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If one parent requests a paternity test, does the other parent have a right to know? What about the child?

Titaniu

December 16, 2016
1 upvotes
/r/PurplePillDebate
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Post Information
Title If one parent requests a paternity test, does the other parent have a right to know? What about the child?
Author

Titaniu

Upvotes 1
Comments 75
Date December 16, 2016 9:19 PM UTC
(9 years ago)
Subreddit Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/5iqsoo/if_one_parent_requests_a_paternity_test_does_the/
Archive Link https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/if-one-parent-requests-a-paternity-test-does-the.271215
https://theredarchive.com/post/271215
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Comments

[–]shoup88Report me bitch6 points7 points8 points 9 years ago (37 children) | Copy Link

Like a noninvasive test that you mail off to get results? If so, then I don't think you're obligated to tell the other parent or the child. The request itself is harmless, so I see no reason to advise anyone else until you have the results.

As far as the results go, if it's proven that the father is the father, I don't think you should have to tell anyone you had the test done. If the man raising the child is not the bio father, both he and the mother have a right to know. I think the child be informed as well, but there could be convincing reasons not to.

[–]Titaniu 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (36 children) | Copy Link

As far as the results go, if it's proven that the father is the father, I don't think you should have to tell anyone you had the test done.

In this case, why not?

[–]shoup88Report me bitch7 points8 points9 points 9 years ago (33 children) | Copy Link

If a man is raising a child under the belief that it is his own, nothing is changed by proving that fact, so why would you tell the other parent?

All that would do is bring negative feelings to light by proving that either the mother or the father doubted his parenthood enough to get a test done.

[–]fredgravy1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (32 children) | Copy Link

Nothing outside the fact that she's been fucking other dudes.. and quite possibly under the guise exclusivity..

[–]exit_sandmanstill not the MGTOW sandman FFS2 points3 points4 points 9 years ago (17 children) | Copy Link

Not necessarily. If you do a test (as a guy) for "better safe than sorry"-reasons, this doesn't automatically mean that she fucked around.

[–]fredgravy0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (16 children) | Copy Link

If there's a reason for "better safe than sorry" doesn't that only stand to reason that there are more than one possible father..

Unless you're operating under the guise that it could have been imaculate inception..

Even still doesn't the potential father have a right to know the test was taken..

EDIT: I misread.. as a guy why wouldn't I want her to know I wanted a test..

[–]shoup88Report me bitch2 points3 points4 points 9 years ago (15 children) | Copy Link

As a guy, you're asking why wouldn't you want to tell you partner you don't trust them and think she cheated? You can't think of a single reason why that might be best left unsaid?

[–]fredgravy0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (14 children) | Copy Link

Nope not one..

Care to give me one?

[–]shoup88Report me bitch1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (13 children) | Copy Link

Bitterness and open distrust are generally bad for a relationship.

[–]fredgravy0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (12 children) | Copy Link

Not sure where you're getting the bitterness part from..

Protecting myself is far from bitterness and open distrust.

Disagree?

[–]shoup883 points 9 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

If I found out my partner got a paternity test done without my knowledge, or if he said he thought I might have been cheating on him, I would be bitter towards him and his distrust of me would be out in the open.

At least if he gets the paternity test done in secret and proves he's the father, he can work on trusting me again without blowing up the relationship in the process.

[–]fredgravy1 point 9 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

If you found out.. so why not be upfront about it in the first place..

You're arguing yourself with me in the middle..

EDIT: he can work on it.. that's blame shifting.. isn't it your responsibility to be trustworthy..

[–]shoup883 points 9 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

Replying to your edit: if the father gets a test that proves he is the father, then his distrust of the mother was baseless.

[–]fredgravy1 point 9 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

It obviously wasn't baseless if he felt the need to do it in the first place..

[–]shoup883 points 9 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

Wow the mental gymnastics on that one. So essentially anytime you feel suspicious of someone, they are guilty, even once proven innocent. Fascinating.

[–]fredgravy1 point 9 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

You might want to think about that one again..

If he felt the need to have it done in the first place.. that would be the base..

If it came back that it was his it wouldn't make it baseless.. it would make it a non issue..

I have noticed that you throw "mental gymnastics" around quite freely..

Then follow it up with assumption.. essentially pulling the same shit you are accusing..

Fascinating.

[–]shoup882 points 9 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

Feeling suspicious about someone does not necessarily mean those feelings are grounded in reality. If you thought your wife was cheating, and it was proven she was not, your suspicions were invalid. Another way of saying baseless.

Feelings are not what give your suspicions merit. Reality is.

[–]fredgravy1 point 9 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

Not invalid.. wrong..

The reality of it is that there could quite possibly be a real good real reason for the suspicion..

[–]shoup881 point 9 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

I'm giving you an example of why I wouldn't want to know. There's no argument on my side - I think there are benefits to keeping this request hidden.

[–]fredgravy1 point 9 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

When trust is involved omission is no different than lying in the long run..

It's no different than resetting the timer on a time bomb without defusing it..

If you want to live with that on your conscious.. or can somehow justify to yourself that you did the right thing.. that's on you..

I choose to be upfront.. handle the issue now before it becomes infected over time..

[–]shoup881 point 9 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

That's very noble of you, and it's in line with what is generally taught - that honesty is always the best policy.

I disagree but I understand why you feel that way.

[–]fredgravy1 point 9 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

It's not noble..

Honesty being the best policy is great if you have the stones to stand by your decision.. other wise it becomes very bluepill and apologizing..

[–]shoup88Report me bitch1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (13 children) | Copy Link

Yep, those would be the negative feelings.

[–]fredgravy0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago* (12 children) | Copy Link

Edit 1: got rid of the "how so" comment.. it was a bad one.. made no sense..

Edit 2: so lie??

[–]shoup88Report me bitch0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (11 children) | Copy Link

I didn't see your first comment. What are you asking me?

[–]fredgravy0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (10 children) | Copy Link

So lie?

[–]shoup88Report me bitch1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link

Omit.

[–]fredgravy0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

Why would it be okay in this situation

[–]shoup881 point 9 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

What do you mean by "okay"?

Sometimes keeping things secret is the best thing for the relationship. Ignorance is bliss and all that.

[–]fredgravy1 point 9 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

So adding to the distrust as you mentioned in your other comment is "justified".. what happens when the omitted truth comes out 5 years later?

Trust would then be breached.. making the past 5 years questionable at best..

And more than likely considered a lie by the other party..

[–]shoup881 point 9 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

So then work harder at keeping that omitted truth hidden.

[–]fredgravy1 point 9 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

Or be upfront in the first place.. and the relationship falls apart or is better off because you don't need to work at hiding something.. and can focus on the relationship.. not covering your ass..

That sounds like a lot of work when you would be much better off enjoying.. or moving on..

[–]shoup881 point 9 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

Meh, agree to disagree. I personally don't think you should tell your partner every complaint and suspicion and insecurity you have, but I respect other people feel differently.

[–]fredgravy1 point 9 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

It's not a complaint.. nor a suspicion.. nor an insecurity..

It's a standard operating procedure..

True.. it's my standard operating procedure.. and I understand others have their SOPs..

Omission may not be a full on lie.. but it is for sure underhanded..

And that's your SOP.. good luck with it..

Omission is fear

[–]shoup882 points 9 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

"Omission is fear" - I'm sure that would get a lot of Facebook likes if you found the right black and white landscape background, but it doesn't actually mean anything.

[–]fredgravy1 point 9 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

How not?

Omitting something is fear of the repercussions of a choice..

If you can't own up to something how are you not living in fear?

[–]CarkudoThe original opinionated omega0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

What would be the point of a duty to tell the other party that you haven't fucked them over? "Oh, by the way, dear, I am legally obligated to inform you that I haven't cheated on" - that's quite a bit ridiculous I think

[–]Titaniu 0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

The child's right to their personal medical history.

[–]Atlas_B_Shruggin🔪Yeetus that Feetus🔪4 points5 points6 points 9 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

No

[–]Titaniu 0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

Why no?

[–]Atlas_B_Shruggin🔪Yeetus that Feetus🔪3 points4 points5 points 9 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

Why yes? Where would such a "right" come from for either the wife or the child? Each parent has something like "joint and several" rights over the child and children have no right wrt medical tests, parents have pretty unchallenged right to have medical procedures done to them at their discretion

[–]Titaniu 0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

For the parent: the right to know their dependent child's medical history.

For the child: the right to know their own medical history.

I'm not asking from a legal standpoint...you could flip it around and ask why one parent has the right to keep medical test history a secret from the other parent or the child itself.

[–]Atlas_B_Shruggin🔪Yeetus that Feetus🔪2 points3 points4 points 9 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

"Rights" is solely a legal concept. There is nothing else

[–]CarkudoThe original opinionated omega2 points3 points4 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

That's a copout Atlas, and you know that. With all your obsession with intellectual honesty, how are you not ashamed to use that tactic?

[–]Titaniu 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Legal rights evolve from ideas, they're not inflexible.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Oh.. NOW she comes out with it. Fuck me, why all the BS about imaginary stuff in the other thread?

[–]DucksCanDanceRed-ish Man3 points4 points5 points 9 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

No, so long as it is easily and harmlessly accomplished, a man should have the same certainty re paternity that the mother has

[–]Titaniu 0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

I agree, but why should mother or child not be informed?

[–]DucksCanDanceRed-ish Man2 points3 points4 points 9 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

To put the father in the same position as the mother

If you required the father to disclose the fact that he was running such tests, it would have a chilling effect. Men would be deterred from obtaining the information

[–]Titaniu 0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Should women be able to get the test done and keep it secret if he's not the father?

[–]DucksCanDanceRed-ish Man1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

There's really no excuse for a woman not to know the paternity of her children

But to answer your question, yes, absolutely

[–]exit_sandmanstill not the MGTOW sandman FFS1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

You seriously want to compare harboring lingering doubts with paternity fraud?

[–]the_calibre_cat2 points3 points4 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Because the mother will lose it. I talked to my ex-girlfriend about this, and she certainly did. I stood my ground though, thought she was about to dump me, but she finally caved. I managed to negotiate two paternity tests - IE if we had three kids, I'd have to trust her on the last one, and if the first two came back positive with me being the father, that's reasonable.

But yeah, this is just one of those things that would give men relative equality with what women enjoy biologically right now. I'm pleased to see some of our resident feminists (/u/shoup88) standing up for it, because opposition to it would be hypocritical as fuck, in my opinion.

[–]TheChemist158Non-Feminist Blue Pill Woman1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Interesting question. I'm leaning towards no but I'd like to hear others thoughts.

[–]Titaniu 0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Why no?

[–]TheChemist158Non-Feminist Blue Pill Woman1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Lots decisions about the kids are made unilaterally. Being a legal guardian means you are trusted to do that kind of stuff.

[–]-almost-blue- 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

i think so, leaning towards yes to both (but i admit i don't know much about paternity testing). the (hypothetical) idea of even non-invasive tests being run on a child i co-created with someone, without my knowledge or the kid's knowledge, seems like a major breach of trust and boundaries. but i can only really apply it to my own relationship, so, that's also why.

[–]midnightvulpine1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

There is no legal obligation. One could make an argument for a discreet test being reasonable in certain extreme situations. But one shouldn't be surprised if, should your other half find out, there would be a certain blow to trust in the relationship due to the secrecy. If you require that secrecy, there is obviously a problem in the relationship.

[–]exit_sandmanstill not the MGTOW sandman FFS1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

If you require that secrecy, there is obviously a problem in the relationship.

We had a thread about this once, and all women (apart from the redpill ones) considered it a dealbreaker if a guy entertained the thought of having a paternity test done.

[–]DupreeMcJones2 points 9 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

I see no reason for this.

Seems like one of these cases of women not wanting to give up an inherent advantage.

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[–]Titaniu 0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

It only seems fair to give my own view, I invite others to CMV if they like...

As for informing the other parent, I don't feel very strongly either way. There may be good reasons to inform or not to inform the other parent whether the test proves parentage or not.

From the perspective of a the child being tested, I feel strongly that any and all medical testing, no matter how harmless, should be available for them to know at least by the time they reach adulthood. It is their body and they have a right to know their medical history.

[–]super-commenting0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

they have a right to know their medical history.

I wouldn't really consider a non invasive DNA test to be a part of my medical history.

[–]Titaniu 0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

Any reason in particular?

[–]super-commenting1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

If spit in a cup and then that spit is analyzed to determine parenthood it doesn't affect my health any more than if I had just spit in the sink. Of course that's assuming that the test doesn't reveal anything surprising. If the test reveals that the child has a different father or if somehow the test reveals the child has done genetic anomaly then i would agree these things should be shared with the child.

[–]Titaniu 0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I see it this way...you could spit in a cup and someone taking it and testing it may not physically harm you but it would violate your right to privacy. If your boss took that cup of spit and had it tested for drugs or diseases then chose to fire you or cancel your medical insurance, for the results, for example.

I think parents should have the ability to have their child tested, but not to keep the knowledge of that testing or its results private, at least not past 18 years...

[–]Titaniu 0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Why not just keep it on the child's medical record to view later on?

[–]artietx 0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

It should be a basic procedure along with other tests. Shouldn't be a big deal where you need to specifically request it etc.

[–]LSTW12340 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

They don't have a "right" to know in any legal sense. Ethically, I think it should be disclosed to the other parent regardless of the results, but not to the child unless the results prove the child is someone else's.

[–]darksoldierkPurple Pill0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

No and no.

Full paternity tests should be standard. If divorce court is going to continue to be as biased towards support and custody, than at the very least, there should be hard proof that the person they are screwing over is the right person to screw over.

[–]Battle-Scars0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

All this would be solved by mandatory DNA testing when the Baby is born. The child could have his DNA printout attached to his birth certificate. Of course that would be a valuable database in the wrong hands, like the government, so privacy would have to be protected.

[–]fredgravy0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

The fact that someone needs a paternity test to figure out the biological father alone should be reason to HAVE to tell the father of the child.. even if it's his..

Explain why not?

Let him decided after that if he chooses to disclose whether or not mommy needed a test to decide if we were a family or not..

The fuck..

EDIT: read it as mommy asking for the test.. the other way still stands for me..

Fuck ya daddy.. let her know..

Protect child at all cost..

[–]murpyramidz0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

It depends on how you are planning to use the results. For example, if you plan on using the result for Family Court or a Birth Certificate name change. Then it would be wise for you to make the other party aware.

A Peace of Mind Paternity does not require the other party to have knowledge to the test. I guess the issue for the party who wants to perform the paternity test would be acquiring the genetic sample of the father. This assuming the mother or another family is looking to perform a paternity test.

If an alleged father wants a paternity test, it is just a matter of having the child with you on the day you want the samples collected or, acquiring some kind of sample from the child if you are not able to have alone time with the child.

Please note, if a child or an alleged father is not able to be present during the sample collection process you will then be performing a Forensic DNA Paternity Test. This type of test requires another type of sample like a toothbrush, q-tip etc.

Hope this helps.

[–]GroovyEFS 0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Afaik to make sure you're the real father you don't even need the other parent's DNA, just your own and the child's.

[–]Entropy-7Old Goat0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I don't think you should tell the other parent about the test but you should inform them of negative results. That is in the case where the kid is very young or within a narrow window after a .guy becomes a "surprise" father (a relative of mine did not find out until 16 years later. . . when mom ran out of money and came after him for child support).

But more than a few years in, I don't know what the answer is because it can really mess with a kid's mind.

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