The Wall

hakosua · 2016-11-05T22:22:56+00:00

Having just entered my 31st year of life, I'm thinking more about 'the wall' than I used to. Your interpretation speaks more to my own experiences. If there's been a wall for me, it's been more attitudinal than physical. Thanks for your post!

I mean, I do think of my looks as an asset that depreciates with age but, thus far, I haven't experienced many age-related disadvantages. The people whom I find attractive still tend to reciprocate my interest and, when I dress up and go out, I still get enough validation to keep me confident. Ideally, I'll evolve not to need that validation. But I am reassured to notice that I seem to need less of it as I grow older.

The wall we talk about the most is the one where a woman comes crashing in to the realization that she was never empowered by giving herself away for free. It's not the end for her. I'd say it's a catalyst for change, if anything.

I've always hated the idea that women who have casual sex are 'giving it away for free,' maybe in part because that would mean I've squandered a lot of capital. 30-somethings still happily 'give it away' but they also tend to stress more about finding a spouse or a co-parent. In other words, they become more intentional, even as they continue to fuck around.

The novelty of being desired sexually also wears off somewhat as time goes on. Young women often seem shocked to realize people fancy them. And, as somebody who's fucked around with girls in their early twenties, I can attest that there's something charming about that. When I confess attraction to a crush, I want surprised emojis and hearts and exclamation points, not a flat "Yeah, I figured."

My own personal wall involved getting sober. Without the social lubricant, casual hook-ups became a lot harder to enjoy. I also became less of an asshole -- a trait which had endeared me to certain kinds of guys. For every pushover chasing her bad boy, there's a white knight waiting for his princess to sober up and notice him.

It's Always Sunny in Philadelphia is fucking spot-on as always -- not because Sweet Dee is dumb for giving it away, but because she's too drunk to grow past the point of basing her worth on sexual validation.

SipsSparklingWater · 2016-11-05T20:45:44+00:00

"The Wall" is not the end of course. I think it basically just means you've reached your peak and it's only going down hill from their.

MisgenderedCactus · 2016-11-06T03:01:40+00:00

The wall we talk about the most is the one where a woman comes crashing in to the realization that she was never empowered by giving herself away for free.

So if you've never done this, said wall doesn't exist for you anyway. Same as the other wall TRPers go on about, where it gets harder for women to live without sexual attention from men. If you've spent your life doing things to decrease said attention, then it will be less of a "wall" and more of a relief to not need to hide so much.

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Willow-girl · 2016-11-05T22:49:42+00:00

The wall we talk about the most is the one where a woman comes crashing in to the realization that she was never empowered by giving herself away for free.

What; should she start selling it instead?

Prostitution has never been my thing, but ... whatever works for ya!

fuxdpus · 2016-11-05T22:50:06+00:00

I don't think I agree with "the wall" concept. That makes it sound like they just wake up one day and their looks are gone. It is more gradual.

Willow-girl · 2016-11-05T22:58:24+00:00

I think the impact of "hitting The Wall" may be more painful for beautiful women who have a lot more to lose.

I'm strictly average-looking, so I've never been under any illusions that the men who chose me were drawn to my stunning good looks! My personality has always been my main attraction, and that has only gotten better with age, I think, as I've continued to work on my character defects and have interesting life experiences.

Years ago, I did know a beautiful woman, married to a musician, who was approaching The Wall and seemed to feel a lot of angst over it. I think it was less that her own looks were fading -- she was still beautiful -- but she wasn't the youngest and newest kid on the block anymore.

iponi · 2016-11-06T03:50:02+00:00

It's not the wall it's a wall. The wall we talk about the most is the one where a woman comes crashing in to the realization that she was never empowered by giving herself away for free. It's not the end for her. I'd say it's a catalyst for change, if anything.

No, that's not what the wall is. The wall is the moment when:

She is at the age where she realises that the baby clock is ticking, and thus wants to settle down.
Her attractiveness has declined to the point where the hot men no longer even want to have sex with her, let alone settle down with her, though average men still want to have sex with her.
She then realises that the only men who want to settle down with her are men she would have previously found sexually unattractive or even repulsive.

biblesjedi_mindtrick · 2016-11-06T00:04:32+00:00

It's not the end for her. I'd say it's a catalyst for change, if anything. Much like a TRP user has came to the crashing realization that he's been used for free as a beta chump, then changes into a man who get's what he's worth,

Good post! Agreed. Plus, the clip rocks. :D

PostModernismKills · 2016-11-06T00:18:29+00:00

I don't know if wall is the right term since despite its existence people everywhere at many different ages manage to have sex.

wuboo · 2016-11-06T04:22:19+00:00

where a woman comes crashing in to the realization that she was never empowered by giving herself away for free

So what about women who never believed it in the first place? Does that mean they hit the wall before they were born or that they never hit the wall?

Rollo-Tomassi · 2016-11-07T20:38:46+00:00

https://therationalmale.com/2012/07/18/the-wall/

Defining the Wall

When I wrote Navigating the SMP, the reason I used 30 as the general age women typically hit the ‘Wall’ is really a combination of factors. Most importantly it represents the threshold at which most women realize their lessened capacity to sexually compete with the next generation of women in their ‘actualized’ sexual peak (22-24). However, there is a male part of the Wall equation that needs to be understood. 30 is also the general age at which men (should) become aware of their own, longer-lasting sexual market value and potential. This affects women’s interpretations of the Wall. Once a Man is aware that he has the capacity to attract the sexual attentions of the younger women he’d previously had limited access to, and understanding of, his actions and imperatives define the Wall for women who are approaching that threshold. And unsurprisingly this is the point at which Wall-fearing women begin their accusations of men’s infantile ego issues, shaming, etc. for preferring younger women over themselves.

When we (and as women in particular would have us) view the Wall in terms of physical attractiveness we don’t see the full picture and relevancy the Wall has for women. It’s very easy (and often fun) to compare pictures of girls we knew in high school with their current FaceBook profile shots at 40+ years old and get a laugh at how bad she hit the Wall. It’s also easy for women to point out the notable exceptions to the rule and find a hot 38 year old woman with 3 kids competing in the Ms. Fitness USA pageant. It gives them a false sense of hope about their own decay.

However the Wall is much more than just the physical; it’s the conditional that accelerates or decelerates a woman’s date with the Wall.

Single mother? Acceleration.

Consistent, bad personal habits? Acceleration.

Careerist obsessive? Acceleration.

Obesity? Acceleration.

Do notable exceptions to these exist? Of course, but they prove the rule. And that rule comes in the form of such an overwhelming fear that contemporary society needed to be restructured to help avoid it. The 38 year old, careerist, single mother of 3 competing in fitness pageants is only a hero because of the fear of the Wall.

The psychological stress about women hitting the wall is less about their actual attractiveness to men and more about their capacity to intrasexually compete with younger, hotter, tighter women for the attentions of men with long term potential. Women who get closer to the point where they can no longer ignore their lessened capacity to compete with their younger sisters are often the most necessitous of a commitment from a man with long term security potential.

But rather than accept the responsibility of their late-life state upon themselves, women put that burden on men's shoulders by shaming them for desiring younger, hotter, tighter women they prefer and lacking the "maturity" to conveniently find themselves more suitable mates. It's essentially an evolutionary case of women wanting to have their cake and eat it too by making it socially inappropriate for men to follow their own sexual imperatives while conveniently ignoring their own sexual decisions before they arrived at the Wall.

Joseph_the_Carpenter · 2016-11-05T21:20:14+00:00

Much like a TRP user has came to the crashing realization that he's been used for free as a beta chump, then changes into a man who get's what he's worth, a woman can realize the same thing and make the same changes on the feminine end of the spectrum.

I argue the wall is different for men and women. Men's looks aren't as impacted the older they get and men start from nothing and have to build up to their peak value. Women are born into it and it all goes downhill from age 16 onward.

TRP says that the wall is where a woman realizes she has started losing her value and it's all downhill from there, which is true in the sense that her looks can't be restored and she isn't getting any younger, so her value can go up in some ways: the feminine changes and such. You're also right that it's not a good revenge fantasy to have. Older women don't "get what's coming to them." They still bang younger guys if they want, but now they have to give up having more or have to give more. I know because I'm one of those dudes banging older women. The huge SMV disparity between me and them means they tend to be more polite, giving, and less drama-filled. As for how much of that is proper TRP behavior coming from me and the huge SMV disparity is anyone's guess, but I have a type and I'm aggressively pursuing it.

The problem with the wall is she's already reached her peak; she could have been even more valuable before by changing behaviors and habits, and habits can change but youth is gone forever. Perhaps that's a source of anger and resentment about the wall from men: what does it say about the woman that could have been a better person when she was younger, but it took her losing her youth and looks for it to happen? Men have no choice but to suffer through self-improvement to get anywhere in life (even more so with sex), yet women don't have to make the choice of improve or starve.

anitapk · 2016-11-05T20:45:25+00:00

I think you are confusing the two things

questioningwoman · 2016-11-06T00:32:22+00:00

The people who say "act like a man get treated like a man" shouldn't be hypocrites. If they think they have a right to hit women who "act like bitches" but bitch and moan whenever a woman has leadership qualities, they should put their money where their mouth is.

kevin32 · 2016-11-05T22:52:52+00:00

The wall we talk about the most is the one where a woman comes crashing in to the realization that she was never empowered by giving herself away for free.

Completely disagree. This implies that all those years on the carousel was her attempt to "make something of herself" in terms of her relationships with men, to find the "best man" to build something long-term. If that were the case there wouldn't be so many men rejected like this, this and this (NSFW).

"The wall" the Red Pill talks about is the one where a woman comes crashing in to the realization that she's no longer attractive enough to ride the carousel and needs to find a provider soon before she completely drops out of the SMP. Her carousel years had nothing to do with her empowering herself and everything to do with hedonism.

Your quote reads like "Don't feel so bad post-wall woman. You made a mistake that you weren't aware of until now." But assuming she started riding the carousel at say, 20, don't you find it a little strange that it took her roughly 10 years to come to this realization, which just so happened to coincide after all the jerks and players no longer wanted her? (NSFW)

Now to your credit, maybe she went into the carousel thinking she could find a nice Chad for an LTR, but the dick was so good she didn't mind him not committing to her. But from my perspective, these women know exactly what they're doing, and they're even encouraged by feminists.

StickItInTheToilet · 2016-11-06T00:04:19+00:00

This seems more like a post that belongs in trp. We (the blues) don't believe in the wall.

Of course, you'd prob get shot down for saying it in trp.

Title	The Wall
Author	[deleted]
Upvotes	8
Comments	101
Date	November 5, 2016 8:31 PM UTC (9 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/5bbzbb/the_wall/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/the-wall.271999 https://theredarchive.com/post/271999

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