Redpill and perfectionism

KombuchaEnema · 2022-11-21T00:58:30+00:00

The manosphere can be (and usually is) extremely toxic.

It’s one thing to call out toxic femininity and hold women accountable.

It’s another thing to completely undermine women’s value and treat us as lesser beings and think we should “know our place” as lesser beings. Which we aren’t.

Some men want a feminine woman, but they don’t genuinely appreciate or respect femininity. They just think feminine women are hot and easier to deal with (versus respecting the genuine value of femininity).

SunshineSundress · 2022-11-21T05:05:10+00:00

The vast majority of men in the manosphere are still in the anger phase. Ultimately, the goal of r/theredpill’s creators was to get these men to channel that anger into bettering their lives. Their goal was NOT to make it easier for women, because it’s a sub dedicated towards MALE goals.

If it hurts you to listen to that stuff, then stick around here instead. Those same creators of r/theredpill created r/redpillwomen because even though the underlying theory (which all revolves around the fact that men and women are different and want different things from each other) is the same, the delivery is VERY different for a reason. Being around anger may be helpful for men, but it might not be helpful for you. Male goals and female goals can be VERY different too (but not always, but let’s save that for another time). The women here will give you the truth if you ask for it, but their delivery will be a lot more palatable for you.

For instance, this:

To me, regardless of your past I think every deserves the affection that they need.

Is a bit of a flawed mindset. No one DESERVES anything. And even if people did somehow deserve a happily ever after, it doesn’t really matter. How does feeling like you deserve something actually get you what you want, in this case affection and a happily committed relationship?

That is similar to incels saying that they DESERVE a government mandated wife. Well sure, they can think that all they want, but until they stop their moaning and woe-is-me schtick and ACTUALLY do things that make women want to be their girlfriends and wives, it is just screaming into the void. If you want affection and commitment from men, you have to do things that make men WANT to give that to you. Just like how if men want a supportive, submissive woman, they will have to do things that will attract those kinds of women.

With that understanding, just don’t let those men take up space in your mind. Their message is not for you. We deliver a similar message, but it’s targeted towards women AND it’s geared towards women’s benefit above all else. So you can absolutely enjoy a bike ride with friends and get a job for your hobbies or whatever else you want to do.

P.S. One of the founders of r/theredpill wrote us a guide on how to still find romantic success even if you have a lot of partners, so no, you are not hopeless just because you have a high N-count. I much prefer his writing than what some rando with a microphone who has never even participated in the sub says. I find that Fresh and Fit and the like don’t REALLY grasp the nuances of RP theory and just parrot the most basic and controversial points anyways 🤷‍♀️

Glad-Discount-4761 · 2022-11-21T05:21:19+00:00

I went through same things you mentioned. I realised I was so stupid and started getting mad at women.I started getting mad that I am not man and still not satisfied with being woman.My youth is wasted,done stupid things. Now it is gone,so I just accepted that I am not going to get my dreams.I accepted I am not going to get man,my smv is -1 now because of disgusting wrinkles and all that stuff and suffering from endometriosis and hearing loss.Also I am asian where rp theory is probably more relevant.I was being mocked .Then I started having sympathy for incels.

I am bit realistic person so reality was easier for me to accept.So I just do jobs and trying to get rid of alpha Widowhood.At least you are aligned with femininity which I am not so maybe try to get into some social clubs or something.

You mentioned you are 24.Girl ,you are in prime,don't waste time and go for bit older man like man in early 30s if you want serious relationship with financial settled man.

sunglasses90 · 2022-11-21T14:29:55+00:00

I think when society as a whole has adopted a fairly degenerate lifestyle for both men and women then redpill content/standards can seem like perfectionism and difficult to achieve.

Nobody is perfect and we were all raised by the similar types of families, community, and schools. None of us were taught redpill ideals. All it is is a set of ideas that you can use to try to improve yourself or your relationship. Being redpill isn’t necessarily better or more perfect, it’s just a set of idea that may help people find their place and purpose in the world. Just like any other set of ideas.

Finally, drive your life looking through the windshield, not the rear view mirror. You can’t move forward looking behind you. People can change direction and you can be whoever you want to be. But you have to put in the work to make those changes. Your past doesn’t doom you. Your reaction to your past will though. If you think you’re not worthy, you won’t be. Because nobody can do that work for you. It can only be you.

TheBunk_TB · 2022-11-21T14:57:28+00:00

" But no they still rather see them as worthless dirty creatures that don’t deserve love. "

Not quite. It is a mixed bag. The smart men among me will wish plenty of hurt women well instead of engaging. The ones that are working now to do better after a hiccup (or four) usually elicit neutral/positive responses. But a really bad track record with no sense of self work is a big no. It isn't worth my derision for my energy is better used elsewhere.

I am not someone to throw the judgement, nor am I on the market for that.

There is a level of disappointment in certain circles in that we seem to be missing potential members of a community, (friends, healthy neighbors, etc). I have said that.

(Without joking, I have had a ton of women throw themselves at me when I wanted to meet people and develop a sense of community, base of friends).

I stopped expecting women in their twenties to have an inkling what men wanted. I was surprised to meet women with a level of focus, but I also had to wade through those that lacked "direction". It took a conscious effort to do so.

CountTheBees · 2022-11-21T10:32:27+00:00

Reality check time. Yes, some manosphere men are harsh, but how many men IRL do you know like that? Most men are very bluepill, and will defend women on many things. And a lot of RP content creators are very nuanced and accepting - it's not as if they are all harsh.

What really opened my eyes was seeing so many manosphere guys lamenting not having a loyal, loving relationship and wishing they could have one. I've seen this sentiment expressed by Better Bachelor, Solomon II, and Roosh. And many many nameless men, even those in the anger phase readily admit this.

A common pitfall for RP newbies, is when they see a simple statement of preference for men - "I prefer women without <XYZ characteristic>" - it is often misunderstood as a complete rejection of XYZ characteristic! Or the belief, that one guy's rejection of XYZ speaks for all men. While men may have similar preferences, preferences are not dealbreakers. Guys are actually very happy to compromise for girls that have ABCD but not XYZ. It's a matter of gracefully accepting your flaws and focussing on things you can improve. It's very painful initially, because you have to let go of the fairytale notion that you are someone's "perfect partner" off the bat. Often there's a period of growth where the two people in a couple have to change to become the other's perfect partner. It's a bit like uni entry scores - they don't matter after you get in. Okay he's a tits man but you're flat chested. So you're not "perfect" for him. But when two people bond and grow together they can become perfect for each other, with work, and love, and kindness. His preferences can change to accommodate you! Things he thought were important no longer are - and vice versa.

Regarding your pickiness, there's really not much detail to go on. What exactly are you looking for? What do you think is unrealistic? I had the same fear as you - but I knew that what I wanted wasn't vain or shallow - it was rare, but not out of my league. Pickiness is only a problem when it's out of your league. I stuck to my guns and I'm very glad I did.

LateralThinker13 · 2022-11-21T14:51:35+00:00

To me regardless of your past I think every deserves the affection they NEED

This statement encapsulates the difference between men and women.

To a man, a person deserves the affection they EARN. Because men are doers. We don't deserve anything automatically. Our genitalia is mutilated at birth; we're treated as inferior women when raised by an all-female education system. We're taught to be women, not men, with activities like being active/ADD penalized, and gym removed from the curriculum. We are even graded lower than women for the same performance, so we have to strive even harder just to measure up.

So when a man in the manosphere sees a woman, 30 and tatted with kids, spouting "Where are all the good men?", they laugh. They see karma in action. They see JUSTICE. Don't tell these men that their laughter is wrong.

YOU should be laughing too. Because encouraging, or even forgiving, these women's behavior without them admitting responsibility for it (which they almost never do), isn't helpful. Because you do not deserve anything just for being alive/female. The sooner you get over that entitlement, the healthier you will be.

It’s like they expect us to spend our entire 20’s looking for and thinking about men.

What? In today's society, women DO focus on men - and men on women. Those who don't are the exception. Biology is powerful.

I also have sympathy for mgtow.

I suspect they do not want your sympathy. They want nothing to do with you.

We’re all just hurt people trying to protect ourselves and feel human.

It's hard to respect this statement when you come from female privilege.

I’m also wondering if I am too picky.

I guarantee it.

AutoModerator · 2022-11-21T00:28:31+00:00

Title: Redpill and perfectionism

Full text: I remember going through this phase of binge watching manosphere content.

Even though I agreed with something that were said, I couldn’t help but feel worthless no matter how much of a “good” and feminine woman I was. And of course the “empath” in me hated to see all the hopeless and highly critical comments on woman and that they’re all the same no matter what.

Like I feel sorry for women who might have wasted away their youth and now want to be a better person. Men don’t have to date these “washed up” women but have some grace for them working on healing their trauma. But no they still rather see them as worthless dirty creatures that don’t deserve love. To me regardless of your past I think every deserves the affection they need. It’s like they expect us to spend our entire 20’s looking for and thinking about men. That’s exhausting, I want to go on a nice bike ride with friends and have a job so I can pay for hobbies and activities to do while I’m waiting. I’m too old to be asking for money from my parents.

I have the same empathy for incels. Their unpleasant life experiences have made them that way and they’re stuck that way. I also have sympathy for mgtow. We’re all just hurt people trying to protect ourselves and feel human. But instead we choose to dehumanize just to feel human.

Just because you humanize someone doesn’t mean you’re encouraging or supporting their wrong doings or ways of thinking. You just understand why they are the way they are now and want to create a better environment for the next generation so they can choose better for themselves and just be a content human being.

Please for the sake of your mental health, don’t get caught up in the rage and hopeless part of groups and communities like this. Wanted to give up finding love because I didn’t want to disappoint men with all these high demands regardless of how much of a decent life I live. I’m feminine, nurturing I’m trying to stay fit and healthy (I’m a little chubby but not over weight)

I’m also wondering if I am too picky. Idk there’s just a certain type of man I prefer that I don’t see in most men these days (it’s mostly in older men) so I rarely find someone I’m into who’s close to my age. Even when I did, things didn’t work out (for reasons, otherwise we’d be dating still).

I’ve tried having an open mind but I just haven’t met someone that has stood out or helped me change my mind yet.

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cringe_but_not_a_sin · 2022-11-21T19:14:58+00:00

I think the final pill there is about femininity is that the most feminine thing you can do is be confident and love yourself. Because from the root of that comes all the outpouring of taking beautiful care of yourself, patience, kindness, and empathy that makes you so compatible and attractive to men.

The thing about website and YouTube traffic is whatever makes people the most emotional and insecure is what keeps them clicking. Manosphere youtubers thrive off men edging their rage at low value women.

But you are not a low value woman. You shouldn't even need to compare yourself to low value women. Remember that men at all ages desire companionship. A mature, emotionally intelligent 50 year old man knows he has no shot at the 22 year old models, but he can still find a satisfying companionship with a 40 year old woman, or even 50. Heck, a man might even date older than him if she adds immense value to his life. One of the greatest advantages nature has gifted women is our emotional intelligence, by default adds value to every woman regardless of age or appearance.

And the thing is, "It’s like they expect us to spend our entire 20’s looking for and thinking about men. " is not even true! The women who are obsessed with men have no sense of center and are hard to be with in a long term companionship. These hobbies and social circles are promoted in red pill women books because it gives you stability and joy that makes you an attractive long term partner!

I also think that men who are kind and generous to women don't advertise that outright. You have to see the subtle signs of it based on their work ethic and how they treat others. Men who are users and abusers have nothing to lose advertising their open slot for a girlfriend. Men don't become providers until they're settled in their careers, and even then, they have a bit of a learning curve to balance between "these women who are using me for money so I should tell her I'm poor" and "this woman who is genuine and I want to keep her no matter what it costs"

There is another flaw to manosphere commentors; men who hate on women are low-value themselves! So of course they attract women who use them for money or flings. They have little else to offer. Think about it, do you think someone who thinks of another human being as "washed up and unworthy of love" is going to have a good time in his own relationships? Even if he were with a nubile 22 year old model, she'll see through it and ditch him ASAP knowing he's going to "trade up" soon, but even a man's trading up has a limit. Men are aging too. They only hurt themselves when they hate others. When a woman sees a man is in it for the long haul, doesn't have woman-hating tendencies, then they have a beautiful long term mutually satisfying relationship.

Perfection is unattractive. Perfection is surface level. That girl may be exactly your type, red head, busty, short, whatever it is; but you like her for qualities that may fade or change over time. Becoming confident and secure in yourself is authentic, and that's more attractive than anything. Accepting your flaws/past and being the best human you can be regardless of them will make you more attractive than any woman trying to project an image of perfection by putting others down.

Nonetheless, I do encourage you to finish your weight loss journey, because men treat you so differently when you're stereotypically attractive. You may still be invisible to the "good men" so they hold you at arms length. The good men take care of themselves and expect you to, too. You only attract what you're worthy of. When I changed my appearance it was as if half of the population suddenly realized I was a human being. Pretty privilege is so fucking real it's insane, they really do live in another world... Being ugly is a signifier that you don't care about yourself or others (you don't care if your man is pitied for being with an ugly chick) or have some mental trauma. As part of self improvement and self love, you better yourself so you can have the best chances at a good quality of life. Sometimes taking good care of your outside appearance seeps into your inner world too, reminding your mind that you are worthy of being cared for. Once you escape the hateful manosphere, you realize there are a lot of flaws to their logic they're blind to, like how their hate for women only attracts self-hating women who act out in insecure, defeating, validation seeking ways.

ZPSCIENCE · 2022-11-21T21:32:03+00:00

>"We’re all just hurt people trying to protect ourselves and feel human."

This really resonated with me ❤️

wingsandclovers7 · 2022-11-26T19:44:37+00:00

I do agree with some of your perspectives but I also think balance or understanding all sides to a point is critical for a more "effective" perspective.

I think that while it is true that were all essentially "alone" in this world, it's also true that were all connected.

If it does no harm to you, and you can afford to help out someone or teach others about something at no significant cost to yourself, I think the right thing to do is influence others towards positivity. Yet, they need to learn to lead themselves still, if they do not already have a strong leader in their lives that wants to sacrifice their time and energy.

This world can be a cruel world, it is very unforgiving, and I generally think that everyone gets what they sow. Weakness, or making the wrong decisions usually gets punished (even though you feel pleasure in the short term; i.e. alcohol, drugs, etc.... Yet it's also true there's beauty in the world as well.

Everyone has their own problems, economically, spiritually, and socially, things are much worse than the "good old days" I believe, and were getting poisoned from all sides. The foods, the entertainment, emf, etc. So I believe everyone has some deep seated anger or negativity issues that sometimes they have a hard time addressing.

This is part of the reason I like to be alone, and only interact with others when it is needed, or when I can do something to influence others with no real cost to myself.

Burdening others with your problems doesn't do any good for you or others, and taking on others burdens are the same. A lot of people have their own traumas and problems, but we all need to work them out ourselves... I believe, especially for us guys.

I believe that a lot of times, when guys talk about girls without baggage or something, it's usually because these types of girls are detrimental to your physical, spiritual, and emotional health in the long run (The love is of the type that doesn't build up each others, just the opposite, I guess you might respond with, can't you be more of a strong leader to lead the girls in the opposite way? but my opinion is that you need to have enough motivation, or the feelings to be "real", and those types of women don't usually elicit those feelings, guys have feelings too). They don't have enough self-control, and wisdom and essentially they're only value is beauty (of the energetically strong sexed type, most of the times the charisma that calls on lust, not love). Or they're smart, and have lots of wisdom but they only use it for self-gain, without regard to others (These types of people are obviously not good for long term relationships).

For girls, one of the advantages that they have is that as long as they're homely to look at, their will be some type of guy that's willing to deal with you, you just have to play your cards right.

Title	Redpill and perfectionism
Author	Waxflower8
Upvotes	45
Comments	25
Date	November 21, 2022 12:28 AM UTC (3 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/RedPillWomen
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/RedPillWomen/comments/z0k9hs/redpill_and_perfectionism/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/RedPillWomen/redpill-and-perfectionism.1140792 https://theredarchive.com/post/1140792

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