"Shotgun dad" masculinity

Korvar · 2019-11-01T22:28:57+00:00

It's absurd, and relies on a series of insulting generalisations of men and women. All men are predatory, all girls are helpless, only violence and intimidation is the answer. It's ridiculous.

manbaby1769 · 2019-11-01T22:53:29+00:00

Legitimate “toxic masculinity”

joeclark5 · 2019-11-02T02:23:31+00:00

I'm hoping that it's just an internet meme and not something that happens in real life.

Blauwpetje · 2019-11-02T15:13:10+00:00

I think this is American, redneck. Never heard about it as a common practice in the Netherlands or elsewhere in Europe.

mrsuperguy · 2019-11-02T00:31:09+00:00

I definitely think it's one of those archaic archetypes that we could do losing. Especially when you compare to the way we think about fathers/parents in general and their attitude to their son's dating lives.

Now I know OP provided some examples of this. But now I think about it, I'm wondering how accurate this stereotype actually is. In my personal experience with my parents it's never been more than a reference for humour. But is this the norm?

StraightGangstaHack · 2019-11-02T07:51:01+00:00

Historically you had to be concerned that the young man would knock her up without assuming the (enormous) religious and economic responsibilities.

With the advent of birth control, welfare and feminism, this went from being an existential problem to being a notional one. Or, less so in more traditional communities where religious responsibilities still matter.

Which is most often where it persists. Echo of an instinct. The simple enjoyment of dominance.

ElderApe · 2019-11-02T05:38:26+00:00

I think it is mostly a symbolic gesture of support and protection. The reason it appears in such a gendered way us a recognition if the risks traditionally invoked with dating and sex that women faced that men were not as vulnerable to. I don't think many people actually want to make people chose between their daughter and a barrel of a gun. And despite the cliche I don't think the idea is to scare guys off. I have dated a Texan in senior high school and while they gave me the spiel and even showed me their guns, it was all fairly light hearted and over all they were very welcoming. They just made it clear they weren't going to have her taken advantage of. It seemed wholesome to me that they cared about her as much as I did.

Wanderer15 · 2019-11-02T22:52:37+00:00

That seems to be one of the few legitimate expressions of Toxic Masculinity.

About 572,000 lives were lost to guns in USA 1999-2016. Here.

jobobicus · 2019-11-02T22:57:07+00:00

I think in most cases, it’s just a humorous exaggeration. And, at the root of it all is the Dad saying “treat her well and take care of her.” I have 2 daughters so I kind of get it. I want their bf to be just a little intimidated by me.

lol1969 · 2019-11-04T18:15:06+00:00

Yeah I agree, it infantalizes the daughters and requires this shitty outdated idea of the daughter's sexuality belonging to her father, and it also creates an atmosphere of distrust between men. It perpetuates a shitty gender stereotype of men as assholes until demonstrated otherwise. I don't think that's good for anyone's psychology and this tradition needs to die.

AbysmalDescent · 2019-11-05T17:05:45+00:00

This is a combination of this mandate that is placed on men to be protectors of women, specifically from other men(because all men are bad, and so is male heterosexuality), and personal bravado tough-guy boasting that is also socially/culturally/romantically reinforced in men by women.

It is very easy to just paint this picture as "arg! chauvinistic man treating daughter like his property!" or "behold! toxic masculinity!" but that is a very superficial and feministic "all men are evil" approach. The truth is that the daughter is in a position of power in this narrative, and this type of behaviour is typically one that daughters fully allow, legitimize or even romanticize from their fathers(other women, like the man's wife or her friends, are also very likely to glorify and romanticize this type of behaviour as well).

Women have absolute control in standing their own ground, setting boundaries and immediately shutting these types of behaviours from any man in their lives, especially their fathers(specifically because fathers inherently want to be in their daughters' lives), but many choose not to. Many will see these types of indirect threats against other men, via proxy of their male peers, as empowering and intimidating, which they can then abuse to bully or coerce men in and out of relationships(whether the threat is real or not) without ever really having to be accountable for it.

A man saying "I'm gonna shoot you if you don't treat me the way I expect you to", even as a joke, would be received very differently than a woman saying "my dad will shoot you if you don't treat me the way I expect you to" but they would both be forms of intimidation. The former could actually go to jail for it too.

mtcapri · 2019-11-05T00:01:00+00:00

It's worth noting that every single example you gave was clearly a joke. In my experience (which is definitely limited to certain areas of the U.S.), actual examples of this are very rare these days. I can believe that there are legitimate examples of this and that it's more prevalent in certain areas of the country than the ones I've lived in, but I think it's safe to say this is considered very traditionalist behavior these days, akin to asking a woman's father for permission to propose to her.

That being said, to the extent that this is practiced in less extreme form, like fathers being particularly concerned with their daughters coming home at an early hour from dates, I think that stems from a somewhat more reasonable understanding that a good number of guys out there (not the majority perhaps, but still) are under a lot of social pressure to get to "home base" quickly, and sometimes lose interest after that—the "notch on the belt" mentality that is an ancient and stereotypical complaint from women in dating. To the extent that said stereotype still contains a nugget of truth to it, I think measured action from parents (particularly fathers, because they have more inherent insight into men/boys) is at least understandable, if not always justified.

Quite frankly, I would find it refreshing to see more mothers being protective of their sons when it comes to money-grubbing girls who just want free meals and gifts.

Title	"Shotgun dad" masculinity
Author	kabukistar
Upvotes	16
Comments	23
Date	November 1, 2019 8:14 PM UTC (6 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates/comments/dq9p9f/shotgun_dad_masculinity/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates/shotgun-dad-masculinity.1203013 https://theredarchive.com/post/1203013

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