Losing frame with my mother

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March 18, 2019
6 upvotes

I've been wanting to ask a question like this and was inspired to do so by today's post about OPs mother on MRP. My mother, the one who raised me to be a Mr nice guy, always succeeds in making me feel so small. The MRP stuff has been simple enough to implement with my wife and it gets easier by the day, but if I have to be honest I just can't figure out how to keep my mom from getting to me. She knows how to push my buttons because she put them there. She asks me specific questions about my life so she can criticize my answers so I find myself stammering for an explanation that won't make me look like the clueless helpless child she sees me as. Obviously she's been with me my entire life so I feel like she could see right through any of the MRP "tricks" because she knows exactly what she shaped me into. I don't see any posts on this sub in relation to how to handle an overbearing mother , just wives, and I'm sure we all have one. How do you detach yourself and get over all the shit someones own mother has put them through?


Post Information
Title Losing frame with my mother
Author Youdontgottadenyit
Upvotes 6
Comments 33
Date 18 March 2019 10:23 PM UTC (2 years ago)
Subreddit askMRP
Link https://theredarchive.com/post/222741
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/askMRP/comments/b2ozx0/losing_frame_with_my_mother/
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Red Pill terms found in post:
frame
Comments

[–]BobbyPeruRed Beret17 points18 points  (1 child) | Copy

She asks me specific questions about my life so she can criticize my answers so I find myself stammering for an explanation that won't make me look like the clueless helpless child she sees me as.

RP101 stuff here. Fogging and pressure flipping are your moves when she asks these questions. They are not “tricks.” They are more effective ways of handling it. For example, when she asks a set up question, pause and say something like “ I’m not sure. What do you think?” Use STFU also, just like you would with an LTR or wife

[–]haraishi3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

Agree especially the word "tricks" Your not tricking anyone you are moulding yourself to be a better man

[–]Redpillbrigade1710 points11 points  (0 children) | Copy

The moment you start putting your poker face on and stop taking her so seriously is the moment you begin to control the interactions.

Also - slowly if you must - build some detachment. She should not know all the details of your life.

She’s your mommy so the two of you will have this dance for the rest of your lives (esp. if she’s got issues and likes to keep controlling your little ass) where you subconsciously go into being a little boy, and she’s the nurturing protective momma. You must break that. Go away for a few months where there’s no phone signal/ internet if you have to, but you must create your masculine, adult and confident self - otherwise you’ll always be a little boy.

Good luck.

[–]UEMcGillI am become McGill, Destroyer of Blue Pill8 points9 points  (1 child) | Copy

AWALT. You're familiar with the term right? AWALT.

If you feel like the advice given here is nothing by tricks you haven't internalized it yet.

So many people make the mistake of sitting across from their parent and forgetting that they aren't 12 anymore. Remember you are the prize and will only keep people in your life that add value.

My mom is always very respectful to me and my family. The one time recently she wanted to start talking about some stupid drama going on with the other hens in my family I shut that shit down. "Ma, I don't want to hear about this shit. Is this what we came for dinner for?" She knew the deal and it was over.

You need to reset your boundaries with your mom.

She knows how to push my buttons because she put them there. She asks me specific questions about my life so she can criticize my answers so I find myself stammering for an explanation that won't make me look like the clueless helpless child she sees me as

This right here. You won't own your own issues. She pushes buttons because you have them, not because she put them there. She gives you shit for your choices because you DEER, not because of the choices you made.

Own your shit. Enforce boundaries. These aren't tricks.

[–]NoCoast821 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Remove the fuckin buttons, this is all 101 level stuff, but concise evaluation of of the situation. Gonna keep that idea in the back of my head

[–]justpickanyusernameRed Beret14 points15 points  (2 children) | Copy

It doesn't matter who you gave your balls to (wife or mother). It is up to you to take them back. It's called manning up and not being a pussy.

Same rules apply with frame and handling your mother, wife, LTR, 13 year old daughter, whoever. Your just not trying to fuck you mom. Your not trying to fuck your mom are you?

[–]MrChad_ThundercockBig Red Machine1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Dude you been killing it lately. Like your responses.

[–]meetinnovatorsadrian12 points13 points  (2 children) | Copy

There's a huge subreddit for dealing with difficult parents here: https://www.reddit.com/r/raisedbynarcissists/

One answer is to go low contact or no-contact for a while. Then it is easier to come back and establish a strong frame, think of this as a parents version of dread game.

If you aren't able to establish long term healthy boundaries with your parents it may be better not to re-establish contact.

[–]Chinchilla_the_Hun0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Definitely check out this sub OP, even if your mom isn't a certified narcissist (based on info you provided, I'm betting she is, just not properly diagnosed). You have to wade through a lot of "woe is me" and other attention-seeking posts, but there are actionable points. There are also resources on "toxic parenting" out there to consider. But like most others here are telling you, don't treat her any differently than any other woman with RP tactics.

[–]RPeed6 points7 points  (9 children) | Copy

Go zero contact for 3-18 months, low contact thereafter and treat every interaction like a WISNIFG script.

I had to do this a few years ago with much of my family. Zero explanation before, during or after it.

It works. It will scare you how easy it is.

[–]meetinnovatorsadrian0 points1 point  (8 children) | Copy

How is your relationship with your family now? Are you still low contact or have things been resolved?

[–]RPeed4 points5 points  (7 children) | Copy

Very good. Two perfect grandparents, one sibling with mutual respect. One that needs to remain on low contact. That is just how it is going to be.

No contact prepares everyone for new behaviours. But like people say wrt wives: avoidance only gets you so far. You have to stand your ground eventually to set the new dynamic.

I am an assertive motherfucker but I got a lot out of WISNIFG anyway. It’s not “tricks”, it’s a thought process. Drilling the techniques takes the emotion out of exchanges. Then when you stop getting tongue tied, your brain stops getting frustrated.

Now we all get on fine. It is mutually beneficial to all concerned. My wife asked for and implemented a lot of advice with her domineering mother with good results too.

Read the sidebar!

[–]PersaeusRed Beret1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

it’s a thought process. Drilling the techniques takes the emotion out of exchanges. Then when you stop getting tongue tied, your brain stops getting frustrated.

everybody wants to be a gangsta until it comes time to do gangsta shit. - Tony Soprano

enjoying something requires competence, competence requires practice which is not always enjoyable - my wife

[–]RPeed0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Haha, well put both.

[–]meetinnovatorsadrian0 points1 point  (4 children) | Copy

Thanks a lot for this. I think you should consider posting more about this topic. The raisedbynarcissists subreddit mostly ends up labelling family negatively and generally not repairing relationships. You have much better insight.

[–]RPeed1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy

Might do bro. But read WISNIFG if you haven’t: there are literal scripts in it for people dealing with family.

I’ve seen that sub before btw and it seems like and invitation to victim puke. That never works. My wife’s folks are textbook narcissists (maybe that’s why she married me?!) but she got nowhere until adopting a little praxeology.

[–]meetinnovatorsadrian1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

I've half read WISNIFG and will be finishing it soon, and will practice the material.

I think your approach is much better. I'm surprised this issue isn't discussed more here and in other subreddits - raisedbynarcissists has 382k subscribers, here we have under 7k. I guess everyone prefers victimhood today.

[–]PersaeusRed Beret0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

water, and people mostly, always follow what appears to be the easiest path.

it's why being a top 10% man isn't really that hard

[–]SiegreicherMarsch5 points6 points  (1 child) | Copy

In WISNIFG a lot of the example dialog is the practitioner talking to their mom, so if you haven't read that you should check it out.

[–]Startlivingfornow3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy

Your mother is a woman.

[–]mrpthrowa2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

Top tip - treat your mothers questions as nothing but shit tests.

Top tip 2 - treat her like a 5 year old. Your mother, however much you love her, has exactly the same behaviour of any woman, and will want to excercise control over you by shit testing you.

Break free, and do not give a fuck.

Make your presence scarce, if you don't like what she says, cut the conversation short and move on. She'll Pavlov learn that pissing you off means no you around her.

It will take a while, your mother will learn to respect, and she will love you more for it trust me.

[–]PersaeusRed Beret2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

how to handle an overbearing mother , just wives, and I'm sure we all have one.

speak for yourself faggot. i lined my mom out when i was 15

[–]donmcde2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy

You still view your mom as some wise sage. Do you have any neices/nephews in your family? Have you ever told them something offhandedly and have them accept it 100% without questioning it in the least bit? They just assume you have it together and know what you're talking about because you're older. You need to realize that your mom isn't any wiser than any other grown up in the universe.

Thought experiment: Your mom had some friends her age when you were a kid. What your mom said was gospel, but you'd question what her friends say to you. Your mom's friends also has kids. To their children, they're the wise ones and your mom is the adult friend whose wisdom could be questioned. It's all a matter of perspective. You need to grow up and cut the umbilical cord.

[–]SorcererKingMod / Red Beret1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

Sadly, the same dynamics apply with your mom. He (or she) who cares least has the power. If your mom did something shitty, do you have the balls to never speak to her again? Would you be able to write her off and not even show up to her funeral? If not, looks like you'll be accepting her control until one of you is gone.

This doesn't mean you have to hate her. It just means you have to be your own person, worthy of self-respect, who doesn't let people treat him badly. You might need to pop over to /r/NMMNG for some remedial training.

[–]alpha-zach1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy

“For an explanation”

Do you explain things to your wife too? Instead of stammering you prob just get a deer in the headlights look.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

It's funny, I had the opposite experience growing up in that I always fogged , AAed my mom. I think it's because I gradually learned it worked , plus she laughed and who doesn't want to make their mom laugh.

Truly though, you have to stop volunteering any information. As weird as it may sound you have to O.I. as well and grow a pair and limit exposure if she oversteps or you find you can't control your emotions. She's like any other person and will learn if she wants to be involved in your life it has to be in a particular way.

Look at the situation as a sitcom. You're the guy going for laughs. And if it isn't from her, it's from some audience member that is laughing along with you at home.

Actually this is how I view a lot of my interactions (thanks to growing up with sitcoms in the 70's / 80s).

And you have an advantage that you CAN control the situation with more relaxation/giving less shits about it...

My wife has an overbearing and narcissistic mother. Her son (and I to be honest) never had an issue with aa/am pressure flip, ribbing, dismissal etc. but my wife had to cut her off because these behaviors are mostly guy oriented and the mother/daughter type of projection dynamic is different. So it should be easier to fix.

You think your mom wants you to do what she advises. I bet she wants you to do the thing you pick and not care what she advises because ...then she can trust you can handle your affairs. And if you feel the need to share under questioning then surely you need mommy's help?

Amalt?

I had a friend who had the stereotypical overbearing Jewish mother. As a full grown adult I'd watch them come over to his house and he'd turn from this pretty self assured person into a whiney middle schooler. The mom would criticize , he'd get mad and whine. It would have been comical if not so disturbing to see a 30 year old devolve. If he had for one second joked , relaxed or deflected, I could tell it would have gone different. I remember even cracking wise a few times and she would usually instantly change demeanor and laugh with a shooing motion at me.

Also /u/rpeed is spot on if you can't gradually steer this, cut her off then gradually baby step back in. Ready to pull the ripcord again at the first sign of breach and reset for another set amount of time.

[–]John92491 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Dont take her shit or any woman's shit (tests) so seriously. Have fun with em be funny do not give a fuck.

I get much better results when I can do or say something funny or make fun of them than when I try to be a redpill hardass.

The most naturally redpill guy I know used to pick his mom up and set her in the fridge when she "got out of line". It was funny they had a laugh he showed me pictures.

I have noticed that trend with other alpha type guys they all have fun giving mom shit while being masters of their universe. Their relationships they have with their moms are better than other guys who give a fuck what mommy thinks.

[–]friendandadvisor1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Let me see..."How do I stop spilling my fucking guts every time my mom asks me a question...what is The Trick?"

[–]MrChad_ThundercockBig Red Machine1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

“can't figure out how to keep my mom from getting to me”

It’s a shit test. Treat it as such.

Doesn’t matter it’s from your mom. She’s a woman.

How old are you.. 16?

You haven’t swallowed the Red Pill yet.

[–]red-sfpplusHard Core Red0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

overbearing mother

Faggot. My mom is 2nd generation Sicilian here in the US. I got my ass beat by a wooden spoon until I was 16 when I fucked up.

It is amazing to me how poor a job WHITE women do of raising men, where other colors and races Red Pill their little men from birth.

Beyond that - are you over 18? Ghost her if you need to.

Unless mommy is still paying your bills. Bet she is...

[–]RPeed0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

1st gen Irish mom. Proficient in wooden spoon and slipper.

There are still serious white women.

[–]RowzyUnicorn0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Ll

[–]screechhaterRed Beret0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

You seriously need to ask yourself if you are living for yourself or her ?

Which is it ?



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