What are the limits of feminist theory for male advocacy?

Punder_man · 2024-02-18T03:10:21+00:00

What are some things that you won't ever be able to advocate for a man under a feminist lens without reducing the issue to a class issue?

Male genital mutilation, Male Rape Victims, Male Domestic Violence Victims and Criminal / Family Court Bias are some of the notable things that we are unable to advocate under the feminist lens.. The only way that we are allowed to advocate for these issues that is acceptable to feminism is to do so from the perspective of "Its men doing these things to men"

What are some of the male experiences which can never be seen or heard by feminism without reducing to class?

False Rape Accusations, Being Drafted, Family Court Bias
These are experiences that can never be seen or heard by feminism because they are situations which women generally will never find themselves in..

It is highly unlikely at a man falsely accusing a woman of rape would have the case even make it to court.. Aside from that due to the bias within our criminal court its unlikely she would receive anywhere close to the punishment a man would receive in that case.. as such they have no nuance or scope to understand how damaging a false rape accusation against a man can be..

Not only that but many feminists will try and insist that False Rape Accusations, despite being "Very Rare" are actually a good thing because it gives a man who was falsely accused a chance to self reflect and ask himself "What did I say or do to make this women believe I was capable of doing this?" "How can I do things differently to ensure that I don't make women feel unsafe around me"

Same thing for the draft.. Because its something that only affects men, Women and Feminists can't possibly understand how it feels knowing that in order to have the same rights / privileges that women have (The ability to vote, get a drivers license or get a student loan) as a man you need to be willing to put your life on the line and be drafted should the need arise.

They obfuscate it by claiming "Nobody has been drafted in over 100 years!" but they fail to understand the point is that men shouldn't be FORCED into this in order to obtain the same rights / privileges afforded to women who don't have to be conscripted.

What are some of the male identities which can never be validated by feminism without reducing to class?

MGTOW and Stay at home dads.

If men decide to go their own way and not play the game.. Feminists see it as a beacon of Misogyny.. often assigning the label of "Incel" to men who declare themselves MGTOW.. because any man not under their control is a liability and so they must publicly shame them into falling into line.

Stay at home Dads..
Despite this being an increasing identity for men, its something Feminists can't validate because in their twisted world view.. men should continue abiding by the gender roles / norms of being the provider / protector (because this benefits women) but expecting women to conform to the gender role / norm of being the nurturer is "Misogyny"

The key take away here is that Men are not allowed to advocate for themselves and are only allowed to advocate on issues / situations that have been first per-approved by our feminist overlords..

If you step out of line and try to advocate for something that has not been approved you will be shut down, labeled a misogynist, incel etc and essentially beaten down for daring to not follow the per-established program..

All while being told "You don't need Men's Rights! Feminism is about equality and for Men too!!!"

Karmaze · 2024-02-18T01:35:05+00:00

The Oppressor/Oppressed dichotomy is a complete 100% block on any issues involving men at this point. Sure, there might be some things done in parallel politically, but generally, if any O/O language comes into play, that's basically it.

What might be controversial here, is that I follow this up with that at this juncture, the Oppressor/Oppressed dichotomy is about an 80% block on issues facing women. So it's not like it's all peaches and roses on the other side either, tbh.

I'm not saying it's always been like this, but I think that's where we stand in 2024.

To be more clear, I think if you look at gender relations and socialization in 2024, I do think it revolves around the increasing enforcement of the Male Gender Role. But we cannot change this while denying women's agency for it. I'm not saying it's all women, or the problem is caused entirely by women, far from it. But if you completely remove them from the equation, as pretty much you have to do to not be called a misogynist or a pig or whatever, you will never be able to facilitate change.

Edit: Just to give an example...a big example in my mind...of what I mean. I'm sure most people here are familiar with that Female Dating Strategy stuff. Well, I think that stuff has escaped containment and it's actually much broader. And I think that stuff needs to be treated as the female equivalent of the new-ish red pill stuff, and in the same manner.

Leinadro · 2024-02-18T08:42:33+00:00

Feminist theory for male advocacy is limited by how feminism prioritizes women.

You can't advocate for a group of people and make that advocate conditional on how members of another group feel about it.

Low_Rich_5436 · 2024-02-18T11:11:03+00:00

There are so many. The ones I see as most threatening are everything involving children. That's when the contradictions become out of control.

Feminism is supposedly about freeing women from their restrictive motherly role, but they will never ever ever let go of their supremacy on children.

Feminist organisations fight tooth and nail against surrogacy (only way for men not in a straight couple to become parents in significant numbers), against the recognition of parental alienation, and in favour of false accusations (the "silver bullet" of child custody cases).

They might consider equal parenting time off, but only because it benefits women. My country recently increased paternity leave, and the equality secretary of state made a point to say it was NOT for the sake of men (or children), but so they would help women more.

We are not fathers, we are assistant mothers, and should be dissmissable at will. [Feminists] will fight for the right [of women] to abduct and abuse our children.

Gantolandon · 2024-02-18T09:15:18+00:00

From what I’ve seen, it’s not even functionally possible to actually advocate for those men issues that are 100% under the lens of feminism. Your primary audience, the feminists, won’t give a fuck and they might even accuse you of trying to distract everyone’s attention from women issues. What you are allowed (and even encouraged) to do is to preach to the men outside the movement how the traditional gender roles hurt them and how better they would be as feminists.

It’s the mirror image of the situation of women who come to the conservative far right: they’re not there to be heard, but to advertise, and to show that women actually want what they have to offer.

Motanul_Negru · 2024-02-18T12:12:31+00:00

I don't believe in using feminist anything for male advocacy. Feminism = feminine supremacy, it's right there in the name.

griii2 · 2024-02-18T22:06:57+00:00

I don't know how to answer your questions because feminists directly cause some male issues and they directly prevent others from being acknowledged.

They only let you advocate a whitewashed version of the problem which will lead to inefficient solutions.

Mitago1 · 2024-02-18T11:35:11+00:00

Unfortunately it's kind of hard for feminism, at least right now, to advocate for men's issues since men are largely considered the ''oppressors''. Also as it stands right now, people aren't really that ready or even willing to realistically look at men's issues and take them seriously without weird biases and preconceived notions about men. Although you can point out that there is talk about ''male loneliness epidemic'' ( which realistically is just people loneliness epidemic), but it's largely seen as an joke.

Hopefully in the distant future this is going to change and we'll start caring about people and their issues without taking gender, sexuality or race into consideration, without the whole oppressor, oppressed narrative, which greatly damages and stagnates any progress that's made when it comes to these issues.

jnkaze · 2024-02-20T18:08:51+00:00

Domestic violence is a big one. Despite the studies, most feminists still leverage it as largely something men do to women.

Also child abuse is heavily undersold as its something that statistically women do more. It's not taken seriously despite it's long term affect on children including boys who become men who may commit abuse

It's just not something feminist highlight as much

Title	What are the limits of feminist theory for male advocacy?
Author	Intrepid_Cry_9172
Upvotes	60
Comments	19
Date	February 17, 2024 11:57 PM UTC (2 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates/comments/1atg81n/what_are_the_limits_of_feminist_theory_for_male/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates/what-are-the-limits-of-feminist-theory-for-male.1245697 https://theredarchive.com/post/1245697

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