‘It’s hard to have compassion’: can interventions change violent men’s behaviour?

im_a_teapot_dude · 2024-06-08T23:55:56+00:00

“Let’s help men, because otherwise they’ll be violent, won’t someone please think of the women!?” is still weirdly sexist and awful, but I guess it’s a step in the right direction.

Trollsense · 2024-06-09T00:41:47+00:00

No talk of helping men in general to overcome mental health issues; just those who commit domestic violence and only because women are impacted. You can’t make this shit up if you tried, we’re in dingdong clown world.

Most men don’t commit domestic violence, a lot of these guys give off the toxic “bad boy” vibes beforehand. If you point this out then it’s either “victim blaming” or calling us incels. Nearly all of these guys who commit such atrocities exhibited signs of violence, criminal convictions, stalking behaviors, narcissistic tendencies, and the dark triad long before the tragedy took place.

Clemicus · 2024-06-09T00:39:12+00:00

Found the article using their keyword system (domestic violence vs violence against women and girls). I was trying to find the article about a upcoming report.

Thought I’d explain why I posted this. As with almost any article it frames it as an gendered issue. That men are the perpetrators and women are the victims (of male violence).

The boys and men most at risk of perpetration, Seidler says, are a “massively overlooked part of the equation”, largely because empathy of any kind – including delving into the complexities of the men’s lives – is considered by some to amount to condoning or excusing perpetration.

But going by their own figures girls are victimised at almost twice at the twice the rate of boys. So the implication still here is, it’s a gendered issue and that it’s men who are striking out.

The safety valve aspect of this is interesting. In cases where they were the perpetrators, there’s potential benefit. But at the same time they’ll be those who have been court mandated or referred to these types of services who haven’t perpetuated and were the victims.

And the training will be around them being the sole perpetrators. So they’ll only be able to look internally for the cause and not externally to anyone who’s possibly victimising them and to spot their victimisers actions.

This seems to be more a reflection of reality. They’re mentioning these types of courses more, seemingly as they become more command place.

Though I have to wonder if they can keep up the facade and continue down this route. With there being more focus on abuse during childhood, that may lead to more statistics that back up domestic violence isn’t a gendered issue.

PS excuse the babbling. It’s late.

nerdboy1r · 2024-06-09T01:50:30+00:00

Sometimes I feel that Siedler has to don the clothes of this kind of language in order to get anywhere in his field. But a lot of his speech here is quite frustrating.

I dont know why people cannot at least permit the nuance of saying 'some' men' instead of just 'men.' It plays right into the hands of this baseless take that the reason bad men perpetrate is because good men stand idly by, that all men are enablers of one another.

Further, the focus on 'intervention' and 'prevention' rather than providing men with the community, social, and economic supports that they need to thrive.

We focus on those who are at risk, and intervene, to prevent violent behaviour.

OR

We work with low SES/unemployed/substance abusing/traumatised/poor mental health men to improve their quality of life, lower their distress, and carry the burdens they cannot carry alone.

But apparently saying the latter would be to say the quiet part out loud? It frustrates me more than anything else in this space, really. So close, yet still draped in the veil of paternalistic feminism.

Present_League9106 · 2024-06-10T00:21:19+00:00

DV rates in NSW are up to .441% of the population in 2023 from .362% of the population in 2017. That's an increase of .079%. These statistics also completely ignore men as victims. Just to put it into context, autism is more than twice as common as DV against women and children (more often women) in NSW. I'm not saying that DV is irrelevant, I'm saying that the narrative that men are naturally abusive is tired. That data seems to suggest that a shockingly low proportion of men are actually violent against women, and I only say "shocking" because I've grown up in a society that over saturates our media with reports of violent men.

ArmchairDesease · 2024-06-10T14:32:45+00:00

It would be nice to have some compassion for violent men. Just the honesty to admit that they too are victims (having often received violence as boys).

But, in fact, you don't need to feel any compassion. Not even basic empathy. And still, you should want to help these men. Because that's the only way to stop the violence cycle.

Treating them as irredeemable monsters just hides the problem under the rug. It's a way to make sure they remain violent, untreated and dangerous.

Eaglingonthemoor · 2024-06-09T01:38:12+00:00

I feel like this is a good point to make but definitely think it's pretty condescending in isolation. It needs to exist as one point in a broader conversation.

Is now a good time to share the video I made that argues for being compassionate to men because it is simply the right thing to do? I feel like that would be a nice chaser to this article but I also don't want to be that person who's always derailing conversations by droppin like "oh ya check out my youtube channel" lol

Edit: if I'm gonna do it I should probably just do it. Heres the video if you are interested https://youtu.be/UwIc0-ZfrTw

This article just pricked my ears up because in this vid I also say essentially "it is hard to be compassionate" so I was like oh! Someone else making the same case as me! Oh, ok nevermind, it's about fixing broken men again I guess. Why is it always about fixing broken men

SarcasticallyCandour · 2024-06-09T00:57:21+00:00

God help us when Labour get in. The government especially with a large majority will be like a women's studies department.

Title	‘It’s hard to have compassion’: can interventions change violent men’s behaviour?
Author	Clemicus
Upvotes	56
Comments	20
Date	June 8, 2024 11:36 PM UTC (2 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates/comments/1dbfzi3/its_hard_to_have_compassion_can_interventions/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates/its-hard-to-have-compassion-can-interventions.1520959 https://theredarchive.com/post/1520959

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