Is it true that most women are sexually submissive and have rape fantasies?

tullia · 2024-02-12T00:57:02+00:00

Only the abstract is there, but ...

This is one study from 2009 of 355 women that says it found higher rates than previous researchers, meaning it's not a lot of women and it's a bit of an outlier
In it, 62% of women reported having had a rape fantasy ever, not having them on an ongoing basis
Half of women who did report having ever had them — so ~30% of the women surveyed — did so every three months or less, and only 14% reported doing so weekly or more (it looks like 14% of all the surveyed women, not 14% of the 62% who ever had one)

So the answer to your question is no, not in any serious sense. A majority of women in the study had a rape fantasy at least once at some point, yes. On the other hand, only a third said they had these fantasies even occasionally. Only three in twenty had them weekly or more.

In addition ...

About 10% of the rape fantasies were and frightening and largely not arousing to the fantasizer (or, put another way, "aversive rape fantasies ... usually involve the use of force to coerce sex and often contain painful violence with no sexual arousal")
45% were erotic and another 45% a combination of erotic and aversive, but erotic rape fantasies "typically involve low to moderate levels of fear with no realistic violence," meaning they're usually not about being seriously physically injured or otherwise being at threat of harm

Both of these in turn mean that a small number of these women had rape fantasies that were more like intrusive thoughts about being hurt, not pleasant sexual fantasies, and that the women who did get turned on by rape fantasies were likely not getting aroused by the thought of being in real danger. And, again, only about 15% were having these fantasies weekly or more.

Finally, sexual submissiveness is about the type of sex you want to have, not the kind you don't. Sexual submissives don't want to be truly forced to have sex, be seriously injured, have pregnancy scares, or be given STDs.

Maybe you're not looking for proof that women really want to be hurt and forced into sexual servitude. If you are looking for such prood, this study isn't that proof.

operation-spot · 2024-02-11T23:44:32+00:00

I personally don’t think it’s widespread but regardless, a r@pe fantasy is not submission. If you as (presumably) a man want to be a dom, go to a BDSM club but don’t except that from everyone you encounter.

Truthteller1995 · 2024-02-12T00:32:30+00:00

It's kind of like how many of us have hospital fantasies. When push comes to shove, most of us would not want to be in that situation.

VisceralSardonic · 2024-02-12T00:36:59+00:00

I can’t access the full text, so I’d be interested to know how they operationalized “rape fantasy.”

The article summary does say that the study analyzed a few hundred undergraduate students, presumably in one place, and that they’re including people for whom the “fantasy” was entirely aversive rather than erotic in the slightest. That’s a hell of a leap to “most women have rape fantasies” or sexual submission, which I don’t see mentioned. This study, at least in the brief glimpse of it I get, seems to be the equivalent of “we asked 400 students in scandanavia whether they think about eating lutefisk (whether or not they like it)” and generalizing that to “62% of all people everywhere love lutefisk.”

I’ve heard that statistic quoted as a HUGE driver of people’s attitudes towards rape, which is fucking crazy when I see that it’s an inaccessible article without much nuance or generalizability. Does that include, for instance, women having a dream about sex that turns into rape? Flashbacks of actual rape? “I want my husband to want me so bad that I play hard to get and he convinces me”? A “what if this happened this way” imagined situation?

More than ANY of this, no matter how they define rape fantasies, fantasies don’t mean that women fundamentally want to get raped, or that rape isn’t traumatizing. Rape is horrifically traumatizing, even when people (children, for example) don’t know enough about rape to understand what happened to them or why it might be bad. Rape is traumatizing even when the person has previously had rape fantasies, when the person knows or trusted their assaulted, or when the person is attracted to their rapist. It’s hateful and damaging to anyone of any gender to act like their rape isn’t harmful because of something about who they are as a person. As someone who works in trauma and recovery, the only things that mitigate effects of rape are things like coping mechanisms, support, internal locus of control, and professional help. Not whether or not they’ve fantasized about being tied up at some point in the past.

Grouchy_Toe2404 · 2024-02-12T00:42:59+00:00

What concerns me is why do you want to know? Why do red pillers care?

Studies like this are interesting, for sure, but I'm afraid that many people care about this only because they want to justify violence against women. Realistically, the only women whose fantasies are relevant to you are your consenting partners' who choose to share them with you.

NegativeKarmaVegan · 2024-02-12T01:33:34+00:00

I don't think you can extrapolate the findings about 355 young American college students to all women on Earth.

But I've heard this is not an uncommon fantasy.

agreable_actuator · 2024-02-12T00:36:39+00:00

Abstract

This study evaluated the rape fantasies of female undergraduates (N = 355) using a fantasy checklist that reflected the legal definition of rape and a sexual fantasy log that included systematic prompts and self-ratings. Results indicated that 62% of women have had a rape fantasy, which is somewhat higher than previous estimates. For women who have had rape fantasies, the median frequency of these fantasies was about 4 times per year, with 14% of participants reporting that they had rape fantasies at least once a week. In contrast to previous research, which suggested that rape fantasies were either entirely aversive or entirely erotic, rape fantasies were found to exist on an erotic-aversive continuum, with 9% completely aversive, 45% completely erotic, and 46% both erotic and aversive.

LiuoTT · 2024-02-12T00:56:59+00:00

I hope you're not asking for the wrong reasons. I'll assume your good faith here.

Most people with r*** fantasies are often victims of se**** assault. It can be seen as a way to deal with trauma. It's about feeling in control of the situation. When some of the trauma comes from being powerless, it is a way to come to terms with a traumatic experience in controlled conditions. It's not like they actually want to be in this situation again. I admit it's quite sad.

floracalendula · 2024-02-12T00:57:00+00:00

NOPE

NOPE NOPE NOPE

NOPETOPIA

99power · 2024-02-12T01:13:35+00:00

So we’re gonna cherry pick one study from 2009 to generalize about all women now? Cool story bro. The interesting part of this is how only 14% of the women had them consistently, meaning you’re generalizing the 14% to the other 86%. In addition, around the same percent of men report having actually committed forcible intercourse (rape), so maybe there’s just a 10-15% of the population that has some underlying psychological factor pushing them in the direction of rape play (or actual rape).

Venustarr_777 · 2024-02-13T00:06:46+00:00

The answer is no and I really despise the term "rape fantasy"; it really pisses me off even if it's about submission. There's no consent when it comes down to rape. A fantasy or role play is consensual.

No one dreams of or get turned on thinking about getting raped.

UrbanChampion · 2024-02-11T22:52:51+00:00

Well. If you're into that kinda thing. Some guys...like to get the strap-on from women and told how worthless they are. That's ENTIRELY their business. Just leave them to their devices. "Different strokes, different folks".

oldcousingreg · 2024-02-12T01:09:01+00:00

You know that’s ridiculous.

CaptinSuspenders · 2024-02-12T09:55:48+00:00

Intuitively I think women have "ravishment" fantasies, meaning they want someone they're attracted to to be insanely turned on by them and expressing that physically.

SweelFor- · 2024-02-12T06:45:33+00:00

In what way does the research you linked not already answer your question?

TimelyBat4004 · 2024-02-18T03:15:59+00:00

...no. creepy men want this to be true. women cant have good sex unless they feel a healthy bond. this is why when husbands start slacking, the woman loses her sex drive.

LargeTry88 · 2024-03-04T16:26:25+00:00

I do have rape fantasies. But its also not "real rape". Its more likey I know Im horny as fuck and truly wan that dude to "force" me and give me pleasure, in a more gentle way (not besting the shit out of me). But yeah its a fantasy and not reality. Very different from actual rape. More like "rape play" aka its still consensual.

Title	Is it true that most women are sexually submissive and have rape fantasies?
Author	Cool_Position_6191
Upvotes	0
Comments	31
Date	February 11, 2024 10:47 PM UTC (2 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/ExRedPill
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/exredpill/comments/1aokw13/is_it_true_that_most_women_are_sexually/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/ExRedPill/is-it-true-that-most-women-are-sexually-submissive.1245169 https://theredarchive.com/post/1245169

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