women try and fail to become army rangers according to the male standards. Solution? Change the standards of course!

xNOM · 2015-05-30T15:53:16+00:00

And so it starts, only a matter of time before they get the standards lowered.

Just like for the police force.

Just like for fire fighters.

Just like for every other job with something like this.

Next up? navy seals, because women that can't pass the tests can make the units more effective! some how.

hello_end · 2015-05-30T22:31:59+00:00

Well shit.

First let’s clear a few things up.

Ranger School is an Army leadership school. Actual real world US Army Rangers serve in the 75th Ranger Regiment.

Someone can be in the conventional Military and attend Ranger school. If they pass they are now considered “Ranger qualified”. They get to wear the coveted Ranger Tab and receive promotion points for completing the course (More on this later).

They then return to their unit and go back to doing whatever the fuck it was they were doing before. No shit you can be a cook in the Army and gain a Ranger tab. They don’t start running secret squirrel, black-ops missions and shit. They have just proven that they can “lead” under extreme duress and a few other things.

To gain entry into one of the three Ranger Battalions that make up the 75th Regiment they have to attend RASP. Once they complete this then they start running the secret squirrel, black-ops shit. Two very different worlds we have here.

Now Rangers from Battalion have to attend and complete Ranger school within (generally) the first year of being at battalion if they want to stay in the unit. If they fail out of the school they will be kicked out to a conventional infantry unit like the 101st or 82nd.

Now let’s get back to promotion points. When someone in the US military is looked at for a promotion the promotion point system is used to weigh one candidate against another. Having courses and schools barred to women obviously puts them at a disadvantage against men who have more options. If you have two medics and one has a Ranger tab and the other does not who is going to be promoted? You got it.

There is the flip side to all of this which is the segregation of the male, female physical fitness testing standards. Men and women are held to different standards to achieve a perfect 300 score. This puts men at a disadvantage because they have to perform to a much higher standard to achieve a 300. This can also looked at for a promotion. Which is fucked up.

This issue is not clear cut and is incredibly nuanced.

I have probably just pissed off a whole hell of a lot of guys who have been to Ranger School by saying that it is just a leadership course. I am just trying to clear up a few misconceptions going on here. No disrespect intended.

DiaboliAdvocatus · 2015-05-30T17:02:15+00:00

For Col. Jason Dempsey, a fellow Ranger and West Point graduate, this points to a need for “reassessing what war-fighting is, and what’s really important,” he says, rather than “having 100,000 guys who are essentially pack mules.”

Lol what, infantry since Roman times have always been pack mules, where they were expected to march 20 miles carrying their equipment and several days of rations, dig for 2hours to construct an overnight camp, have supper and maybe have at most 5 hours sleep, day after day on campaign. Even nowadays in Afghanistan, soldiers on extended foot patrols are going out with 87-127lbs of gear.

The ability of an army to rely on as little logistics as possible and carry all their gear on themselves has been the way you win wars, even in the most mechanized war in history, WW2, infantry were carrying 80-100lbs of equipment in Europe, in the Pacific, individuals could be carrying up to 105% of their bodyweight.

Most recent example of an outright military victory thanks to the infantry being pack mules was in the Falklands War

The British soldiers, during the Falklands conflict, did a remarkable job of carrying heavy loads on their backs over long distances and during adverse weather conditions. A good example of this physical endurance was the 42 Commando of the Royal Marines. The Commandos landed at San Carlos carrying approximately 120-145 pounds of equipment per man. A typical load consisted of two mortar rounds (26 lbs.), personal weapon and ammunition (50 lbs.), 2 water bottles, food for 48 hours, sleeping bag, shelter, spare clothing and other special equipment required by the individual or his squad. With this load, 42 Commando made a "Big Yomp" (forced march) of 80 miles across the Falklands. The "yomp" was made in three days across boggy and wet ground during wet and cold weather. [23]

Mechanization has done nothing to lighten the load the infantryman carries, infact you could argue it has gotten heavier

http://i.imgur.com/S3FaFZa.png

wanked_in_space · 2015-05-30T16:51:35+00:00

I hate that these are referred to as "male standards". They are army ranger standards.

FleshPanda · 2015-05-30T19:33:32+00:00

I was talking with a female veteran of the Iraq War and she told me that she doesn't think women should fight in combat units. They are more of a burden than a help and often hold units behind.

victorymonk · 2015-05-30T19:42:56+00:00

The Rangers are the best of the best, and being a Ranger means passing a physical test that pushes body and mind to the breaking point. If women can’t do it, the argument goes, then they shouldn’t be Rangers.

If a person can't do it, they shouldn't be Rangers. I'd guess 99% of men would also fail those tests. Also, I somehow feel that neither Putin nor Chinese Army are lowering standards for their elite troops.

Wargame4life · 2015-05-30T17:25:24+00:00

lets hope the enemy lower their standards when firing at them shall we...idiots

jimmywiddle · 2015-05-30T19:47:13+00:00

Credibility of these units will just plummet if they do this. I thought being a ranger meant something. If they start letting women in who don't meet the level (I have no problem with those that do) then the reputation will be ruined.

And in military terms reputation means a lot, it gives the soldiers pride to be part of it.

Cannon0006 · 2015-05-30T20:20:29+00:00

inferior soldiers=inferior army=conquered country, imho

Neo_Techni · 2015-05-30T15:52:22+00:00

I thought they said they weren't going to lower the standards cause that would be misogyny

greycloud24 · 2015-05-30T21:23:30+00:00

i don't think they should reduce the physical standards. they currently don't do so for older members. rangers requires not just higher physical fitness scores than other units, they also measure everyone no matter what age as an 18 year old male. this means that older more experienced members can be removed for not performing as well as their younger and stronger peers.

the high standards is what ensures that only the most capable soldiers can become rangers in the first place. this is the base one which elite is built, you must start with the gifted and driven, and improve from there.

docalypse · 2015-05-31T01:49:04+00:00

I worked at the Benning phase of Ranger school for 4 tears. A common joke was that one day you'll get a Ranger tab through powerpoint.

Seems to be on the right track.

FleshPanda · 2015-05-31T04:37:39+00:00

First off getting a ranger tab and being in ranger regiment are two drastically different things. 2nd, as a combat arms vet (artillery) who deployed with women I can say that they have absolutely no fuckin business in combat arms. Period.

Aarondhp24 · 2015-05-31T01:58:50+00:00

You tell those rangers to shut their fucking mouths.

xynomaster · 2015-05-30T19:47:03+00:00

I'm all for equal opportunity. If women can't meet the standards and you can show that the standards are arbitrary (ie higher than necessary for the job) I'm all for lowering them.

But only if you show that they really are unnecessarily high and lowering them won't put people in danger.

i_cant_find_a_name · 2015-05-31T01:50:35+00:00

The start of America becoming Earth's pussy.

YourPepperMint · 2015-05-31T04:19:33+00:00

women will also start bitching on the battlefield

Kingpink2 · 2015-05-30T20:07:25+00:00

Its a non issue. Women dont exactly line up for these jobs. Even the airforce has vastly less women compared to men and the ratio of male to female pilots is even more skewed. Just let them lower the standards so a handful of women can play at being a ranger for a year or 2 before they decide it isnt really for them.

Title	women try and fail to become army rangers according to the male standards. Solution? Change the standards of course!
Author	iambecomedownvote
Upvotes	131
Comments	53
Date	May 30, 2015 3:04 PM UTC (11 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/37ulje/women_try_and_fail_to_become_army_rangers/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/women-try-and-fail-to-become-army-rangers.978927 https://theredarchive.com/post/978927

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