After all it's not like men are shamed for being virgins... (FB: Screencap)

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The logic behind that trend is probably more disturbing than the actual trend itself, I think. There are girls who don't like virgins because they don't want to deal with the inexperience or because they don't want to deal with the emotional repercussions that come with having sex with a virgin, which are problematic on their own I would say simply because the former is incredibly selfish and egotistical while the other relies solely on a stereotype of virgins(both of which are also actually very short-sighted given that inexperience resolves itself pretty quickly or that ignorance resolves itself through basic communication).

Most, however, will simply reject male virgins because they do not conform to this ideal of masculinity that men are supposed to follow, or because they don't live up to the expectations that society put on men to be assertive, aggressive and all-knowing with women, and because of this idea that, because a guy hasn't had a lot of sexual success with women, than he simply isn't any good himself. The former is a pretty blatant double-standard for men and the latter is a giant leap in logic. Not every man is the same, not every man likes to sleep around, be assertive or chase women. The fact that a guy could be quickly looked over by women, doesn't mean that he isn't worthy of love and affection, or that he couldn't be a perfect match for any given woman.

What's worse, however, isn't just that this creates a cycle, or spiral, of emotional and sexual misery for a lot of men(not having with women for whatever reason, women think less of him for it, fewer women want to sleep with him, etc...) but how typical it is for women to then sexually dismiss, belittle or vilify male virgins because of their virginity. Some will treat them like asexual eunuchs, some will treat them like sexual predators just waiting to happen and some will just treat them like children that are completely unworthy of appreciation or respect; regardless of any other experiences or knowledge. All of which will undoubtedly create some pretty devastating harm to the average man and something that women are essentially exempt from themselves given that female virgins are not met with nearly the same level of scrutiny, disdain or belittlement that their male counterparts face(regardless of how much easier it would be for any woman to find someone to lose her virginity if she ever decided to compared to a man).

Sure, there are women who have virgin fetishes(a selfish motivation that typically leaves little regard for the state of mind of men they find to fulfill their fantasies) and some women are even compassionate or empathetic enough to understand what male virgins go through, and who are willing to put in a bit of effort to make it work, but the sad reality is that they are truly in the minority and that it becomes increasingly hard for men to find such women as years go by; and no one is really addressing the greater social issue that is perpetuated by the female majority, the media and our culture in general.

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Men do it too but not nearly to the same extent. The average guys typically understands it's not easy to be a guy when it comes to sex/love and that sex isn't just readily available to guys the way it is for women. Typically what happens is you get guys who, after being part of a culture that shames men for being virgins for so long, start to project that same feeling. When they do have sex, it becomes a validation of who they are and that sense of approval from women fuels this sense of superiority/competition over other men(especially among men who might have been insecure to begin with).

Generally speaking however, men are not nearly as harsh when it comes to virgin shaming, because they've been there as well. They understand what it's like to have to struggle and fight for just the slightest bit of female attention. Women on the other hand, typically come from a position of absolute privilege, and will use the fact that they had sex earlier on in life, and without much effort, as a testament to their own superiority(without ever truly acknowledging the aforementioned privilege, which would in turn diminish the accomplishment that fuels their ego).

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Yes... because women dont find it attractive... Do they shame men for being good at sports, being strong, or having a good body? No, because those are considered masculine and what is considered masculine is what women are attracted to, so would make no sense at all to shame men for being exactly what women want.

Women arent attracted to weakness, that is why men shame men for being weak. Women arent attracted to virgins, that is why men shame men for being virgins. Being a virgin suggests you are not good with women, if you arent good with women it means you dont have social dominance. Women want men that lots of other women are attracted to, a virgin suggests there's something wrong with you that women dont want to have sex with you. When you are a young teenager, its okay to be a virgin, but as time goes on it gets worse and worse for this reason.

By the same token, women are shamed for being things such as being overweight or not looking feminine enough. This is because it is not considered attractive. Same reason.

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Some men also feel inferior to other men, so shaming them makes them feel superior. Not everything a man measures himself to is to impress women.

The men that do this because they feel inferior do it because they don't feel they are attractive enough. We don't need to do things consciously to have our thought processes or behaviour still be based on something subconscious. The very desire to have sex is based on probably the most base instinctive desire we have; to procreate. If we didnt have this instinct the human species would have died out long ago. As I said before you cant shame a man for being strong, successful, good looking, funny, charismatic, etc. If you want to bully them the characteristic that you pick must be about something else. The reason you would pick something like "virginity", or weakness, or being fat, or being small, is precisely because this is not considered attractive.

Some of your points are true, however not all women go for masculine men. Some people like artsy men, musical men, hell I've met some women who prefer tiny, passive men to those who are fully masculine. While I do agree with some of your points, I think most of them are a bit overgeneralized.

That's because you misunderstand what I mean by masculine.

You don't have to be necessarily physically strong and muscular, its all about how and if you are able to convey this image to women about yourself so that they perceive you as being socially dominant. That's why the most often given piece of advice for men in attracting women is "be confident". Looking strong just makes this easier. Having a deep "manly" voice makes this easier. Etc.

Men who are musicians can be attractive because they can be seen as having status. Status is an aspect of social dominance. Men who are funny are more attractive for the same reason.

Some women put more emphasis on different characteristics, so some value something like a muscular body more than others. But just about all women are attracted to social dominance, the only question is what characteristics they put more importance on and how much of it they require.

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having sex with almost any and every guy just to try and gain their approval = slutty

I think that's the problematic part. If a girls is having sex with many different partners, people assume it is because she wants people's approval. Also, I have to point out that between having an active sex life and "whore" there is no middle ground. Now I'm not sure if you meant sexually active as "choosing to having sex with who she wants to" or "having sex regularly with regular partners" as the term is used both ways, so I can't draw conclusions from this but it bothers me a little bit.

For example, a female friend of a friend had a threesome with two guys while pissed drunk. Afterwards she was ashamed a lot. You wouldn't see a guy feeling shameful for scoring two girls at the same time. I think that's what slut shaming means. Although this situation is bad for both male and female as gender roles force men to "perform" in their sex life while for women, they have to be passive.

And for the girl being harsher, I don't think that's relevant. If we take a situation where a guy claims to have been raped by his girlfriend and not being sure how he feels about it told that to his friends, you can easily imagine that the first question they would ask would be: "but how?" My point is, obligation to fit gender roles is bad, no matter your gender and no matter where the pression comes from.

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Title	After all it's not like men are shamed for being virgins... (FB: Screencap)
Author	ithinkmynameismoose
Upvotes	319
Comments	103
Date	December 12, 2013 2:02 AM UTC (12 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/1somob/after_all_its_not_like_men_are_shamed_for_being/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/after-all-its-not-like-men-are-shamed-for-being.1156376 https://theredarchive.com/post/1156376

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