The Bitch Factor

pildorado · 2016-06-28T18:50:54+00:00

You know, women can only treat you like shit if you let them. That includes your wife. Why are you putting up with bitchiness at all? It is a good question. Women have a certain level of bitchiness that you will never eradicate. Anything beyond that baseline, you have to deal with it directly and decisively.

I'm not married anymore but I am dating and the other night we were cooking dinner together. Cue her snotty complaints about the way I was slicing zucchini. Like it fucking mattered in some important way. I shit you not. Zucchini.

I thought "you have got to be fucking kidding me." I just put the knife down, picked up my car keys, and headed for the door. I told her that I'm not so hungry that I have to put up with that kind of bullshit. She hasn't stopped texting me since. I'm not answering.

bismarck8888 · 2016-06-28T17:23:57+00:00

You may have missed, but it's something I've always heald.

You have 3 tools, affection, commitment, and attention. Use them, commensurate with the value she gives you. Building your SMV is what gives those tools teeth.

It's not using the stick (dread) but removing the carrot.

2016-06-29T13:35:23+00:00

Excessive bitchiness ( along with wife's weight gain ) is what led me to this forum. Its learned behavior. My mother in law does it to my father in law. He puts up with it. My wife began trying it on me. Pre MRP I would either defend, argue or accommodate. Thanks to MRP - I no longer do any of the above. It would only get worse..

Since then Ive worked on myself by specifically, no longer acting like a whining bitch about work, money etc... This alone was a huge step in the right direction.

Secondly I began using a mixed bag of AA, AM and firmness to nip it in the bud. Depending on the situation, my threshold for patience etc... determines what tool gets used and when. However, my basic rule of thumb is to start with AA. If that fails - I move right into being firm about what is/is not acceptable. One of my most used lines with the wife is " Do you want positive attention today ?" Almost always she will respond with " yes" . I'll then say " then act like a good girl" . 9 times out of 10 the bitchiness will then stop. In the rare instance where it doesn't work - I remove myself from being near/around her. Go off and do my thing. She has never failed to eventually follow up and act well civilized after that point.

In a year and a half we've come a long way. the bitchiness and overtly nasty shit tests have decreased by over 85%. Along with making home life much better for myself,, Ive also noticed that there is a renewed sense of peace and happiness in my wife and a real desire ( on her part) to take much better care of herself.

Living together is a fairly pleasant experience again.

IASGame · 2016-06-28T18:11:09+00:00

This is more theory than practice for me, but generally the answer is to demonstrate (and preferably have) higher value.

Is the wife a bitch to you, but pleasant to others (including strangers)? This shows you that she knows how to be pleasant.

Why does she want to give off a good impression to strangers but not to you? Most likely, because she thinks you are low value (and she may well be right). It could be simply because you put up with it, which does demonstrate low value.

2016-06-29T14:12:41+00:00

Time.

It's like belly fat...the last to go. But even after you start improving in all other areas... you still just have to stick to the principals.

Another way to put it is my wife has a "temper". Or as a friend of mine says: a wife that requires a lot of skill.

I can be sailing along the seas of doing everything I should and all it takes is a few triggers to set her off.

If it's directed at someone else and they don't deserve it, I'll step in, separate and tell her to take a breather. Or as I just alluded to in another recent comment around her parents: I just had to get her out of there.

If it's directed at a thing (let's say a phone), I'll lightly mock. Just trying to lead on "it's just not a big deal". sidenote musings after line break

If it's directed at me I can take a few approaches.

If I feel it is egregious I tend to lean to O.I. with a parting thing for her to think about on the way out. She may talk over it or have a come back, but I make sure it's the last thing she needs to hear before I walk out.
Mid level and ridiculous-trust me in that at some point she'll get frustrated enough to leave the room while I continue about my day. Now maybe with less commitments.
Might just leave or work on something else I wanted to do anyway. Snipe at me for no go reason and it's like a free pass. You're no fun...have fun with yourself. I take the viewpoint of it being her asking for space to chill. She just doesn't necessarily know she needs it.

So while I got RAPID AND INTENSE improvement once I started down the path of RP. Some rough edges definitely took time to wear down.

sidenote

One time she did parlay being mad at her phone to trying to be mad at me. Forgoing the usual A.A/ A.M./O.I.

I actually just cut to it and asked (paraphrase) :

"You're pissed at a phone, now how does that translate in any way in the universe to your tone you are using with me?"

Her answer "Because I think you know exactly how to fix this and just like seeing me fumble with it."

That was as enlightening as it was a small kick to the head.

It wasn't that she was being a bitch and 'kicking the dog'. She genuinely knows I'm good with tech...respects it enough to think I know everything about it, and because I not only sell my A.A. /A.M. she actually sees that as if I ENJOY IT. Talk about overselling. It was an actual honest moment about testing and the mechanics.

I had to show a chink in my armor (again paraphrase as it was a few weeks ago). "Hon, I appreciate you think I know how to fix everything. But let's just assume that when I don't, I don't hold back just for my amusement."

I'm attracted to women I see as having a SPARK. Nice girls are boring as fuck to me. When I started going out with my wife I was dating a plate...nice as you could imagine. Bored me to fucking death.

I just find the interplay !FUN!

But I was really sent for a loop when my wife was honest with me in the phone situation. That knee jerk bitch response in women , looked at with the light of the YOU, THEM, THE WORLD knows something and is just laughing at them can spark some compassion and ease when viewing such a tantrum. Totally helped squash some defensive reflexes I had to fight. Again...her being emotionally childlike. Makes it easy to be the father figure and take the high road when you understand where a lot of things come from.

LAST POINT

Don't forget the lessons one can find in "The Great Happiness Space: Tale of an Osaka Love Thief" (find a copy and watch the masters if you haven't already).

Some women occasionally need to and want to be scolded. If your SMV's is high in her eyes and she's being a total bitch: Scold.

I'd say they're rare events...but occasionally necessary. You'll know when it's required if you're in a mentally stolid/stoic place which can give you a clarity of vision in the face of someone elses' rampant emotions.

NameOfAction · 2016-06-28T17:18:47+00:00

Everything is always easier when the wife's out of town, every chore takes half as long and every meal tastes better.

Something that has worked in my relationship: if she speaks to me with disrespect in anything less than sexkitten purrs I dont respond.

I say some variation of "how else can you say that?" No response untill she speaks to me right.

When she gets it right I'll say something like "isnt it better to be nice?" And give her a kiss.

Only then do I answer her question or open the pickle jar.

Women like to be spoken to like children. Don't be condescending, because like children, they can spot that and hate it

Talk to her like a loving father of an 8 yr old who only wants the best for her. But a father knows sometimes whats best is to be stern.

2016-06-28T17:44:43+00:00

Disrespect is still disrespect whether its no sex, or no courtesy.

The steps of dread are actually quite the same. You expect better from her. You put her in situations where another woman speaking to you in the manner you would want causes a increase in your attention and improvement of your mood.

FMOFU can also be "Stop being a bitch, or See YA"

pildorado · 2016-06-28T18:49:43+00:00

Yes. This is my problem as well and I assume you are quoting BPP. I am at fault for the majority of my relationship problems. Due to unawareness, checking out, BP beta behaviors, Nice Guy tendencies, etc. etc.

As I correct these, the situation improves greatly but, the main problem persists and that is the bitchiness and disrespect. I have seen this play out with her family members and close work associates as well. So, I know a certain amount of this behavior will be unavoidable. I am waiting to improve myself and the situation to a point where it is unwarranted and then reassess whether or not I am willing to deal with what remains.

ColdEiric · 2016-06-28T19:18:06+00:00

If your wife being a bitch bothers you then you are in her frame. Remember your wife has the emotional mentality of a child. When your child is on the ground throwing a tantrum should you get emotional too? Or is the proper response to think it's funny and goof with the kid until they're laughing and over it?

Never argue with your wife when she is being this way. Never give her ultimatums or tell her to stop being a bitch like some in here are saying. That's how she wants it to go because she gets to feed off that emotional high an argument provides.

You start with agree and amplify. Turn everything she says into a ridiculous farce. Early on this may not always work (it gets more effective as you get more fit and your SMV goes up.) In that case you should remove yourself from her proximity. Don't do it in a butthurt way.

She only does this because it gets results. She wants attention and emotional validation, even if it's of the negative variety. If you don't feed her she will stop.

fuckmrp · 2016-06-28T18:27:36+00:00

Getting someone to take action (sex) is much easier than getting someone to change behavior (bitchiness).

when the fuck are you going to be somewhat tolerable and human

This is way too weak for my tastes. I'd go with: "If you keep disrespecting me I will fucking leave and I will take everything". Say this as cold and calm as you can. Do not say this is the heat of an argument. Say it and fucking mean it and only say it if you're prepared to do it. And after you say it STFU and stare her down until she responds.

BTW if she is prepared to lose you this will backfire.

sexyshoulderdevil · 2016-06-28T20:11:57+00:00

You don't provide any examples.

There is something off to me. You say sex is fine but she's a bitch. This combo can happen but it seems more rare.

Are you sure you just don't have one of those wives who comes across bitchy but is actually busting your chops for fun and you just don't take it the right way? She may be just messing/flirting with you and waiting for you to put her in her place as an almost extended form of foreplay via shit testing.

Anyway, give some examples, bitch.

Edit: I see your post history is long. Haven't read through it. Give a recent example that got under your skin.

bismarck8888 · 2016-06-28T21:40:34+00:00

I've taken the lead on major things (planning trips for example) but now she feels like she has no say in anything. Wtf, I'm doing all the work an you're complaining about not having a say?

This is causing me to say fuck it. You do the legwork now. Plan the trips, shop around for the best price, deal with the bills. Fuck it.

Innerouterself · 2016-06-28T22:53:02+00:00

I am in the same boat. Wife just gets crazy. It went from "I am fucking outta here" to "okay, kinda tolerable to okay".

But i feel like I put in an ass ton of work but left with just an okay wife. It's a big blow to me now. She has improved but not enough.

The tough reality is our spouses are still people. We can be the bomb red pill husband but still only have a tolerable wife.

As I grow and become a better man, my standards keep expanding too.

Flathatter45 · 2016-06-29T01:55:47+00:00

Bismark, I'm going through something very similar right now. I'm glad you posted this. The conversation it generated has some useful stuff in it.

Wife and kids came back last week from a few days with my in laws. For some reason, she started giving me cold shoulder. Whatever. Then, on Sunday after church as we were getting into the car, i scolded one of my daughters for backtalking me.. didn't lose my shit or anything close to it, but raised my voice for emphasis.. well, a guy in the next car overheard and "gasp" looked over at me...thus embarrassing her. I don't care, because I am the only judge as to what constitutes appropriate discipline for my children, and I will not apologize or back down an inch for appearances sake. Wife then commenced to lecture me, ending with "Well, there is a such thing as self control." I burst out laughing at that, and went back to reading a book until my daughter and son got back from the errand I had sent her to run in the church. Mind, she was not upset because I was overly harsh with my daughter. I wasn't. No, she was upset because I EMBARRASSED her. I could feel her eyes boring into me, but ignored her. Then, she tried to start up with me again. I told her. "I am only a little upset. If you want me to get a LOT upset, keep nagging at me." calmly, but with an undertone of warning. Her. "Don't worry, I am not going to say another word to you all day!" This was Sunday, and now cold shoulder has turned to 3 days of silent hate and a hard no for sex last night. Inside, I was furious. But I just laughed, rolled over and slept. THis morning I woke up re freshed.

I tend to think the advice given here about not feeding the hamster is good. When she overtly disrespected me, I shut her down fast. Now she wants to ignore me? Fine. My productivity is already going up. Sex? I haven't decided what I am going to do about that yet. I might initiate again tonight, if I feel like it.

redearththeory · 2016-06-29T10:33:09+00:00

My wife is almost never openly disrespectful now. I think there were a few things that sorted out the disrespect problem.

1) I became very consistent with frame control. I defended shit tests consistently and aggressively, and usually involved some form of counter attack after the A&A. I teased regularly. I got to the point where I enjoyed arguing because it affected me less than it affected her.

2) I started rewarding good behavior and added more value in her life. When she did sweet things, I took her places, cuddled her more and was sweet to her. I organized dates and outings. I made sure I was a great dad.

3) We had a main event and I made it very clear that I was fine with divorce. Once I got to thinking about how nice life would be without her the idea started to get really appealing. After that she knew she couldn't control me.

BluepillProfessor · 2016-06-29T15:17:52+00:00

is there a formula like approach to the bitch problem like there is the sex problem?

No, we don't have a stepwise process to relieve the bitchiness- probably because there are to many sources of bitchiness to account for in one model. With low sex there is usually one source- the man is not attractive enough to meet the woman's hypergamous needs. Solution: If you are not attractive enough then fucking GET attractive. One of the ways you do that is to build other options- aka "Dread."

We are still working on a stepwise plan for the bitch factor and some guys claim Dread works great for that. Sometimes it does, but in my experience it also tends to lead to a divorce without improving the bitchiness. Sometimes they double down on total cunt when you throw dread in that case.

I think in cases where Dread cures the bitch, the bitchiness is caused by your woman not getting the D good and hard enough. Dread fixes that bitchiness.

I don't think Dread fixes bitchiness of other kinds and can make it worse. Dread causes the tingles! Dread makes her want to fuck. If you are already getting that I don't see a huge need to work on Dread- certainly not beyond level 5-6.

The key to ending the bitchiness then is to NGAF and to take control of yourself and your wife. To do that you have to:

*1. Be fucking her good.

*2. Be the guy that brings the good times.

*3. Be a leader.

*4. Maintain a stoic frame where you bring the good times.

When you have all this can usually lead her to a happier place.

Read up on Shit Tests and comfort tests. Start passing them. Maintain a positive, upbeat frame and don't lose your shit when she is a bitch. The idea is to gradually shape her behavior and attitude into something worthwhile. Ignore when she is ranting, pay attention when she is pleasant.

This takes months, not weeks. At the end of the road you can begin taking active control and ordering her to stop.

When my wife is in one of her moods and starts to talk disrespectfully to me I tell her sharply: "Hey! You don't talk to me like that. Try again."

rocknrollchuck · 2016-06-29T23:47:56+00:00

When I first came here, I was dealing with the constant bitchiness but the sex was great. I think you should read my first post and the comments / advice I received there, because I bet something there is really going to help you like it did me. Then contrast that with the details in my second post 4 months later. Short answer, it was ME and the way I was handling things that was causing the problem. I've still got a long way to go, but I'm not dealing with anywhere NEAR the bitchiness I used to.

1v1crown · 2016-06-30T20:06:18+00:00

Why not just ask her why she is being destructive toward your marriage with her bitchiness? Get her to figure it out on her own, chances are she wont be able to and maybe realize she's doing nonsense.

Title	The Bitch Factor
Author	bismarck8888
Upvotes	26
Comments	95
Date	June 28, 2016 4:46 PM UTC (10 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MarriedRedPill
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/marriedredpill/comments/4qaepl/the_bitch_factor/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MarriedRedPill/the-bitch-factor.199814 https://theredarchive.com/post/199814

Comments