Is It Misogyny or Projected Misandry?

a-man-from-earth · 2022-10-04T23:52:08+00:00

Post removed as OP is a self-admitted misogynist and we don't want that bigotry here.

RockmanXX · 2022-10-04T01:09:38+00:00

what do you folks think about the notion that quite a lot of the misogyny that women claim among men is actually projected misandry?

I refuse to accept Feminists as the representatives of all Women.

EDIT: If an ideology is about doing good, then shouldn't an "extremist" naturally be EXTREMELY good?

courteously-curious · 2022-10-04T02:45:54+00:00

So, even if this has come up before, what do you folks think about the notion that quite a lot of the misogyny that women claim among men is actually projected misandry?

As a serious response, I would say that there is evidence that suggests that misogyny and misandry are nearly always intertwined so that it is nearly impossible for a person who is a misogynist to avoid being a misandrist and vice versa.

This is why men who despise women tend also to despise any man who fails to conform to their gendernormatives, calling them "sissies" or "not real men" or hurling homophobic bigotries in their direction,

and it is why women who despise men also tend to hate women who like men or defend men and refer to them as "gender traitors" and worse.

hshsgdve · 2022-10-04T01:29:14+00:00

This take is a bit weak sauce.

Most misogyny and misandry, is a response to emotional pain via hate and sometimes tribalism. Displays of aggression towards the out-group perpetuates a group reward… and the cycle continues.

I’d say there is a very strong case for their being more “acceptable” misandry present in Western cultures, than there is misogyny. I’d also see a strong case for there being more displays of misogyny from women, than from men (again, in the west).

The bottom line, is that you’re responsible for your displays of hate. This whole “misandry is a response to misogyny” and vice versa, is entirely unacceptable as rationalisation. It’s the game that feminists play to justify hate. It’s the game that racists play to justify hate. It’s the game of all other bigots.

AskingToFeminists · 2022-10-04T06:58:24+00:00

Here's the thing. Many people would define misogyny as unequal treatment or views about women. But the key is in that term : unequal.

You can't be "unequal" period. You are always unequal "to something/someone".

And when it comes to such topic, unequal refers to "with regard to the other sex".

But if women are unequal to men, then, necessarily men are unequal to women.

And the trick is, the world is imperfect. Almost nothing is absolutely one thing or another. Like they say, "every cloud has its silver lining". Women being taken less seriously (than men) sucks in the workplace, but is great in the courtroom when on trial for a crime, or faced with an armed and overworked cop.

From there, everything is a question of framing. As such, there's very little misandry that isn't also misogyny, and very little misogyny that isn't also misandry.

To try to consider the both as separate is a bit like taking seriously the question "what's the difference between a duck?" (which is usually answered, here in France, by "both legs are the same length, particularly the left one").

And so, there can be no fixing of misandry without fixing of misogyny, no fixing of misogyny without fixing misandry, and any attempt in that direction is patently ridiculous and should be taken with suspicion, maybe as an attempt to enforce some kind of supremacy.

The point I always raise is that feminism can only work if you ask only what is bad for women and good for men while ignoring completely what's bad for men and good for women. By operating in such a manner, one can make the president of the US look worse off than a homeless person. And the minute you start asking the complementary questions that allow you a more complete picture of things, a whole another view of things appears.

LLLevin · 2022-10-04T03:38:44+00:00

I'm kind of concerned about you mentioning thinking misogyny is often a response to misandry

It sounds kind of like an excuse, and considering how often this exact same excuse is used to excuse misandry, I hoped posts on these sub would be better than that

Yes, people respond to discrimination with discrimination towards the opposite group, but that's not an excuse that's just evidence of the cycle of bigotry and why downplaying it as deserved or punching up or whatever is BS

SjurEido · 2022-10-04T11:54:34+00:00

It depends on where you go. I'm a woman in Ohio.... Plenty PLENTY of men in some southern counties talk to me like a child, and to their eyes when they hear in a software engineer...

Then there's the benevolent mysogynsits trying to white night me every time I so much as try to pick up a piece of paper.

McGauth925 · 2022-10-03T21:34:14+00:00

Yes! Yes! BRILLIANT idea!!

Thought I'd maybe get you all off on the right foot.

hotpotato138 · 2022-10-04T12:33:58+00:00

I agree with you. I was called a misogynist for saying I prefer women who are a few years younger up to the same age for relationships. The woman who said that couldn't give me a logical reason. It was on another sub.

There are some men who are legit misogynists. They give all men a bad name.

nuditarian · 2022-10-04T05:44:58+00:00

My personal experience, observing misogyny in management in my workplace for about 10 years, is that those instances of misogyny that MIGHT be cast as projected misandry(given the merits of the women's complaint) were perpetrated by a male leader who ultimately proved to be a misogynist. I personally witnessed this individual act out his misogyny on 8 or 10 occasions, and am aware of far more through hearsay.

This organization is around 33% women in leadership. Of the men in leadership, I witnessed one instance of a man being slighted by this same misogynist for not fitting the masculine mold (person wasn't feminine, but didn't "look" the part of a leader, i.e. short, balding, obese, but talented, effective and a hard worker).

I personally think things ARE more egalitarian. I'd probably even go as far as to say things are more egalitarian than many feminists argue. I'd also say that misogynist men can easily hide their misogyny, so there is still quite a bit of egregious treatment of women, it's just harder to identify or explain to men. (I.e. it's not so obvious as 60 years ago when women were just wholesale excluded from certain roles.)

And I would agree if you said this was just a "bad apple", the problem is that a bad apple in a pinnacle leadership role can have reverberating effects for many years, which I think is still a significant hurdle to equality in some sectors.

Poly_and_RA · 2022-10-04T22:22:56+00:00

It depends on what context you're asking about.

If you're asking about my own local context, i.e. left-wing liberal Norwegians, then I agree with you - it's a LOT more common and a LOT more accepted to toss around casual deeply misandrist claims than the reverse would be. It's sometimes "justified" by claims that it amounts to "kicking upwards" -- but this justification rings hollow to me.

Norway is one of the most gender-equal countries on the planet, and it's NOT clear to me that women are overall on a substantial disadvantage here. Sure lots of examples of discrimination remains; but we ALSO have a lot of examples of discrimination of men, and overall it's hard to judge which gender faces the most discrimination.

But if you ask about the world overall, then I see a LOT more misogyny.

I see guys being elected president despite being recorded bragging about grabbing women by the pussy. I see entire countries being out of gender-balance because of widespread gender-selective abortions of female fetuses. I see piles of countries with less than 1/3rd women among politicians, and essentically zero of the reverse. I see especially middle-eastern friends of mine lacking even very basic freedoms that men in their own countries are able to take for granted and so on ad near infinitum.

Title	Is It Misogyny or Projected Misandry?
Author	McGauth925
Upvotes	53
Comments	36
Date	October 3, 2022 9:32 PM UTC (1 year ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates/comments/xuw4w2/is_it_misogyny_or_projected_misandry/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates/is-it-misogyny-or-projected-misandry.1135216 https://theredarchive.com/post/1135216