What does commitment mean to you?

King_Booga · 2018-11-12T14:02:14+00:00

You're not the only one freaked out about this. This is one of the reasons a lot of men are hesitant to get married. There was no deterrent to keep her working on and staying in the marriage. She let her hypergamous nature take over and left. After years of being together the guy thought he knew her. Luckily and thankfully for this guy it worked out for him but for a lot of men it destroys their entire life on multiple levels.

This is the reality a lot of men face in today's world unfortunately

girlwithabike · 2018-11-12T16:09:21+00:00

Ultimately, you define for yourself what commitment means. Some people treat is very lightly for a variety of reasons. That doesn't mean that it has to be something you lightly undertake.

Throughout my relationship, before and after marriage, I would ask myself: "will I stay with him if things never change". That may be less relevant depending on your starting point. However, when I met my husband, he was working an overnight shift at a very blue collar job, living at home and putting the remainder of his time and money into school. We've lived in crappy apartments, we've both been unemployed and pinched pennies, we've been sick. Through all of that, I didn't want to be with anyone else.

Now that we've been through rough times together, I can't imagine fitting as well with another man. My dad once told me: when you are young, you are too poor to get divorced and then when times are better, you have been through so much that you don't want to get divorced. My mother is harpy and I wondered for years why he was still with her, but as an adult, I understand that sentiment (though still not why he stayed with her tbh).

As women, I believe we can allow ourselves to adapt to become his perfect mate. This is an aspect of femininity that many women shy away from. It's too vulnerable and it requires choosing the right man. If you shape yourself to fit into his life, commitment is easy because there is no other man for you. Hypergamy is curbed because there are so many years of growing with this man that no others can hold a candle.

After marriage I also locked myself in. He wanted me to get a tattoo for as long as we've been dating. It's not something I ever wanted and I joked that I needed a ring first. When we got married, I followed through fully aware that this would be next to impossible to explain in the dating market as it was my bridal bouquet and quite large. This isn't a recommendation - but it was how I showed my dedication to "forever". Technically, the law could now give me his stuff, but I'd permanently marked myself and couldn't reclaim my SMV in any easy way.

Finally, I was taught that staying married is a choice. You pick the right man and you realize that he will never be perfect because nothing is. Emotions come and go for all people and for women in particular. The feeling that you've "fallen out of love" or whatever the women in your post was thinking could just as easily be regained if she committed to the relationship and saw what her husband would do next. Just because he makes me crazy today, doesn't mean that will be the case tomorrow.

To me the red pill on commitment (for women) is a. there is no fairy tale, relationships are a choice and an effort b. there is no better man than the one you've already given a part of your life to and c. don't leave an exit strategy, in your heart or your plans.*

I don't know if any of that answered your questions but it's an interesting topic and those are my somewhat disjointed musing on commitment.

*I could get more into detail on this because planning for all possibilities is my job, but for this comment, I'll leave it here.

Jikira · 2018-11-12T16:05:06+00:00

Oh I remember you posting about your relationship some time ago. As I recall your man was very anti marriage. In my opinion, I think it is a bad ideal to propose.

I am saying this not because you are a women, but more so from the limited information I gleaned from your post.

You say he is committed to you he just doesn’t want to have to be committed to the government as well.

I feel a proposal would be kinda of too much. Do you think he might feel disrespected or pressured? Because this would be a very strong move to guy who clearly stated no on marriage.

If I were you, I would instead bring him the ideal that you would like to have a celebration of your love! A formal dinner/party where friends and family can stand as witnesses to your commitment to each other for example.

When I want something from my man, I try to inspire him to do it. For instance my boyfriend isn’t into the stereotypical romance stuff and thought I wasn’t into as well. Instead of telling what he should do. I told him what I like and the rest was up to him to do it or not.

I hope this helps!!!

PHOENIX_THE_JEAN · 2018-11-12T14:33:12+00:00

Okay. Several issues here. Going to do my best.

DO NOT propose to your man. DO NOT PROPOSE TO HIM.

The man should propose to you. Set up a conversation where you guys can talk about "your future". Before you do this, take a good, long look at yourself. A really good, long look and ask yourself what do you really want. This is the most important part. BE WILLING TO WALK AWAY FOREVER if the commitment conversation doesn't go the right way. 7 years is a long time to be together without having had the "where are we going? What's the future"? "Where's the ring?" talk. I REALLY HOPE you're not dating a married man or someone with a GF. From past experience (with answering this type of question), one of the MAIN reason guys don't propose is that you are the side-chick. My best friend's mother was in a "relationship" with a married man for 15 years. She found it IMPOSSIBLE to leave because she felt she was "over the hill" and she felt she couldn't attract other single guys. This insecurity kept her in that toxic, dead-end relationship forever. I don't know what these men are telling their mistresses to keep them coming back, but they will NEVER leave the wife for you. NEVER. Even if they spend more money on you than the wife.

Women and men are NOT the same. Women "age" out of fertility and women age out of their beauty, and this will affect you whether you like it or not. Whether you like it or not, some men are only interested in you when you look a certain way. Whether you like it or not, it is easier to get in a relationship with certain people when you're younger than it is when you're 36 or 39. You've kept yourself stuck in a 7 year relationship with such LOW prospects of long term success and you find that YOU are the one who has to propose. You are basically doing all the work of the guy. This isn't even a good look to project.

This is going to make me sound like a miserable, HORRIBLE, deplorable person but here it is. You know how you've had Certain Girfriends throughout life who've liked guys that treated them like ABSOLUTE SHIT? Yet they've continued to be super perfect barbie babes for the asshole, only to still get cheated on/dumped? You have any GFs like that? Well men are the same. IF you have a certain set of rules, and you enforce them seriously at all times, they will respect your rule. For example. If you sit down to have "the commitment" talk, and he basically disappoints you... Don't even waste time. Tell him VIA TEXT "Look this isn't working. I need (and insert quoted text from your rules) "I really thought that after 7 years, this relationship would be heading towards something permanent but it looks like we both want different things. Nothing's wrong with that but I can't do this anymore."

Turn your phone off and set up an Online dating profile. Use OkCupid. Get started meeting others immediately. DO NOT GIVE UP AFTER THE FIRST WEEK OF DISAPPOINTING MATCHES.

I KNOW it seems scary to move on but TRUST ME. After I dated my ex for NINE YEARS (engaged for SIX) and realized it wasn't going ANYWHERE - I met the love of my life. He's Taller, hotter, army vet, makes more money and proposed in 2 years, wedding date set for 10 months after the proposal. The reason this post stuck with me was that you sound like my fiance's EX.

They were together for 6 years. He never proposed to her. Never. In all fairness. SHE initiated their relationship, not him. She approached him and basically pursued him at his job for 8 months until he made it official. They moved in, and the dynamic was always shitty where she was basically pursuing him. He dumped her and within a year met me. I don't know if this i relevant or significant for you but that's the reason I feel he propose to me and hot her. I STRAIGHT UP Cornered him December of last year (around new years time) and told him that I love him, we were together for a year and a half, and it wasn't going anywhere, I tried to break up with him... blah blah blah. It was a BAD FIGHT. REALLY BAD FIGHT. But.... 2 months later and he popped the question.

I don't know man, I hope my story helps you. I don't know why men think or act this way. They just do.

merel-- · 2018-11-13T15:45:14+00:00

I tend to go for the ambitious, more wealthy men. I really appreciate a man who is successful, I think it's very sexy. I wouldn't leave if shit hit the fan and we lost everything. I would stay because I trust he can figure things out and get himself back on his feet. Although if he chooses to just stop working and travel the world on his savings or something dumb like that I would very much consider leaving. That is not what I signed up for.

Commitment to me is when both parties try their best to have a good relationship and to have the life both wanted at the start of the relationship. Which is why you vet for someone who wants the same at you.

You obviously want to get married but you are in an almost decade long relationship with a MGTOW. You will never marry him.

timeforstretchpants · 2018-11-12T15:00:16+00:00

Can you clarify your situation? What is your perspective about how to honor your man's place as leader with you proposing?

loneliness-inc · 2018-11-12T15:02:23+00:00

A woman who proclaimed to herself, to her family, to GOD that she'd stay with her man no matter what, through thick or thin, through rich or through poor, through good and bad, left because he wasn't ambitious in the way she wanted him to be ambitious.

Many women who say that mean: in riches but not in poverty, in health but not in sickness, in good but not in bad.

brooklynnbb · 2018-11-12T20:05:10+00:00

I just want 'something real'

And I get being attracted to certain things, that's why I'm like make sure it's real

I think if it truly is your once in a lifetime it would be real enough to survive that

AnarchoNAP · 2018-11-12T15:40:57+00:00

Commitment means I will stay unless it becomes morally untenable to stay. Like it would make me an accomplice to child molestation or something. Though this is what vetting is for. Commitment isn’t an emotion and it doesn’t matter if you don’t feel like it.

Do not propose.

Unless you were illegally young at the start of 7 years, 7 years is too damn long. Ask him about the future. If he is annoyed, vague, avoids making concrete statements, or is honest enough to say he doesn’t want marriage any time soon, then leave. Do not negotiate. Do not think about it. Do not linger on in hopes that he meant something other than what he said. Leave.

This example is why I think gender roles are important. Women with careers just don’t seem to mix well with stable relationships in my observation. It’s difficult to respect someone who is bringing the same thing to the table as you. If we’re both just bringing resources to the table, and I’m bringing 100k while you’re bringing a 30k pension, why SHOULD I respect you? You’re doing the same thing as me just not as well. But if you’re bringing the resources while I’m bringing support, housekeeping, budget management, and child care depending on age, then we are BOTH bringing something to the table where neither is less or more. It is also attempting to serve two masters- from 5pm to 7am I serve my husband and have to be feminine, from 7 am to 5pm I serve my boss-or in her case her clients- and have to be brutal. Except, those things are going to overlap because jobs don’t disappear at 5pm and men don’t not need things during banking hours. It’s like having two men. (Hell, even gay couples with kids tend to adopt gender norms because it is efficient.) This is also why I think you shouldn’t propose.

pearlsandstilettos · 2018-11-12T14:00:27+00:00

Hi OP, could you make a small edit for me? Please add carrots ( > ) in front of the paragraphs that are quoted text. It will make it easier to tell what is you talking and what is the post you are quoting. Thanks!

skeleflor · 2018-11-12T18:11:14+00:00

I often meditate on this quote from C.S. Lewis in "Mere Christianity":

The promise, made when I am in love and because I am in love, to be true to the beloved as long as I live, commits me to being true even if I cease to be in love. A promise must be about things that I can do, about actions.

Commitment is a practice: a continuous choice to love, to be loving, to act lovingly in service of the other. It's a daily renewal of that promise to each other, despite the vagaries of life and human hearts.

I really like what Jordan Peterson has said about the "shackles" of marriage as opportunity for deeper mutual growth: "If you can run away, you can't tell each other the truth." We have this modern notion that relationships are entered into for warm and fuzzy self-fulfillment, and if we no longer feel fulfilled in them, or they're too demanding and no longer convenient to us, we can just Eat Pray Love ourselves out of there and shop around for the next shiny ego distraction. A marriage commitment is ultimately an offering up of oneself in sacrifice to another person (or people, in the family one creates with that person and acquires from them through marriage). It's a yoking together of two lives into one in joint defense against the cruelties and hardships of time. That's what it should be, anyway.

For that reason, it may be more useful to approach marriage from a sober contractual mindset than a purely romantic one. I don't mean that one should enter into a marriage as a business transaction, but that one should remove the rose colored glasses of love when evaluating one's marital expectations. Marriage is a long haul. Both parties need to be able to imagine the marriage and its demands beyond the honeymoon phase, through trials and tribulations, and well into the decline and infirmity of old age. The two greatest assurances of marriage have always been for the young (legitimacy of children) and the elderly (companionship and caretaking). A middle aged couple might fight harder for their marriage when it hits an inevitable bump if they could imagine themselves sick and alone at 70 or 80.

AnarchoNAP · 2018-11-12T20:17:38+00:00

Ask them what they were vetting for. Many people will tell you they choose their partner for humor, looks, fun to hang out with, liked the same board games. Many people don’t even vet for values or goals. I don’t have a statistical analysis, but this is my observation.

And it IS somewhat of a tautology. If you were committed you wouldn’t have left absent extreme circumstances.

Sunshine-Fox · 2018-11-12T23:52:41+00:00

Are you two planning on having children together?

Zegiknie · 2018-11-12T16:16:30+00:00

Commitment is a matter of honor. For most people, it's the only time they make a solemn vow in their entire lives. Breaking that vow, being an oath-breaker... to me that is the worst thing you can do. If I were widowed and willing to find someone new, I wouldn't date a divorced man (either he was okay with it, or he wasn't capable enough to keep his family together).

You never agreed to the laws of your country and some may be unjust. Perhaps your sense of responsibility to provide for your own leads you to rob banks. That might make you my enemy, but I can respect that. Loyalty to your own and all that.

But going back on your word - no. Just no.

If my husband did the worst I can think of, if he molested the kids, I would leave the home to protect them. But I would not divorce him. I promised not to. Divorce would mean losing respect not just for him, but for myself, too.

If I ever lost that loving feeling, I would continue to be as good a wife as I can be and hope for it to return.

It's a choice you make. Not this inevitable falling apart thing.

And holy shit, I wish mine could retire so young! Mad respect to anyone who pulls that off. His wife just never loved him - spending that much time together got to be too much.

Title	What does commitment mean to you?
Author	LittleMissAfrodite
Upvotes	29
Comments	101
Date	November 12, 2018 1:34 PM UTC (7 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/RedPillWomen
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/RedPillWomen/comments/9we1jn/what_does_commitment_mean_to_you/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/RedPillWomen/what-does-commitment-mean-to-you.67825 https://theredarchive.com/post/67825

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