[Meta][Q4All] Is Elite Overproduction (Lawyer Glut) Responsible for the Proliferation of both Red Pill and Blue Pill ideology?

sublimemongrel · 2017-01-23T18:41:30+00:00

A) how is this about PPD? B) Practicing lawyers produce law, these lawyers protect the rights of citizens and businesses and everything/everyone in between. Maybe this isn't "production" the way you are using it, but it's not meaningless either. Neither is it just "arguments". Case law is law. C) Where are you getting that lawyers "get bored" and argue amongst themselves? Practicing lawyers argue on behalf of clients and/or the state. Money and ethical obligations are much more apart of this rather than boredom. D) I agree there's too many lawyers, but lots of them end up fizzling out due to oversaturation in the market, like with many other careers. IMO, the bigger problem are lawyers who cut corners/take too many shortcuts and don't fight hard enough. At least in my industry.

IamTheWalkingMenu · 2017-01-23T19:12:19+00:00

Engineers don't produce things and neither do lawyers. Entrepreneurs flush with money from hedge funds are the producers and innovators. Lawyers and engineers work for those kinds of guys.

Lyanina · 2017-01-23T19:01:41+00:00

Rather than producing things, like engineers do, they only produce arguments while everyone else gets fucked over until they either create a revolution and kill the lawyers (communism), each other (race riots), or people in other countries (terrorism)

Assuming this is true, ELI5 how it explains "the proliferation of both Red Pill and Blue Pill ideology." I mean, Red Pillers want to get laid, Blue Pillers think women are people, and it's all the lawyers' fault?

SirNemesis · 2017-01-23T19:11:51+00:00

Whoa somebody else who reads Peter Turchin??? Hi! ^{_^}

The kind of acrimonious arguments between extreme ideologies we're seeing at the moment is definitely an obvious symptom of the disintegrative phase of Structural Demographic Theory that we're in (and the 50 year bigenerational cyclical peak of violence that we're approaching in 2020). There is obvious data that elite overproduction is happening, as well as popular immiseration (median real wages for men have been declining for decades, perhaps the biggest driver for the manosphere). And these secular cycles tend to be accompanied by SMP features such as divorce and single-motherhood.

Unfortunately, this doesn't just result in online arguments but also in real world violence, some of which we're seeing with, for example, BLM devolving into riots, right-wing militants doing an armed insurrection in Malheur wildlife refuge, etc. See http://peterturchin.com/cliodynamica/quantitative-prediction-political-violence-2020s/

fiat_lux_ · 2017-01-23T19:28:59+00:00

/u/SirNemesis , /u/Frensel, and I talked about this for a bit on the IRC, so they might have more to weigh in.

IMO, Turchin isn't the first person to come up with this idea. This is a variation on the age old idea that rising middle class is what causes revolutions. Generally, when a country's GDP per capita reaches the 8k-15k USD range (adjusted for inflation of course), the country "democratizes" (peacefully or violently).

There's various reasons for this, but when a country reaches that level, it's correlated to more people being educated and kids being raised with higher order concerns. They're not being kept busy starving or making ends meet. These can be compared to the various "elite" groups (or elite wannabes) in Turchin's model.

I think overgrown middle class causes empires to collapse.

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Atlas_B_Shruggin · 2017-01-23T20:08:18+00:00

Do you read Peter turchins cliodynamics blog?

despisedlove2 · 2017-01-24T02:09:44+00:00

BS.

I am an engineer and scientist by training and profession. Purple red pill.

People might come to PPD because they love to argue. They don't turn red pill for that reason.

Red pill are the men who didn't take their lives, and decided to question the hypocrisy instead, before quickly becoming hard realists.

Atlas_B_Shruggin · 2017-01-23T18:28:16+00:00

Title	[Meta][Q4All] Is Elite Overproduction (Lawyer Glut) Responsible for the Proliferation of both Red Pill and Blue Pill ideology?
Author	sunkindonut149
Upvotes	6
Comments	73
Date	January 23, 2017 6:26 PM UTC (9 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/5pqlht/metaq4all_is_elite_overproduction_lawyer_glut/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/metaq4all-is-elite-overproduction-lawyer-glut.270464 https://theredarchive.com/post/270464

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