As MRAs, are you guys Pro-Choice or Pro-Life?

Frosty-Gate-8094 · 2021-01-03T13:25:28+00:00

Pro-choice.. And I support paper abortions too.

VermilionScarlet · 2021-01-03T15:30:21+00:00

I don't see it as a binary thing. Being pro-abortion to me is like being pro-having lifeboats on a ship. You want them as a last resort but also, make sure you do everything possible not to crash the ship in the first place.

Also, I see myself as being more pro-choice than most pro-choice people. When adoption agencies advertise on campuses, their billboards get vandalised by pro-choice people because they don't like having the extra choice. Adoption is a good thing and should be promoted as a choice more than it currently is.

iAntiMage · 2021-01-03T12:13:51+00:00

Women should have the right to decide if they want to continue thier pregnancy and no one should force one against their will.

Similarly i support the right of men to decide if they want to support financially or not. States should not force individuals to pay for something they dont want.

Finally it goes both ways. One without the other is hypocrisy.

Men-Are-Human · 2021-01-03T14:52:03+00:00

I'm pro life, but I think that's a pretty rare view here. I see it as legal murder.

ThatDamnedRedneck · 2021-01-03T14:53:43+00:00

I just want men to have the same options as women, whatever they are.

Alejandro4222017 · 2021-01-03T19:52:26+00:00

I am pro-life

Vaultdweller1001V · 2021-01-03T08:39:02+00:00

Pro Choice, so long as child support is abolished.

garethCorrelian · 2021-01-03T10:18:43+00:00

If abortion exists then the man should have a choice to withdraw from parental responsibility. But I am pro-life and no state involvement with child support. Responsibility lies in the hands of the parents and failure to support their child should mean social shame and adoption.

excess_inquisitivity · 2021-01-03T10:29:25+00:00

No one should be coerced to parenthood by one's personal choices.

I don't want to be coerced into anything undesirable by my personal choices either. Undesired consequences should never apply to me.

novhaku · 2021-01-03T16:44:25+00:00

Pro-choice. I live in a country where abortion is legal and paid by the state anyway so it's natural for me.

I still have a list of problems with it though. First, depending on the meaning of the word "right" in a given context, it's not a right. It's a privilege. A privilege I am personally 100% for and that should be granted, for sure, and most certainly a legal right, but it's still a privilege, not some kind of innate right that comes with the act of existing alone. This is mainly just semantics, but it's still important because people tend to forget that having the state paying for you isn't automatic. My country is supposed to have a great universal healthcare, one of the best in the world, everyone can benefit from which is a legal right, but it's a privilege our society, which in the end just means other taxpayers, grants us and they're the ones paying for it, not something innate and automatic. This is somewhat important because, just like how it is for universal healthcare, my country is a prime exemple of it, people benefiting from it and seeing it as natural tend to forget that it is an ADVANTAGE they have in our current society, and a sign that this society isn't that bad by itself. Which becomes problematic when as a result they just forget how good they have it becaue to them legal right = natural right and compare their country's policies to things that are rather unflattering, to say the least. It's a legal right (well, in my country anyway) that definitely shouldn't be revoked, and a privilege other taxpayers grant you, not some kind of right that is innate and comes out of nowhere as if it was automatic to humans. Ultimately, society is giving you the privilege of having a mostly risk-free operation so that you will not risk suffering severe harm or even dying doing it yourself at home. The least one can do as a thank is to be thankful for that, instead of reacting with entitlement while forgetting that it comes from somewhere.

Second, I don't agree with actually abusing it like some women me and my close family know that basically use it as the pill "because they don't want to get fat because of the pill". Which technically shouldn't even be authorized since after a while it can become dangerous for the person, but it's not always applied. We're not talking about 3 or 4 times here. We're talking about multiples times a year for many, many years. It isn't "the pill" and is supposed to be a last chance, and while most sane women do know that, sadly some apparently either aren't aware of it or (more likely) they just don't care. The fact that repeated abortions can be dangerous (if only because more abortions means more risks of a mistake during the operation, which means more risks of infections) is sadly not yet acquired for some. They're certainly the outliers, but the fact that such outliers exist is problematic by itself, if only from an health perspective.

Third, call it what it is without sugarcoating to make people feel better about it: killing someone. It's just that we sometimes justify killing and "make it right". No need to sugarcoat it. It doesn't make someone an "evil murderer" or whatever else that is commonly said to diabolize abortion. Again, we do sometimes allow killing under specific circumstances. In the end you're still taking a life, and the time limits when it comes to abortion are quite arbitrary. It doesn't make the action bad; again, we justify killing in some situation. There's just no need to be an hypocrite about it just to entertain the arguments of pro-life people or rules or moralities that didn't take specific circumstances into account when we wrote them a long, long time ago. If you're doing something, at least do it knowingly and without downplaying it; it's the least one can do out of respect for the life that is being taken away. Don't guilt-trip over it, that's not the point at all, just be aware of what you're doing, and why.

All of this being said, I again support paid-by-the-state abortion. I just don't like the hypocrisy that can show up in this debate.

Paper abortion should come with it though, which is obvious. Otherwise, there's a problem.

HUZNAIN · 2021-01-03T17:11:23+00:00

Pro-life.
The other option is baby murder.

AdikaHUN0328 · 2021-01-03T11:38:46+00:00

I am pro choice, in that early stage, it doesn't realy live that much. And usualy if they are aborting, and the parents want to abort, it will be better than living as an unwanted, maybe sick child.

devnull791101 · 2021-01-03T09:18:10+00:00

it should be reciprocal. if she has a right to abort you should have a right not to pay

saying that abortion is totally murder. Human life just isn't that precious

cld8 · 2021-01-03T10:16:13+00:00

I personally am pro-choice, as I don't see anything unethical about terminating a pregnancy before the baby is born.

2717192619192 · 2021-01-03T11:17:53+00:00

I am pro-choice 100%. Bodily autonomy is very important - a woman should not be forced to bear pregnancy and childbirth against her will, just as a man should not be forced to bear child support and should have a right to paper abortion. Every human being should also have a right to genital autonomy, and choose for themselves once they become adults if they wish to mutilate their genitals.

Fantastic_Crazy_2539 · 2021-01-03T08:42:32+00:00

I am Pro life due to religious reasons

HUZNAIN · 2021-01-03T12:30:56+00:00

I'm pro-idc

Bojack35 · 2021-01-03T13:08:26+00:00

Pro choice. I don't see the benefit of forcing someone to have an unwanted child.

Paper abortions for men are an interesting one... overall I'm for it but there are issues.

Basically the problem is once a child is born the theory of the law is the best interests of the child. The practice is often punitive to fathers. Given how much the state spends on children anyway I dont mind having that money come out of the taxpayers pocket instead of a man who at an early enough stage declared he was unwilling to be a father. However what then stops couples exploiting this and having the tax money on top?

Yoramus · 2021-01-03T13:51:00+00:00

Pro-choice.

But I believe there is a strong non religious argument for being pro life, too. I support abortions for the first weeks or so.

KissMyAsthma-99 · 2021-01-03T15:07:01+00:00

The only rational answer for a true egalitarian is prolife.

The reasoning is simple: an egalitarian believes in identical treatment for both genders. In the case of parental rights, that means identical rights. It's not enough to say 'prochoice decline child support,' because that isn't identical treatment. If one parent can choose to kill their child but the other cannot, you have an unequal treatment between the sexes. In order to argue prochoice logically as an egalitarian, you'd have to argue prochoice for BOTH parents; you'd have to argue that EITHER parent could choose to abort unilaterally, OR that both parents were required to consent. Either position is pretty absurd for quite a number of reasons.

To address some ridiculous and anti-scientific comments I've seen here (and a million times elsewhere), a fetus is a human being from conception and the fetus is NOT the woman's body. To make those claims shows a laughable level of biological ignorance.

Don't want to get pregnant? Don't have sex. Don't want to get in a car accident? Don't go driving. If you accidentally hit another driver, you don't get to shoot their kid in the passenger seat.

pacsatonifil · 2021-01-03T16:49:28+00:00

I’m pro choice.

dukunt · 2021-01-03T17:50:39+00:00

Im pro-choice for the most part. But when I was 20 my girlfriend found out that she was pregnant and together we decided that we weren't ready to be parents and she got an abortion. That was 27 years ago and I regret that decision everyday. Getting an abortion is not something that I would ever consider doing again for me. But I would be a hypocrite if I said that no one should get an abortion. But I will never be a part of an abortion again. I got a vasectomy just to be safe.

AndrewLevin · 2021-01-03T18:48:02+00:00

Pro-equality. If women can avoid responsibility for their children, men also should be able to do same.

TheDongerNeedsFood · 2021-01-03T18:53:12+00:00

I am as pro-choice as it comes (we need to increase funding for planned parenthood by an order of magnitude, but also expand its services for men) and I am just as strong a supporter of paper/financial abortions for men.

DubsPackage · 2021-01-03T19:53:57+00:00

Ethically pro-life, pragmatically pro-choice.

There is no way for me or the govt to know about every single situation that could possibly happen in a pregnancy, maybe the baby is severely brain-damaged, maybe its life will be terrible, who knows what the situation is.

Do we want the govt necessarily adjudicating these things?

Or can we trust maternal instinct to do the right thing most of the time?

We can fault women for some things, but overwhelmingly most women are good mothers and good with children.

I think if we have sufficient safety nets and prenatal support, we can hammer abortion to where it becomes a less and less prevalent "option" while still retaining that option. It's still there but we discourage it and do what we can to support families.

boringcarpets · 2021-01-03T21:13:35+00:00

Pro life isn't the same argument as pro choice - the two concepts are not binary opposites

Maldevinine · 2021-01-04T09:41:19+00:00

I am neither pro-life nor pro-choice, because I believe both are based on a flawed highly individualistic view of the world.

The entity who should actually get a say in whether or not a child will be born in the society in 20 year's time, because that is what will be affected by the child's actions. If the child is going to be abused or cannot be properly supported during it's infancy, then it is better for all that the child be aborted or adopted. The parents do not suffer trying to provide for a child that they cannot (either physically or emotionally, whichever applies), the child does not suffer abuse and abandonment during their infancy, and the society that they grow into does not suffer from the actions of the child.

However, "I don't want to" should not be a valid excuse for destroying a valuable piece of the future. We all exist as an unbroken chain of children and nothing else you ever do (outside some absolutely incredibly things, like if you manage to start WW3) will ever have as much impact on the future as raising a healthy, stable, productive child. You owe it to the future to get it right.

ImplodedPotatoSalad · 2021-01-07T14:28:34+00:00

Pro choice of men leaving or staying.

evenmoremeancomments · 2021-01-03T09:44:50+00:00

Pro life, not counting pregnancy due to rape and life threatening pregnancy conditions. Actions have consequences and men shouldn't be the only ones to face them

Ren_kurusu · 2021-01-03T09:14:28+00:00

Depends on the situation. It's a very shitty thing to abort after having unprotected sec when you know what's gonna happen. But other than that due to rape cases or similar cases it's okay to get abortions during the first trimester.

Title	As MRAs, are you guys Pro-Choice or Pro-Life?
Author	HUZNAIN
Upvotes	5
Comments	103
Date	January 3, 2021 8:37 AM UTC (5 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/kph3v1/as_mras_are_you_guys_prochoice_or_prolife/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/as-mras-are-you-guys-pro-choice-or-pro-life.836831 https://theredarchive.com/post/836831

Comments