"If you're not a feminist then you're a misogynist."

lostapwbm · 2016-01-29T06:18:41+00:00

"If you're not a feminist then you're a misogynist."

shrug Okay then. Because calling me a name is really how you persuade me into accepting your point view. And attempting to shame me into submission works despite the fact that I don't know you, probably don't like you, and couldn't muster up a fuck to give about your opinion.

Sure thing, cupcake. I'm a misogynist. And a poopy-head.

Perhaps a feminist is TECHNICALLY a person who believes in equality...

Wrong. Feminism means "ending the patriarchy AND male violence against women." How do I know this? A women with a master's degree in "Gender Studies" told me. Since she has actually matriculated in this sawed off feminist nonsense, I'm more inclined to her definition.

I hate hanging around on feminist sites...

Why do it then?

even though women have their "safe spaces."

You misspelled "echo chambers in which no dissent may enter."

Feminists claim that men can never fully understand women's problems.

That which cannot be rationally explained or understood is by definition "irrational." If no feminist can ever rationally explain her position to any man, what does that indicate about feminism?

Westlothina · 2016-01-29T06:07:01+00:00

Why get involved? Because they want to have a small captive group who sits in the back of the bus silently until your name is called. Then, you are bestowed the honor of working very hard for your vagina-having betters, perhaps as an attack-dog or human shield. After you cease to be useful, you are to tip your hat gratefully and get back in the rear of that bus and once again keep your mouth shut. And you must like that treatment because it is fair and just.

But don't ever talk-back to your feminist betters. Your shiny, tin-plated Male Feminist badge can be taken-away for minor transgressions.

2016-01-29T06:27:08+00:00

The correct response is to laugh the words "I don't care".

That is, if you even think feminists are worth speaking to.

iongantas · 2016-01-29T06:13:16+00:00

The correct answer to this phrase is "that is a lie".

thrway_1000 · 2016-01-29T06:18:04+00:00

Feminism is not for equality "BY DEFINITION". It call for women to be equal to men and have the same rights. It does not impose responsibilities and does not require that men get the same rights as women. Thus, even by its definition it's NOT for equality.

Westlothina · 2016-01-29T06:48:59+00:00

Advice For Male Feminists: I've tried your life. It didn't work out. Perhaps you should give my life a shot. Gather a bunch of introverted neckbeards together and play Super Smash Bros. U while drunk. You might like it.

My friends are a bunch of neckbeards, bronies and aspies. There's nothing wrong with that. We have tons of fun. I'd rather be a neckbeard than a male feminist prick or a PUA jock douchebag.

ThePigmanAgain · 2016-01-29T08:50:54+00:00

My response these days is basically, "Yeah, so what?" At least, that's my response when i am in a polite mood. If the girlies get outraged i then point out all the ways in which women suck these days. After that, they wish they had kept their gobs shut.

2016-01-29T13:18:04+00:00

Only a sith deals in absolutes - Jedi Master Obi-Wan Kenobi

wisty · 2016-01-29T06:53:09+00:00

If you're not a Christian you're a Satan Worshipper.

I guess that kind of shaming might work on people with really low self esteem?

TamidMT · 2016-01-29T07:42:39+00:00

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=kafkatrap

Perhaps a feminist is TECHNICALLY a person who believes in equality but that's not how most people use the word. Most people do believe in gender equality but most people don't call themselves feminists...

The gulf between feminism on paper and feminism in practice is rapidly growing, and an increasing number of people (like me) are realising it and walking away. The most recent UK survey, done on behalf of a feminist charity, said that 83% of the British public support equality of opportunity for women, with higher support from men (86%) than women (81%). That same survey had only 7% of respondents calling themselves feminists. The movement has lost the plot.

I'm not sure if I consider myself an anti-feminist. I don't fight against them. I mostly just try to avoid them.

The term 'non-feminist' is fairly popular and might work well for you.

Feminists claim that men can never fully understand women's problems. That's where the term "mansplaining" comes from. If this cause is beyond my understanding then why should I even get involved?

If men can never fully understand women's problems, then in this case the reverse must also be true. Just ask Norah Vincent. The difference between sympathy and empathy is the viewpoint: sympathy is to be able to see someone's world through your eyes, empathy is to see someone's world through their eyes. Feminism has NEVER been empathetic to men. It is only ever sympathetic, but its sympathy is built on a LOT of falsehoods. Take it from someone who walked away: don't get involved.

aussietoads · 2016-01-29T06:26:06+00:00

They are calling you a misogynist because they are a-holes. They'll take your denial or any attempt to rationally rebutt them as a weakness to be further exploited at your expense.

Next time just tell them they can call you anything they like so long as they don't call you late for supper.

AJaggedRedPill · 2016-01-29T06:33:00+00:00

90 percent of everything is shit. Feminists aren't any different. Especially not online.

Your best bet is to find a group where the 90% percent of their shit doesn't cause you any personal grief, and then talk shit about the worst of some other group. If you're lucky, the best 10% of what they offer you will make you a better man.

2016-01-29T08:25:33+00:00

You don't need to be involved in anything you don't want to be - regardless of who you are or your gender. It's refreshing to see someone who can stand up for themselves and be honest about what they believe and what they care about. And if anyone else states that how you think and what you think is wrong - than they are not worthy of your time and attention.

Allblacksworldchamps · 2016-01-29T08:39:43+00:00

The easiest way I've found just to brush off, and most people understand where I come from is to;

a) Relate the full dictonary definition of feminism, it is the social, economic and political equality OF WOMEN TO MEN. The bold is part that shows ot has a singilar focus on women gaining all the rights of men (perhaps with as few of the attendant responsibilities) while leaves nothing for men to gain the rights of women, such as being able to vote without submitting to the draft, or being able to name the father on the birth certificate, etc etc etc.

B) Check out these guidelines for mens participation at the Seattle feminist book club. http://www.meetup.com/Seattle-Feminist-Book-Club . Now it may be true that many women describe themselves as feminist and do care about mens issues, their sons and brothers and fathers, and do welcome men into their struggle. They say we use the word feminist as shorthand for equal rights in gender and it's only feminism as this is historically where the struggle was. But it cannot EVER be a movement for equal rights if it ALLOWS THE POSSIBILITY that one group can marginialise the voice of the other group within that movement, even when we believe that our branch is not doing this, or that the others are doing feminism wrong (well what do we then call these feminists that are doing it wrong, usually x,y,z feminists).

The analogy would be if the identity politicians and environmentalists told the labour unions to sit down and shut up within the various Labour parties (the political parties funded by the unions) around the world. Could we then still call them labour parties?

c) The feminist lens is biased, and cannot help to be so even when they are sometimes right. So we get many excuses for women when attacking or killing, and yet do not allow insights to excuse men, (by excuse read diagnose). I prefer to take a neutral stance prior to researching an issue.

C ii) Where feminism has excelled is in raising questions and highlighting the marginalised voices that may not have been considered in research, but the "feminist lens" that asks these questions is not the right tool to answer the questions or decide on policy, which it too often is used for.

Each of these positions have got people away from trying to convince me have to be a feminist "if I believe in equal rights", without the argument that "I don't understand feminism". Some have said OK you dont want to allign but you have the same intentions as feminists, which I leave to lie, while others have said you're right, and I have to define my own feminism clearly, usually going for an egalatarian feminist definition, before rejecting the label somewhere down the track for human rights campaigner.

192873982 · 2016-01-29T10:55:12+00:00

Feminism is a religion.

I don't know if they have a god (Can't be women, since they hurt them often), but they definitely have a devil and it's called the patriarchy.

They use the "you're not with us means you are against us" bullshit to brand you as an ally of the devil.

Also note that the feminism cult has nothing to do with gender equality, just like islam has nothing to do with peace, yet that's what they say.

Believing in gender equality wouldn't even make you a feminist, even if feminism was for gender equality. It's easy to see that if you just compare it to islam. If you were for peace, that wouldn't automatically make you a muslim, even if islam was for peace.

I believe in gender equality. I don't fight for women's rights though. I wouldn't be good at it. Most of my friends are guys. That's just what I prefer. There's nothing wrong with that.

There's literally no connection between you being good at fighting for womens' rights and you having mostly male friends. You could honestly know no woman at all and still be good at fighting for womans rights, just because you have a great mind. The only reason to not fight for something is because you don't want to and the reason is irrelevant. Don't let anyone say you have to X. The only thing a man has to do is to die some day.

I hate hanging around on feminist sites mainly because those sites are full of people who think that I'm a loser.

Understandable. You wouldn't try to befriend people who hate you outside of the internet either.

Another Thing: Feminists claim that men can never fully understand women's problems.

That's bullshit, men can fully understand womens problems, just as the other way around. BUT IT'S HARD. Fighting for gender equality requires you do understand both to some degree, but since feminists claim that it's not possible, they admit that they can't fight for gender equality.

orangorilla · 2016-01-29T12:48:05+00:00

"If you're not a feminist then you're a misogynist."

Simple shaming tactic. When you don't have a logical leg to stand on, claim the moral high ground.

Now, let's change the sentence:

If you don't believe both genders should have equal opportunity, you're a misogynist.

This is false though, you may place either women or men on top of your stack. For feminism to be the only movement in favor of equal rights, it has to exclude all those who think one gender is lesser than others

Then we come to intersectionality

If you don't believe everyone should have equal opportunity, you're a misogynist

Once again, now there's a whole bunch of things you could be: Transphone, misogynist, misandrist, racist, ableist, disableist, straightphobe, cisphobe... The list could possibly go on.

"If you're not a feminist then you're a misogynist."

Means that the only people excluded by feminism are the misogynist. If you identify as feminist, all other thoughts of supremacy are welcome, just don't think men are better.

Rockbottom503 · 2016-01-29T12:58:48+00:00

I'm not really sure how describing an event that you're depicting as a real thing and marketing as a guide for others to follow can be considered satire??

CMOS222 · 2016-01-29T13:51:09+00:00

"If you're not a feminist then you're a misogynist."

The short answer:

"That's like telling a Christian that if they're not Roman Catholic, they're an atheist."

The long answer:

There was once a time in European history when the Catholic church claimed a monopoly on the definition of a person's relationship to God. The Catholic church decided what a good Christian was, what a good Christian amounted to, and that anyone claiming to having a relationship with God outside the definitions prescribed by the Catholic church - Jews, Muslims, Protestants - was a heretic. The Catholic hierarchy was psychologically constrained by their worldview. They literally could not understand how someone could believe in God, or profess to be a good Christian, and not follow the dictates of the Catholic church.

Contrary to what many people believe, the idea of rights for men is not based on the idea that men are superior to women. Not at all. It's based on the idea that men have their own concerns, their own worldviews, their goals and ways of breaking out of gender stereotypes and roles assigned to men, their own take on equality and human rights. It also advances the idea that one can be both in favor of human rights for women as well as for men.

A lot of feminists (not all) have difficulty fitting this into their worldview. Somehow along the way they've mentally translated the assertion "Feminism is about equality between men and women" into "feminism and ONLY feminism is about equality between men and women". That somehow feminism has some kind of intellectual monopoly over deciding how gender equality is achieved.

A lot of feminists, male and female, have this assumption that if men want to pursue their own issues, their own aspects of freedom from gender restrictions and more personal opportunity, it has to be done through a feminist theoretical framework. It's a lot like the medieval catholic church faced with the intellectual and doctrinal challenge of the Protestant Reformation. They don't know how to fit it into their worldview. And demand that everybody adapt their worldview to conform with an assumed necessity for feminism.

Their response to the men's rights movement is pretty much along the line of, "feminism is about equal rights for men too, so if you want equal rights for men, it has to be pursued through a feminist framework".

In doing so, they come at men's issues with a SERIOUS attitude problem. 'If you want to achieve better rights and conditions for males, you must do it through a feminist worldview and by working with feminists.' It's like the Catholic Church saying to Luther, 'If you want to have a closer relationship with God, you must only do it through the Church.'

TacoNinjaSkills · 2016-01-29T15:27:50+00:00

I forgot where I first heard this point (maybe Honey Badger Radio) but the free handed accusations of misogyny show them for the bullies they really are. Think about it. If one truly was a misogynist, being labeled so would cause them no real trepidation. However, if someone was vehemently not a misog, calling them so is major insult to them.

Of course, it is also an ad hominem in that even if one is a misog that does not automatically invalidate their critiques of...well...anything.

DavidByron2 · 2016-01-29T17:12:48+00:00

Feminism is a hate movement technically. And actually. It's common for such groups to attack critics by accusing them of exactly what the hate group itself does.

GenderNeutralLanguag · 2016-01-29T17:35:45+00:00

"If your not a feminist then you're a misogynist"

"Of course I'm a misogynist, I also eat babies and rape unicorns. But my personal failings are not relevant to the point I just made"

Xelipho · 2016-01-29T18:09:53+00:00

"If you're not a feminist then you're a mysoginist"

Only a sith deals in absolutes.

DillipFayKick · 2016-01-29T20:13:51+00:00

The more they mis-use the word 'misogyny', the less power it will have to silence us. Let them have at it.

2016-01-29T22:00:04+00:00

Then feminism has become so broad a title as to be meaningless

aussietoads · 2016-01-30T00:45:57+00:00

Or conversely, using the same flawed logic, if you're a feminist then you're a misandrist.

equiposeur · 2016-01-30T06:12:56+00:00

Don't fall for the feminist bait and switch!

The bait: "Feminism is belief in equality of the sexes."

But once you're on-board it switches to: "Society and history can only be understood as a struggle between evil male oppressors and sweet female victims, obliging us to undertake all measures now to lift up women and diminish men."

Everyone agrees with the bait definition, so a feminist who feels attacked will assert that is definition. But society is fair enough now that if a feminist wants to go on the attack the bait definition is useless, so the switch definition is deployed to justify whatever the feminist wants.

Title	"If you're not a feminist then you're a misogynist."
Author	Westlothina
Upvotes	17
Comments	34
Date	January 29, 2016 6:00 AM UTC (10 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/437jxx/if_youre_not_a_feminist_then_youre_a_misogynist/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/if-youre-not-a-feminist-then-youre-a-misogynist.957449 https://theredarchive.com/post/957449

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