After browsing this subreddit for a while, I've decided on my stance on Men's Rights.

EricAllonde · 2017-11-16T07:36:21+00:00

Feminists actively push the line that any and all criticism of feminism = hatred of women. Of course that's idiotic, but they've had some success with it.

They also frequently claim that speaking in favour of men's rights or legal equality for men is "misogyny" as well. Why do they do that? I have a hypothesis:

We know many women want & expect to receive "benevolent sexism" from men, meaning special treatment & extra privileges given on the assumption that women are weaker or less capable than men.

Amy Yeung's research paper showed clearly that what most women think of as equality is actually benevolent sexism. When women experience actual equality, i.e. men treating them exactly the same as they treat other men, women mistakenly think that is "hostile sexism".

So I imagine that when people in this sub argue that, for example, men & women should have exactly the same right to consent to becoming a parent (i.e. the Legal Parental Surrender argument), many women will find that idea frightening and sexist.

Likewise when people argue that men & women should receive equal sentences for the same crimes and with the same criminal history. Although that is objectively equal treatment, a lot of women find that idea scary and will interpret men arguing in favour of equal sentencing as sexist or hateful speech.

Amy Yeung's paper, "Lay misperceptions of the relationship between men’s benevolent and hostile sexism"

Try examining a couple of your debates with other people about men's rights from this perspective and see whether you think it has any weight.

SecTeff · 2017-11-16T07:42:56+00:00

I think the thing is to focus on the positives of equality and the issues affecting both men and women. Don’t see things as gender war or fall into the trap of hating the other gender.

There are some very real issues affecting men such as prostrate cancer, high male suicide rates and mental health problems, lower life expectancy, fathers rights etc. There are also some very real issues affecting women such as sexism, harassment in the street etc.

Someone who really cares about equality will recognise all of these issues. Sadly however if you mention men’s rights or things like international men’s day you will get accused of misogyny by some. Just don’t fall into becoming what they try and wrongly label you.

Demonspawn · 2017-11-16T14:25:55+00:00

I am passionate about equal rights for both genders.

Why does everyone forget equal responsibilities?

KingRobotPrince · 2017-11-16T10:32:06+00:00

Since you're still in school and have yet to graduate university, be careful with how you proceed from here to getting out into the real world.

As good as it is to be aware, we have seen from the news that things can get pretty sticky for guys at university who try to speak out for men's rights.

Universities are extremely leftist and stifle any kind of discourse on inequality that doesn't favor women. To the point where your academic career could be jeopardised just for speaking out.

Obviously it is up to you how you act, but just putting it out there. There's being right and there's being 'dead right'...

Jsassu27 · 2017-11-16T09:44:12+00:00

First off, I think its dope that you're in HS and you seem to care about more than just getting likes on FB and watching those mindless youtube weekly compilations... So props on that one broseph... Beyond that though, I think its more or less the culture of your generation. I'm 30 and I went to school in the era where kids wore close that that were no lie, about 3x bigger than what actually fit. Everything was gay for some reason, all of my friends literally described just about everything they didn't understand as being gay. I'm def guilty on that one as well so my apologies to the LGBTQXRSA community... I still have no clue what any of the letters after T stand for but hey its a free country! Be whatever the hell you want and don't ever let anyone toss your identity in the trash! Unless you're pedophile (I'm not associating the queer community with child molestation, I mean in terms of being whatever you want). If you are then get your ass some help because that stuff will never be tolerated... When I was in high school it was perfectly fine for guys to hug girls... Matter fact most of the guys I knew were in it for the hugs! They used to wear that nonsense like a badge of honor.. Lol. Look I'm gonna be straight with you on this one homie, it would do you good to understand this now and just accept it.... If you're a guy, no matter what you do, it's always going to be your fault. Even when it's not your fault, it still is. Women are always right my friend, so whatever book club they've attended that insights their existentialism this week, or any other for that matter... Go along with it. I learned at a very young age that you can say sorry out loud, followed by sike bi*ch in your and she never has to know about it. Now of course theres a thing called self respect that you NEED just like you need air, so don't ever let a woman trample on your self worth because trust me, she will the moment she knows its ok. All women, no matter how cool they might be, all have this need to see exactly how far they can get their bf to go for them. It's like they get together every Wednesday and just compare stories about what crazy ass stuff they managed to get their bf to do this week. Not only that, but she will lose respect for you the moment she realizes that you have no respect for yourself! I say women are always right, however that does not mean she gets to treat you like garbage. The number one rule, If she cheats you bounce, no questions asked. If she disrespects purposely in front of friends, you have enough respect for her to then pull her aside and let her know that shit will not be tolerated. When I say shes right, I mean so long as your love for her supersedes your ego, and you have a good woman. If thats the case then being wrong all the time is worth it my friend. Theres nothing in this world that compares to a good woman so don't mistake this as me telling you or anyone else to disrespect her in anyway because trust me, that shit won't last long if thats the route you take. We live in a society where women are "seen" as equals with men, but in reality thats not entirely the case and we are dead smack in the center of one of the largest shifts in consciousness that human race has ever experienced. For the better part of a thousand years, white men pretty much oppressed everyone and their mother (I'm a white man btw). In the last 100 years the status quo has been turned upside down giving just about everyone the voice they deserve, so don't be surprised when they being to use that voice.... One of the side effects of this, is that you're going to see those same groups who've been oppressed, begin to lash out on whatever is truly upsetting them. I'm not a woman so I can't tell you exactly why some of them feel the need to give their opinions on everything they hear, but I would imagine its probably because now they can, and even though I as a white man have never oppressed anyone else in my life, I will still have to deal with fact that generations of white men before me did and as a result I now fall into a category for which I have to bear that burden of being seen as the cause of everyones problem... All I can do is try and have positive dialogue with anyone who wants to listen. I know I've rambled on and on but the point I'm trying to make is this, we live in a time where everyone can now be heard, no matter what color or gender they are, and thats a beautiful thing. Instead of being offended by what girls say and do at your school, just try to be a good person through and through. You can't change it, so just understand it instead, and use what you learn as a tool to show others around you that you are in tune with their perceptions. You may not be able to change an entire group of peoples beliefs, but you can show them that you acknowledge those beliefs which wont change their perception of men altogether but it it might change their perceptions of you for the better... Thats all you can do my man.

SkeletornCW · 2017-11-16T18:35:50+00:00

I am starting to wish there was no men's rights or woman's rights. There should be human rights, which are limited but protect those who need it, and based on your character you earn more rights. A person who donates money and time to charities and stuff should get more rights. A psychopathic murderer rapist should have even the most basic human rights revoked. Sort of like a meritocracy. Obviously this system wouldn't work currently, though. Plus, if everyone has the same rights, then no one has any rights.

Everyone and their dog is way too fucking worried/entitled about rights these days.

LibertyIsNotFree · 2017-11-16T09:24:59+00:00

If you've never hugged me, you're not a real friend. Ipso facto. Life is literally as simple as that in this one area.

Keep that in mind, the vast majority of all people you meet your entire life are not and will not ever be your real friend. That doesn't mean don't be friends with people, nor does it mean don't hug people, just always be keenly aware of whether a person is a social member or a real friend.

What you want to ensure you keep out of your social members are Fair Weather friends. If you let these snakes stay in too long you might get tricked into believing they're real friends much to your chagrin.

brokedown · 2017-11-16T15:42:55+00:00

You may be interested in /r/Egalitarianism then.

bigbronze · 2017-11-16T16:22:50+00:00

First off when talking to your feminist friends, don’t go at it with the approach of “women aren’t the oppressed gender”. That’s like saying “black people don’t have it as bad as white people”. Regardless of the context you try to make, your message won’t be heard and you would be casted off as a racist (sexist in your scenario). Your approach should be more along the lines of saying men have issues too. If you come at it right, they can’t argue against you. I.E. the issue of suicide. Start off with teen suicide, they will probably say girls something along the lines of too many girls attempt suicide; then you can say yes you are right, we should also look at boys attempting suicide because not only are they attempting just as much, but they are more successful in killing themselves. We as a society should look into what is driving teens to the edge. If they try to focus on women, you could then ask “so you don’t care about people/men killing themselves”. They usually will either try and backtrack to include male victims or double down on their preferred women victims, thus you can call them out on being sexist. Either way you would either gotten people to see the men’s side of the issue or at least officially ousted one person a sexist who you now know that to avoid.

BlockNotDo · 2017-11-16T18:03:39+00:00

While I'm not against feminism, I am passionate about equal rights for both genders.

Those two statements are mutually exclusive.

circlhat · 2017-11-16T18:11:40+00:00

I understand Men's Rights is sort of controversial and not too many people support it,

At state level but most people don't support or identify with feminist.

If you don't have any haters your doing it wrong, this has nothing to do with whatever ideology you accept just know once you think for yourself (This happens to men and women) people will attack you.

When I try to talk to my friends about it they think I'm some kind of incel

The new insult for young men, I get called this alot to sadly we live in a society where my ideals are only respected because I sleep with women, The first thing a women will call me is a incel, than I say I'm married if I wasn't married they would say I was abusive, hateful and couldn't get a women.

where men are not looked down upon, but rather, seen as equals.

Welcome to the men's right movement, to be honest I don't even want a men's right movement but rather a equality movement were both issues are looked at because women do have issues but those are being addressed and men aren't

BlueOrange22 · 2017-11-16T18:16:37+00:00

Welcome! Your friends reactions are unfortunately common due to the misconceptions about the MRM, but people are starting to realize the truth, much like you did. When people really look into the facts, arguments and data, there's just no questioning that the MRM is the right side.

Juan_Golt · 2017-11-16T21:36:48+00:00

Almost no one starts out as anti-feminist. It's more of a label that is thrust upon you. As an MRA you'll be told your anti-feminist so many times eventually you just say "ok sure".

cyotee · 2017-11-16T15:55:56+00:00

Good for you. I just gave up on the whole thing.

Title	After browsing this subreddit for a while, I've decided on my stance on Men's Rights.
Author	Aligator237
Upvotes	147
Comments	47
Date	November 16, 2017 7:14 AM UTC (8 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/7dasgh/after_browsing_this_subreddit_for_a_while_ive/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/after-browsing-this-subreddit-for-a-while-ive.911048 https://theredarchive.com/post/911048

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