Who pays on a date?

jamieoneal82 · 2014-08-16T09:56:00+00:00

I highly recommend splitting on the first date for several reasons:

You should be going on as many first dates with as many women as possible and paying for all of them will get expensive. Read the sidebar material on plate theory.
Paying for the first date shows too much provider investment and sets that as the tone of your relationship with her.
Splitting is a good test to help weed out the needy, the gold-diggers, and the self-entitled bitches.
It displays abundance mentality and overall high value.

mrust · 2014-08-16T11:49:36+00:00

Stop dating.

By that I mean, don't think of it as a date. Definitely do not invite a girl out to dinner; just call her up to hang out, grab a drink, or do some activity.

Paying for her will work against you as /u/jamieoneal82 already said. Setting the tone is especially important. Decide beforehand what's ok to pay for (coffee, first round, cab fare for a shared ride back to your place) and what's not ok (dinner, bottle service, movie tickets). Then stick to that and don't let her sway you with emotional arguments. Don't argue with her. Don't explain your decision. Definitely don't explain your thought process or your logic. Just be amused and make fun of her.

Letting her pay is allowing her to show investment. IMO it screens for the types of girls I want. Even if you are looking for a girlfriend, paying will quickly become an expected obligation. Don't buy any of the bullshit about "whoever offers the invitation pays" since 100% of the time that means the man pays. Keep your frame.

xwm · 2014-08-16T17:22:18+00:00

The answer is easy If you're on the same diet I am. Eating as well as I do at a restaurant is almost impossible, so I tend to avoid them. I cook and she plays sous-chef to my lead, or she cooks for me. Either way no one pays, and I don't mind telling her to bring something specific along if the cooking is done at my place because there's no way that makes me look cheap, it just makes it look like I am out of that particular thing (she isn't going to expect me to pay her five dollars when she arrives either (and if she does, there is a huge red flag nice and early on)) while at the same time making her invest in me and giving her the precedent of obeying my commands.

Reddthrown · 2014-08-16T09:37:42+00:00

Do what you are comfortable with. If you think splitting is fair, split. If you want to pay, pay. If she's not happy, move on to the next one.

darklogic420 · 2014-08-16T11:13:07+00:00

Paying for the date is a shit test to hook you into being a provider or even a beta orbiter. Don't do it. Not the first, not the second... hell not ever. Don't pay unless you are explicitly treating her and are treating it as a gift. And if the woman isn't grateful, then she's a hollow soul and should never be more than a pump and dump in your mind.

Algermas · 2014-08-16T13:12:01+00:00

The only time I pay for companionship or sex is at a whorehouse, anything other than a direct transactions between my money or goods and her ass means we're splitting the bill.

Are there exceptions? Sure, if we're in a relationship and it's your birthday and I take you to a fancy restaurant I'll pay.

Vioret · 2014-08-16T11:30:51+00:00

This is what you should do.

Tell her, "I've got this check. You grab the next one."

It's like splitting but better because she feels like you're making the decisions and not afraid to take charge.

PersianVino · 2014-08-16T14:51:57+00:00

Avoid this by going for drinks instead.

Full-blown dinners/meals are not efficient, especially if you're spinning plates (as you should be).

telechronn · 2014-08-16T22:01:18+00:00

I wouldn't pay for a date unless you are farther along and even then it would be a a back and forth, I got this you got the next. The only time I'd pay if it is something elaborate/expensive that I really want to do.

I haven't had any problem with women when we split and if they secretly held that against me then they self selected themselves out, which is great.

Since discovering Game/TRP, Ever so often girls end up buying me shit for a change and that Ben Franklin effect is great.

Paying for a date is a relic from when women couldn't work/were underemployed and men were the bread earners.

SkorchZang · 2014-08-16T23:45:35+00:00

First date for me is usually short coffee/tea, the more casual the better, and she pays for herself, I don't offer.

Would never pay for fancy dinner or take her to anything like that, if not already fucking the woman.

I picked up a bit of sage advice somewhere, which says make it a rule every month or two to take out a different man from your circle who's influential, socially above you, treat both of you to fancy dinner or lunch, where you insist that you pay. To talk shop and be "Sure I'm dumb & green, but stubborn persistent and want to learn from you". This makes more and more sense to me, and it certainly is a far wiser investment of fancy dinner time than utterly wasting them on women.

[deleted] · 2014-08-16T21:37:03+00:00

Typically, it's just best to avoid situations for first dates that require money. However, if you absolutely must, I typically will say, "hey, I've got dinner so you've got dessert" and will go get ice cream somewhere. Makes her feel like she got a nice dinner when it's closer to splitting. That, or if we are getting drinks, I'll buy one round, she buys the next, etc etc.

You can buy shit for them,if you want, just realize you are willingly putting yourself in a beta bux role. If a girl is making you pay for shit to get into her vagina, just rememver that a girl like that will be like that forever.

0Zen · 2014-08-16T22:59:10+00:00

Well, generally it's your mama.

BedlamStatesman · 2014-08-17T03:51:01+00:00

I'm in a LTR and have been for some time. But here's how I approached it back when I was still cruising the scenes.

There is no reason why your first "Date" (The language is outdated. "Hanging out" or "Chilling" has such a better feel to it, and it helps to view it as such to help keep you relaxed and confident, as opposed to feeling like the interview it is.) should involve anything you have to spend money for. Take her to the park and run around a bit, if she's the sporty type. If she's a bookworm, take her to the library for some quiet atmosphere (maybe some hanky-panky in the reading rooms, if risky "Might get caught" sex is yours or her thing). There is usually some event, going on somewhere, that you can have fun at, that doesn't require money. If you can't put your finger on something, you either aren't thinking hard/creatively enough or you live in a literal Prison Block.

2nd and 3rd dates, maybe you can go to a coffee shop or a restaurant, once it becomes obvious the venture is worth investing a little into. For the other women, game is usually all you will need to get what you are looking for. But remember that you probably won't find LTR material this way. For great returns, risks and investments must be made. This is true in any venture, whether professionally, financially, or relationship-wise, and results are never guaranteed. It's up to you to make the most of the opportunity.

EmanuelGold · 2014-08-17T05:53:37+00:00

How do you go about asking to split dinner/cab etc?

I've never really been in the situation to ask because I don't take girls out for dinner/lunch dates, I normally go out to bars where I say i'll grab this round you can get the next which works fine and doesn't seem as straight as saying "let's split the cost"

Mild111 · 2014-08-18T00:37:02+00:00

First date = Beverages.

Arrive early (she will most likely arrive late due to checking out herself for last minute adjustments in the mirror.)

Get your drink, pay for it, and wait for her to arrive. Don't get involved in her ordering, let her deal with the bartender/barista on her own.

After the first drink the conversation should be going somewhere and by then you should be able to tell if things are headed to a place you want to invest in.

Don't offer until it's worth it to offer, until you know she's investing interest.

Don't risk friend-zoning yourself to some self-serving harpy.

EKcore · 2014-08-16T14:24:33+00:00

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[deleted] · 2014-08-16T14:37:16+00:00

Whomever invites pays first, then you swap turns.

That's how I play it.

IllimitableMan · 2014-08-16T16:05:41+00:00

If I like the chick a lot (as in, think she's pretty cool) I'll pay like I'd pay for a friend. You know what this means don't you? I hardly ever pay. If I think she's a whore, a vapid collection of holes with no real personality, overly entitled or there's no real connection between us I'm not paying for that beverage/ticket/whatever. I never buy drinks for chicks in a bar. Buying a coffee is far different from buying a spirit/mixer in the bar. The bar is sexualised, the coffee shop isn't. Chicks go to bars to get free shit, jumping from guy to guy they don't fancy until they find one they do. In bars buying a bitch a drink is failing a shit test, not buying one is passing it, getting her to buy you one is hitting it in the back of the net. In coffee shops? Not so much. This bullshit doesn't exist there.

If she's disappointed you didn't pay who gives a fuck really? Oh what, you've got a strike against your name and lost brownie points because the silly bitch is upset you didn't pay? Give me a break. There are loads of chicks out there. Being afraid she'll not like you any more because you didn't pay on the first date is coming from a scarcity mindset and will ensure you always have minimal success with women because your mind is in the entirely wrong place to be a bachelor/spin plates and especially maintain an LTR. If you have a scarcity mindset, innately, within yourself, you may as well be running dread game on her behalf. Insecure guys without options aren't HOT. Chicks fuck bad boy types who would demand THAT SHE PAY all the time. The frame is all about being better than her. If you've got asshole game you can easily blag not paying for shit, upset her a little, and use that energy in a patrice o neal way to neg her for her entitlement, call her on her shit, use amused mastery, escalate and close. Obviously you calibrate this kind of game in its intensity based upon what type of chick she is (a bear, a hare or a rabbit in patrice terminology.) By the fucking by paying isn't important, just don't be the dumb cunt who is constantly getting his wallet out because he lacks personality or you know, a clue in general about how social dynamics work.

Don't use money as a crutch, she's there to spend time with you. Your time is valuable. If your time isn't valuable and your character is so weak that you need to go all provider on her ass to try and convince her you're worth a shot then you're approaching this shit all wrong and need to go up your confidence. I suggest monk mode for that endeavour: http://illimitablemen.com/2014/04/13/monk-mode/

If you're unsure about how to behave, you're unsure in yourself and that means your confidence needs work. My $0.02c.

whatsazipper · 2014-08-16T16:55:52+00:00

Am I on TRP or not?

Read the god damn sidebar before posting.

abXcv · 2014-08-16T12:51:48+00:00

In my opinion, ALWAYS split the check on a first date.

It's a big red flag for me if she gets bitchy about having to pay, or expecting you to pay.

After that, I'm not bothered.

I would expect her to pay sometimes, and sometimes split the cheque, but I'm not counting it up, I don't really care.

You don't want to set yourself up as someone who pays for dinner on the first date though, because that sets the tone of the relationship.

altra_hex · 2014-08-16T13:38:17+00:00

Looks like there is not really much consensus on this.

Based on prior experience and what TRP says on it, I still have to just play it by ear. Generally, if I find that I am liking her, then I'll offer to pay. If not, then split.

Rougepellet · 2014-08-16T16:17:05+00:00

Before you go on a first date, make it very clear the the bill will be split. You aren't anyone's atm.

scamper_22 · 2014-08-16T15:58:30+00:00

It depends is the best answer. It really depends on the girl as well. For me, it is more important that the girl give according to her ability. So for example, I dated a girl who worked in a daycare when I was younger. She didn't make a whole lot compared to me. So, I didn't mind paying more often than not. What she had though, she had no issue spending on me.

But when I've dated girls who make enough money, well then its generally 50/50 for me.

ShinyBrah · 2014-08-17T04:13:56+00:00

Ideally, avoid high investment dates. Go for drinks (best one) or get a coffee and go for a walk. Restaurant dates are the fast lane to the friend zone.

[deleted] · 2014-08-16T21:44:14+00:00

[permanently deleted]

cali_gunner · 2014-08-16T14:12:41+00:00

If you don't have A+ game then the uglier person pays.

whatsazipper · 2014-08-16T16:28:15+00:00

If you're asking this question, you're structuring your 'dating' wrong. You've just met this chick. You want to screen her and fuck cause she's into you. There shouldn't be any significant expenditure of money going on here.

If anything, a girl showing investment in you is the real indicator of attraction. When girls are buying you stuff, you're doing it right.

smokingmonkey420 · 2014-08-16T17:33:23+00:00

A way to work around this is to buy a coupon for a "free" ice cream, movie tickets, whatever... Beforehand

That takes away all of the pressure and raises your status since she perceives that people give you free stuff.

violent_frame · 2014-08-16T15:31:12+00:00

The one who invites pays. So the man. If you don't want to pay much then do something free

hepatosplenomegaly · 2014-08-16T15:36:14+00:00

Don't pay for anything until you are fucking her. There are too many who just use multiple guys for free shit even though they know they don't want you for anything other than that.

First date should be meeting for drinks or coffee, get there early and buy your own first.

PlusGoody · 2014-08-16T16:12:29+00:00

First date, you pay, but it should be cheap. A couple drinks at most.

Second date, you can pay, and a bit more. She should at least make a move for the check.

Third date, she MUST pay. Don't make a move for the check. If she doesn't pick it up, you pay, but sayonara after that. Obviously third date should be something she can afford.

Title	Who pays on a date?
Author	[deleted]
Upvotes	28
Comments	63
Date	August 16, 2014 9:26 AM UTC (11 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/TheRedPill
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/TheRedPill/comments/2dpm5r/who_pays_on_a_date/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/TheRedPill/who-pays-on-a-date.19512 https://theredarchive.com/post/19512

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