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Doctor faces trial for cutting off 4yo boy's penis during circumcision

Thinkmoreaboutit

March 29, 2017
425 upvotes
/r/MensRights
https://www.rt.com/news/382693-swiss-doctor-circumcision-trial/
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Post Information
Title Doctor faces trial for cutting off 4yo boy's penis during circumcision
Author

Thinkmoreaboutit

Upvotes 425
Comments 208
Date March 29, 2017 4:45 PM UTC
(9 years ago)
Subreddit Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/627t12/doctor_faces_trial_for_cutting_off_4yo_boys_penis/
Archive Link https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/doctor-faces-trial-for-cutting-off-4yo-boys-penis.927490
https://theredarchive.com/post/927490
Top posts by Thinkmoreaboutit

"A campaign group wants circumcision to be recognised as male genital mutilation (MGM) and for it to be considered a criminal offence."

1889 upvotes
June 30, 2017
/r/MensRights

Doctor 'acted illegally' by circumcising boy - BBC News

331 upvotes
June 3, 2017
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I took my newborn in for a nose job . . . and his pediatrician flipped out on me. Can you believe it?!

306 upvotes
June 3, 2017
/r/MensRights

TRY TO CUT ME NOW YOU FUCKING COWARDS! - #bloodstainedmen #circumcision #mgm #bsm #acog

205 upvotes
May 7, 2017
/r/MensRights

Charges dropped against Boynton mom who fought son's circumcision - Protecting your child gets you mentally evaluated, or face jail time.

204 upvotes
February 20, 2017
/r/MensRights

Circumcision is Child Abuse and Torture

185 upvotes
December 13, 2016
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GoFundMe allows users to receive funds to rape and mutilate baby boys.

167 upvotes
May 31, 2017
/r/MensRights

EXCLUSIVE: NYC knew about dangerous Jewish circumcision ritual for years but didn't warn parents until after baby's death

161 upvotes
June 3, 2017
/r/MensRights

Comments

[–]Freakity 93 points94 points95 points 9 years ago (129 children) | Copy Link

4 years old?? This kid is going to actually remember this!

[+]somelikeitinthetwat points 9 years ago [recovered] (12 children) | Copy Link

Typical for Turkish boys, which is why I think this is a Turkish family in Switzerland.

Source: was circumcised at that age and I remember it.

[–]starbuckxks 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

Mine happened when i was around 9 or so. our culture says that boys needs to remember the circumcision.

[–]rodrigogirao 6 points7 points8 points 9 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Your culture is disgusting.

[–]starbuckxks 4 points5 points6 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

yes. i hate it too. luckily, i dont live in turkey anymore.

[–]Freakity 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

Wow That puts Turkey in a whole new light for me!

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points8 points 9 years ago* (4 children) | Copy Link

Thats how its done almost everywhere in the middle east and Africa.

Most circumcisions globally are performed on boys right before puberty, Americans and Jews are the exception not the rule.

[–]aksoullanka 4 points5 points6 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Plus Malaysia, Indonesia, Philippine ............

Sometimes they don't even get proper privacy or correct medical equipment. Done in a makeshift medical camps for example in schools, churches ........ in front of everyone and use rudimentary apparatus.

[–]Freakity 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Holey! Learn something new everyday. You should add Canada to that list also.

[–][deleted] 11 points12 points13 points 9 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Yup, they consider it a coming of age ritual. A party is thrown and the boy's relatives are invited, the party ends with him being taken to a separate room where his male family members hold him down while the circumciser does his thing (usually with no anesthetic).

Not many people realize that where they cut little girls (FGM) in barbaric and unsanitary conditions, they cut little boys the same way.

edit: this is also how its done in the Philippines.

[–]aksoullanka 4 points5 points6 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Boys won't get privacy in some occasions. Sometimes they are cut in front of women and girls while they are laughing at the boys.

[–]Thinkmoreaboutit[S] 67 points68 points69 points 9 years ago (37 children) | Copy Link

Age is irrelevant. Rape and mutilation is abhorrent.

[–]toddiehoward 33 points34 points35 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Still relevant.

[–]dbcaliman 6 points7 points8 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

You are absolutely right, this is genital mutilation. Just because it's more severe, doesn't mean that this entire process isn't already morally corrupt.

[–]topsecreteltee 4 points5 points6 points 9 years ago (34 children) | Copy Link

That just isn't true. There is a huge difference between knowing something bad happened and being able to remember it.

[–]Thinkmoreaboutit[S] 8 points9 points10 points 9 years ago (33 children) | Copy Link

Mutilation is mutilation.

[–]jeegte12 4 points5 points6 points 9 years ago (29 children) | Copy Link

there is a difference between mutilation and mutilation with a dash of trauma.

[–]Thinkmoreaboutit[S] -2 points-1 points0 points 9 years ago (28 children) | Copy Link

Are you a fucking moron?

It's trauma regardless.

THIS is the shit thinking that allows this to persist.

IT'S FUCKING DISGUSTING!

[–]topsecreteltee 3 points4 points5 points 9 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

Hahahahah, you must not have had anything really awful happen to you. The difference is that you never stop reliving the terrible things. They start to define you.

[–]Thinkmoreaboutit[S] 3 points4 points5 points 9 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

Genital mutilation and rape is pretty fucking horrible.

[–]topsecreteltee 7 points8 points9 points 9 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

It is pretty horrible, but using myself as an example, my circumcision does not impact my personality, but having my friends and friends of friends dismembered by IEDs does. I don't relive being circumcised, I relive having to explain to my friends wife why she couldn't have an open casket funeral for him after the notification officer said she could. I'm not happy about being circumcised, but I'm haunted by the memories of how vile humanity can be.

Terrible things are terrible by definition, but if you can remember them or not makes a world of difference.

[–]Consilio_et_Animis 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

er... have you ever stopped and thought why there is so much physical and sexual violence in the Middle East and other Muslim countries? Could it possibly be anything to do with the physical and sexual violence inflicted upon all infant and young boys' penises at such an impressionable age?

[–]Thinkmoreaboutit[S] -4 points-3 points-2 points 9 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Good job dismissing the harms of genital mutilation and the pain of men.

[–]k_rol 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

I don't understand why you can't discuss nicely with others. He has good arguments and instead of coming back with intelligent response you bash him. That's not how you look serious.

[–]Urishima 0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

He is what we colloquially refer to as a 'spergelord'. Pay him no mind.

[–]k_rol 0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I didn't know that term, I like it.

[+]Thinkmoreaboutit[S] -6 points-5 points-4 points 9 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

That's not a fucking argument you moron.

It's not good.

It's a mental disease trying to justify MUTILATIONS.

[–]k_rol 4 points5 points6 points 9 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

Wow you are good at conversation. Keep insulting people.

[–]Thinkmoreaboutit[S] 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

I don't expect logic and reason from people who don't understand how disgusting and damaging genital mutilation is.

[–]jeegte12 -2 points-1 points0 points 9 years ago (11 children) | Copy Link

most men who are circumcised at birth are not psychologically traumatized by it.

[–]shadowguyver 2 points3 points4 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Studies show circumcision does rewire the brain. From circumcision then we are not exactly who we would have been. Our world changes at that point because of trauma that was not needed.

[–]rodrigogirao 0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link

Or maybe they are, but just can't point at the reason.

[–]jeegte12 -1 points0 points1 point 9 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

that's just wild speculation, you have no idea if that's true.

[–]rodrigogirao 2 points3 points4 points 9 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

Do you suppose that amputating a body part has no effect?

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

What you say if I stated that torture+murder was worse than plain murder? "Murder is murder!" is my guess.

[–]Thinkmoreaboutit[S] -1 points0 points1 point 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

"Less violent" rape is still rape.

It's fucking wrong and disgusting.

It's not the pain Olympics motherfuckers.

[–]such-a-mensch 11 points12 points13 points 9 years ago (76 children) | Copy Link

I've got a buddy who did it at age 20. 15 years later we still make fun of him.

[–]shadowguyver 41 points42 points43 points 9 years ago (40 children) | Copy Link

At least he made his own decision. Infant circumcision has caused me both physical and mental pain throughout most of my life.

[–]such-a-mensch 11 points12 points13 points 9 years ago (39 children) | Copy Link

I'm pretty happy my parents circumcised me but I can absolutely understand why many people find it to be a bad thing.

[–]shadowguyver 37 points38 points39 points 9 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Good for you. My circumcision left me with too little skin. I rip during sex, have painful erections and when flaccid my penis is pulled back into the scrotum.

Logically you should wait til you have past puberty so you have stopped growing, but then parents can't feel powerful making every decision for you. Nor can they push their religious view on you by carving it into you.

Why should men be allowed the same body autonomy that women are federally protected to have.

Guess my body my rights is only for women.

[–][deleted] 9 points10 points11 points 9 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Fuck I think this is what happens to me as well. When I have sex very regularly (more then like once a day) or very vigorously (usually) my skin tears right under where the foreskin would have been. This leads to me not being able to have sex as often or hard as my gf would and myself would like. This could also explain why when I'm flaccid it's small as hell but when erect I'm well above average. I can't believe I've never thought of this...

[–]englishfury 3 points4 points5 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

This could also explain why when I'm flaccid it's small as hell but when erect I'm well above average. I can't believe I've never thought of this...

This could also explain why when I'm flaccid it's small as hell but when erect I'm well above average. I can't believe I've never thought of this...

I'm not so sure, I'm uncircumcised and mine behaves in the same way.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points6 points 9 years ago (35 children) | Copy Link

Why?

[–]such-a-mensch 6 points7 points8 points 9 years ago (34 children) | Copy Link

Why am I happy? I think it looks better and I feel like I am able to clean myself better. Overall I'm just happy with my dick.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points5 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Thanks for the response.

The cleanliness thing is BS. But I'm glad you're happy. You can't do anything about it now anyways.

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points7 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Washing your foreskin takes about 5 seconds in the shower.

[–]Thinkmoreaboutit[S] 7 points8 points9 points 9 years ago* (31 children) | Copy Link

Scarred, dried out, missing function looks better?

[–]Morrenz 6 points7 points8 points 9 years ago (13 children) | Copy Link

Oh fuck off not everyone has to feel the same about their bits and bobs as you do.

[–]Master_Qu33f 2 points3 points4 points 9 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

As much as infantile circumcision is wrong, I agree with u/Morrenz; I was circumcised as an infant, so all I can remember is not having a foreskin. How can I be upset if I don't know what it's like to have one?

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points8 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

How can I be upset if I don't know what it's like to have one?

How can a grown women be upset if she doesn't remember having a clitoris?

[–]Thinkmoreaboutit[S] 5 points6 points7 points 9 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

Would you say the same for an arm or an eye?

Classic denial of harm.

I'm glad you're okay with your body, but don't for a moment a think this is acceptable to do to anyone.

[–]G-man88 2 points3 points4 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

You can educate yourself on what is missing, realize it was taken away for not justifiable reason, then choose to not allow it to happen to another within your power.

[–]Thinkmoreaboutit[S] -3 points-2 points-1 points 9 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

Triggered by truth?

It was an honest question.

[–]Ndvorsky 4 points5 points6 points 9 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

You're an asshole.

[–]such-a-mensch -4 points-3 points-2 points 9 years ago (16 children) | Copy Link

There's plenty of function in my junktion! Every woman I've been with who's experienced both has openly told me that they prefer circumcised to not. Either a bunch of women independently gave me the same lie or there's something to it.

[–][deleted] 7 points8 points9 points 9 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

and my girlfriend has told me that foreskin restoration has made her enjoy sex more since it's not so dry now.

[–]such-a-mensch 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

That's awesome things worked out for you and your girl!

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points7 points 9 years ago* (11 children) | Copy Link

That's interesting since most women I know have said the opposite. Me being one of them.

I wouldn't be surprised if they lied to you.

[–]such-a-mensch 0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (10 children) | Copy Link

So they lied to me but told you the truth? That sounds logical sure. There's 3 billion dicks in the world and nearly the same number of women, have you considered that there's some variety in women's preferences?

[–][deleted] 7 points8 points9 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I've been with who's experienced both has openly told me that they prefer circumcised to not

Probably all American, don't show your dick to European, Asian, or Central/South American women.

[–]ElectroFlannelGore 18 points19 points20 points 9 years ago (33 children) | Copy Link

Wow. You're assholes.

[–][deleted] 17 points18 points19 points 9 years ago (11 children) | Copy Link

They're just jealous that he had the choice.

[–]shadowguyver 2 points3 points4 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

No, I'm pissed as being circumcised as an infant has caused me lots of pain both physical and mental. Too much skin was taken causing rips in the skin when I have sex, painful erections and I recently had to undergo corrective surgery which only fixed one problem partially.

[+]such-a-mensch -22 points-21 points-20 points 9 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link

I'm actually happy I didn't have a choice and I'm happy my parents made the decision to do it to me

[–][deleted] 14 points15 points16 points 9 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

Why?

[+]blackxxwolf3 -7 points-6 points-5 points 9 years ago* (7 children) | Copy Link

deleted What is this?

[–]englishfury 8 points9 points10 points 9 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

or you could just not have it done, as its pointless?

[–]blackxxwolf3 -4 points-3 points-2 points 9 years ago* (1 child) | Copy Link

deleted What is this?

[–]shadowguyver 8 points9 points10 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

It is pointless here in America too. All of the benefits can be had without cutting. The foreskin is there for a reason.

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points7 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

You realize you don't have to get circumcised right? In fact most men around the world don't.

[–]MasterFrost01 10 points11 points12 points 9 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Let's all go baby beating then.

[+]blackxxwolf3 -7 points-6 points-5 points 9 years ago* (1 child) | Copy Link

deleted What is this?

[–]G-man88 2 points3 points4 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I'm not here to antagonize you sir, I am wondering though why do you think you need to be circumcised in the US. The divide is an even split now days with half of males being cut and half not. Opinion is moving over to not cutting.

[–]such-a-mensch 27 points28 points29 points 9 years ago (19 children) | Copy Link

Why am I an asshole? He did it for a girl and ended missing half of the football season and missed out on making the national wrestling team because he wasn't healed in time for the qualifying tournament...

The girl dumped him a few months later.

If that's not worth making fun of a friend then I don't know what is!

[–]BloodFartTheQueefer 17 points18 points19 points 9 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

Wow that's really stupid.

[–]such-a-mensch 14 points15 points16 points 9 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

I know right? Getting a body modification for a girl is insane to me.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

Did he say if he lost any sensitivity or pleasure?

[–]such-a-mensch 0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

A few years ago when it came up again he was really happy he'd done it. He said it was a rough start while it healed but after a couple of months he was good to go and based on his exploits he's enjoying himself quite a bit. We've never discussed the before and after specifically.

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points7 points 9 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Thanks for the insight. I ask because I'm a man that was circumcised as a baby and I fucking hate it.

[–]such-a-mensch 0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I was snipped as a baby too and quite like it. Different strokes for different folks!

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

He could be saving face. A man who regrets having some of his dick cut off for a woman who wasn't even his wife is going to feel like a damn fool after they split up. Like those guys walking around with a tattoo of an ex-girlfriend's name.

[–]such-a-mensch 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

If you met the guy you wouldn't think so. He's the epitome of a dick swinger haha. He's proud of it, he's sent me photos of threesomes he's had without any regret and he rarely wears pants when camping. Not exactly shy about what he's working with.

[–]englishfury 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

That's hilarious, would give my friends more than enough reason to give him shit over it.

[+]TattooedWife points 9 years ago [recovered] (1 child) | Copy Link

Was his name Carl Gallagher?

[–]such-a-mensch 0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Frank the tank.

[–]G-man88 -1 points0 points1 point 9 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

He's fucking retarded, please continue to mock that dipshit for that, he mutilated himself permanently for a quick fuck. Jesus that's so fucking stupid.

[–]such-a-mensch 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

Fifteen years later he's happy with his decision but we still feel like we have to mock him for it.

[–]G-man88 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

He mutilated himself for a quick fuck, it would be different if he did it for himself but the guy cut off a piece of himself solely on the request of a girl who he dated for a few months.

Dude. That. Is. Retarded.

[–]such-a-mensch 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

I was on your side when he did it but given the fact that he's happy with the decision all these years later I'm reluctant to think he made a mistake when he doesn't think he did. It's still fun making fun of the guy though.

[–]G-man88 0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

It's perfectly fine that he's happy with it, I'm not trying to convey the idea that he's some how deep down regretting it and hurting or something like that, I'm solely saying having a piece of yourself removed on the request of someone else is objectively dumb, and even worse if you don't know them all that well. Which if they only dated for a few months I'd say was probably the case. That's all I'm saying.

[–]such-a-mensch 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

I think you misunderstood my post higher up. They dated for about 4 years prior to him doing it. The relationship ended a few months after though. It's not like he did it for a fling. We thought they'd get married all through university but she found someone with more money and bounced....

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points6 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Making fun of each other is something that friends do.

[–]mwobuddy 0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Lol.

[–]cuntycuntcunts 52 points53 points54 points 9 years ago (19 children) | Copy Link

parents who allow genital mutilation should be held equally responsible!

[–]dirtyMAF 17 points18 points19 points 9 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

Here's the problem though: parents often trust (naively) their doctor. When the doctor tells them it's more hygenic they believe that. They also hear the same thing from most of their family and grew up in a culture of cutting. So they don't bother to question it and do their own research. They end up thinking of it like a vaccination because so many ignorant doctors think the same thing.

Now, you and I know better and so we have to speak up in whatever way possible to new parents so that they make a better decision. And it has to be non-confrontational because when it becomes a confrontation, people stop listening.

[–][deleted] 8 points9 points10 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

This is why it should't be the parent's option.

It should be illegal.

[–]cuntycuntcunts -4 points-3 points-2 points 9 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

quit justifying it! you know the truth, why you assume everyone else doesn't?! everyone has access to internet, you obviously do!

[–]dirtyMAF 9 points10 points11 points 9 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

There's a big difference between justification and explanation. I'm strongly against it and online access has clearly begun to inform the next generation. My gf circumcised her son. I'm intact and explained how its wrong to her, and now that shes with me she knows the hygiene arguments are BS and better understands the ethical implications. She knows better now, even though its too late. There are a lot of parents out there just like her.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points6 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Still doesn't undo the damage.

Even if my parents came out against circumcision and apologized to me, it still wouldn't matter to me, because it wouldn't bring my foreskin back.

[–]cuntycuntcunts 0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

why doesn't she do something about it and start making awareness about it to other couples?! why doesn't she push gov't to ban it? ohh does she think on same way as it happened to me so I let it happen to someone else so I don't feel left out?

[–]jeegte12 3 points4 points5 points 9 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

for the same reason you don't donate 15% of your income to combating deadly diseases in africa. not everyone can apply energy to all causes in the world.

[–]k_rol 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Very good point.

[+]Meyright -12 points-11 points-10 points 9 years ago* (10 children) | Copy Link

What would you do as a parent, when its legal, the majority of your peer group has done it, you/your husband has done it, your religion tells you to do it and even your doctor "lies" that it has benefits and its better to do?

Parents normaly just want whats best for their child and they listen to authority.

[–]chumia40 26 points27 points28 points 9 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

You ban it like it's been done for female genital mutilation...

[–]Meyright 5 points6 points7 points 9 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

Parents don't ban anything though. Govrnment does.

We gain nothing by vilifying "well meaning" misinformed parents who made the mistake circumcising their sons.

[–]chumia40 3 points4 points5 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Parents (I am one) vote and if people made a fuss about this like they do with FGM... I'm sure it could be legislated, just like the ban on FGM.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

I don't care if my parents were "well-meaning". They had me mutilated, which is unforgivable in my opinion.

[–]shadowguyver 2 points3 points4 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Because of my parents "well meaning" I now rip during sex, have painful erections, have had to go through corrective surgery and might not be able to father a second child.

All because it was tradition to do something unnecessary like cutting off healthy functional tissue and nerves.

[–]cuntycuntcunts 9 points10 points11 points 9 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

think for yourself and stop being a sheep! if everyone throw their firstborn out of the window, would you do the same?

[–]jeegte12 -1 points0 points1 point 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

you're not truly imagining the world in which your terrible analogy exists in.

[–]dirtyMAF 2 points3 points4 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Not sure why you are being down voted because this gets right to the core of the issue: changing the culture and getting people to think differently.

[–]shadowguyver 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Research it, ask why is it done. As for religion the child has not decided on one yet, what about his religious freedom. Carving your religion into his flesh robs him of that.

There is a market sadly for neonatal foreskin, that alone keeps some doctors from being honest.

[–]TorontoIntactivist 7 points8 points9 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

He should not have agreed to do it in the first place. Hopefully him getting in trouble has a chilling effect on other Swiss doctors.

[–]mwobuddy 32 points33 points34 points 9 years ago (44 children) | Copy Link

Did you know you're not supposed to remove the whole thing?

Oh shit, really?

[–]Thinkmoreaboutit[S] 66 points67 points68 points 9 years ago (43 children) | Copy Link

You're not supposed to remove ANY of it.

[+]mwobuddy -38 points-37 points-36 points 9 years ago* (42 children) | Copy Link

For a circumcision? I disagree. In fact, I'm pretty sure that's the definition of circumcision, mr. wrong-o.

[–]Thinkmoreaboutit[S] 51 points52 points53 points 9 years ago (41 children) | Copy Link

Nothing should be removed from a healthy baby.

Genital mutilation and rape should not be allowed to happen to a child.

[+]mwobuddy -40 points-39 points-38 points 9 years ago (40 children) | Copy Link

ideological and separate argument.

[–]Thinkmoreaboutit[S] 40 points41 points42 points 9 years ago (38 children) | Copy Link

Cutting healthy body parts off a non-consenting person is mutilation.

Stimulating an infants genitals and inserting tools is rape.

Learn2definition.

[+]mwobuddy -59 points-58 points-57 points 9 years ago (37 children) | Copy Link

How do we know the baby didn't consent? Did you ask it?

[–][deleted] 37 points38 points39 points 9 years ago (11 children) | Copy Link

Babies can't consent to anything.

[+]mwobuddy -10 points-9 points-8 points 9 years ago (10 children) | Copy Link

Prove it.

[–][deleted] 21 points22 points23 points 9 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

If you;re gonna troll at least be more creative.

[–][deleted] 8 points9 points10 points 9 years ago* (2 children) | Copy Link

He who cannot talk (or communicate nonverbally) cannot conesnt.

[–][deleted] 42 points43 points44 points 9 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

Really? The screams mean no.

[+]mwobuddy -12 points-11 points-10 points 9 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

So if I had to amputate your arm in the woods with no anesthesia, and you screamed your head off, but it was successful, the screams meant no even though you asked to have it amputated to prevent dying from gangrene?

[–][deleted] 27 points28 points29 points 9 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

But there's no gangrene, or anything of clinical significance. It's a normal dick. What if I cut off your fully functional arm?

[–][deleted] 10 points11 points12 points 9 years ago (11 children) | Copy Link

If the baby didn't explicitly say "I want to be circumcised, it's nonconsensual"

[–]mwobuddy -3 points-2 points-1 points 9 years ago (10 children) | Copy Link

If only explicit consent to "I awnt a dick in my pussy" is the only valid form of consent, otherwise its nonconsensual, I think you're all in trouble for rape.

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points8 points 9 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

But just existing isn't a yes. A baby does not use body language to communicate they want body parts sliced off, and women don't just say they want sex by existing.

[–]I_love_black_girls 3 points4 points5 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

A baby doesn't know what a circumcision is. You cannot consent to something you don't know exists. Hell a baby barely knows what it's penis is except that sometimes liquid comes out of it.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points4 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

You can consent nonverbally, but for consent to be valid, you have to understand what it is you're consenting to.

A baby doesn't understand what circumcision is. All they know is that for some bizarre reason, they are strapped down and the most sensitive part of their body is in excruciating pain.

[–]franklindeer 0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

You realize that this is an infant we're talking about right? You also realize that some things do require explicit consent while others don't? We require explicit consent to all sorts of medical procedures but one can implicitly consent to committing a crime or any number of other things. You seem to be under the impression that if anything requires explicit consent then everything should require the same level of consent regardless of context.

Basically you should fuck off. You're an idiot, you're a detriment to this sub and you do nothing but constantly say ridiculous nonsense with an impressive stridency and arrogance.

[+]Thinkmoreaboutit points 9 years ago [recovered] (1 child) | Copy Link

Fuck off pedophile.

[–]mwobuddy 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

That's a clear, cogent argument.

[–]franklindeer 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

As far as the law is concerned, babies have absolutely no personal agency. They cannot sign contracts, refuse medical treatment, engage in sexual relationships or even be held responsible for crimes they commit. In terms of mental capacity, we use our common sense, babies clearly do not have the capacity to so much as feed themselves or wipe their own ass, they certainly can't decide whether they want their genitals altered.

Is that an acceptable answer to an absolutely stupid fucking question?

[–]mwobuddy -1 points0 points1 point 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

refuse medical treatment

There you go.

[–]LetItOutBoy 0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Agreed.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points4 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

To anyone who says "I'm circumcised and I'm fine", I say this; the kid in this article could have been you. The kid in this article could have been your son. Is it really worth risking something like this happening just for the sake of your son "looking like you"? People will try to justify infant circumcision with all sorts of crap like "STD protection", but even if I believed in that stuff, I'd rather trust my hypothetical son to practice safe sex in when he's an adult than entrust the future of my son's sex life some to fucking scalpel-wielding quack.

[–]samsc2 6 points7 points8 points 9 years ago (15 children) | Copy Link

Ok well reading what happened in that post, it doesn't seem like it was the fault of the doctor at all. The kid moved while the cutting was going on which caused said amputation. Not sure why they are making him the villain in this story? He also tried to find a important device for the kid to finish the reattachment. While they try to make it seem as if the doctor was out running around wasting time. Geneva is only 6 square miles so even if the doctor was physically running with his feet it would only take him 7-15 minutes per mile he needed to go....There are also only 4 medical facilities in Geneva and the child was already at one of them? So it just seems stupid to go after the doctor for this.

[–]shadowguyver 32 points33 points34 points 9 years ago (10 children) | Copy Link

First there should have been no circumcision if the kids was fully healthy, second the fact that the kid was moving should show he didn't want it to happen, thirdly the doctor should be held responsible because the fact the kid could move means either no anesthetic was used or not enough.

Having circumcision forced upon children needs to stop.

[–]samsc2 2 points3 points4 points 9 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link

I'm not arguing that circumcision is a good thing not sure how you are getting that from my comment? I'm just stating from the facts that the doctor wasn't to blame entirely and certainly wasn't malicious in what happened. It was completely by accident by the doctors point of view and reflexive by the child's point of view. Just doesn't seem fair to the doctor who did not mean to cause this amount of harm.

[–]rodrigogirao 11 points12 points13 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

He is to blame for performing a medically unnecessary and harmful procedure. Every so-called doctor who performs infant circumcisions is a villain.

[–]Consilio_et_Animis 7 points8 points9 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

So a doctor takes a knife to the perfectly healthy and normal foreskin of an infant boy, all to please the imaginary sky god of his parents with their iron age ritual.

The boy then recoils in agony, and the Doctor slices his glans penis off.

But it's all the fault of the infant boy.

Crazy.

[–]shadowguyver 4 points5 points6 points 9 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

But he is by performing a procedure that was not necessary. He should have educated the parents about the complications that could happen. Its funny that America is the only industrialized country that still pushes circumcision as routine and not a human rights violation.

[–]mikesteane 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

Its funny that America is the only industrialized country that still pushes circumcision as routine and not a human rights violation.

It's because of the profit motive.

[–]shadowguyver 0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Yeah

[–]Thinkmoreaboutit[S] 0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Lack of ethics.

[–]mikesteane 3 points4 points5 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

It certainly is in contravention of the Hippocratic Oath ("Firstly, to do no harm") and, for that reason, I consider that doctors who have performed unnecessary circumcisions on minors should be disbarred from practice.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

And cultural inertia.

[+]5150_Ewok points 9 years ago [recovered] (3 children) | Copy Link

The doctor is the villain because click bait.

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points8 points 9 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

No, the doctor is the villain because he decided to perform an unnecessary cosmetic surgery on a healthy boy's penis.

[+]5150_Ewok points 9 years ago [recovered] (1 child) | Copy Link

Point your fingers at the parents.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points6 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I point the finger at both. No doctor should perform an unnecessary surgery on healthy boy's penis just because his parents said to do it.

[–]majortom22 0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Can you imagine what a loss of quality of life it is to not have a penis? If you're a woman, imagine that your vulva was sown shut permanently and like cauterized so that you could never be penetrated for life. Plus the medical problems it would cause.

I honestly think I'd rather lose a hand or foot or something. Poor kid.

[–]Thinkmoreaboutit[S] 0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

MGM and FGM are abhorrent human rights violations.

[+]blackxxwolf3 -6 points-5 points-4 points 9 years ago* (10 children) | Copy Link

deleted What is this?

[–]Thinkmoreaboutit[S] 17 points18 points19 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

You had a choice. Good for you.

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points8 points 9 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

At least you had a choice, I would give up a nut to have my foreskin back.

If you don't mind me asking, why did you get circumcised? And did you lose any sensitivity or pleasure? Any regrets?

[–]BichRoddy 0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

I'm curious as to how you can say something like that since you've never had it to begin with. Why do you think it's so great? Because you read where other guys say it is?

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points7 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Why do you think it's so great? Because you read where other guys say it is?

By the very fact that circumcision cuts off tens of thousands of nerve endings and several square inches of erogenous tissue. And it also leaves the head exposed to desensitize and keratinize.

[–]rodrigogirao 2 points3 points4 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Sour grapes. He has to tell himself it's a good thing, otherwise he'd have to face an unpleasant reality.

[–]blackxxwolf3 -4 points-3 points-2 points 9 years ago* (4 children) | Copy Link

deleted What is this?

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points6 points 9 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

masterbating actually became more pleasurable i found out. i used to not use lube (and still dont for the most part) but using lube felt amazing

Why does masturbating now feel better, why does lube feel amazing?

[–]blackxxwolf3 -4 points-3 points-2 points 9 years ago* (1 child) | Copy Link

deleted What is this?

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points4 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

most sensation to the head of the penis.

Actually that's not true.

[+]samsc2 points 9 years ago [recovered] (55 children) | Copy Link

Ok well reading what happened in that post, it doesn't seem like it was the fault of the doctor at all. The kid moved while the cutting was going on which caused said amputation. Not sure why they are making him the villain in this story? He also tried to find a important device for the kid to finish the reattachment. While they try to make it seem as if the doctor was out running around wasting time. Geneva is only 6 square miles so even if the doctor was physically running with his feet it would only take him 7-15 minutes per mile he needed to go....There are also only 4 medical facilities in Geneva and the child was already at one of them? So it just seems stupid to go after the doctor for this.

[–]DartTheDragoon 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (54 children) | Copy Link

I'm not exactly sure who to blame for this, but if we have a very sharp object and plan on cutting off a part of someone's body, should the body be restrained in some way?

[–]shadowguyver 5 points6 points7 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

The doctor and parents as circumcision is not really a necessary surgery. There are no real benefits, but there are many complications.

[–]samsc2 2 points3 points4 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Usually they are? However, the child was 4 years old and not completely immobilized so he was still able to wiggle. He just so happened to wiggle the worst possible part to wiggle. His hips. Which caused the accident. Just the article makes it seem as if the doctor cut off the child's penis maliciously, when it was just a bad accident.

[+]samsc2 points 9 years ago [recovered] (51 children) | Copy Link

Usually they are? However, the child was 4 years old and not completely immobilized so he was still able to wiggle. He just so happened to wiggle the worst possible part to wiggle. His hips. Which caused the accident. Just the article makes it seem as if the doctor cut off the child's penis maliciously, when it was just a bad accident.

[–]Thinkmoreaboutit[S] 6 points7 points8 points 9 years ago (36 children) | Copy Link

Bad accident? They were mutialting a child.

[–]samsc2 2 points3 points4 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Yes and it was a bad accident. The child didn't go into the doctors to have his penis removed. So therefore it was by accident. The doctor didn't intend to remove the penis, so therefore it was an accident. The genitals being removed from a person unwillingly is bad. So therefore it's a bad accident. Do you want me to call it a good accident?

[+]samsc2 points 9 years ago [recovered] (9 children) | Copy Link

Yes and it was a bad accident. The child didn't go into the doctors to have his penis removed. So therefore it was by accident. The doctor didn't intend to remove the penis, so therefore it was an accident. The genitals being removed from a person unwillingly is bad. So therefore it's a bad accident. Do you want me to call it a good accident?

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points1 point 9 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

Circumcision is mutilation.

[–]samsc2 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Yes? I have no idea what the point of your comment is. Are you saying that it was good that the kid lost his penis? My comments were about the fact that it was a complete accident and that it doesn't seem fair/right to be putting the doctor on trial for something that sadly the child did to himself by moving during the surgery.

[+]samsc2 points 9 years ago [recovered] (5 children) | Copy Link

Yes? I have no idea what the point of your comment is. Are you saying that it was good that the kid lost his penis? My comments were about the fact that it was a complete accident and that it doesn't seem fair/right to be putting the doctor on trial for something that sadly the child did to himself by moving during the surgery.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

My point was that the end result would have been mutilation either way.

The doctor has partial blame, because he decided to do the surgery, the parents didn't force the knife into his hands.

[–]samsc2 0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I'm pretty sure the parents asked for the surgery and that complications can always happen with every single surgery. I'm pretty sure the doctor didn't force the parents to bring the child in for the circumcision. In fact i'm pretty sure the parents brought the kid into the doctors and asked him to do it. Not sure why you are blaming a doctor who did his job. It's just a bad accident that caused a freak set of events to take place at just the right moment and the outcome is the kid lost his penis for a few hours. The parents asked for the surgery, the kid moved his hips up, and their religion supports this kinda shit. The doctor didn't go to work that day and decide to just cut off the kids penis for no reason what so ever.

[+]samsc2 points 9 years ago [recovered] (2 children) | Copy Link

I'm pretty sure the parents asked for the surgery and that complications can always happen with every single surgery. I'm pretty sure the doctor didn't force the parents to bring the child in for the circumcision. In fact i'm pretty sure the parents brought the kid into the doctors and asked him to do it. Not sure why you are blaming a doctor who did his job. It's just a bad accident that caused a freak set of events to take place at just the right moment and the outcome is the kid lost his penis for a few hours. The parents asked for the surgery, the kid moved his hips up, and their religion supports this kinda shit. The doctor didn't go to work that day and decide to just cut off the kids penis for no reason what so ever.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

But the doctor didn't have to perform the circumcision.

[+]samsc2 points 9 years ago [recovered] (3 children) | Copy Link

Yes and it was a bad accident. The child didn't go into the doctors to have his penis removed. So therefore it was by accident. The doctor didn't intend to remove the penis, so therefore it was an accident. The genitals being removed from a person unwillingly is bad. So therefore it's a bad accident. Do you want me to call it a good accident?

[–]Thinkmoreaboutit[S] 0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

The destruction of the genitals was intentional.

[–]samsc2 2 points3 points4 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

so the doctor was able to somehow get the child to move at just the right moment? How'd he pull that one off? Is he a dick jedi or something?

[+]samsc2 points 9 years ago [recovered] (13 children) | Copy Link

Yes and it was a bad accident. The child didn't go into the doctors to have his penis removed. So therefore it was by accident. The doctor didn't intend to remove the penis, so therefore it was an accident. The genitals being removed from a person unwillingly is bad. So therefore it's a bad accident. Do you want me to call it a good accident?

[–]Thinkmoreaboutit[S] -2 points-1 points0 points 9 years ago (12 children) | Copy Link

Get over it mutilation apologist.

[–]samsc2 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (11 children) | Copy Link

So weird how you somehow think that i'm saying circumcision is good. How can you be so dumb? So you like the idea that the kid got his penis cut off? what kind of sick fuck are you?

[–]Thinkmoreaboutit[S] -2 points-1 points0 points 9 years ago (10 children) | Copy Link

The mutilation was intentional.

You're ignoring and arguing for no good fucking reason.

Just end at STOP RAPING AND MUTIALTING CHILDREN.

Goddamn gold medal gymnast.

[–]samsc2 0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link

Why do you want the kids penis to be cut off? what's wrong with you? Are you some sort of psycho who gets off on kids having their penises cut off? You're just sick. Take your pedophilia sadomasochism shit elsewhere. Stop trying to be so happy that a sad accident occurred.

[–]Thinkmoreaboutit[S] -1 points0 points1 point 9 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

Get fucked troll.

[+]samsc2 points 9 years ago [recovered] (4 children) | Copy Link

Yes and it was a bad accident. The child didn't go into the doctors to have his penis removed. So therefore it was by accident. The doctor didn't intend to remove the penis, so therefore it was an accident. The genitals being removed from a person unwillingly is bad. So therefore it's a bad accident. Do you want me to call it a good accident?

[–]Yndrd1984 2 points3 points4 points 9 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

The child didn't go into the doctors to have his penis removed. So therefore it was by accident.

So if I fire a gun at you in attempt to wound, and you end up dying, that's an 'accidental' death?

In a certain technical sense I could see it, but it still seems weird - where's the line between accident and negligence?

[–]Ndvorsky 0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Actually yes. It would be something like "accidental death with intent to harm" or probably drawn up as 3rd degree murder or something.

[–]Yndrd1984 0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Right, that was the point of making an analogy with ... the situation in the deleted post. -sigh-

[–]Thinkmoreaboutit[S] 0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Call it mutilation.

[–]shadowguyver 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (13 children) | Copy Link

So let's look at it another way, a doctor is performing surgery on a adult male and the anesthetic is insufficient that during the surgery he twitches in pain and the doctor slices something he shouldn't have, who would you blame?

[–]samsc2 2 points3 points4 points 9 years ago (10 children) | Copy Link

Well lets look at it in the realistic point of view. Considering there is absolutely no possible way to prevent the child from moving their hips without putting them completely under, which has the risk of death associated with it, would you put all the blame onto the doctor and put him up for trial as if it was a crime to have a bad accident?

[–]shadowguyver 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

You do realize that children do die from circumcisions too, right? My answer still is yes as it is a unnecessary procedure. The only reasons it still happens are uneducated parents and yes even doctors, not to mention that neo natal foreskin is also a commodity sold for profit and used for profit.

[–]samsc2 0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

what exactly is your point? are you arguing it wasn't an accident? that the doctor wanted to cut off the kids penis?

[–]shadowguyver 0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

Considering there is absolutely no possible way to prevent the child from moving their hips without putting them completely under, which has the risk of death associated with it, would you put all the blame onto the doctor and put him up for trial as if it was a crime to have a bad accident?

You acted like having enough anesthetic was the only way the child could die, which is false. Children have died from circumcision, and will continue until parents realise it's not needed.

[–]samsc2 0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

Yes but again my comment was pointing out how they are treating the doctor as a criminal as if he intended to cut the kids penis off instead of as a doctor and a misfortune for the child. How is that so complicated?

[–]shadowguyver 0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

He should have had better control over the child, or not operated. How's that!

[–]shadowguyver -1 points0 points1 point 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

http://thinkaboutnow.com/2016/03/3-wayscorporationsprofitoffbaby-foreskin14/

[+]samsc2 points 9 years ago [recovered] (1 child) | Copy Link

Well lets look at it in the realistic point of view. Considering there is absolutely no possible way to prevent the child from moving their hips without putting them completely under, which has the risk of death associated with it, would you put all the blame onto the doctor and put him up for trial as if it was a crime to have a bad accident?

[–]shadowguyver 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Yes, because they know the risks, still they go ahead and perform surgery to remove healthy tissue that has function for no immediate health problems. Any other surgery like this is illegal.

[+]samsc2 points 9 years ago [recovered] (2 children) | Copy Link

Ok well reading what happened in that post, it doesn't seem like it was the fault of the doctor at all. The kid moved while the cutting was going on which caused said amputation. Not sure why they are making him the villain in this story? He also tried to find a important device for the kid to finish the reattachment. While they try to make it seem as if the doctor was out running around wasting time. Geneva is only 6 square miles so even if the doctor was physically running with his feet it would only take him 7-15 minutes per mile he needed to go....There are also only 4 medical facilities in Geneva and the child was already at one of them? So it just seems stupid to go after the doctor for this.

[–]greatest-art-thief 5 points6 points7 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

its obviously the 4 year old kids fault for squirming while someone was holding his dick.

[–]Chewiemuse 5 points6 points7 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Yea I mean DUH you're not supposed to move when you're getting part of your penis cut off comon guys..../s

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