/MGTOW215/06/20 12:44 PM
1

To be honest, I think that's a bit unfair on men. You meet an attractive woman, and you want to have sex with her. Do you want to have a relationship with her? That's harder to decide, and takes time and usually multiple meetings to decide. You could make a rule of "I won't have sex with a woman until I've decided to have a relationship with her", but sex and sexual chemistry itself is part of that decision. I definitely agree that you shouldn't lie to a woman to get sex. Don't lie to a woman an…
/r/MGTOW215/06/20 12:53 AM
2

I never thought I'd ever be defending MGTOW1, but... Why do you let it slide when they're trashing men, but act all sensitive, when they call women out on their shit? If all MGTOW1 did was "call women out on their shit", then I wouldn't have a problem with them. They call out both men and women. It's the "all women are evil" tropes, and the constant piling on of those themes, that is the problem. It's not healthy. MGTOW is freedom, it shouldn't be just changing one group-think to another. "Blue-…
/r/MGTOW215/06/20 12:08 AM
1

It's been 8 years, blue pilled nice guy beta me turned into red pilled pussy slayer chad, but I can never love any other person unconditionally... Hence, dont care about anybody, dont care about anyone. I'm sorry to hear that. You need to take the red-pill. Sounds like all you've done is change your brand of blue-pill. We need to be able to care about others. I hope you can work things out. Best wishes, brother.
/r/MGTOW214/06/20 11:49 PM
1

Always found most of the mgtow teachings to be correct , but I thought I should give this girl a chance... Now, I am angry... Out of interest: why are you angry now? If you gamble on the lottery and you don't win, you wouldn't be angry. You took a chance, and it didn't pay off. If you felt disappointment, then that I understand; but not anger. Can you explain where the anger came from, given that you already had found most of the mgtow teachings to be correct? (I'm not saying you shouldn't have …
/r/MGTOW213/06/20 10:06 PM
2

(Saamohod, a tip: add a brief note about the website article in the text area, rather than link directly to the website. Otherwise it might be removed as "low effort".) https://mobile.reuters.com/article/amp/idUSKBN23J2LI Men who were unemployed or had lower income were more likely to be sexually inactive, as were men and women who were students.... "Higher income could mean more resources to search for partners and could be considered as more desirable by such partners," study co-author Peter U…
/r/MGTOW213/06/20 01:11 AM
2

I see. If your kink is "unpopularopinion-porn", then posting about happy marriages on a MGTOW sub is about as good as it can get! :) Welcome, brother.
/r/MGTOW212/06/20 11:31 PM
2

... as someone who is in a healthy marriage going on ten years One thing I hate about some comments by some MGTOWers is the idea that all marriages are bad. But the reality is that some marriages work out. In fact, some people will have a happier life being married than being MGTOW. (I don't play the lottery because it is a bad deal, but I acknowledge that some people win the lottery.) I'm very happy to see you posting here, because different perspectives are valuable, including those from happi…
/r/MGTOW212/06/20 10:50 PM
1

Some marriages work out. If you are one of the lucky ones, you will be happier being married than being MGTOW. You need to do what is best for your own life. If that means marriage and children is the right thing for you, then that's what you should go for. Just be aware of the risks as well as the benefits. Unfortunately, society promotes the benefits of marriage and hides the risks, like a shady car salesman. As with everything, education is your friend. Best wishes, brother. (I'm happily sing…
/r/MGTOW212/06/20 10:36 PM
1

Woah, that sounds horrible. My hope is that, if the West collapses, it won't be as bad as roaming bands of bandits, at least for a while. It's a scary thought. But I think you are right, that in that situation being MGTOW and mobile would be better. Do you see many similarities with what happened in Ukraine to what is happening now in the USA? I know the situations are different, but just wondering what you think might happen next, based on what happened there.
/r/MGTOW211/06/20 10:04 AM
1

going mgtow is the right way to face it. enjoy the decline, folks! I'm sorry, but that is a stupid and naive attitude. You are not going to like the decline and what follows it. When the electricity stops, water dries up and the food delivery ceases, strong family units will be in a better situation to survive than most MGTOWs. We have the luxury of thriving as MGTOWs in a working society. But most MGTOWs are not equipped to live off the grid, from what I can see. Marriage and children are benef…
/r/MGTOW211/06/20 02:00 AM
3

I have been in monk mode for six years now, and I have begun to feel that I miss sharing my life with someone. Okay, time for a little MGTOW tough love! This is a particular bugbear for me: people using stock phrases that don't really convey an explicit meaning. I don't understand what "miss sharing your life with someone" actually means for YOU. Could you not get a family member or male friend move in with you? Then you'd have someone to share your life with. But I'm guessing you mean something…
/r/MGTOW211/06/20 01:41 AM
1

I thought it was just "Men Going Their Own Way". I think it should be irrelevant as regardless of orientation, you are simply avoiding relationships No, it's a little more than that. The definition is on the sidebar. It is: "MGTOW is defined in r/MGTOW2 as: Men walking away from marriage and other relationships with women that subject them to the laws of a gynocentric court. Choosing to use your talents to improve your life, finding happiness and satisfaction." I'd insert "Men making the RATIONA…
/r/MGTOW211/06/20 12:59 AM
4

I guess the idea is that your children will look after you when you are old. That used to be true. Nowadays, as you noted, nearly everyone will grow old in Aged Care homes, and the children will visit once in a while, if at all. They are very depressing places.
/r/MGTOW210/06/20 07:25 PM
1

MGTOW is the RATIONAL decision to avoid damaging legal entanglements with women based on a cost/benefit analysis of marriage/co-habitation, in a society that pushes men towards making those legal entanglements. Personally I don't think gay men can be called "MGTOW", but it is a definition thing, not an exclusion thing. If the definition of MGTOW changed to also include gay men and gay marriage, I wouldn't have a problem with that. But I'm happy with the definition as it exists, since there is a …
/r/MGTOW210/06/20 07:19 PM
8

How do I view male homosexuality? Live and let live. How do I view female homosexuality? Often.
/r/MGTOW210/06/20 07:09 PM
2

GET OFF SOCIAL MEDIA, RIGHT NOW. Sorry for the caps, but the way things are going now, if you can be tied back to any controversial statement on-line your job may be jeopardised. Do not talk about MGTOW. I am in complete shock with what is happening at the moment in the Western world. For those young people starting out in life, be very very careful with what you put on-line. (Anyway, hope you get that job!)
/r/MGTOW209/06/20 11:24 PM
2

Why do people care so much about others' lives? I understand my mom cause she wants me to be healthy, but the neighbor? Well... why do YOU care what your neighbor thinks?
/r/MGTOW209/06/20 12:08 AM
1

Being born and not taking full advantage of that.
/r/MGTOW208/06/20 10:55 PM
7

Imper000, can I ask: what exactly do you think MGTOW says about women?
/r/MGTOW206/06/20 06:38 PM
2

MGTOW is the RATIONAL decision to avoid legal entanglements with women based on a cost/benefit analysis of marriage/co-habitation. That decision will differ based on how each man defines the costs and benefits to their own lives. MGTOW is not about being anti-woman or pro-man. It is about being pro-individual. Learn as much as you can, question as much as you can, and go your own way. The fact that, at 15 years of age, you are trying to figure things out puts you well ahead of many others! Well …
/r/MGTOW205/06/20 10:46 PM
1

If this is a problem, what do you recommend that we should do here on this sub?
/r/MGTOW205/06/20 10:40 PM
3

Hell, will those kids now even have a dad, or because at least partially due to their mom's choices, will they grow up without one and start the bad cycle we always talk about here? That's sad. It's very compassionate of you to think about the kids. Perhaps you can start up a Fundraiser to help them?
/r/MGTOW205/06/20 10:23 PM
1

The revenge porn narrative is just a waste of time thinking about. "Revenge porn narrative" :) Nicely put! Perfectly in line with what MGTOW2 (as opposed to another MGTOW sub which I will not name) is all about. Besides the lack of testosterone (the main sex drive hormone) women derive more (or most) fulfillment from cultivating platonic relationships. That's a really important point. Women are in general able to form platonic relationships with others much easier than men. Conversely, and proba…
/r/MGTOW205/06/20 06:34 AM
3

Sounds good!
/r/MGTOW205/06/20 06:02 AM
1

The mods here do a great job.
/r/MGTOW205/06/20 12:31 AM
1

Nathanv70, I don't know enough to contribute I'm afraid. But can I ask you to come back to share what you've learned when you've completed your analysis please? I'd be interested in what you find out.
/r/MGTOW202/06/20 10:30 PM
1

I'm indecisive in regards to some of the MGTOW values, and I may need convincing. MGTOW is the RATIONAL decision to avoid legal entanglements with women based on a cost/benefit analysis of marriage/co-habitation. I don't know how that would relate to gay marriage, since I don't know enough to make that cost/benefit analysis. I guess you might be in a better position to judge this for yourself. For it is your own decision, since it is your own happiness that is at stake. The main value of going y…
/r/MGTOW202/06/20 10:16 PM
1

The same benefits you get from male friends: someone who helps you when you need help; someone who has your back. I'm not saying you should make female friends in particular. It's just that good friends are rare, so make them if you can. I had a wonderful friend who died a few years ago. She was rude, loud, opinionated and annoying as hell. She also had a heart the size of a house and would move heaven and earth to help friends as well as strangers. She is missed by many, including me.
/r/MGTOW201/06/20 12:40 PM
3

Well said! Just to be clear -- and I think you'd agree -- there are wonderful women and horrible women, just as there are wonderful and horrible men. Women, like men, just want to get by as best they can. It's just that when it comes to marriage and cohabitation, the costs for men currently outweigh the benefits. But even there, it depends on how each individual man weighs the benefits of marriage. Marriage isn't for me, but it might be for others, and best of luck to them. But it bears repeatin…
/r/MGTOW201/06/20 05:01 AM
1

I actually agree with you there about women. I've had great friendships with women. MGTOWs are crazy to ignore the benefits of having female friends in their lives. I also agree that the OP may be equating MGTOW with disliking women altogether, rather than it being about "no marriage/cohabitation". It's not a healthy mindset, even if it isn't a toxic one. But I disagree with how you responded. Ivanbxng came here in good faith asking for advice. If he is mistaken about MGTOW, then better to put h…
/r/MGTOW201/06/20 04:02 AM
8

Yes, lots of wonderful women out there. MGTOWs should try to make good female friends. I've had great friendships with women. Those friends have been loyal. You'd be crazy to ignore the benefits of having female friends, just as you'd be crazy to ignore the costs of marriage and cohabitation.
/r/MGTOW201/06/20 03:51 AM
2

If I came to you with the same problem, what advice would you give me?
/r/MGTOW231/05/20 11:05 PM
1

Hi alasdaire92. It seems to me that the OP has a good mindset. He asked a very good question, one that I think affects a lot of MGTOWs. Can I ask if you can explain a little on why you think he has a toxic mindset? What would, in your eyes, constitute a good mindset?
/r/MGTOW231/05/20 11:01 PM
2

I don’t intend on marriage or living together. We’re in our early 20’s and both focusing on our goals. Then you are MGTOW as far as I'm concerned. Falling in love doesn't mean your MGTOW card is revoked. I’m gonna stop lying to myself and straight up tell her if she wants to be part of the ride or not. Either choice is good for me. I like what Owen_slaughter wrote, which was: "Did you stop doing that stuff when you started dating her? If so, THERE is your real problem." Too often men are told th…
/r/MGTOW231/05/20 10:57 PM
2

Are you able to have a relationship with her, and not get married and not cohabitate? Or do you feel that you should live together and marry her? That's what MGTOW is all about. If you haven't married, you are still MGTOW. I’m try to stay focused on my purpose but I can’t get this bitch out of my head. Date her. Don't lie to her or to yourself. Don't marry or cohabitate. After a while, the fog will lift and you will see her as she is.
/r/MGTOW231/05/20 10:44 PM
1

Well said. We should put energy into our enthusiasms, not into our hatreds. We need to be as careful of what we put into our minds as we do our bodies. I love your analogy between sugars and ideological echo chambers. I never thought of that before, but it makes sense.
/r/MGTOW231/05/20 07:28 PM
1

I'm not one for conspiracy theories, but... The chaos may be being partly instigated by people outside the local community, make of it what you may. Tim Pool covered it in a video today: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pIn_I49fCao 'Organized arson', it gets called in one tweet. I'm glad I don't live in the USA, but I'm concerned that the same thought processes will be replicated here in Australia. Scary times.
/r/MGTOW231/05/20 02:15 AM
2

True enough. I can only go on what is in the OP. My belief is that in general, one should work through relationships with family and friends, as long as it doesn't compromise one's own needs. Especially important is the relationship with the father and the mother. These relationships need to be renegotiated as we move from children to adults, regardless of how harmonious that relationship is when we are children. What is your advice to cracksniffer666? Let's help out our MGTOW brother as best we…
/r/MGTOW229/05/20 07:30 AM
2

What are you raging about? Can you clarify? It might be a helpful process.
/r/MGTOW228/05/20 10:44 AM
8

Remember, you are MGTOW. Don't marry her. More seriously: you are going to have bad relationships, and one of the 'joys' of being an adult is to learn to work them out. It may be you have to distance yourself as best as possible, but when it comes to family, I always recommend sitting down and working through the issues. Family is so important, especially as you get older. Nothing comes from that? Then at least you tried. But keep some kind of relationship going, as long as you don't compromise …
/r/MGTOW228/05/20 04:34 AM
10

I don’t even care about going MGTOW, while believing and accepting MGTOW. I've often said that the final stage of MGTOW is to move away from MGTOW subs, and start living your life. It's part of leaving behind red pill rage, concerns about shaming and what others think of you. No need to seek validation for your life choice, just go off and live it.
/r/MGTOW227/05/20 11:56 PM
11

Holy heck! Well done. I admire your commitment. I didn't do anything in that time except sit at home. In my defence though, the weather was a little chilly, but I managed to get up from the couch and put the heater on.
/r/MGTOW227/05/20 11:20 AM
3

In fact I think it's too much stress. From chatting with her and getting to know her, to flirting and thinking up creative replies, to the dates, to the sex and then the aftermath of sex, which involves keeping in touch with her to prevent that spark from burning out so that you can bang her again. I think it's too much effort for the little reward of intercourse. This is so true! And yet it is rarely talked about outside of MGTOW forums. We keep getting told about how important sex SHOULD be in…
/r/MGTOW227/05/20 02:44 AM
2

For insomnia: try intermittent fasting, and not eating after 3 pm. Gut bacteria can affect brain function, so sometimes if the body is still trying to process food, the brain finds it hard to shut down. It might also be too many carbs, or not enough carbs, etc. The food-brain link is important, and differs from individual to individual.
/r/MGTOW227/05/20 02:34 AM
11

Fantastic! I see this as a "game-changer". Cheap and easily reversible vasectomies will mean less unwanted pregnancies and unexpected child support duties. I hope all men are encouraged to get the injection as soon as they are of legal age to do so. This type of technology could have been available years ago. But the Big Pharma companies don't want to sell a cheap injection that a man needs to take every 5 years, they want to sell a gel or a pill that needs to be taken daily. So the developers o…
/r/MGTOW226/05/20 11:55 AM
7

He does say "be silly".
/r/MGTOW224/05/20 03:15 AM
13

she seems faithful (because she is a bit clingy and insecure) Did you mean "unfaithful"? I've never thought of clingy and insecure people as "faithful".
/r/MGTOW224/05/20 12:19 AM
3

She complains the whole time and when I try to help she doesn’t want it and makes me feel bad for not wanting to listen to that shit everyday. That is the reddest of red flags. If she is starting to blame you for her own fixable problems, then everything she does to you down the track will be YOUR fault, YOUR responsibility. You know, "stop hitting yourself!" They are not the thought patterns of a responsible adult. No accountability, no responsibility.
/r/MGTOW223/05/20 10:49 PM
1

Yungdoodirty, I know there is an implied "what do I do?" in your OP. But can you state what the actual problem is, in your own words? This will help to clarify what the problem is in your own mind. If it is just a general "What do I do?", then obviously the advice you'll get on a MGTOW board is "break up with her right now", followed by (from me) "MGTOW is freedom!" But you must have thought of that already. Often, when people ask "What do I do?", they KNOW what they should do. They're just look…
/r/MGTOW223/05/20 10:36 PM
2

Would men be concerned about being short if there were no women?
/r/MGTOW222/05/20 10:09 PM
2

It's an interesting idea. But I would be wary of bringing the court system and thus the government into this. Best to keep them out of relationships completely, including marriage.
/r/MGTOW222/05/20 10:07 PM
2

Well said. MGTOW is freedom: freedom for me, to live my life as I wish; and freedom for everyone else, to live the lives that they wish to live.
/r/MGTOW221/05/20 11:49 PM
1

In many religions, adultery is punishable by death. That's how it is controlled. That's not a good thing. Jordan Peterson thinks that modern relationships should be subject to "enforced monogamy", which he describes as "socially-promoted, culturally-inculcated monogamy". Even in a secular setting, that comes close to what religion promotes. Whether that would work or not without legal enforcement, I don't know. It comes down to the old battle between nature and nurture. Maybe religion kept us mo…
/r/MGTOW221/05/20 11:37 PM
3

My last serious relationship left me so broken and disturbed that I was formally diagnosed with PTSD. I'm sorry to hear that. Well, my advice is this: to me, integrity is important, so I always advise men to not lie to a woman nor lie to themselves. Is it possible for you to date without it being a serious relationship? That is, to be completely honest with the woman from the start about what you want: a "friends with benefits" relationship that includes intimacy, without the relationship becomi…
/r/MGTOW219/05/20 01:45 PM
4

Try the PUA subs like r/theredpill, they offer advice on how to get a girlfriend. MGTOW might not be the right place for you at this time. Best of luck!
/r/MGTOW219/05/20 11:31 AM
15

I'm definitely the same. I don't miss sex at all, but I do miss intimacy. How do I cope? When I was 20, I was attracted to 20 year old women. When I was 30, I was attracted to 20 year old women. Now I'm a 60 year old man, and I'm attracted to 20 year old women. I'm not attracted to 60 year old women. I don't want intimacy (much less sex) from that age group. Similarly with 50 year old women. They do start getting more attractive to me around the 40 year old mark. I could probably 'get' a 40 year…
/r/MGTOW219/05/20 08:14 AM
3

"What is one of your weaknesses?" "When I get rejected for a job, I hunt down the person who rejected me and then... well, I'd rather not say."
/r/MGTOW218/05/20 10:45 PM
6

This question comes up often on MGTOW. "My mother is a woman and I'm MGTOW -- what do I do???" But MGTOW isn't about hating all women, it isn't about hating any woman at all. The best answer I read to the question was "It's okay as a MGTOW to love your mother, just don't marry her." MGTOW is the RATIONAL decision to avoid legal entanglements with women based on a cost/benefit analysis of marriage/co-habitation. It is for YOUR benefit. Similarly, maintaining good relationships with your family an…
/r/MGTOW218/05/20 10:32 PM
4

You're not being a coward. You get something from the job that is of benefit to you: social interaction. I've worked in quite a few places over a long career, and one thing I've found is that when you aren't happy at a job, 90% of the time it is because of one or more of the people around you, and not the activity of the job itself. Don't quit working at a place you enjoy just so you can not consider yourself "a coward". That's the reason some men get married. Shaming language is often internal.…
/r/MGTOW218/05/20 10:19 PM
1

The points in the article itself aren't bad, but it ends with a nauseating: I call them king mindsets because they add a great deal of control/power to your life…. King status. Does anyone know where "we are kings!" idea came from? I know some women say "we are queens!", but is "we are kings" something that exists outside MGTOW, or is it just MGTOW?
/r/MGTOW218/05/20 10:14 PM
6

MGTOW is the RATIONAL decision to avoid legal entanglements with women based on a cost/benefit analysis of marriage/co-habitation. That's because those kinds of legal entanglements, more often than not, end badly for men. So a long-term relationship is not out of the question, but be careful of the legal implications, including pregnancy and child support. Society doesn't teach you the legal implications. It will tell you the benefits of marriage/cohabitation, but never the costs. MGTOW is a RAT…
/r/MGTOW218/05/20 08:34 AM
1

I could say im MGTOW, but honestly it is all the political and radical people i see on youtube that makes me wanna distance from the "name" itself, even if i am agreeing with the basic outlook of it. Yes, I understand where you are coming from. Perhaps the final step of becoming MGTOW is leaving MGTOW behind. "MGTOW" is just a label, after all.
/r/MGTOW218/05/20 08:26 AM
2

He loves women until it becomes about them / Marriage. Whoa. Like it!
/r/MGTOW218/05/20 12:07 AM
7

Im not resentful towards women, I love most of them, but I aint no dummy also. I like how you expressed that! I think it is extremely important to have good friendships with women. But be smart about it. I see alot of married people and all their problems, even couples too. And what can I say, I faced the same problems as a 15year old in relationships as i did when 25. And I see men in their 40ties/50ties having still the same problems. Our life is short, dont waste it if its not 100% right or w…
/r/MGTOW217/05/20 11:56 PM
5

Work on your relationship with your mum. Sit her down and have a long conversation about what you want, what she wants, what you both want. Family is so important.
/r/MGTOW217/05/20 06:35 AM
13

Great post, Han_GYOW. I agree with a lot of what you wrote. Here are my thoughts: Also this isn’t towards this subreddit, it’s more towards the sphere of influence in general that MGTOW has. I hope the readers on MGTOW2 keep that in mind, since MGTOW2 is a different kettle of fish to other MGTOW forums that I've seen. My point being this is becoming less of a message, and becoming more of a product to consume. Very true. I've been saying for a while that as soon as money can be made out of MGTOW…
/r/MGTOW216/05/20 10:04 PM
0

Darn! What a shame. Thanks for the response.
/r/MGTOW215/05/20 11:52 PM
0

How did those two crash your plan? Sounds like an interesting story in itself.
/r/MGTOW215/05/20 06:27 PM
7

She, then, becomes possessed and tries to kill him and he has to take a hatchet to her ass. Then, he has to escape the crazy shit. Hmmm... Wife becomes crazy and the man has to flee for his life. Sounds like the kind of marriage that turns a lot of men MGTOW.
/r/MGTOW214/05/20 11:44 PM
2

Good stuff! I love posts like these. I have learned to be lonely well. 'Lonely' or 'alone'?
/r/MGTOW213/05/20 11:34 PM
8

Stoicism, Taoism, Buddhism, Christianity, humanism, the works of various philosophers and philosophies. Lots of people wrote about life before there was MGTOW. Most of that work is not focused on women but how to be a good man. The writings of our ancestors handed down to us are humanity's heirloom.
/r/MGTOW213/05/20 11:01 PM
5

It sounds like the old saying: "Men are interested in things and how things work. Women are interested in relationships and how relationships work." I think that is generally true, YMMV.
/r/MGTOW213/05/20 10:49 PM
3

I understand your concern, but what is a 'man going his own way'? Marriage/cohabitation is what MGTOW are going from, but there is also what men are going to. The OP fits the latter.
/r/MGTOW213/05/20 12:00 AM
6

Man, I feel you. I really have no advice. You are displaying great maturity by asking these questions rather than rushing into anything, which the blue-pilled world would rather you do. Speaking cynically: the best way to resolve these feelings -- the deep conversations, wonderful feelings of compatibility, desire to be closer -- is to marry her, and then wait two years. Can men and women be just friends, without sex getting in the way? Yes, just look at many long-term marriages, i.e. r/deadbedr…
/r/MGTOW212/05/20 10:11 PM
2

I guess the dilemma is that I’m not sure whether to escalate on this or just forget about her. Why not date her? From a MGTOW perspective, dating is okay. Why not have sex with her? From a MGTOW perspective, having sex is okay. MGTOW is about "no marriage/no cohabitation" as a rational conclusion of a cost/benefit analysis. I suspect -- and I might be wrong -- that you feel that any escalation will lead to strong feelings, and these strong feelings will lead to commitment and almost inevitably t…
/r/MGTOW212/05/20 08:39 PM
3

It's completely normal, a combination of nature and nurture. But since I started talking to this chick we’ve had deep conversations and every goal and everything she talks about sounds so different to what other women I’ve met. That's great, you've made a good friend. I always encourage men to make good friends, including female friends. It might be worth you writing it out, so you can clarify things in your own mind: what exactly is the problem or dilemma that you face?
/r/MGTOW212/05/20 08:21 PM
2

Well done! How has that impacted your life?
/r/MGTOW212/05/20 08:17 PM
1

Good post, I hope things work out. It's said that we all have a spiritual home, a place we like to go to to reflect, usually alone. Mine is a certain spot near a local beach, where I talk to the water. There are also spiritual routines and small rituals that we can develop along the same lines. I also used to lie on the floor when I was a kid if I couldn't sleep, so nice to find a fellow floor-layer! Somehow the hard surface relaxed me more than the softer bed. My old bones couldn't take it now,…
/r/MGTOW212/05/20 08:13 PM
4

It's a nice coincidence: "Tao" means "Way". "MGTOW" sounds like "mig-tao" So "men going their own way" sounds like "men going tao". I've often thought that the Tao symbol (yin-yang) would look good in the word (not sure if it will display on your PC): MGT☯W
/r/MGTOW212/05/20 07:33 PM
8

Hey, that's cheating! :) Looks like an interesting experience. I'd love to know more. How did you transition from no-sex to a sex-is-okay life afterwards? Were there hurdles? Did you feel differently about the role of sex in your life?
/r/MGTOW212/05/20 09:32 AM
3

Sounds like you went God Mode, not just Monk Mode! Congratulations on your achievements, keep it going!
/r/MGTOW212/05/20 04:23 AM
2

As MGTOW grows, it is inevitable that it will fracture into groups. Each group will formalise around a specific set of ideas, with some ideas mutually exclusive between groups. I don't think it will ever be a 'dominance hierarchy' though, because MGTOW is about 'doing your own thing.' There is no movement, no leaders and no agendas. Not yet, anyway. The big question will be: can you make money off MGTOW? When the answer is 'yes', MGTOW will fracture.
/r/MGTOW211/05/20 11:53 AM
1

They don't really discuss that in the video, which is why the title is misleading. Where I think Wilcox is coming from is that, because marriage rates are tied to financial security, and 'the system' suppresses wages amongst the working class, there has been a resultant drop in marriage. (The 'elite' class, having money, don't have that impediment to marriage.) There is nothing in the video to suggest that this is a deliberate strategy by 'the elite'.
/r/MGTOW211/05/20 11:43 AM
11

I'd never heard of "The National Marriage Project" before, so I looked at their website: http://nationalmarriageproject.org/about/ The National Marriage Project was founded in 1997... In the summer of 2009, the National Marriage Project moved to the University of Virginia, where it is now directed by W. Bradford Wilcox, associate professor of sociology at the University of Virginia... The Project’s mission is to provide research and analysis on the health of marriage in America, to analyze the s…
/r/MGTOW211/05/20 09:19 AM
8

Can i become a part of MGTOW, if i’ve never had a relationship? Yes, in my opinion. MGTOW is the RATIONAL decision to avoid legal entanglements with women based on a cost/benefit analysis of marriage/co-habitation. i used to say “Why i can’t get girlfriend” but of course now i don’t give a fuck about that anymore, i only care about accomplishing my goals. Again, this is my opinion: MGTOW isn't "don't give a f*ck about women", it is "based on seeing the world really works (i.e. taking the red-pil…
/r/MGTOW210/05/20 11:03 PM
4

Amen! That's it exactly. I decree that ye change your name to GodsTruth69!
/r/MGTOW210/05/20 10:47 PM
14

These people are not considered MGTOW if they can't get any... Will you please stop repeating this? There may be some who think that, but stop making this a general statement about MGTOWs. It isn't true. You seem to want it to be true, but it isn't. Read the content you posted, and understand it. It isn't that you 'can't get any' that is the problem, it is that you pin your self-validation on 'getting some'. PUAs and Incels get their validation from achieving relationships with women. MGTOWs get…
/r/MGTOW210/05/20 12:48 AM
3

Many of you probably won't like what I am going to say but not all women are narcisstic and superficial. Wait, that's breaking the first rule of r/MGTOW2! See the sidebar where it lists "SUB-REDDIT RULES". It is: "No Women-hating, hate, and negativity in general" Oh. Carry on.
/r/MGTOW210/05/20 12:45 AM
2

Why not just have sex? Pay for it if you must. MGTOW is no marriage, no cohabitation. It isn't "no sex" and "no sexual feelings".
/r/MGTOW209/05/20 11:45 PM
9

This crisis is going to be good for some, and bad for others. I suspect that, generally speaking, those who thrive in crisis situations also thrive in non-crisis ones. Same for those who do bad in crisis situations. There is a small number who might benefit from a crisis, with a larger number who will probably suffer. All-in-all, a crisis is NOT a blessing. The blessing is being MGTOW in these times. And, please please stop this "kings" cr*p.
/r/MGTOW209/05/20 11:38 PM
4

Nice article! I'll check out further ones on that website. Its theme of self-mastery converges with the rationale behind avoiding legal entanglements with women through marriage/cohabitation.
/r/MGTOW209/05/20 07:43 AM
5

I thought I'd thrive in this environment, given that I'm all but retired. Nothing better than being at home, working on my hobbies and little projects. But after a few weeks, the shut-down has started to drive me crazy. I never realised how much doing those little things outside -- visiting the library, going to cafes, op-shops, bookstores, meeting up with friends to see a movie -- were important to me. It made me realise I couldn't live 'off the grid' after all. I'm definitely an urban person, …
/r/MGTOW209/05/20 03:56 AM
8

The "haves" feel that the "have-nots" are extremely lazy people who just don't try hard enough... The "have-nots" feel that the "haves" should show sympathy and try to understand their situation instead of providing useless advice. You can divide MGTOWs by politics or football team support I suppose, but neither has anything to do with MGTOW. MGTOW is the RATIONAL decision to avoid legal entanglements with women based on a cost/benefit analysis of marriage/co-habitation. I can sympathise with so…
/r/MGTOW207/05/20 07:19 AM
1

I hear you. I can't advise you on your life choices, since I don't know your circumstances. But my immediate thought was that someone with a high IQ should be able to work out relationship issues. It doesn't mean acquiescing to what they want, but to strike some kind of compromise, based on your own stated needs. And I do mean "stated", clearly and unambiguously and, if possible, kindly. This time now IS the most free life can get. It doesn't mean it's easy. Freedom can be a terrible burden with…
/r/MGTOW206/05/20 10:16 PM
2

I'm sorry, but you'll grow up and realise that these were the best years of your life. You will never be freer, with less expectations, and more potential, and greater health, than right now. You are a stem cell, with the ability to turn into anything that you have the capacity and drive to do. I'm not saying you don't have many good years ahead. But should you grow up thinking that these WEREN'T the best years of your life, then you have wasted all that freedom, all that potential, all that rob…
/r/MGTOW206/05/20 12:45 PM
7

Congratulations! You've achieved something you wanted by working hard and sticking to your goal. But I'd be interested to know: For you personally, isolation is the solution to what problems?
/r/MGTOW204/05/20 11:24 PM
7

It's all the outside influences that changed her overtime. How could that not happen to women? That is so true. The "you DESERVE a great guy" and "you DESERVE a high-paying job" attitudes, coupled with "men and the Patriarchy are stopping you getting what you deserve" must have some kind of influence on marriage. I'd love to see a serious objective study on the topic.
/r/MGTOW204/05/20 11:19 PM
2

My view: "You can be MGTOW and think that marriage is a good idea." "You can be married and think that MGTOW is a good idea." The first one is NOT true. The second one can be true if MGTOW is something that developed after getting married. It depends on what you consider "MGTOW" to be: is it a state or a philosophy? If it is a state, then marriage and MGTOW can't coexist. If it is a philosophy/life-style choice (or a preferred life-style choice after the fact), then they can co-exist. I think it…
/r/MGTOW204/05/20 11:00 PM
5

"Red pill raging" is really a failure to swallow the red-pill completely, and should more accurately be called "Blue pill raging". These are people who are angry, not at the red-pill, but at the blue pill not being true. Some part of them still wants to hold on to that blue-pill mentality, that blue-pill life. The rage is an indication of the strength that the blue-pill still holds on a person. Once you've completely lost your blue-pill mindset, there is no hatred of women, and no red-pill rage.
/r/MGTOW204/05/20 10:47 PM
2

Yes, exactly right. I call it "red pill rabies". It's one thing to allow someone to vent. If your friend wants to vent about something, you let them get it out, and they'll calm down. That's healthy. But it is another thing to pile on and ENCOURAGE your friend to continue to rant. As you rightly point out, it's become a perpetual state. That's not healthy.
/r/MGTOW204/05/20 10:37 PM
3

Read a lot before deciding to follow a religion. Best maybe to not follow a religion at all. I believe in God but don't feel I am part of any particular religion (I grew up as an atheist). Stoicism, assertiveness training, taoism, all offer good reflective paths to follow. Also read a lot of history. Best wishes, brother.
/r/MGTOW203/05/20 11:43 PM
8

It's like asking "what are the benefits of selling everything you own and betting on black at the roulette table at the casino?" The benefit is you can double your money instantly. If you are lucky. The benefits of marriage: Physical health: you have someone who can encourage you and look after you when you are sick; someone you can have sex with if and as you need it. Mental health: someone to build a life with, with family to support you. Financial health: a fiscally aware wife and husband can…
/r/MGTOW203/05/20 11:26 PM
2

I feel that going your own way is actually the easy way out. Do you not see the irony in that statement? Doing what you want is actually "the easy way out" -- doesn't that sound a little 'brain-washy'? It sounds like 'thinking for yourself is the easy way out.' If you want to get married and have children, then I hope you achieve that goal. But do it (1) because YOU want to do it, and not because society told you to do it, and (2) understand the costs/benefits of doing so. So: MGTOW or marriage.…
/r/MGTOW202/05/20 06:45 AM
16

unless you're a high tier good looking man, you'll either be ignored or cheated on by modern women. Do incels really believe that high tier good looking men don't get cheated on? I'd be interested in seeing the stats for that, but it doesn't seem likely. An attractive man will attract an attractive woman. Are attractive people less likely to cheat? I don't think so. Quite the opposite. An attractive cheater (male or female) has more opportunities.
/r/MGTOW201/05/20 12:10 PM
7

Regardless, that doesn't disqualify from me still be incel, as it's impossible for me to attract a woman, even if I still wanted to. If you don't want to attract a woman, doesn't that make you voluntarily celibate? I've always thought that MGTOWs aren't incels, and incels aren't MGTOWs, but I'm happy to be proven wrong. I'd heard that visiting a prostitute doesn't stop an incel from being an incel, since it isn't sex but the lack of ability to form a relationship that makes one an incel. Incels …
/r/MGTOW201/05/20 11:46 AM
3

"The limits of your language are the limits of your mind." It doesn't matter the language: specialised language in a particular field, a foreign language, a programming language. Expand your vocabulary, and your mind will follow.
/r/MGTOW229/04/20 10:13 PM
2

Nowadays, I treat men and women the same. In fact, I'd say my friendships with women are equally as awesome as my friendships with men. If there's no sexual tension or attraction between you and a woman, you'd be surprised how well the friendship works out. Yep, I can confirm. Well said!
/r/MGTOW229/04/20 05:00 AM
7

You should view them. It is always good to get an opposing point of view. The problem though is the lack of good counter-views. Most are a waste of time, as you've found. If anyone can recommend a good video that is critical of MGTOW, I'd be interested in watching it.
/r/MGTOW229/04/20 03:44 AM
20

For me, the issue with fat acceptance isn't the self-acceptance. Okay, if they're fat and they're okay with it, fair enough. (I think they are being foolishly unhealthy, but it is up to them.) But it is their insistence that YOU approve it as well which is annoying. YOU have to want to date a fat person, YOU have to find them attractive. That's what's at the heart of modern 'fat acceptance' it seems. No thanks.
/r/MGTOW229/04/20 03:40 AM
4

Conservatives are usually about family values: get married, have children, and get a full-time job to support others. That side of things is not consistent with MGTOW. MGTOW is apolitical. MGTOW is the RATIONAL decision to avoid legal entanglements with women based on a cost/benefit analysis of marriage/co-habitation. Is there any political party that is consistent with that idea? Not that I know about.
/r/MGTOW228/04/20 10:14 PM
1

I don't see anything wrong with it personally (ignoring the MGTOW aspects, of course).
/r/MGTOW227/04/20 12:10 AM
5

I thought I was reading a Linux line command for a moment! -sudo apt-get kudos from-much-older-dude :)
/r/MGTOW226/04/20 11:43 PM
1

Well said!
/r/MGTOW226/04/20 11:36 PM
3

I think MGTOW is strongly aligned with self control & discipline No, getting the most out of life is strongly aligned with self control and discipline. MGTOW is the RATIONAL decision to avoid legal entanglements with women based on a cost/benefit analysis of marriage/co-habitation. There may be overlap, of course. But let's not put too much on what MGTOW is. A man can be a lazy jerk without self-control and a MGTOW. Best not to be a lazy jerk without self-control, though.
/r/MGTOW226/04/20 11:31 PM
1

Like a lot of men, you became MGTOW ("after I got fed up with chasing women") and THEN you found out about MGTOW. I wonder how many men out there are MGTOW without knowing about it. My answer: I became MGTOW a long time before I ever heard of the term. When I heard about 'Men going their own way', I thought "I'm home." You write that you are now focusing on your hobbies. Excellent! But unless one of your hobbies is masturbation, what does Nofap have to do with MGTOW?
/r/MGTOW226/04/20 11:24 PM
10

I've heard of that book. If you get the time after you finish it, could you post a short review on MGTOW2? Especially how it intersects with MGTOW ideas.
/r/MGTOW225/04/20 03:22 AM
84

Society makes nearly everyone feel guilty about everything. It's how it keeps people in line. At a certain point in your life, you have to start not worrying about what society thinks about you. Because most people are too busy worrying about what everyone else thinks, to ever spend much time worrying about what you think. Don't be concerned about it, and go your own way. MGTOW is freedom.
/r/MGTOW225/04/20 01:56 AM
1

My recommendation may be controversial, but here it is: There is a thing called "abundance mindset", as distinct from "scarcity mindset". Try the abundance mindset idea of: go out and ask as many women out as you can. The more attractive the woman, the better. Of course try not to do it in a creepy way, but do it in a fun spontaneous way. Think of whimsical pick-up lines and try them out. Make it a game, rather than a serious pursuit where you pin your self-validation on the result. You don't ha…
/r/MGTOW224/04/20 11:36 PM
2

"I vow to always make my own path and go my own way."
/r/MGTOW223/04/20 11:34 PM
2

From a MGTOW perspective: "'First they laugh at you'... who cares? MGTOW is freedom"
/r/MGTOW222/04/20 09:28 PM
2

I read the thread title, rolled my eyes and thought, "Oh no, here we go. Incel-bomb incoming!" But I actually found myself agreeing with you. Sex can be like an addictive drug, and we need to be aware of the implications of that. On the other hand, sex can be like a remedial drug. There are benefits. Beware becoming addicted of course, but I personally believe that a MGTOW lifestyle can incorporate sex in a responsible way. We may disagree there, though. A provocative but good post, AndrewLyssun…
/r/MGTOW222/04/20 12:24 AM
2

^ This.
/r/MGTOW222/04/20 12:15 AM
1

Serious question: Why do you care what others think? How much time do you think others spend worrying about what YOU think?
/r/MGTOW222/04/20 12:14 AM
2

I've noticed that in the past, my old self would have been infuriated or disturbed by what I have seen or read... I don't know what you've been reading or why, but I'd suggest not reading that material. Hate-watching and hate-reading are real things, and are not healthy, even if you now feel nothing doing that. What are you passionate about? Maybe write a list for yourself. Then focus on your passions, not your hates. If you think about it, MGTOW and the red-pill is the essence of that idea: foc…
/r/MGTOW222/04/20 12:02 AM
1

:) No, you didn't give growing old a negative connotation, so no worries at all. My point was that life gives you opportunities to learn as you pass through the years, so old age should bring wisdom. Still, "there is no fool like an old fool" is also true because the stubborn old man -- confusing age with wisdom -- thinks himself right, and doesn't have the flexibility of youth to change his mind. So keeping a youthful open mind is just as important as wisdom. I think it is great you are asking …
/r/MGTOW220/04/20 01:20 PM
2

My question is how are men supposed to be men without being deemed as sexist or misogynistic? Who is doing the deeming, you or someone else? Make the deeming come from you.
/r/MGTOW220/04/20 05:16 AM
2

I'm old. Yes, wisdom is a function (or should be) of age. But what are you going to do? Work with what you have, and improve. It's an incremental process. There is no "maximum level" of wisdom, but there is a maximum level of age.
/r/MGTOW220/04/20 04:45 AM
1

Driving a car can be a risk. Just make sure you take as much care as possible. Similarly with dating. Note that false allegations are sometimes made by women when the man refuses to sleep with them, so even going monk doesn't necessarily stop that problem. Your English is excellent.
/r/MGTOW218/04/20 07:52 AM
2

That's the answer. Be true to others, be true to yourself. Integrity and accountability. You can't tell others what they should do, you can only tell yourself what you yourself should do. I always say that MGTOW is about the three healths: good physical health, good mental health and good financial health. We need integrity, accountability and purpose for good mental health.
/r/MGTOW218/04/20 01:27 AM
1

Great question! Read the famous Stoic Roman Emperor Marcus Aurelius's "Meditations", who was very enlightened on the topic. A good man indeed. Then his son Commodus, thinking he (Commodus) was a god, came in, slaughtered people personally in the gladiator arena, and wrecked society. There's the answer.
/r/MGTOW218/04/20 12:48 AM
1

And being single is saven, both money and souls.
/r/MGTOW217/04/20 08:03 AM
1

I broke MGTOW for a while but I guess I’m back to this now. Wait, what? You can be MGTOW and date, you know. MGTOW is the RATIONAL decision to avoid legal entanglements with women based on a cost/benefit analysis of marriage/co-habitation. You build your world your way. Or do you mean you only date with a view towards marriage or cohabitation? I really don’t have a choice about going my own way now since I should be social-distancing. Sure you do. You can social-distance and say to yourself "Aft…
/r/MGTOW217/04/20 04:47 AM
1

You're not suffering from red-pill rage, you're suffering from blue-pill rage. That is, some part of you still wants the blue-pill world to be true, so you are resentful and resisting giving that up. Once you have fully swallowed the red-pill, and realise that this red-pill world is the one to live in because it is simply better here, then you can finally let go of the blue-pill world. Good luck, brother! P.S. And don't hate your mum! She has experienced her own travails. Talk to her, and try to…
/r/MGTOW217/04/20 12:20 AM
1

I haven't thought too much about a female equivalent I'm afraid. I suppose it might be a woman who makes the rational decision to avoid having children due to it being a bad deal for women? I'm not sure how many women feel that way. But childless women get a lot of the same cr*p that men who don't marry get, through societal expectations.
/r/MGTOW216/04/20 10:57 AM
1

Well, think about it. WHY did the male mice separate themselves in the first place? They obviously felt that they got something out of it. I don't think Calhoun ever got into the reasons. Why are men going MGTOW? Are they the same reasons? Lots of things to think about. Can you think of a female equivalent to mgtow? I forget what it's called but they refer to all women as queens who dont need to improve. MGTOW is the RATIONAL decision to avoid legal entanglements with women based on a cost/benef…
/r/MGTOW216/04/20 10:30 AM
1

Mice Going Their Own Way! Yes, quite a few people have noticed the similarities between "The Beautiful Ones" and MGTOW coming from Calhoun's 'Mouse Utopia' project, though I prefer to call us "Those Handsome Devils". One term that came out of the experiments was "Behavioral sink", where over-crowding brings on a break-down in social order, which causes population to fall, all the way down to extinction. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_B._Calhoun Initially, the population grew rapidly, doublin…
/r/MGTOW216/04/20 09:44 AM
1

Vasalgel. Every man at 18 years old to get a mandatory easily-reversible vasectomy. A vasalgel injection (still under development) into the scrotum blocks the emission of sperm and lasts around 5 years. All women can then get off birth control, which screws with their hormones and emotions. Condoms would still be needed to control STDs. But the removal of the possibility of unwanted pregnancies would be fantastic for men. Combine that with compulsory DNA testing for all births.
/r/MGTOW216/04/20 09:20 AM
2

OMG, Vue is a Progressive Javascript Framework. The gender ideologies have finally infiltrated computing! I'm reporting this thread! :) Not really. Well done! Thanks for the link. Sometimes, when sitting on the balcony sipping a coffee, I've thought that it would be good to create a "Social Justice scripting language", like 'if male then..., if female then...' Then I think 'what a waste of time, to spend it on something negative', and get another coffee. When you have a choice between spending t…
/r/MGTOW216/04/20 02:22 AM
16

Forever alone men are not considered MGTOW because MGTOW are happy to be single. We are single because it makes sense. MGTOW is a Forever Free mindset.
/r/MGTOW215/04/20 03:50 AM
5

And then I thought: "If a woman couldn't love me now, why would I have a wife that only loves me for my money and what ever else I can provide for her?" Yep. It's strange that these obvious 'truths' don't get questioned everywhere: A man needs to get a good job, so he can find a woman who will love him for who he truly is. A woman needs to put on make-up and clothes to look as attractive as possible, so she can find a man who will love her for who she truly is. Whereas it should be: A man needs …
/r/MGTOW213/04/20 11:39 PM
1

:) It's perfectly normal. But you'll work it out. The fact that you are asking these great questions at 19 years old shows you are already on the right path! Best wishes, brother.
/r/MGTOW213/04/20 10:55 AM
1

I want land and to build my house from the ground up, I can think of few things in life more satisfying than to do that, and then live in that house!
/r/MGTOW213/04/20 08:16 AM
1

"Life is what happens while you are making other plans." "Man plans; God laughs." I'm 60 years old. Many years ago, in my younger days, I moved to a completely foreign country twice, learning new languages, for quite a few years. It was something I also wanted to do, and I will always have those memories. It did stuff up my career trajectory though. That was the trade-off. What you haven't told us is: what are you passionate about? What do you want to accomplish? There is no point asking others …
/r/MGTOW213/04/20 06:51 AM
1

Jocko Podcast (motivation videos): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IdTMDpizis8
/r/MGTOW213/04/20 02:35 AM
1

Best wishes, brother!
/r/MGTOW212/04/20 09:49 PM
1

Well said. To me, it's about personal integrity. Step 2: Be you at all times. Step 1: Work out who you are.
/r/MGTOW212/04/20 02:00 AM
1

Is there any chance that she might harm the dogs? Are you completely confident that they are safe and well cared for?
/r/MGTOW212/04/20 01:41 AM
6

Social distancing for MGTOWs: Keep 1.5 metres from others Wash hands thoroughly regularly Stay at home No marriage/cohabitation
/r/MGTOW211/04/20 05:38 AM
2

In time the Unicorn variable gets replaced with the AWALT constant. I like it! :thumbsup:
/r/MGTOW210/04/20 10:46 PM
8

:) You're right, it IS conservative. But I've found that, if you've finished two, and you're starting on three, then it probably won't stop at three. On a related note, see The Onion's shocking story on the 2 AM computer worm (2 mins 27 secs): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xIVXo7Kl9EY
/r/MGTOW210/04/20 07:25 AM
17

It's like driving: never post after 2 drinks.
/r/MGTOW210/04/20 06:30 AM
2

I just wish to gain some self-esteem In the last few decades, the idea of 'self-esteem' somehow changed to mean 'something that one was given', rather than something developed through personal achievement. So children were given participation trophies to 'boost self-esteem', removing the 'self' part from the achievement. Why would anyone have self-esteem under those conditions? Set small goals, and then achieve them. Set out to do something for a day. If you can't do a day, set out to do it for …
/r/MGTOW210/04/20 01:41 AM
3

I'd recommend you seeing the Cassie Jaye documentary "The Red Pill", which covers a lot of material. You can also see her Youtube channel, where she has a lot of clips interviewing MRAs and others: https://www.youtube.com/user/Cassiejaye/videos
/r/MGTOW208/04/20 12:31 PM
3

Just to be clear I’m not MGTOW That's fine, you do you. But I'd be interested in how you define 'MGTOW' ideology, and also where you first came across the idea?
/r/MGTOW207/04/20 07:30 AM
3

MGTOW is the RATIONAL decision to avoid legal entanglements with women based on a cost/benefit analysis of marriage/co-habitation. Men and women have their own advantages and disadvantages in the West. Women should have equal rights to men, including equal opportunity in social, financial and political spheres. They mostly have these now. I would also add equal responsibility and equal accountabiiity. I'd recommend seeing Cassie Jaye's documentary "The Red Pill" to understand where men have disa…
/r/MGTOW207/04/20 07:16 AM
3

God bless you for trying. I agree with you that there are certainly nasty people out there, including within MGTOW. And I also agree with you that it would be good for men and women to be able to talk together. There is no oppressor group and oppressed group, just gender roles that advantage and disadvantage both sexes. It's useful to understand the context in which both sexes live. What I question is discussing MGTOW ideology with the idea that dating can suck for women too (which it certainly …
/r/MGTOW206/04/20 08:04 AM
1

This, it seems to me, should be the watchword of MGTOW. I serve no man. I do not owe anybody anything unless I have consented to the obligation. This means value for value, tit-for-tat. You owe people a hell of a lot. Your family, your friends, the people who have built this society, those who keep things going, esp first responders. You owe them now more than ever. What you don't owe people is marriage/co-habitation.
/r/MGTOW206/04/20 07:34 AM
5

Thanks for the respectful post, moneyinthemiddle. Out of interest, what kind of responses do you get when you go onto feminist boards and tell them that men have it rough too, and that the problems that women talk about are pretty relevant to men as well, so men can relate to them? Does it result in useful discussion and dialogue?
/r/MGTOW206/04/20 12:02 AM
1

That's more of a ceiling than a wall: a man's maximum earning potential. Like a woman's wall, it is really only relevant for calculating SMV. Ideally a MGTOW is out of that market.
/r/MGTOW204/04/20 09:10 PM
3

Is the Twin Cities a coronavirus hot spot? How many people there have tested positive?
/r/MGTOW204/04/20 04:42 AM
3

Numbers are doubling every 2 to 3 days. Numbers are still low, except in hot spots. Currently all hospitals aren't being over-run, except those in those hot spots. I'd like to see reports of hospitals in the hot-spots, not in areas where numbers are currently low. Let's look again in 2 weeks, when numbers will have increased by a factor of 20 (though hopefully social isolation practices may lower that number).
/r/MGTOW204/04/20 04:39 AM
2

I speak all the truths that I believe You complain about your mother's use of "emotional manipulation". You are right, manipulation is the wrong thing to do. Why talk about fake suicide attempts, then? Who are you? What truths do you want to communicate with your mother so that she understands who you are? I can out-smart and out-debate almost anyone my age on them. It isn't about out-smarting and out-debating anyone. Being true to yourself and others is about personal integrity. No tricks, no m…
/r/MGTOW204/04/20 04:13 AM
3

Heck, please work to make sure that YOU don't end up like you. Life will get better once you hit 18 and you get some degree of independence. I know that isn't much comfort now, but just know that it is true. In the meantime: no fake suicide attempts, please. Be true to others and to yourself. Speak the truth as much as you can. This will take all your strength to do, so it is a challenge. It will get you a lot of sh*t in the short term, but in the long run it is best for yourself. Best wishes, b…
/r/MGTOW203/04/20 10:01 PM
6

What a horrible quote. Sounds like a waste of mental energy, much less spit. Far better to not worry about the power of women, and go your own way.
/r/MGTOW203/04/20 10:49 AM
5

I don't see any thumb-hitting there. Sounds like he validated the rationale behind MGTOW (sometimes it's good to be reminded), and had a little bit of fun along the way.
/r/MGTOW203/04/20 08:43 AM
11

If you continually hit your hand with a hammer while hammering down nails, what do you do to minimize the pain? Answer: either drop the hammer, or learn to hammer in a better way. The first way is MGTOW, the second is PUA. You might find more suitable responses on a PUA board.
/r/MGTOW202/04/20 12:43 AM
6

Look after the three healths: good physical health, good mental health and good financial health. In the end, these all affect your finances. Also, distinguish in your own mind between what you need vs what you want.
/r/MGTOW231/03/20 01:51 AM
8

Well said. "A dull routine that I indulged because it was all I knew." I wonder how many men chase after women for that reason: that's the only thing around for them. They have nothing else in their life to do. MGTOW is what happens when you are no longer interested in that game.
/r/MGTOW230/03/20 03:44 AM
2

You know about MGTOW, so that puts you ahead of 90% of other men! It's a real ego boost to be desired by a hot woman, no doubt about it. We are moths attracted to the burning lamp. We know the lamp will burn us, but we still want to go into the flame. Like everything, you need to weigh up the potential costs and the potential benefits. You know the costs, you know the benefits. The hard part is doing what is best for you, and not what you want. Best of luck to you, brother.
/r/MGTOW229/03/20 09:05 PM
1

There are so many weird ideas out there, that is, weird when you first encounter them. Some of them turn out to be true. MGTOW is one of them. The claimed benefits of Nofap seem over-the-top, but who knows? I wouldn't rule it out, but I'd like to see the evidence to support it beyond the anecdotal. Does anyone know of any scientific research on the topic?
/r/MGTOW229/03/20 09:01 PM
1

I don't even mind the general 'reee i hate women' rhetoric of the board because it gives the men a place to vent It's one thing to vent. If your friend vents, then you let him vent since it can be therapeutic to get it out. But it is another thing to have a lot of others then pile on with their own vents. That isn't healthy. I call it "red pill rabies".
/r/MGTOW226/03/20 05:41 PM
6

lol Reminds me of what Rorschach said in the prison scene in the "Watchmen" movie.
/r/MGTOW225/03/20 11:33 PM
12

80% of men are invisible to most young women, if stats are correct. I think when it comes to the other 20% of men, those particular women do see the difference between the men who want to interact and men who don't. Not even necessarily to date those men; it is the attention they like. "Attention is to women what porn is to men." A desirable man who gives no attention is a challenge. In many ways it is better to be a member of the invisible men... except when you want sex. Unfortunately it is na…
/r/MGTOW225/03/20 11:26 PM
1

Okay. Nice video, thanks for the link. How would you define 'dependence' in this situation? My dentist and optometrist are women. I'm guessing you would not classify that as 'dependence'? I'm 60 years old, I love my mother and I will be devastated when she passes. There is an inter-dependence there, since I provide physical care and she provides some emotional support. Am I going my own way, in your opinion? I'm not really arguing with you, in that I have my own definition of MGTOW which I am ha…
/r/MGTOW225/03/20 01:48 AM
7

No, nothing to do with race. There are MGTOWs of all races, countries and creeds. The commonality is that marriage now seems to be a bad deal for men throughout the world, and nothing to do with race. This question stems from the piles and piles of assumptions I've heard about the MGTOW community. Can I ask where you have read that? Are there any websites or articles in particular where you have seen that information? A lot of people come here expecting MGTOW to be alt-right Trump supporting whi…
/r/MGTOW225/03/20 01:28 AM
1

MGTOW isn't just about being independent of relationships, it's about being independent of all women, and even all people. No, it really isn't. MGTOW is the RATIONAL decision to avoid legal entanglements with women based on a cost/benefit analysis of marriage/co-habitation. You build your world your way. What you are talking about is something different. You can be MGTOW and be independent of people, certainly. But going your own way is about your own choices. If that includes dependence on peop…
/r/MGTOW224/03/20 10:47 PM
8

As a straight male who is MGTOW and has an urge for sex, this is how I cope: I have sex. MGTOW is the RATIONAL decision to avoid legal entanglements with women based on a cost/benefit analysis of marriage/co-habitation. Where does this idea that "MGTOW means not having the urge for sex" come from? Has the definition for MGTOW changed over the last year or so, and I missed it? Perhaps the Great Incel Invasion of MGTOW1 last year has changed what people generally perceive MGTOW to be.
/r/MGTOW223/03/20 11:03 PM
1

in a sense I guess I am not a mgtow... You sound like a MGTOW to me. In what sense do you think you might not be a MGTOW?
/r/MGTOW221/03/20 11:41 PM
7

It's a form of virtue signalling, along with "women are b*tches amirite" type posts (which yours isn't). Why do you think it may not be allowable to have sex and still be MGTOW? Have you come across MGTOWs who actually say that? Just curious.
/r/MGTOW221/03/20 11:37 PM
5

That's a good quote. I think it applies to more than romantic feelings, though. You should love someone or something, because the heart needs to beat to be healthy, even if that risks it being broken. There are a lot of things to love: your family, your friends, your pets. Marriage/cohabitation is a bad deal for men nowadays, so avoid that. Otherwise: love.
/r/MGTOW221/03/20 07:03 AM
85

To have a broken heart, you need to have a heart. To learn from a bad experience, you need to have a brain. You have heart and brains. Best wishes, brother. MGTOW is freedom.
/r/MGTOW221/03/20 01:31 AM
2

Yes, that's what I mean -- perhaps I could have expressed it a little better. Some people think that MGTOW is about men 'sent their own way'. I.e. if they could only get that decent woman, they could get married and be happy! But people are MGTOW because of what happens AFTER they get that decent woman: the chances of dead bedrooms, the unfair divorce and custody laws. Looks like the OP is not planning on getting married, so really my criticism was moot. It's a tricky road to have a family witho…
/r/MGTOW220/03/20 09:13 PM
2

Wow. Any examples of racist MGTOW channels with a lot of subscribers? I'd like to see how they combine racism and MGTOW. From what I've seen, we have all races represented in MGTOW, and there are lots of MGTOW channels by African American Youtube content creators.
/r/MGTOW220/03/20 11:25 AM
2

Peppapig26, welcome to the sub! Out of interest, how do you define MGTOW?
/r/MGTOW220/03/20 02:24 AM
6

MGTOW is about what happens AFTER you get the decent looking woman. I'm sure there are many good decent women out there. There are also many good decent men who divorced those good decent women. You might even be lucky and have a good successful marriage. There are potential costs and potential benefits. Ask men you know for their experiences, especially young men who are dating and marrying women around the target age of the women you are after. Learn from that. In particular, ask young men who…
/r/MGTOW219/03/20 08:11 PM
1

Don't sell yourself short. You're looking into these things and you are only 14. Too many people waste their teenage years. Sounds like you are far ahead of the game! You don't hate women, which is good; and you are aware of many of the issues with women, which is important. Now, go forth into the world young man! Have fun with women (while not lying to women or to yourself, and ALWAYS being wrapped and careful) and build your world your way!
/r/MGTOW219/03/20 03:26 AM
1

Most women are wonderful! I've had some great female friends. There are some you need to be wary about, but that's true of some men as well. MGTOW isn't about hating women. Hating women is unhealthy. But so is being blind to modern day legal issues around marriage and co-habitation. MGTOW is the RATIONAL decision to avoid legal entanglements with women based on a cost/benefit analysis of marriage/co-habitation. You build your world your way.
/r/MGTOW219/03/20 03:11 AM
3

Good post!
/r/MGTOW219/03/20 03:05 AM
2

The phrase "The Red Pill" is used in at least three ways: The Red Pill/Blue Pill metaphor is about preferred fantasy vs harsh reality, as taken from The Matrix movies. The Blue Pill represents believing the idealised narrative provided by society. The Red Pill represents seeing things as they really are. I've seen the metaphor used in articles about politics, economics and of course the manosphere. There is a forum called "The Red Pill" (TRP), which I don't know too much about, but seems to be a…
/r/MGTOW219/03/20 02:54 AM
2

I wish things were different but it is what it is. Life must go on! Now that you don't need to worry about dating, you now have the freedom to do the things that you want to do. That's great! What do you want to do?
/r/MGTOW218/03/20 10:57 AM
2

I just watched the Ray Stevens' classic, so my recommendation for a channel name: "Everything Is Beautiful In Its Own Way" or ""Everyone Is Beautiful In Their Own Way".
/r/MGTOW218/03/20 02:16 AM
1

Good post. Sometimes there are no solutions, just recognition. That's important, too.
/r/MGTOW217/03/20 05:10 AM
2

What is the part of MGTOW that you don't buy into? You don't really describe it in your OP.
/r/MGTOW217/03/20 01:41 AM
-4

Talk to her, support her as much as you can, without compromising your own needs. Help her. She's your mum.
/r/MGTOW216/03/20 10:07 PM
3

Good point. Reminds me in a way of the recent Babylon Bee article: https://babylonbee.com/news/nations-nerds-wake-up-in-utopia-where-everyone-stays-inside-sports-canceled-social-interaction-forbidden "Nation's Nerds Wake Up In Utopia Where Everyone Stays Inside, Sports Are Cancelled, Social Interaction Forbidden"
/r/MGTOW216/03/20 10:02 PM
5

Mgtow will say you are not a mgtow if women dont want you. No, that isn't the defining attribute of MGTOW. Where do you get such an idea from? MGTOW is about what YOU do and think, and not what a woman does or thinks of you. Validation comes from within, not from a woman's approval. MGTOW is the RATIONAL decision to avoid legal entanglements with women based on a cost/benefit analysis of marriage/co-habitation. You build your world your way.
/r/MGTOW216/03/20 09:44 PM
1

I was sent my own way... I didnt remove myself from the dating pool the women I wanted to date removed me. That's not MGTOW. This annoys the heck out of me. It's like saying "I was forced to leave the plantation. Oh no, I'm out of the plantation!" DangZagnut already said it below, but MGTOW is a positive thing. What you are talking about in the OP is not MGTOW. MGTOW is the RATIONAL decision to avoid legal entanglements with women based on a cost/benefit analysis of marriage/co-habitation. You b…
/r/MGTOW216/03/20 09:36 PM
2

As someone said, "Would any guy worry about being short if it wasn't for women?" MGTOW is about finding validation from oneself, and not from the approval of others. Having said that: I hear you, brother. Approval from others, whether from men, women or even pets, is beneficial to one's self-esteem. But approval from one's self is vital. But at the end of the day, I am contented and happy. That is an excellent base to build from! You are ahead of many others. Now, what is your next step? How wil…
/r/MGTOW216/03/20 08:57 PM
2

Well said! I've always said we need to emphasize that MGTOW is pro-individual and not anti-woman.
/r/MGTOW216/03/20 01:20 AM
2

Family is so important. Look after your family and nurture those relationships. Just ensure your own needs aren't compromised in the process. Ideally, what relationship do you want with your mother? What is stopping you from getting to that point at the moment?
/r/MGTOW216/03/20 01:10 AM
1

I don't mean to ramble but my question is am on a self leading road too destruction or should I stay the path. You probably have a better understanding of women and relationships than most. A lot of Chads become MGTOW for that reason. But I don't understand your post: what self-leading road to destruction might you be on? What is the destruction that you think might be at the end of the road (at least from a MGTOW perspective)? Just trying to understand where you are coming from.
/r/MGTOW216/03/20 01:00 AM
1

If it isn't broken, don't fix it. MGTOW is a RATIONAL consideration of the costs as well as the benefits of marriage/cohabitation. If your relationship is giving you the benefits, then good! Keep it going. If you decide to marry or cohabitate, then make sure you understand the costs.
/r/MGTOW214/03/20 09:32 PM
8

MGTOW is the RATIONAL decision to avoid legal entanglements with women based on a cost/benefit analysis of marriage/co-habitation. So what you are doing is not related to MGTOW in any way. Enjoy!
/r/MGTOW214/03/20 10:05 AM
5

Every other guy I know IRL cares about women: sex, relationships, etc. Some men look for their self-validation by receiving the approval of women. Other men look for their self-validation from within themselves. The first group includes incels and PUAs. The second group includes MGTOWs. From that, the conclusion is obvious: MGTOW is freedom.
/r/MGTOW214/03/20 03:31 AM
2

Date, but keep it wrapped. Otherwise, I agree with the others: it's not a MGTOW question. MGTOW is a RATIONAL decision, based on a personal cost/benefit analysis of marriage/co-habitation. Date, don't date, it's up to you.
/r/MGTOW211/03/20 04:08 AM
68

You see a nice cake in a shop's window. What stops you from grabbing the cake and stuffing it into your mouth? Because you have impulses, doesn't mean you have to act on them. I see a good looking woman and I desire her. What's wrong with that? MGTOW isn't about no longer desiring women. MGTOW is the RATIONAL decision of avoiding legal entanglements with women based on a cost/benefit analysis of marriage/co-habitation.
/r/MGTOW210/03/20 10:46 PM
11

There are quite a few female Youtubers who have made clips saying they understand why men are walking away from legal relationships with women.
/r/MGTOW210/03/20 08:54 PM
31

Please be careful walking a dog with the lead dragging on the ground. It is the equivalent of walking around with your shoelaces undone -- potentially dangerous.
/r/MGTOW210/03/20 12:46 PM
3

"If it wasn't for women, no guy would be concerned about his height."
/r/MGTOW210/03/20 02:42 AM
6

I'm sorry to hear that, brother. I hope you get better soon. Best wishes.
/r/MGTOW210/03/20 12:43 AM
2

Yes, that was my experience. I'd been MGTOW for quite a few years before I first heard the term. I thought, "I'm home."
/r/MGTOW208/03/20 10:40 PM
1

My answers: Personally, if you are a gay man who isn't concerned about marriage with a woman, then you aren't MGTOW. But it's a definition thing, not an exclusion thing. Please don't worry about it. You are my brother. No political leaning. If MGTOW did require a political leaning, either left or right, I'd get out of here. (I'm centre-left myself). If marriage proved itself to be beneficial to me, then of course I'd get married. I'd be crazy not to. But with marriage/co-habitation laws the way …
/r/MGTOW208/03/20 10:14 PM
2

Have you heard that from men living in Brazil and Thailand? Because often you hear about countries where marriage is still 'safe', but then someone from that country pops up and says differently.
/r/MGTOW208/03/20 10:04 PM
17

I am a 5ft 5 inches guy and I was constantly compared by girls when I was in my early to be short As someone once noted: "if it wasn't for women, would guys generally worry about being short?" MGTOW is freedom!
/r/MGTOW208/03/20 10:00 PM
6

I've had wonderful friendships with women, and hope I have many more. Then again, I'm 60 and have absolutely no interest in a sexual relationship, which makes things easier. However, this -- I am tempted to start a friendship with her, but then I am second guessing this. Kind of like when I quit alcohol and almost walked in the liquor store... Yeah, I hear you. That does sound like a problem if you feel like that. Are you REALLY talking about 'friendship' there with your friend? Is 'friendship' …
/r/MGTOW208/03/20 09:56 PM
6

MGTOW seemed like a joke to me when I first heard about it. I'm interested in what people hear about MGTOW, before actually looking at what MGTOW people are saying. What did you hear about MGTOW that made you think it was a joke, and where did you hear it?
/r/MGTOW208/03/20 08:32 AM
1

Best wishes, brother. Good for you to do what you need to do to get better.
/r/MGTOW207/03/20 09:59 PM
2

"Patriarchy" is "rule by fathers". It died out a hundred years ago or more in the West. Nowadays it just means "men in the top positions of government, business and society." There are reasons for that, but one reason is not a conspiracy to keep it in place. Women should be given equal opportunity to those positions, and as far as I can see, they do (mostly) have those opportunities. But this has nothing to do with MGTOW. MGTOW ideas have been around since time immemorial.
/r/MGTOW207/03/20 09:53 PM
3

Yes, I was going to say that also. The gut biome apparently affects hormones, moods and even things like depression. If you are feeling down one day, feel okay the next, and nothing has changed in between: it might be a sign of nutrition deficiency.
/r/MGTOW207/03/20 09:47 PM
2

Again, I don't care if eight million women put a price tag on themselves....as long as they don't have exclusive rights to talking about it. Are you saying that you want the right to talk about it also? What do you want the right to say? I just don't see this as something a MGTOW should consider to be an issue. Women put a price on themselves because they CAN put a price on themselves. Society gives them that privilege. Good luck to them. Personally I think it best to shrug your shoulders and no…
/r/MGTOW207/03/20 09:42 PM
3

I love my mother. I'd die for her. But I am MGTOW, so I will never ever ever marry her.
/r/MGTOW205/03/20 09:06 PM
8

What was that like, working in a 100% female working environment? Was the inter-company relationships between women as bad as they say? What would you say was the main differences from a mostly male working environment?
/r/MGTOW205/03/20 04:30 AM
3

My red pill lense isn’t shut off though, I set rules on her, leave her when she acts up and I never allow her to talk back. She’s shown me many times she has that crazy side though, cutting herself and threatening suicide every time I want to leave her. How would you advise a good friend who told you he wanted to move in with a girl-friend who has a crazy side, cutting herself and threatening suicide every time he tried to leave her? It is a HUGE red flag. Split with her. Right now. Because thin…
/r/MGTOW205/03/20 02:52 AM
5

No, I'd say you're not MGTOW. MGTOW is a RATIONAL decision, based on a personal cost/benefit analysis of marriage/co-habitation. If, you yourself, RATIONALLY conclude that the benefits (family, children) outweigh the costs, then you aren't MGTOW. But, so what? That's perfectly fine. I have my needs, you have yours. You do you. You and I are red-pilled, we probably agree on nearly everything else, and I call you my brother.
/r/MGTOW205/03/20 02:41 AM
5

MGTOW is (or should be) a RATIONAL decision, and nothing to do with emotion. It is a cost/benefit analysis on the value of marriage/co-habitation, which results in deciding that there are more costs than benefits to those things. Part of that rational decision include evaluating stats around divorce, knowledge of hypergamy, personal experience and anecdotal evidence from male peers and their families. That MAY result in hatred of women generally, I suppose, for those still yearning for a blue-pi…
/r/MGTOW204/03/20 08:04 AM
26

Did she frame it as "an accident"? I've read so many stories by women on various relationship subs on how they 'accidentally' got drunk and had a ONS; or 'accidentally' fell into an affair with someone at work; or 'accidentally' cheated with an ex. Some women (and men) are just 'accidents' waiting to happen.
/r/MGTOW204/03/20 07:39 AM
5

I've never lived off the grid. I don't think it is for me, personally, though I must admit it might be a good thing to try for a year or two. Like being MGTOW, treat it as a cost/benefit analysis exercise. I think it will depend on what benefit you get personally out of either, and what cost you are willing to pay for those benefits. Which provides the benefits that you are looking for the most? Is there anyway you can combine them both? Somehow get the best of both worlds?
/r/MGTOW201/03/20 07:30 PM
10

I've seen the "MGTOWs are kings!" crap pop up on MGTOW1 and Youtube comments. It's reverse virtue-signalling, which is just virtue-signalling; just like reverse discrimination is still discrimination. MGTOW is a rational decision, based on cost/benefit analysis of marriage and cohabitation. "We are kings" is far away from that.
/r/MGTOW201/03/20 10:29 AM
53

Can we get rid of this 'Kings' crap on this sub, please? How do you feel when you read some women want to be called 'Queens'? Let's just call ourselves 'Men', and make that mean something.
/r/MGTOW201/03/20 05:14 AM
2

Please read the Sub-reddit Rules on the side of the main page, esp the first line.
/r/MGTOW228/02/20 08:36 PM
2

MGTOW has nothing to do with politics. There are no laws or political positions that impact men who are already going their own way, as far as I know (not counting those positions that impact everybody, e.g. economic situation). If I am wrong, I'd be interested to know.
/r/MGTOW228/02/20 07:56 PM
3

I'm not a Christian myself, but remember the Bible does say: Proverbs 21:9 Better to live on a corner of the roof than share a house with a quarrelsome wife. Proverbs 21:19 Better to live in the desert than with a contentious and ill-tempered wife. Proverbs 25:24 It is better to dwell in the corner of the housetop, than with a brawling woman and in a wide house. Pretty much the same thing, three times; so that the readers get the message!
/r/MGTOW227/02/20 09:05 PM
12

Yep, I can confirm this. MGTOW is freedom for a lot of reasons. That is one of them.
/r/MGTOW226/02/20 06:58 PM
4

Thank you! I really appreciate the hard work you've put into this sub.
/r/MGTOW226/02/20 02:16 AM
5

You're 16. I'd recommend: date. You are MGTOW, so you have a good idea of some of the issues around dating. So: date, carefully. Don't lie to women, don't lie to yourself, keep away from alcohol and drugs (esp when in groups that include women), work on your own needs. Good luck!
/r/MGTOW226/02/20 02:07 AM
3

^ This. We need to have a clear definition of "MGTOW" for MGTOW2, so these irritating threads stop getting created.
/r/MGTOW225/02/20 10:32 PM
2

I understand the frustration of not pulling the hottest women. MGTOW is about what happens AFTER you pull the hottest woman. We really need to have a clear definition of "MGTOW" for MGTOW2, so these types of threads stop getting created.
/r/MGTOW225/02/20 10:01 PM
2

Marry her. The attraction will stop.
/r/MGTOW225/02/20 12:43 AM
3

Don't give any response. Walk away. "The best revenge is living well."
/r/MGTOW225/02/20 12:35 AM
1

No, I don't. But please don't confuse "disposable" with "treated well". No doubt you've heard "women and children first". To women, the movie 'Titanic' is a romance; to men, it is a horror movie. The origin of the saying comes from the idea that women need to be protected, because they are the gender that gives birth. You've probably seen the stats comparing deaths in war, in the workplace, via suicide, for both genders. Perhaps you've heard that "women have always been the primary victims of wa…
/r/MGTOW224/02/20 09:40 PM
1

Do you mind if I ask: what is "full MGTOW"? What part of MGTOW are you doing, and what are you not doing at the moment?
/r/MGTOW224/02/20 08:48 AM
1

I hear you, I've been there. It's a horrible feeling. Still, what did you think was going to happen when going out with a Chad and three attractive females? Think of it this way: you have nothing to lose. Enjoy yourself as best as you can. Pick one of the girls and start nodding and winking at her. Bad situations are the best ones for growth. Bad situations are GOOD: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IdTMDpizis8
/r/MGTOW223/02/20 09:06 PM
6

Is MGTOW anti marriage? MGTOW is pro-men. Men have historically been seen as disposable. In the modern West, that means that rules and norms around legal relationships between men and women have shifted so that marriage is no longer a good deal for men. Subject to a cost/benefit analysis, the only winning move is not to play. So, MGTOW is 'anti-marriage' in the sense that MGTOWs have come to the conclusion that marriage is an unnecessary risk with limited benefits. Personally however, if a man u…
/r/MGTOW223/02/20 08:52 PM
2

But this entire theory can be reduced more. It’s not simply the female, it’s the person who has more value in general. That is an excellent insight! Great post.
/r/MGTOW223/02/20 07:46 PM
3

MGTOW is no marriage, no cohabitation, work on yourself. It is not about believing all relationships are bad. It is about avoiding the problems of legal entanglements that men have gradually come to face with relationships nowadays. It is against the idea that "I love you so much, I want to get the government involved in our relationship." We need a clear definition of "MGTOW" on MGTOW2 so that these types of questions stop popping up.
/r/MGTOW222/02/20 06:19 PM
4

By "marriage", do you mean "successful marriage" or "unsuccessful marriage"? A study of lucky and successful gamblers shows there are benefits to gambling. There are potential benefits to marriage, and there are potential costs. You need to weigh up the potential costs and the potential benefits, and then make a decision based on that.
/r/MGTOW222/02/20 06:11 PM
4

Speaking as an old curmudgeon: I don't know why you'd want to play these kinds of stupid games. Seriously: who cares. Why not just try to have a good time? Nothing better for the ego than charming a woman on a date, if that's what you want to do. MGTOW: no marriage, no cohabitation, work on yourselves. No stupid games, no stupid prizes.
/r/MGTOW222/02/20 05:58 PM
9

Great comment! The issue you have raised here has exercised the best minds for 3000 years. How do we know what to believe? I personally think this: we start from the idea that most people are good, and most people are honest. Not completely good and not completely honest, but good and honest enough. From that, the narratives that we are told generally tend towards truth. That may sound strange coming from a MGTOW, since Western men and women are feed a blue-pill narrative that no longer fits the…
/r/MGTOW222/02/20 09:16 AM
3

This is a well-written examination of self that I can well identify with, especially in my 20s and 30s. I'd like to say that this will stop bothering you as you get older, but it won't. It will never disappear. However, it will get easier. In my mid-50s I attended a class that had an attractive, friendly and intelligent woman in her mid-30s. She was married and I was MGTOW without knowing the label, so there was no chance nor interest in romance from either side. But I felt a fascination for her…
/r/MGTOW222/02/20 06:52 AM
4

A reminder: MGTOW is "no marriage, no cohabitation". It is not "stay away from women". We need a clear definition of "MGTOW" on r/MGTOW2 that, well, makes it clear.
/r/MGTOW222/02/20 12:24 AM
1

I've recently starting doing Intermittent Fasting. I've lost 20 kgs over the last year, and at age 60, I'm now fitter than I've been for years. IF explains why people are so fat nowadays. Some blame 'the Western diet', but we are really eating the same foods that we were 50 years ago. The difference (according to IF) is that in the past, people would eat three meals a day, with no eating in between. This gave their livers time to process the sugars. Then people started to snack all the time, and…
/r/MGTOW221/02/20 12:54 AM
1

But how do you guys deal with the idea of having no one close in your time of vulnerability & final memories in this life? Why are you going to have no-one close at that time? Are you planning to not have any friends?
/r/MGTOW221/02/20 12:40 AM
5

I never liked beet root. Then someone recommended chopping up the root AND the green leaves (important to add the beet green!) and frying them in olive oil, with some onion and fresh garlic (I also add fresh ginger). Add some tuna or chicken. Unbelievably good AND healthy!
/r/MGTOW220/02/20 03:26 AM
3

Once you remove the emotion element from relationships with women, you get to see them as they really are. It makes it possible to have real friendships with women on your own terms, and to ignore those who waste your time. It is a good thing.
/r/MGTOW219/02/20 02:01 AM
2

For example, when Knotsy Germany invaded France in 1940, some Frenchwomen slept with German soldiers and even had long-term relations with them... What do you think? I'd doubt I'm alone in seeing this is a betrayal. I'm sorry, but that is a ridiculously unsympathetic view of how people behave in times of war. Women are just people too, trying to get by as best they can. How many men on this board, starving and with starving children to support, would drop their pants and bend over to an invading…
/r/MGTOW218/02/20 10:47 PM
3

Well said! This truth needs to be propagated more on MGTOW boards.
/r/MGTOW218/02/20 10:40 PM
2

How do I stop obsessing over romance? It's an addiction, just like any other addiction. Like the gambler who knows gambling isn't a justified risk, but... maybe... maybe he can JUST MAKE THAT ONE BIG WIN. Alcoholics who have given up the drink call themselves "recovering alcoholics" for a reason. You're a recovering romantic. Unfortunately you'll just have to learn to deal with it day by day. And there will be days when you think that maybe... maybe... you can find JUST THAT ONE TRUE LOVE.
/r/MGTOW218/02/20 10:35 PM
33

How do you define MGTOW? How do they define MGTOW? That's the source of a lot of miscommunication.
/r/MGTOW218/02/20 07:09 AM
2

Climate change is real. Google global temperature trend charts for the last 50 years, and it is obvious. That is the clear starting point for further conversations.
/r/MGTOW217/02/20 09:34 PM
1

Just goes to show women will always have double standards & are never as innocent as they may seem. No, that's not true. There are perfectly good women out there. It's just that you won't know which ones they are until after a life-time has passed. If you are a gambler, get married. MGTOW is a rational choice.
/r/MGTOW217/02/20 06:05 AM
6

What happened that made you officially decide to go MGTOW About five years ago I came across the term "MGTOW" and realised that it described what I'd been thinking for the last few decades. What specific thing would have to happen for you to change your mind If the label "MGTOW" starts meaning something else other than what it meant when I first encountered the term, then I will no longer officially call myself "MGTOW". I'm about half-way there now, since "MGTOW" seems to now mean something diff…
/r/MGTOW217/02/20 03:23 AM
16

I'm 60 years old, never married, no kids. Good relationships with family is very, very important. Good relationships with friends are very, very important. Being married and having kids is no proof against loneliness. "I want to get married so I won't be lonely" is a terrible reason to get married. I know you know that, I know everyone knows that, but for some reason people seem to ignore that truth. Sometimes marriage itself is the death of friendships and the beginning of loneliness. Whether y…
/r/MGTOW217/02/20 02:09 AM
2

She's got to be able to reflect the amount of love I would give her back to me. Let me make a suggestion: pick a country, and then ask men from that country whether the wives there overwhelmingly reflect the amount of love the husbands gives the wives back to the husbands. Then let us know which country that is. Thank you.
/r/MGTOW216/02/20 11:05 AM
8

So #5 is an actual benefit, driven by men with a family typically needing to earn more to support them. I think it is better described as an apparent benefit. Married men work 20% more and earn 20% more, but as you note, it is driven by having a wife and family. "Married men have a responsibility to work more" and "Single men have the choice to not work so much" might be a better way to phrase it -- which marks the "20% more" as potentially more of a cost than a benefit. There is a scene in the …
/r/MGTOW216/02/20 10:47 AM
1

I'm not a great writer, especially in English since its not my native language, so bear with me. I hate it when a writer says that English isn't their native language... and they write better English than me! :) Anyway: good post!
/r/MGTOW216/02/20 06:52 AM
12

It's like there's supposed to be some reward there but someone removed it from the equation. Actually, people who promote marriage tend to remove the negatives. You can see this in the famous Prager U video promoting marriage for men called "Be a Man. Get married", here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EtvfHnZMcOY It lists the benefits for men on marriage: Married men work 400 hours more a year than single men (so about 20% more) . Married men spend less time with friends and more time with fami…
/r/MGTOW216/02/20 03:43 AM
2

Some things just happen. It is part of your background, don't shy away and don't dwell. I know that doesn't help even though true. Best you leave the past to the past as best you can, and look forward to the future. What are you enthusiastic about at the moment? Is your past hindering you moving forward towards your enthusiasms?
/r/MGTOW216/02/20 03:21 AM
2

I believe they noticed that I have no desire for them. Are you saying that, in your experience, Nofap leads to a lack of desire for women?
/r/MGTOW214/02/20 06:49 AM
2

I understand. :) That's why I'm trying to encourage MGTOW2 to adopt an "official" definition of "MGTOW" for this sub: it would help to stop such confusion, and drive discussion on more positive topics. The question in your OP is a good one, and one I'd like to see discussed further. What does a committed relationship look like from a rational cost/benefit perspective? How can we maximise benefits and minimise costs? While at the end of the day it all comes down to individual preferences, I think…
/r/MGTOW214/02/20 02:31 AM
2

No, it isn't a bad thing at all. Do what is right for you. If that is against what others in the MGTOW community approve, then it doesn't matter. I personally wouldn't call you "MGTOW", but it is just a label. You're in a committed relationship that works for you; that's the important thing. But the reason why MGTOW is against marriage/co-habitation is the legal entanglements that come from that. As long as you are aware of the potential costs, then I can only wish you the best of fortunes.
/r/MGTOW214/02/20 02:28 AM
0

mybackupzbackup, do you mind if I ask what your definition of MGTOW is such that you are asking this? Is it "MGTOW means no committed relationships with women"?
/r/MGTOW213/02/20 10:15 PM
1

Look at it this way: They make a big deal out of getting catcalled and approached in public by YOU. https://www.breitbart.com/the-media/2015/07/20/feminista-who-urged-an-end-to-wolf-whistles-now-moans-shes-too-old-to-get-them/
/r/MGTOW213/02/20 04:31 PM
2

We are not cohabiting. She has her place and I have mine. I don't cohabit because I like my own space. If you are not cohabiting nor getting married, then you are still MGTOW. Ignore what I posted earlier on this thread.
/r/MGTOW213/02/20 04:21 PM
3

Remember, being MGTOW is about avoiding the legal entanglements of marriage/co-habitation. So it sounds like you are still red pilled, but may no longer be MGTOW. But so what? Congratulations and my best wishes to you both! I hope it works for you. MGTOW is a cost/benefit analysis. If you believe that your relationship provides more benefits than costs, you'd be irrational not to pursue it. As long as you are aware of the potential costs, and are happy to accept them, go for it! ** Edited to add…
/r/MGTOW213/02/20 04:19 PM
3

"The best revenge is living well."
/r/MGTOW212/02/20 04:01 AM
13

Women are wonderful! Yes, some women are selfish, but most women are just trying to get by as best they can. It's just that modern society has given them a set of privileges that make marriage and cohabitation costly for men. Time to hit the gym, read more of my philosophy books, and enjoy life. Yep! Focus on the three healths: good physical health, good mental health and good financial health.
/r/MGTOW212/02/20 04:00 AM
2

I know that a large portion of MGTOW's like to shit on the present and encapsulate the past as an idyllic picturesque world Can you provide quotes for this, please? I don't think that is true, from the MGTOW content that I've read. Maybe I've missed something though. From the MGTOW content looking at history that I've seen, it has been about how MGTOW concepts have always been around, starting literally from biblical times.
/r/MGTOW212/02/20 03:47 AM
1

Family is important. I don't know the story of your toxic family, but if you can somehow work out how to interact peaceably with them while maintaining your new identity, I'd strongly recommend putting in the effort to do so.
/r/MGTOW211/02/20 09:43 PM
3

I second intermittent fasting. I've lost 20 kgs. More importantly, learning about how IF works and what it does to the body reframed how I saw my diet, encouraging me to stick to it.
/r/MGTOW211/02/20 09:21 AM
2

Only thing that keeps me going is anger, frustration, and the need to get away from my brother and his pet girlfriend. That's not good. What are you enthusiastic about? What are your passions? Best to focus on those things rather than on the negatives. Good luck!
/r/MGTOW209/02/20 07:26 AM
3

Having read the paper (it's short, only about 12 pages long): The Good: It is a comprehensive study showing how users migrate between subreddits that has interesting conclusions. The Bad: The comparison grouped subs "Health" and "Criticism" as controls are not really good controls. It's like comparing the death rates in hospitals with death rates in parking lots as a control group. Sure, it will show that hospitals are more 'dangerous' than parking lots, but raw stats tell us nothing. A raw figu…
/r/MGTOW209/02/20 04:40 AM
1

The problem isn't trying to find a woman to marry. That is a problem for Incels. The problem is what happens AFTER marrying. How is advice on trying to meet a soul mate relevant to MGTOW, in your opinion? (Serious question)
/r/MGTOW209/02/20 03:56 AM
3

Thanks for sharing, MyFatThumb. You're right, this is an important paper, and we do need to look at the data and the conclusions. To dismiss it as biased out of hand because we don't like what it says is wrong. The trend towards toxicity and radicalisation within MGTOW communities is consistent with many of our own experiences with what has been happening in MGTOW1 over the last couple of years. The whole point of MGTOW2's existence is perhaps confirmation of the study's conclusions about what i…
/r/MGTOW209/02/20 03:08 AM
1

I've seen a lot of posts on this subreddit and on r/MGTOW saying that women are poor leaders and that they need a strong man to guide them. Maybe those posts are wrong? Or paint with too broad a brush? Or something else. But why do MGTOWs need to explain this? What has this to do with MGTOW philosophy? Does the reality of some women being good leaders mean "no marriage no cohabitation" is invalid?
/r/MGTOW208/02/20 09:38 AM
3

It's almost as though women are people, too! /s dragonofthewest1221, women are no more a monolithic group than men are. Why are you surprised?
/r/MGTOW208/02/20 09:32 AM
1

New subbers should read the "SUB-REDDIT RULES for r/MGTOW2" on the side-bar. First line: "No Women-hating, hate, and negativity in general". MGTOW is freedom.
/r/MGTOW208/02/20 04:15 AM
6

Good luck! I wish I had started on those things at your age. I'm 60 now, so better late than never. But better early than later. Remember to invest your money also. Look after the three healths: invest in physical health, invest in mental health and invest in financial health. Get sound advice for all three and then try to follow that advice as much as possible. Life is a gift, and MGTOW is freedom!
/r/MGTOW208/02/20 12:13 AM
3

An incel seeks validation through forming a relationship with a woman. A MGTOW seeks validation from himself.
/r/MGTOW206/02/20 09:57 PM
2

Yes, I see where you are coming from. Good point. After thinking about it, I agree with what you are saying there. I'll update it to reflect that. Thanks for your input!
/r/MGTOW206/02/20 01:43 AM
3

Attributed to Mark Twain: "A man who picks a cat up by the tail learns a lesson he cannot learn any other way."
/r/MGTOW206/02/20 01:34 AM
1

True, but that's in the MGTOW2 sub-reddit rules. I'm only talking about a short definition of MGTOW, so we can point people who come here thinking that we are incels, or white supremacists, or MRAs, or PUAs, etc.
/r/MGTOW205/02/20 09:13 PM
1

I'm only talking about a definition for MGTOW for the MGTOW2 sub. What we talk about is something different. I think the Sub-reddit rules are explicit and well formed for that.
/r/MGTOW205/02/20 09:11 PM
2

Short and sweet! :)
/r/MGTOW205/02/20 09:09 PM
2

I think MGTOW means different things to many men. Yes, of course. Each man will go his own way differently. Any definition of MGTOW should reflect that. But it doesn't mean we shouldn't have a definition in place for MGTOW2. Especially since we are about to get a tsunami of "black-pilled" posters coming here.
/r/MGTOW205/02/20 09:09 PM
1

MGTOW is the philosophy that, contrary to popular belief of society, men have purpose in life outside of being a workhorse or a provider. That men have aspirations, goals, hobbies, etc. in life they wish to actively pursue that are independent of women and/or having sex. I like that!
/r/MGTOW205/02/20 09:06 PM
1

MGTOW is the red pill realization of female nature. To me, that's the wrong way around. MGTOW is about MALE nature, about not being disposable. Sure, part of the that is evaluating your role in a world filled with male-female dynamics. But we are not "men walking away" from women, we are "men going our own way". The definition should reflect that.
/r/MGTOW205/02/20 09:06 PM
1

I can't see a definition for MGTOW, only "Sub-reddit rules". Is there something I'm not seeing?
/r/MGTOW205/02/20 09:03 PM
2

I really dislike the idea to define MGTOW. The basic of MGTOW is to make a risk/benefit and cost/value equation in modern society regarding marriage and relationships. What you have given is in fact a definition. It should be as simple as possible. We do need one, otherwise "MGTOW" is meaningless. But I understand your point: the definition should not tell us HOW to go our own way. That part is up to us.
/r/MGTOW205/02/20 09:01 PM
6

I'll note that the most common definition of MGTOW that I've seen on MGTOW boards is the following: M.G.T.O.W - Men Going Their Own Way is a statement of self-ownership, where the modern man preserves and protects his own sovereignty above all else. It is the manifestation of one word: "No". Ejecting silly preconceptions and cultural definitions of what a "man" is. Looking to no one else for social cues. Refusing to bow, serve and kneel for the opportunity to be treated like a disposable utility…
/r/MGTOW205/02/20 01:18 PM
1

Worrying how something is 'seen' by society/others is pretty much the opposite of going your own way. It's not that your question is bad -- it's a fair question to ask on a sub like TRP -- it just has nothing to do with MGTOW. We really need a definition of MGTOW for MGTOW2 so these types of questions don't come up as though they were MGTOW-related.
/r/MGTOW205/02/20 03:38 AM
1

Now comes the choice. Which is better for staying sane and mgtow? The choice has nothing to do with being MGTOW. In your opinion, what is the connection to MGTOW?
/r/MGTOW205/02/20 02:34 AM
4

I loved the first comment: "To be honest, men are also boring. Most humans are boring. You just never tried dating men."
/r/MGTOW202/02/20 08:47 PM
2

My question is this: what can us women do to support you guys better as you pursue a MGTOW philosophy/lifestyle? I think it is a darn good question, personally. It's one I haven't really thought about, and any question that makes you think in new ways is good. Having thought about it, my own answer is: "Be a good friend." That's all. I don't really see that my MGTOW beliefs really factor into that answer, other than of course friends -- whether male or female, whether MGTOW or non-MGTOW -- provi…
/r/MGTOW201/02/20 05:49 AM
2

A food I'd never thought I'd like, much less eat: beet root and beet greens. Chop up the whole plant -- root, stem and leaf -- fry them in olive oil with garlic, ginger and onion -- they are fantastic! Add in tuna or chicken as required. This is coming from a man who never liked his vegetables. Very healthy and tastes great.
/r/MGTOW231/01/20 10:24 AM
2

We need to have a clear definition of "MGTOW" for MGTOW2. I know there is resistance to the idea since it seems to be restricting how "men should go", but that isn't the purpose of the definition. It is to make a clear statement that "MGTOW" is a positive philosophy about male improvement and not a negative one about "women bad". I get weary of posts saying "I love my mother, can I be MGTOW?" ("Yes, just don't marry her!") or "I can't get a woman so I was 'forced' to go MGTOW." ("You were FORCED…
/r/MGTOW230/01/20 11:44 AM
2

No, it's the wrong thing to do.
/r/MGTOW229/01/20 05:57 PM
2

If this guy truly was MGTOW he would divorce the cheating whore and hope he doesn't get too bad of a judgement in the courts. Why would a true MGTOW get divorced? MGTOW is about rationality, about making a decision based on cost/benefit analysis. Don't get married/co-habitate. If you are already married, then make the best decision for yourself. It may well be that there is less pain in keeping married than in getting divorced. I'm just trying to push back against the idea that MGTOW is a negati…
/r/MGTOW229/01/20 03:27 AM
5

And beyond!
/r/MGTOW228/01/20 03:12 AM
1

No.
/r/MGTOW227/01/20 08:52 PM
6

I don’t even believe that some of the people on MGTOW1 genuinely dislike ALL women either. The sub has become a place to aggressively express frustration in poor partners in the past with the name MGTOW attached to it. I call it "red pill rabies", where someone expresses hyperbolic anger against women, and others support him, actually validating the person's anger. It isn't healthy. MGTOW is a positive statement for individual ownership. "MGTOW is freedom" is so true. That's why I like this sub.…
/r/MGTOW225/01/20 09:34 PM
5

The biggest argument against MGTOW claims all the men on MGTOW attract toxic women because they did not receive any love from their parents. Who actually makes that particular argument? I've never seen it myself. Most criticisms against MGTOW that I've seen is that MGTOWs are incels who pretend to reject women because they can't get one.
/r/MGTOW223/01/20 08:58 AM
22

Maybe he will be one of the lucky ones who have a good marriage and a better life because of that? We won't know for a while. But at least he knew the issues raised by MGTOW going in, so he knows the risks. Good luck to him.
/r/MGTOW222/01/20 06:08 AM
2

Men ONLY want to help/give resources to other men they really know and trust. That's not true. Generally speaking, both men and women like to volunteer time and resources to help the community. That's because they are human beings. The difference is generally how they do it. The old saying is: "Women work face-to-face, men work shoulder-to-shoulder." Women offer support generally to the community by providing emotional help. Men offer support generally by making/building things. Both approaches …
/r/MGTOW222/01/20 05:10 AM
10

I think we need to acknowledge that there are men who will get married and have a happier life than if they stayed single. Just as if you sold your house, went to a casino and put your money on red, you might double your money. It's possible. MGTOW is about making a cost/benefit decision, not just about getting marred but about living your life. It is about rationality. If it is important to you to have a child and build a loving family, and understand the risks, then go for it. The blue pill na…
/r/MGTOW220/01/20 08:42 AM
2

"Pump and dump" or "just go monk"? How about the best of both worlds: Pump and dump monks! Personally I prefer monk mode, while recognising I'm still a healthy male who needs intimacy occasionally. I'd never "pump and dump" through deception though, i.e. promising a LTR while knowing that's not what I'll provide. Any kind of deceit diminishes a person. So it would have to be a one night stand or FWB situation, understood by both parties.
/r/MGTOW219/01/20 07:13 PM
1

No, it really shouldn't. MGTOW is freedom. MGTOW is a positive statement for the modern man. Yes, rejecting legal entanglements with women is part of that, but it is based on a cost/benefit analysis. MGTOW is about using your head, not your emotions. A song about how a guy hates his woman and hates "the books she reads and all her friends" might make for a good incel theme song, but not for a good MGTOW one. A good MGTOW song would say "I'm free to read whatever books I want and make whatever fr…
/r/MGTOW216/01/20 09:30 AM
1

No they're not. People are generally good, trying to get by as best as they can. True, many people tend to be reactive to the things that immediately affect them; but that doesn't make them bad, just human. People are good.
/r/MGTOW215/01/20 02:52 AM
3

It always annoys the living fuck out of me how people seem to be well-being on playing the association that men going their own way are doing so because they dont like women, cant get laid, or must be closeted gays. It's because there is no clearly-defined definition of MGTOW on r/MGTOW2. We need one! So that we can point new posters to that when they make assumptions that MGTOW is an emotional reaction to women rather than a cost/benefit analysis of marriage and co-habitation and a positive sta…
/r/MGTOW212/01/20 06:10 PM
3

Good point.
/r/MGTOW212/01/20 08:11 AM
2

Good comment. I suppose it boils down to: be a good role model. If you have children, be a good role model. If you don't have children, be a good role model. But that's true regardless of whether you are a MGTOW or not.
/r/MGTOW212/01/20 08:11 AM
11

I think that most men feel like that, even MGTOWs. I know that I did. It's part biology, part social conditioning. I don't know how to overcome it. I have overcome it, but for me it came with age. I'm no longer expecting anything, so I don't feel jealous of what others have. But that isn't a viable solution for young folks. All I can say is to struggle through it one day at a time, one event at a time. Just remember there are heaps of people -- even the most outwardly confident -- who struggle w…
/r/MGTOW212/01/20 08:00 AM
54

Opting out of marriage/co-habitation is the right thing for me. Whether it has an impact on society or not isn't the reason for MGTOW. MGTOW -- as I understand it -- isn't about trying to change society. It is doing a cost/benefit analysis on how to live the best life.
/r/MGTOW212/01/20 12:40 AM
33

One of the earliest proponents was the Buddha, when he said: "Stuff it, I'm going monk mode."
/r/MGTOW211/01/20 04:03 AM
1

You cant possibly be away from women and actually go your own way. How could you still fap to porn? MGTOW is not 'being away from women', but a realisation that a cost/benefit analysis of marriage/co-habitation shows that marriage/co-habitation is a bad deal for men. I don't think you have an accurate view of what MGTOW is. Not your fault; we need a big font definition put on this page somewhere to stop posts like these. I've seen studies suggest that regular masturbation is good for your prosta…
/r/MGTOW209/01/20 04:49 PM
2

Can you explain how you came (no pun intended) to the conclusion that if you're not on Nofap you're not a real MGTOW? I'd be interested in the reasoning behind that. Any statistics or scientific research behind your conclusion?
/r/MGTOW209/01/20 11:42 AM
1

Does studying philosophy help you with any of your personal problems? Just interested. You eat well, train hard and have fun with family members. That's better than most of us, I guess! That part sounds like you are on the right track at least in part of your life. Best wishes on the rest.
/r/MGTOW208/01/20 02:09 AM
5

How to best go about dealing with sexual desires? Have sex. Carefully. What do you do when you are hungry? Stuff your face with sugary foods, or carefully choose what you eat? The best way to deal with sex urges is to have sex, while understanding the risks and working to minimise them.
/r/MGTOW208/01/20 01:57 AM
1

What are reasons to NOT be MGTOW? What is the other side of that ledger? We need both sides in order to make an informed decision.
/r/MGTOW208/01/20 01:54 AM
6

Reverse these types of sayings for added insight: You don't know that you're done until you've chosen right.
/r/MGTOW207/01/20 01:40 AM
2

You might find you are banned from posting on some subreddits if you have also posted on MGTOW. Also, some reddits have rules that state "No MGTOW content".
/r/MGTOW203/01/20 10:28 AM
12

First: Don't drink and post! After 2 drinks, put that keyboard down! Second: If you are a healthy hetero male, you are going to want female companionship. It's normal. What you do about that is up to you. (Remember that there's no biological urge to marry or cohabitate) Third: Loathing yourself for not having a female partner is NOT normal. That's something you need to address. How would you respond if a single male friend or relative said to you that they loathed themselves for not having a fem…
/r/MGTOW201/01/20 10:32 AM
1

Men going their own way is probably the best education a woman can get on interacting with men. Men going their own way is definitely the best education a man can get on interacting with women.
/r/MGTOW201/01/20 12:50 AM
1

They effectively aren't GOING anywhere so they aren't mgtow, they're just the aggrieved. Nicely put! I agree! But still... so what? Once you've identified someone as being in the default class, what happens then? I'm assuming that you are in the rarer class with the high standards. I'd be interested to hear more about those standards. Can you talk a little about what you are doing in that space personally as a MGTOW?
/r/MGTOW229/12/19 05:01 AM
2

First of all, what really is “the truth”? Well... there is none. When people say they’ve realized the truth, what they mean is that they’ve finally found what makes them happy, and this is completely different for everyone. No, taking the red-pill means facing reality, so by definition it means you believe you have found the truth. I've seen the term used in politics and economics as well. It's not "what makes you happy." The truth sets you free; it doesn't necessarily make you happy. MGTOW is f…
/r/MGTOW229/12/19 04:52 AM
1

Sure, something simple is best. But it isn't defined that way on this board. It isn't defined at all. That's why we get posts like the OP: "I want to be MGTOW but I like dating women!" As though 'dating women' is somehow NOT being MGTOW. Even worse are those people who think that men are FORCED to go MGTOW because they can't get a woman, as though there is that overlap between incels and MGTOWs. We can avoid those kinds of posts by having a clear definition of MGTOW on the sidebar or in a FAQ, w…
/r/MGTOW228/12/19 12:29 AM
2

I don’t know if it’s just a vocal minority of guys fooling me, but at times it sounds more like guys that have been essentially been bottle necked into mgtow for lack of better options and are carrying bitterness and resentment towards women... Unfortunately that is how MGTOW is now viewed, so these kinds of "don't be an incel!" posts will continue to pop up. We need to have "MGTOW" clearly defined on r/MGTOW2, so people stop thinking that MGTOW is just incel-lite and is some kind of "movement" …
/r/MGTOW227/12/19 07:48 PM
1

Well written, and I agree with the sentiment of what you wrote. However: might I suggest that you are still partly on the plantation, in the sense that you are concerned with what people there think about you? Or at least, you are outside the plantation but still tethered to it. That final step into MGTOW is not worrying about how society views you, not worrying about how women view you, etc. MGTOW is freedom!
/r/MGTOW225/12/19 05:55 PM
3

Sorry, I mean 'you' in a general sense there, not you personally. I strongly believe that 'MGTOW is freedom' precisely because it is a positive force emphasising that men have value beyond what we bring to the table as 'stay-at-work fathers'. It isn't just a rejection of women. Simple rejection of women by itself is not MGTOW in my opinion.
/r/MGTOW224/12/19 11:14 AM
14

I think MGTOW is a single philosophy. We need to have a definition for MGTOW on this sub, in my view, so that these kinds of issues don't keep coming up. Or when they do, we have somewhere to point people. My personal definition of MGTOW is this: There are two planks to MGTOW: Men are treated as disposable by society, but we are not. We should strive for self-actualization. Men should look after the 'three healths': good physical health, good mental health and good financial health. As part of t…
/r/MGTOW224/12/19 01:05 AM
7

You might find r/MensRights more suitable for what you are looking for. Lots of women post on that site.
/r/MGTOW219/12/19 10:45 AM
4

I'm sympathetic to women on this point. Many have been taught to fear that if they smile at a man, they are encouraging men to hit on them. Thus it is easier and safer for them to not smile. Imagine if you lived with that expectation -- that you (as a man) were encouraging men -- big burly ugly men! -- to hit on you if you smiled at them. How would that affect your interactions with strangers? It's a sad state of affairs. As the OP notes, most men just don't live with the concept 'A woman smiled…
/r/MGTOW218/12/19 01:54 AM
1

Can a man still be MGTOW and interested in sexual contact with women? Oh, c'mon. We really need an FAQ to define what MGTOW is and is not, at least from an r/MGTOW2 perspective. Can we please get something put in the sidebar, either a definition or link to an FAQ? Basic questions like these should be pointed there.
/r/MGTOW218/12/19 01:35 AM
3

How can I stay strong and stop trying to get in a relationship with a woman? If reading this subreddit doesn't work, then as a last resort: Get into a relationship with a woman and marry her. "A man who tries to pick up a cat by the tail learns a lesson he cannot learn any other way." (Attributed to Mark Twain)
/r/MGTOW215/12/19 03:13 AM
2

It just shows you are a good man. But there is a difference between helping someone, and propping someone up. It's the difference between "giving a hand up" and "giving a hand out". Are you stopping her own development by your actions? I'd set boundaries, give her responsibilities that are reasonable, and take it from there.
/r/MGTOW214/12/19 09:52 PM
1

MGTOW isn't a movement. Whether you stand behind MGTOW or not is irrelevent to whether you agree with its concepts or not. Even if most MGTOWs are jerks, does that make the costs of marriage disappear? I think the problem is that there is no firm 'official' definition of MGTOW, and there should be. There should be one for r/MGTOW, and there should be one for r/MGTOW2. The info in the sidebar distinguishes r/MGTOW from r/MGTOW2, which is great. But there is no definition of what MGTOW is. So thos…
/r/MGTOW214/12/19 11:22 AM
2

I'm 60, never married, no kids. I have no problems with that. When I was in my 30s, I wanted to get married and have kids, but it was more because that was expected rather than a deep desire for either. I could have easily got married at that time; it's more dumb luck that I avoided it. What a disaster it would have been with some of the women I had long-term relationships with! OTOH, if I had found that hypothetical 'soul mate' I would have wanted kids, and sometimes I wonder what my life would…
/r/MGTOW213/12/19 02:47 AM
2

how can I left behind that instinct of attraction for women and not fail in the attempt? You can't, if you have a normal healthy libido. But what you can do is realise that biology is not destiny, that males are not disposable, and that you are free to live life on your own terms. You don't have to get married and you don't have to cohabitate, despite everyone telling you that you must. Take that as your starting point, and go your own way from there. MGTOW is freedom.
/r/MGTOW213/12/19 02:18 AM
7

I'm in Australia, but I keep hearing about the homeless problem in California, with tents of the homeless filling some streets and human poop and needles everywhere. Is that true? Or is it overblown? I hear lots of people are fleeing California for inland states because of this.
/r/MGTOW210/12/19 02:42 AM
3

Won’t that just kind of breed more weakness with all the comfort of consistent sex? Will pretty much suck the ambition out of a lot of men. If a man loses his ambition because of the availability of consistent sex, then I'd say "Good. Time to grow up." MGTOW is exactly that: a positive message for men about going their own way that is NOT about focusing on women and sex. In other words: being an adult.
/r/MGTOW203/12/19 10:16 PM
5

Also how people treat waiters and waitresses.
/r/MGTOW230/11/19 07:42 AM
4

I second intermittent fasting!
/r/MGTOW229/11/19 01:45 AM
2

Neither question has anything to do with MGTOW. What do YOU think about virgin and prude shaming of males, or men being accused of being on "the DL" or "closeted gay"?
/r/MGTOW228/11/19 02:35 AM
1

"Women fail. MGTOW least impacted" Sounds good and healthy!
/r/MGTOW227/11/19 08:51 PM
3

Men have it worse if they still stick to the blue-pill. MGTOW is freedom.
/r/MGTOW227/11/19 08:48 PM
2

r/OMAD. Lots of tips on fasting. I'm trying to follow something along those lines at the moment, and I've lost a few kilos.
/r/MGTOW227/11/19 07:27 AM
2

MGTOW is about applying costs/benefits to decisions. What are the costs of having sex? What are the benefits of not having sex? What would you do if you got a woman pregnant? What is the best way of avoiding that situation? Something to think about!
/r/MGTOW227/11/19 02:47 AM
2

Red pill: "They live" with sunglasses Blue pill: "They live" without sunglasses Purple pill: "They live" with sunglasses for some things Black pill: ?
/r/MGTOW226/11/19 12:00 AM
2

And beta cuck white knights are blue pulled. I think that is a typo? You meant: And beta cuck white knights have blue balls.
/r/MGTOW225/11/19 11:53 PM
2

MGTOW is something used by, mostly, low value males or sexually undesirable ones in order to convince themselves that they're winning by not attracting female attention/not having sex. There probably are people who declare themselves as 'MGTOW' for that reason. But that isn't how MGTOW is defined, and from the content I've read and seen that doesn't seem to reflect the vast majority of MGTOW posters.
/r/MGTOW225/11/19 09:53 PM
1

We've evolved to connect and rely on one another. The idea of making yourself an island, depending on no one else, sounds good in theory (I loved Clint Eastwood) but it's just not natural in my opinion. I personally don't see 'making yourself an island' as some fundamental part of MGTOW. Certainly some MGTOWs want to live off the grid, and good luck to them. However, I agree we've evolved to connect to others and rely on one another. Have friends, be a part of the community. I think men thrive b…
/r/MGTOW222/11/19 08:50 AM
1

"Failure? Good." Motivational speech (2 min 20 secs): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IdTMDpizis8 Alternatively, watch the first series of "Cobra Kai".
/r/MGTOW222/11/19 04:34 AM
1

Look at OMAD (one meal a day) and Intermittent Fasting. It's helped me to lose weight.
/r/MGTOW220/11/19 01:47 AM
2

To be honest, I'm a mere zoomer... OK, zoomer. (Sorry, couldn't resist! :) ) I agree with what you said: "it just feels really satisfying to give yourself an enemy and immerse yourself in an echo chamber." That's r/MGTOW unfortunately. It's more about hating a group, painting them as an enemy, rather than self-improvement.
/r/MGTOW220/11/19 01:40 AM
2

1 mile... 10miles... whats the diffrence? Improvement is what matters, brother. Cheers Exactly! Well said.
/r/MGTOW220/11/19 01:32 AM
1

What do you mean?
/r/MGTOW218/11/19 08:49 AM
5

I'd say don't lie. Lies are harder to remember than the truth, and you don't want to get caught out in a lie like this, since people will assume the worst. On the other hand, don't mention MGTOW since most people will get find information about MGTOW from anti-MGTOW sources. Maybe just say that you want to work on yourself and focus on your career so you're not interested in dating right now, and will relook at the situation when you are 30? It's a little white lie at best. The only problem is t…
/r/MGTOW215/11/19 12:40 AM
6

Men want sex, and women want relationships. I personally believe that women have it worse than men because it is more difficult for us to get what we WANT. it's not about getting laid. its about reaching our goals. I think women do have it worse than men, but only because of what they are told nowadays: that they can have a career and put off marriage until their 30s, at which point they can meet a wonderful man who earns more than them and then have children. But life doesn't work like that, an…
/r/MGTOW212/11/19 08:19 AM
14

MGTOWs/Incels like to complain that nobody will have sex with them No, incels like to complain that nobody will have sex with them. MGTOW isn't about the problem of getting sex. It's about rejecting the expectation that men should get married and have children, as this is now a bad deal for men. MGTOWs choose a different path. That path may include a FWBs situation. Please don't group MGTOWs and incels together in this way. I have nothing against incels, but it is incorrect to group them togethe…
/r/MGTOW212/11/19 08:08 AM
31

Marriage is still seen as men gaining something and women losing something. So many articles present women who don't marry as 'strong and independent'; while men who don't marry 'need to grow up'. Once we start to see mainstream articles presenting the idea that men not marrying and working on themselves as a good thing, a corner will have been turned. We're still not there yet.
/r/MGTOW212/11/19 02:45 AM
6

He even said he had no place to lay his head. Sounds like he was divorced!
/r/MGTOW210/11/19 05:43 AM
4

There are plenty of Chads that have posted on r/MGTOW who have decided to go MGTOW. Not because they couldn't get women, but because they have the same bad experiences with women over and over, and they've had enough. I sincerely wish you the best, brother. I can't imagine going through life wishing for a modicum of respect from women and not getting it. It must be heart-breaking. I hope you eventually see that MGTOW is freedom, and not something you are forced into.
/r/MGTOW210/11/19 05:28 AM
12

... if you think of MGTOW as somewhere you end up when you don't have options then you're not MGTOW in my opinion. You're doing it wrong and you'll be on the plantation when the next uggo blinks her eyes at you. You aren't seeing it as a positive thing, you're seeing it as a negative thing. Exactly. Well said.
/r/MGTOW209/11/19 07:27 PM
2

So I'm essentially a man sent my own way I agree with DangZagnut. A MGTOW is NOT "a man sent his own way". It's like a man who says he was 'forced' from the plantation, implying he'd rather be back there. I don't care whether the guy is an incel or whatever you want to call him. MGTOW is freedom. Being sent somewhere is not an expression of freedom.
/r/MGTOW209/11/19 07:24 PM
18

I became an adult in the 80s. Was it the peak economy-wise? I think it was, but of course you don't know it is the peak at the time. It is only if things start going downhill that you know it was the peak. It could be this time, now, is another peak -- which means things would get worse from now on. I'd say: you just don't know, because you don't know what the future brings. If you are young, enjoy being young. If you are young and MGTOW, so much the better. Invest for the future, and you have t…
/r/MGTOW209/11/19 12:16 PM
5

By not marrying, you avoid the costs of a bad marriage, but also avoid the benefits of a good marriage. So you miss that opportunity of having a life partner and building a family. Do the potential benefits outweigh the costs? That's up to each man to decide. But I'd hate to see MGTOW as defined as just avoiding marriage, which is a negative position. There is the positive position of self-actualization: men are treated as disposable items by modern society, and should work towards achieving the…
/r/MGTOW207/11/19 09:28 AM
1

The Hill youtube channel. It's left-leaning, but has good analysis.
/r/MGTOW206/11/19 10:03 AM
1

The risk you take is ending up alone anyway, except minus half your stuff. Or even if the relationship doesn't break up, you risk ending up feeling alone as well as trapped. The fact that you are questioning the relationship as it exists at the moment does hint at how it is going to go. Do you expect things to get better? Or is the relationship as it exists good enough for you?
/r/MGTOW204/11/19 02:45 AM
1

When the first self-identified MGTOW commits an act of violence, you will see an end to r/MGTOW and r/MGTOW2, as well as a lot of MGTOW content on Youtube. People will say (like they did with incels after those incels committed violence): "There may be MGTOWs in your business; what are you doing about it?"
/r/MGTOW231/10/19 11:04 PM
1

No, don't do it. Keep your integrity. It's an old-fashioned notion, but I still think it is an important one. 'Simping' isn't just about what men do around women, it is an attitude towards life.
/r/MGTOW226/10/19 02:19 AM
3

You left "r/MGTOW", I guess you mean.
/r/MGTOW223/10/19 02:49 AM
1

You should help men and women when they need help, as a general principle. I think that r/MGTOW means don't help them when they don't need help. I'm a feminist. I treat women equally to men. If you wouldn't help a man in the same situation, don't help a woman. If you would help a man in the same situation, help a woman.
/r/MGTOW219/10/19 12:40 AM
1

I'm the same. I always enjoyed the intimacy more than the sex. I think it is an unspoken truth that sex is over-rated. You don't get past the desire for intimacy. Do you get past the desire for food? Do you get past the desire for water? No. Those things are natural. Requiring intimacy is a part of the human condition. Many divorces are caused by people (mostly women) who have lost the feeling of intimacy with their partners. Something to think about.
/r/MGTOW214/10/19 11:49 AM
1

A MGTOW at 15 years of age? You will be a god amongst men!
/r/MGTOW214/10/19 11:44 AM
1

What do you mean 'live alone the entire life'? Do you mean without family, without friends, without fellow hobbyists and acquaintances, without pets? Because you can't. You should have people in your life. Do you mean 'without sex'? That's up to you. Do you mean 'without a wife'? Then 'yes, it is possible to live without a wife'. In fact, I'd say that that's the best path for a good and happy life: avoiding legal entanglements with women. But that has NOTHING to do with 'living alone.'
/r/MGTOW214/10/19 11:42 AM
1

Keep in mind that your blue-pilled friend nutted all day, and STILL didn't really have post nut clarity. It's not just the drive for sex that causes blue-pill behaviour; rather it is how we are conditioned by society that the blue-pill world is the right one. What would the world be like if all men were red-pilled? That would be an interesting world to live in.
/r/MGTOW210/10/19 05:31 AM
1

In other words: you are going your own way! Best of luck to you!
/r/MGTOW204/10/19 06:05 AM
1

Ah, I see where you are coming from. Still, in a way, you DID know her. You did have a connection to her, despite not meeting her personally. And that connection was important to you, so you miss it, if that makes sense.
/r/MGTOW204/10/19 03:28 AM
1

I'll repeat everyone else's comment: you've learned a valuable lesson for a small amount of money. Learn from this and move on. Put the lesson you've learnt to work by working on yourself. The best revenge is living well.
/r/MGTOW203/10/19 09:43 PM
1

Someone whom you are a big fan of -- and never saw perform even though you wanted to -- dies, and you are surprised that you are upset about this? Can I ask why you are surprised? Wouldn't it be natural?
/r/MGTOW203/10/19 09:40 PM
1

You've made a fantastic start! You are at least 10 years ahead of me at the same period in my life. Well done! Keep in mind that even the most accomplished person, even the most attractive person, has doubts about themselves. Even people who have achieved so much still feel that they won't REALLY amount to anything. Best thing to do: right down your goals and the steps you will take to achieve them, and then achieve them. Self-esteem can't be given to you. It comes from achieving things. Achieve…
/r/MGTOW203/10/19 05:11 AM
1

Sympathy for all, sympathy for yourself.
/r/MGTOW203/10/19 04:50 AM
1

Basically, it is impossible for me to interact with women without feeling judged. I'm sorry but I have to say, you have a nail in your head. See this short Youtube clip (1 min 40 secs) for solutions: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-4EDhdAHrOg
/r/MGTOW201/10/19 10:46 PM
1

MGTOW is freedom. I hear you, things can look pretty bleak if we are trying to view our lives through someone else's eyes. It's said that every man is a villian in someone else's story. But life in Western society is pretty good. You just need to avoid trying to live up to a "useful" life that has been mapped out for you. Go your own way. For a start, put value in your own accomplishments. Don't try to derive value from relationships, like the incels do. Don't worry what that fringe group of fem…
/r/MGTOW201/10/19 06:35 AM
2

I wouldn't word that as the essence of MGTOW. To me, the essence of MGTOW is that we live in a world where men are considered disposable and it is time we start going our own way rather than the way that society wants us to go. From there, we do a cost/benefit of what makes sense based on the reality of modern life. FROM THAT, we can conclude that marriage/co-habitation has become a losing proposition for men. That's why I always try to stress that MGTOW is a positive philosophy about self-actua…
/r/MGTOW201/10/19 04:24 AM
4

It's like some Christians say: "Preach the Gospel at all times. If necessary, use words." When it is appropriate, talk about MGTOW. The rest of the time, live a MGTOW life.
/r/MGTOW230/09/19 10:43 PM
1

\^This. I wish MGTOW could be associated with the positive idea that "going their own way" doesn't just mean "don't get married" but "go out there and live your life."
/r/MGTOW230/09/19 05:52 AM
1

Don't get drunk Don't stress too much Talk to girls and enjoy yourself
/r/MGTOW228/09/19 08:57 AM
1

I guess I agree with 30203forever's response, which I know you didn't like. But this is part of a 'problem' with MGTOW: it tells men to rightly leave the plantation, but it doesn't say what to do AFTER leaving the plantation. To me, simply leaving the plantation isn't enough. No value in leaving the plantation and then just sitting by the side of the road, doing nothing. But that's the nature of MGTOW. 'Go your own way' doesn't tell you what way to go, and it never should. But I see a need to di…
/r/MGTOW226/09/19 11:58 PM
1

Sex is over-rated. This is something that should be pointed out more, but something that you learn as you get older (I'm 60 years old). I do miss intimacy; I don't miss sex.
/r/MGTOW226/09/19 02:41 AM
1

I'm sure there are NAWALTs, it's just that you can't know them from the AWALTs. There are people who win the lottery ("not all lottery tickets are like that!"), you just need to decide whether it is worth taking the chance.
/r/MGTOW225/09/19 12:10 AM
1

Someone here made the point that red pill rage isn't so much what happens when you are first red-pilled, but it is what happens when a blue-pill person is trying to down a red-pill but it won't go down. I'd ask: what blue-pill hopes are you still trying to hold on to? What's stopping you from accepting the red-pill, let it go all the way down? It might be because you still feel that the best life you can live is to pair up with a woman, so some part of your self-validation is still tied into tha…
/r/MGTOW221/09/19 03:18 AM
1

Good for you, for finding out for yourself what works and what doesn't work in your life (rather than just following what society tells you you should do) -- the very essence of going your own way!
/r/MGTOW217/09/19 10:59 AM
1

Why "(5) Don't eat red meat"?
/r/MGTOW217/09/19 03:09 AM
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