Convince me I'm wrong. Please. I need to hear it.

thrw2 · 2013-12-10T23:45:02+00:00

It's not about selling out, dressing nicer, or any bag of tricks to help you get women.

It's about deciding for yourself what kind of person you want to be, and working hard to improve in that direction.

Your problem is you are complacent. You seem to think improvement is "compromising" yourself. If you truly think you can't be improved then you wouldn't be here with a clear desire to get better results.

You don't have to compromise who you are to get better. But being good with women is a skill. If you don't put time into it you probably won't get results out of it. Thankfully, retaining your sense of self and becoming good with women aren't mutually exclusive. Actually, learning how to express who you are more honestly will even help you. That's why Models by Mark Manson is so often recommended here.

Bottom line: You can be a better version of yourself. Put time into it and see the results. If you think you're as good as it gets right here, then settle in, because your results won't change.

2013-12-10T23:52:17+00:00

It'll require dressing in a way in which I've not done before,

What's wrong with that? Are you afraid you'll forget your true nature because you put on a pink sweater?

acting in ways that make me uncomfortable

Only if you're uncomfortable with moving forward with women.

You have to realize that if you want a girl to like you, you can't dress and act like a homeless schizophrenic child; you need to dress and act like a man. Maybe that means changing (read: improving) yourself. You have to make a choice, though. Do you value girls or your unique sense of style more?

MiggyEvans · 2013-12-11T00:07:26+00:00

I feel you OP. I also love genuineness. It can feel like you're acting "more interesting" to get girls but it's also denying yourself.

I used to feel like this too, until someone put it in a certain light for me.

As Teddy Roosevelt said, "nothing in life worth having was ever achieved without effort".

You wouldn't expect things at your job to just suddenly fall into place because you're so perfectly attuned for the work. You wouldn't expect to be healthy without diet and exercise.

So why do you think dating and relationships are any different? A good girl will love you for who you are, but it's unlikely that you'll meet somebody who just automatically fits with you straight away. How many friendships do you have that instantly clicked on every level. Do you have any friends who have annoying flaws that you ignore because you like them anyway?

Relationships, even with women, build over time. You don't have to act like a different person, but you need to hold a persons interest.

What is it about you that gets in the way? Anxiety? Social awkwardness? Fear? Low self worth? Well, what's wrong with fixing those things so that you can be yourself around a girl?

It's not about clothes, smooth talking and attitude. It's about respecting yourself, your value as a person and applying the same respect to her.

If you are waiting for a girl to show up and validate you as being "good enough" you will be waiting for a long time. If you buckle down and find your "good enough" on your own, then you can handle a relationship.

Good luck buddy.

thanks_alot · 2013-12-11T00:30:13+00:00

I'm a guy who's 27 who briefly tried seduction techniques and just stumbled across this subreddit again. I'm mostly rejected seduction techniques, so let me say a few things that may be controversial here.

As Kurt Vonnegut said, "we are what we pretend to be, so we must be careful about what we pretend to be." So, if you want to improve yourself, make sure you truly improve yourself as a human being. Rather than trying to create a glitzy image of yourself to hide your insecurity, work on your self-confidence in a deep, lasting sense. Find stuff you're passionate about. Try to stop basing your self esteem on other people's opinions. Listen to your soul and follow your conscience.

Similarly, if you want to be interesting, start actually pursuing things you are interested in. Learn how to conquer fear and become a better human being.

Really, the only thing I've gotten from seduction is:
1) Dressing well is very important (but make sure to develop your own style and not just mindlessly conform or dress in a way that makes you feel like a tool.)
2) Physical touch is important
3) Confidence is everything

Good luck! I think the most important thing to remember is that you always must be someone you are proud of. If you become someone you're ashamed of, this will actually erode your self-confidence and bankrupt your soul. Become someone you'd like to know and hang out with.

philatanus · 2013-12-11T01:20:20+00:00

Keep in mind a lot of things aren't enjoy a at first. Jumping in cold water, learning to dance, trying new food (for some) / music etc.

RoquefortCheese · 2013-12-11T02:18:19+00:00

No sales pitch. All the advice here and elsewhere is take-it-or-leave-it.

(Note that I'm not angry. I just kinda wrote the following in a confrontational tone.)

You're worried that by following advice you found on the internet you'll be doing some kind of act. Somehow "acting" is un-genuine. Well guess what? We, as people, are always acting. When you tell a story and pause for dramatic effect, that's acting. When you are giving a friend a hard time and you give them an exaggerated look, that's acting. When you quote Anchorman or say "that's what she said", that's acting. All acting techniques are communication tools; and all communication tools are acting techniques.

When you write poetry do you get all bent out of shape because you stole iambic pentameter or haiku from someone else? Are you bothered by your use of words that Shakespeare made up? Do you get upset at yourself for using someone else' idea of the coffee date? When your last gf bought you that purple sweater you hated, but then you learned to love it, did that make you un-genuine?

In the words of the great Levare Burton, "Don't take my word for it;" try it yourself. If it doesn't work out for you, go try something else. Are you afraid that these ideas will pollute your mind and irreversibly change you? You're an adult capable of his own free-thinking.

Remember that nothing is permanent.

edited.

Reddit_SLC · 2013-12-11T02:26:03+00:00

It's about making YOURSELF more attractive to women. I think you are thinking about this wrong. If a girl got more fit/better looking, you would certainly be more interested, right? So if you improve your seduction game with women, you get similar results.

surfinfan21 · 2013-12-11T02:29:18+00:00

I have to agree with you. The rest of the comments are really generalist along the lines of improvement doesn't equal compromising. Which is not wrong. But I think you have a point to. I see people all the time "acting" alpha to pick up woman. If your beta by nature there's no reason to change your life to impress women. However if improvements are things such as learning something new like how to cook or another language I don't see anything wrong with that. Trying something new is a great way to meet and connect with a new demographic of women. Also you are not compromising a sense of personal identity. I think at the very least it's a very important topic to be self aware of. Always be true to yourself.

JustDoItPus · 2013-12-11T11:26:16+00:00

Noticed we don't tell you how you dress. We tell you to get nice clothing that YOU LIKE. You are still yourself because u choose that outfit because you think it looks good on you. Changing your clothes is not compromising yourself as long as you like the new clothes. Now apply that concept to everything else. U use the routine that you like or the routine you see yourself doing.

2013-12-12T01:05:11+00:00

This is why I like to listen to the guys who advocate a more 'authentic' type of game.

There's a video by Julien from RSD where he says, what would it take for a neckbearded dungeon and dragons type guy to score a hot girl. Imagine him going up to a 10. Just picture that. What's his body language like? How does he speak? In all likelihood, you imagined him awkwardly walking up and trying to act cool, and subsequently looking like an idiot. Hes trying to act like someone hes not. But what if this same dude just owned his shit, came up to her, brimming with confidence, and authoritatively said "what up girl. Check out my magic cards"

She might get weirded out and tell him to get away. But, imagine this dude at a club/party, just getting wild, having a blast, showing all the girls his magic cards, makin it rain on them with his cards, and just being a fun, crazy dude to be around. He'd probably get laid. And this is a good way to approach pick up in my opinion. Just find what you love, have fun with it, and around girls amplify the fuck out of it, to where your just having unreal levels of fun with girls following you and having good times on their own.

Shubrook · 2013-12-14T20:05:14+00:00

Do you watch 'How I Met Your Mother'?

When college hipster Barney got his heart crushed by his first girlfriend, did he sell himself out? Or did he become the most Legen Dary Barney that Barney could be?

Hands down, he became the best Barney.

When you play a sport, you don't just make up your own set of rules - the other people you are playing with will ostracize you. Are you selling yourself out to adhere to the rules of the sport?

Passerines · 2013-12-16T05:09:05+00:00

Go read Models.

tingerwoods · 2014-01-14T06:58:49+00:00

It doesn't mean that if you need to improve yourself, you also need to change everything who you are. It is definitely not! You just need to try new things and step out of your comfort zone for you to attract girls without doing any game.

http://enticethem.net

ragesbastardson · 2013-12-11T18:24:57+00:00

Take some DMT or Psilocybin mushrooms, OP. You'll soon see that all your fears are for naught.

Every single ounce of you wants to excel and approach life in an optimum fashion. However, like everyone, there are irrational fears that hold us back and cause us to stray. Do not worry! Concentrate on the good qualities that seduction brings you. Approach women as a new opportunity to show your best self.

LiftBodyUpThenDown · 2013-12-11T03:15:53+00:00

I would recommend considering what your appearance says about you. Your body type, your choice to groom, your clothing choices. They represent the way you like to appear to others visually, which says something about you.

joshsway · 2013-12-11T00:05:42+00:00

Self improvement is not selling out. Doing things because other people might like or appreciate them is not selling out. It's called not being selfish. As far as fashion, I wrote about that here: http://www.joshsway.com/articles/view/fashion-is-for-others Fashion isn't for you, it's for other people. But really, doing something because other people might like it or appreciate it is not "selling out".

Title	Convince me I'm wrong. Please. I need to hear it.
Author	TracerBullet_11
Upvotes	5
Comments	19
Date	December 10, 2013 11:24 PM UTC (12 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/seduction
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/seduction/comments/1sl6t5/convince_me_im_wrong_please_i_need_to_hear_it/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/seduction/convince-me-im-wrong-please-i-need-to-hear-it.1362837 https://theredarchive.com/post/1362837

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