I'm sick of the casual misandry in society, putting men into categories like "alpha", "beta", telling us we're not "real men", can you imagine the outrage if this happened with women?

jr_xo · 2023-04-09T20:11:06+00:00

I think the "real man" phrase is the one that bothers me the most. Women who dont know what it takes to be masculine, what it takes to be a man wanna tell you as a man what a real man is. That's gaslighting at its finest form

g1455ofwater · 2023-04-09T21:26:17+00:00

It goes back to the thing about women are loved for just being while for men love is withheld until they meet some arbitrary criteria. Love and compassion shouldn't be withheld from men like that.

The term "real man" didn't seem right to me when I learned about history. There were artists and writers and scientists etc so the idea that the natural state for all men is the male stereotype isn't accurate.

Codename-18 · 2023-04-09T21:12:21+00:00

A real woman is thin and virgin.

Hate in 3...2...1...

rudolfrudolf0 · 2023-04-09T21:28:38+00:00

Aragorn's type of male is the best one IMO. He's the the role model i follow.

(Reference to Lord of the Rings, for those who don't know him)

neighborhoodpainter · 2023-04-09T23:25:16+00:00

I often see the "sigma", "alpha", "ligma" stuff being pushed by men more. And I do see people call it out, not necessarily for it being sexist, more for it being stupid.

The whole "real man" thing, on the other hand, I've seen an equal number of men and women say this. "A "real man" does x or does y". This is something I find annoying, and should be called out more.

Winnertony · 2023-04-09T21:32:39+00:00

We are all people, men and women all deserve to be themselves.

SuspiciousGrievances · 2023-04-10T02:00:23+00:00

When they use it on you, just say it back.

"Are you womansplaining, what mansplaining is to me?"

"What a Beta thing to say" "A real woman would never say/do that"

DenimGod4lyfe · 2023-04-09T21:23:48+00:00

And yet, I could say that much of the blame lies with men and the manosphere that has unfailingly taken these terms from various species of the animal kingdom to talk about much more complex social dynamics, changing the paradigm according to the pill you want to take. Chad-alpha, beta-normie-cuckold, incel-subhuman. We have reached that level due to the idolatry that is inevitably held for women. And it's normal, many men are desperate to find solutions to their lives and want to climb the hierarchies of looks, money and status. And for what purpose? Yes, for others, rarely for themselves.

The analytical part of the pills is fine, the hierarchy of society in categories of men is simply gynocentrism.

The_Equalitarian · 2023-04-11T03:17:08+00:00

I mean, there are such a thing as "alpha female" and "beta female" but I think the reason they don't put women into hierarchical systems like men is because women are all the same in their eyes.

reverbiscrap · 2023-04-09T19:54:46+00:00

Only to a point. Humans are a socially hierarchal animal. We tend to sort ourselves out, and natural leaders tend to accrue followers unless forcibly removed.

lasciate · 2023-04-09T20:51:20+00:00

The original point of the alpha/beta thing was to wake the vast majority of men up to how they're getting fleeced in the sexual marketplace.

In typical fashion, feminists and traditionalists co-opted it as a bludgeon to try to force men into their preferred roles. Feminists do this by gaslighting men into thinking being "beta" is actually "alpha" (women actually want beta guys, not alphas) and traditionalists by ignoring that this dichotomy is descriptive of an undesirable, untenable system (just be alpha and everything will be fine).

Edit:

Can you imagine the reaction if this stuff was said about women? If people referred to some as "real women"?

They do. Feminists call women who they believe are not holding the line in the sexual marketplace "pickmes" while traditionalists call them "sluts".

2023-04-10T04:46:58+00:00

i always thought that the alpha beta thing were from manosphere/redpill talk coz that's what i used to hear in those podcasts. like, "high value" men are alphas which to me sounds dumb coz to me you don't have to label yourself as such for other people to value you. anyways, hope y'all have a great day/night, people! surround yourself with good people who value you, your needs and your safety and that you do the same to people you love~

solar-garlic1776 · 2023-04-10T12:03:51+00:00

We live in a gynocentric social order what do you expect.

Yes alpha and beta can very for each person and in different settings.

However, we do have a problem with purposeless and directionless men. I'm looking at you black pill doomers. Too many guys complaining and doing nothing to even attempt to improve their situation.

Female categories for men is a biological choice. However the delusional nature of all women thinking they deserve a 10 is outta control, SIMPS I'm looking at you.

I'm really starting to believe that we as men need to clean our house meaning we need to reject what doesn't help us meet our own goals. Simping ain't getting you the girl and sitting in your basement bitching about the world isn't improving your situation.

You wanna be "alpha" take responsibility of your life and your choices set and achieve personal goals and STOP WITH THE VICTIM MIND SET

LilConstipation · 2023-04-11T05:19:52+00:00

"Real man" makes me cringe the most because it takes away individuality away from men if you don't fit into certain characteristics.

angerproblemsTM · 2023-04-10T00:46:51+00:00

This sub get a lot of hate for being intertwined with the manosphere stuff. Material men are the ones who made that bs up. And I assure you no genuine woman thinks it’s cool or attractive. Be yourself, be confident with yourself, and don’t feel you need to aspire to whatever the monosphere tells you is attractive. Material and superficial will attract material and superficial.

GoodeBoi · 2023-04-10T05:56:42+00:00

Honestly see the unironic sigma/alpha stuff come almost exclusively from males.

Stand_kicker · 2023-04-10T02:57:11+00:00

Aren't men the ones who give themselves labels of alph, etc.

MiniatureMartian · 2023-04-09T20:14:03+00:00

Men came up with this alpha beta bs. It's the men with podcasts that spread this shit around, and it's men who eat this shit up. And there IS outrage for it.

SouthernSeeker · 2023-04-09T19:39:20+00:00

Because it's not sexist; Mech's work didn't make a huge differentiation between male and female wolves. It was, of course, inaccurate; wolf "packs" in the wild are just parents and their puppies, not the vast crowds of unrelated individuals people used to think they were. Mech's work explained what wolves under incredible stress in captivity would do; those who apply it to humans are admitting far more than they think they are.

Mech himself has realized the mistakes he made and disavowed that work; most people apparently didn't get the memo. The obvious comparison is with Wakefield, but it's more accurately placed alongside phrenology.

HalosOpulence · 2023-04-10T00:10:01+00:00

Did anyone study evolution?

leroybaux777 · 2023-04-10T19:08:03+00:00

Okay but the people labeling men like this, ARE OTHER MEN. I don't see women do this, ever.

EzraBlaize · 2023-04-10T00:38:53+00:00

Hypermasculine roles have existed for thousands of years. Mostly because it created a sense of order, and was literally the most efficient thing to do for cultures to survive.

It’s true that more nuance exists now (and that these roles need not be so rigidly defined) but the decade or so has seen an extreme reversal almost to the point of insanity.

People are really scared of essentialist definitions. I don’t really understand why when the prescribed antidote to these things (social sciences like standpoint theory/positionality as well as feminism) are so rife with interpretive biases themselves.

And that’s not even mentioning the proponents of inane views like “speak your truth” and “I am whatever I say I am” when in reality those are just counter-cultural rejections that (if we’re being completely honest with ourselves) aren’t only disingenuous, but pretty damn dangerous.

Not only is it that disheartening in political/social arenas, but these mindsets have now become the de facto force in art and literature. We live in a scary world.

NoPainNoGainEdgelord · 2023-04-10T16:37:51+00:00

As a female that is a mix of Sigma and Omega, those women are absolutely insolent.

A woman must NOT call a man a Real or Unreal man, without being trained and supervised by a man. She must be able to understand men and male mindset before even thinking about judging a man, and even then she shouldn't do it.

Also same said about women is Not a bad idea. If society is not harsh on women, I am merciless. They must learn some life lessons the hard way.

I am totally with you.

Also, beta males are good people and can change in case they don't like what they are. And it doesn't matter how others view you. If you view yourself as a Sigma male for example, then you are.

CryptocurrencyMonkey · 2023-04-10T06:12:43+00:00

Competition makes society stronger.

Victimhood makes society weaker.

TheNerdWonder · 2023-04-10T07:33:48+00:00

I don't need to imagine it. I've seen the meltdown and all of its hypocrisy..

SandwhichMeister · 2023-04-10T12:01:32+00:00

I agree they're behaving pretty shamefully. On the plus side, I think social progress is coming along far enough that (I believe) a pretty significant minority of people react to hearing this particular type of male-bashing with revulsion. Remember that talk show host who talked about cutting men's penises off and her audience cheered? THAT was ridiculous.

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