Do feminists understand the difference between not understanding feminism and not liking it?

lbspredh · 2015-06-15T15:16:41+00:00

To be fair you're never comparing like for like, on the feminist side they would exclude the more extreme people who claim to be feminists from the definition, and on the other side it is assumed that anyone claiming to be a feminist speaks for the movement. You want to avoid defining feminism but that's kind of the point, there is no agreed upon definition of the word and so it means very little

thats_not_what_i_hea · 2015-06-15T07:32:38+00:00

Yeah, some of them do. That's where the No True Feminist kicks in and the crazies are disqualified from being feminists even if they're the ones writing laws or college textbooks.

CursedLemon · 2015-06-15T14:38:55+00:00

Feminism is an interest group for women. That is the long and the short of it. Whether or not women need an interest group representing them, as opposed to men, is a matter for each individual to judge. Feminism doesn't need to take issue with the problems that men face; it's not about men, just like the NBA isn't about soccer. "Why aren't you doing more to bolster the status of soccer in America, commissioner Adam Silver?" "Uh, because we're a fucking basketball league, numbnuts." So as far as not understanding what feminism is, there's nothing to misunderstand, but there is plenty to misrepresent - on both sides.

On the flip side, I do not condone the idea that feminism is some kind of catch-all for every social justice topic to fall under, e.g. racism, LBGT rights, etc. This seems to be a common tendency, and it's stupid.

[deleted] · 2015-06-15T15:38:21+00:00

[permanently deleted]

Atlas_B_Shruggin · 2015-06-15T07:47:45+00:00

I am no feminist, I am more of a moderate, but in their defense, I think people who claim to understand it usually don't. The way I understand it - and I think my understanding is better - it is Kantian philosophy. Respect everybody's autonomy, treat them as ends not means etc. It is the essence of every lefty philosophy, and feminism is just one of the many of those.

I guess... there can multiple kinds of feminism. The kind I described is that when people are generally lefty, and then use these principles on women as a specific case of that.

I guess there is some other kind of feminism when some women don't give a hoot about lefty principles, they just demand whatever is good for them. I think this would not describe them well.

Test: ask them if they think in an LTR after 1 year if a man does not propose marriage is he an asshole. If they say no, they are the first type, if they say yes, they are the second type.

This is a good test, because people who care about lefty principles like autonomy don't think shit like marriage can ever be owed. But people who simply want whatever good is for women regardless of principles, usually think it is good to get proposed.

QraQen · 2015-06-15T10:23:06+00:00

This isn't a matter of Feminists but something done by all of humanity that just results from poor communication skills.

1) person x has complicated idea built off of years of experience and extrapolative thought

2) person y comes along and challenges person x's viewpoint

3) person x lacks the ability to communicate his own logical thought process

4) "Just go educate yourself shitlord."

wombatinaburrow · 2015-06-15T08:34:14+00:00

There are different types of disagreements here. Firstly, there are the people who don't understand intersectionality, and think that the feminist argument is that all women are oppressed by all men. Then there are the people who think that feminism is female supremacy. And then there are the people who think that women should just stfu and get back on their knres/in the kitchen and stop having uppity notions about being as good as men.

Which are you?

StabbyPants · 2015-06-16T02:34:01+00:00

This is my chief gripe with all the feminists I've met: if i disagree with their dogma, it's a result of my ignorance. There's no room for simple dissent.

BeautyinNothing · 2015-06-16T02:43:22+00:00

I think feminists just really hate the fact that they want to be hatefucked

belletaco · 2015-06-15T17:03:53+00:00

I guess I can't fathom someone disagreeing with it if they actually understood what many feminists are fighting for. Harsher sentences for female inmates, paternity rights, domestic violence and rape against men to be taken more seriously etc. It's not just for women, unfortunately the media is constantly portraying one side of it, but the women I know who are actually out there changing shit genuinely just want to be equal.

TheChemist158 · 2015-06-15T17:43:57+00:00

This is one of those understandings that some people have and some don't. Not able to understand this difference is something I use as a red flag. Some feminists have it, some don't, just like every other group. I've seen many red pillers also express this lack of understanding too. In fact, as group, they seem they be very guilty of this (and yes, feminists also tend to do this a lot). The line of reasoning that the person simply "doesn't understand" is a cheap way to avoid actually considering points that oppose your own.

haircombsnightmare · 2015-06-15T18:12:42+00:00

RedPill does the same. "You don't like it? No, you just don't understand it! AWALT RADFEM!"

dakru · 2015-06-15T15:25:57+00:00

Whelp, I'm back to calling for sources for this post. Not to you, OP, but to people who answer.

I think the term needs to be defined if it's usage suggests that it's going beyond it's original boundaries, namely, seeking sociological/political equality for women. Being against this means that you're against equality for women, which is a difficult position to defend, and you'd be forced to explain why. If someone is using the term beyond the boundary I mentioned, they'd be forced to explain how they're deriving their claims, too. Being able to explain your positions is for both sexes, and for people making any claim, ever.

I'd argue that it's a sloppy word choice to say that you're against an ideology when really you're against specific irrational members, or against a certain type of fallout. This is commonly done, mind you, but it's still verbally messy.

Most of the posts invoking feminism that I've seen in threads in this forum, and by redpillers elsewhere, indicate that they don't, in fact, have any idea what the term means. For example, I've seen it said outright that if you claim to be a feminist, then you also hate men, which is absurd.

wazzup987 · 2015-06-15T10:36:15+00:00

Cough cough femradebate

Title	Do feminists understand the difference between not understanding feminism and not liking it?
Author	obstinatebeagle
Upvotes	16
Comments	91
Date	June 15, 2015 6:24 AM UTC (11 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/39vz5q/do_feminists_understand_the_difference_between/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/do-feminists-understand-the-difference-between-not.281606 https://theredarchive.com/post/281606

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