Swapping Dominance

aphelion3342 · 2014-08-06T13:08:21+00:00

You're coming at it from the wrong frame.

You're worried about how adopting a new set of behaviors will affect your marriage. She will surely let them affect your marriage negatively if your new behaviors are incongruent to what she believes you to be. And if you're asking the question, you're worried about it, so there's probably some sense that you may come across as a charlatan.

If you are not credible, you will be rebuffed.

You need to approach it first from within. TRP is not what behaviors you project outward to the world - it's the philosophy at your core. Once your philosophy at your core is congruent and proper, then your actions will naturally radiate it.

So, don't start with 'honey, do the dishes', or 'I'm going to fuck you in the ass', if you're going to stammer and stutter through it. (Particularly the second.). If you're worried about how you will come off, you will lose. You need to start with internalizing your own change first.

I say to start with the personal stuff first - do your own thing and invite her along, improve yourself, lift, etc. Give her some time to see that you are suddenly behaving differently. Don't brag about it or even mention it except in passing - but start getting some results. Once she sees that you're serious and making progress on yourself, and you begin to feel that progress, then she will be more receptive to coming along with you.

Also, whatever you do, do not seek any approval from her whatsoever. Don't say, 'aren't I great honey?' You have to make changes to yourself for yourself, and asking for approval makes it clear that you're trying to improve yourself to please her. So do not do that.

anonlymouse · 2014-08-06T12:58:12+00:00

Women express token resistance, so the resistance isn't necessarily a bad sign. It can sometimes also indicate that you're going too fast rather than that you shouldn't do it at all.

What you could do is show off your new gym body in a dominant but less threatening way - pick her up (literally sweeping her off her feet), carry her to the bedroom and gently put her down. (Only do this if you're strong enough to make it appear effortless, if you fuck up once and drop her she's going to forever have that association). It sends some of the same signals but has a less aggressive tone.

niczar · 2014-08-06T13:36:27+00:00

I've tried more aggressively kissing her, and throwing her up against the door to kiss her, and all I get is resistance from her.

If that's entirely new behavior, she might understandably be surprised. Ease into it. Start by being more sexually assertive verbally. Send her short sexual texts, not too often. Then tickle fight her. Do some push & pull: grab her strongly by the waist, kiss her neck, and then immediately go away do something else.

I_trp · 2014-08-06T17:24:06+00:00

I will tell you from experience (doomed my 5yr relationship) that what you are doing is very, very hard. She's known you for 8 years. I would advise that you do nothing more than lift and get your body in shape for at least 1 year. Don't let anything get in the way of that. Doing this and only this will make you much more confident, and she will respond to it accordingly. She can sense that you are faking it.

the_red_scimitar · 2014-08-06T14:13:59+00:00

Study Rollo's writing in "The Rational Male" (blog/book). He's married, and discusses this a lot.

LostProsody · 2014-08-06T18:58:29+00:00

Based on my own personal experience doing what you are in the process of trying to do, you're caught up on one major thing. You think that being dominant/assertive/some RP behavior will "ruin" your marriage. It might cause some fights, but I assure you that fucking hamster is going to go into overtime trying to figure out what the fuck is going on and more importantly why she has the urge to fuck you "like you used to before you got married". Be warned though, that hamster has a lot of miles to spin before it starts to yield to this new frame. 8 years is a long time to make up for bad behavior. I've been with my wife for a couple more years than you and I'm still in the tail end of the process after over a year, but let me assure you that this shit works.

I know that for a decade I was afraid to piss my wife off. I shelved my natural dominance as our relationship progressed just to decrease the frequency of confrontation, but in the process adopted all manner of awful beta habits. I'm afraid that you have to rock the boat. She won't respect your change in behavior if it doesn't come with a healthy dose of I don't give a fuck about making you upset. There will be tears. The shit tests might be ferocious. Hold frame. Refuse to have discussions with her that are emotionally charged at all cost. Walk away and make sure she knows that when you discuss important things two adults must be sitting down at the table.

Not worrying about making her upset sets the tone for a few things. The most important being dread game. It sounds backwards, but the best thing for your relationship is to instill a fear in the back of her mind that she is in the process of losing you. Fight against your urge to not think this is the case as I did at first. Her true love and devotion and cooperation requires fear. It sucks, but it's true. That is true domination. To create submission. Submission through fear.

All this other sex shit will work itself out if you get the right frame going and you get the proper dread game going; however, quit focusing so much on it. That might be part of your problem. Start flirting with other women. You don't have to cheat, but you need to get comfortable with the idea that its a real possibility so that you either can if the sex doesn't pick up or you can successfully sell the idea that you can to your wife. This is a very slippery slope - to know you can fuck that gorgeous 23 yo and yet not do it.

Sex is something women use to trap us into many things. The reason you don't have the sex life you want is because she already has you snared. Why would she need to keep performing so well to a show that's sold out for the rest of her life? Women are sluts when they are trying to sell you a car, but as soon as you sign the dotted line, they can put that slut card away. If you don't believe me, fuck a single mom. It will be the best sex you've ever had. You know why? I'm sure you know the answer. If not there is a thread devoted to this today.

Throwing your wife up against the wall before you have her panties sliding down her legs because of your frame sounds like where your resistance is coming from. You haven't sold her yet on the idea that beta bitch moved out of the house. She still suspects he's lurking around somewhere.

Use dread. If she won't give you the sex you want. Let her know you know where to find it and its panties ARE sliding down her legs for you.

sir_wankalot_here · 2014-08-06T13:22:02+00:00

Women like to whine and complain. Unless she actually has a valid point, agree and amplify. Meanwhile do what you want.

carbe_donut · 2014-08-06T19:59:49+00:00

I would like to know your process of taking the finances back over. I'm about to do something similar - I'll be opening a single checking account and moving my paycheck to that. Then putting a monthly 'allowance' into the joint checking for groceries and expenses. No longer will she be able to dip into more funds if we overspend out cash. Also will be canceling her credit card.

I'm bracing myself for all the pouting and shit testing that will ensue. Would love to her your experience with it.

Also agree with most all the advice from everyone else. Hit the gym, read MMSLP, flirt innocently with other women it will take a year or so but it will work. She needs the marriage more than you do.

heeb · 2014-08-06T15:36:25+00:00

I've tried more aggressively kissing her, and throwing her up against the door to kiss her, and all I get is resistance from her.

I don’t know to what level you’re taking this, but might it be that you’re being too rough, too quickly? If it borders on domestic violence (or even giving her the thought that that is where this might be heading), then be careful.

Being strong, dominant is good. Being truly violent with your woman is never a good thing. Domestic violence is evil, and omega as fuck.

Enphuego · 2014-08-06T20:50:23+00:00

You are doing the right things in the wrong order. She isn't going to respond well to dominance behaviors until she knows that you have a higher SMV than her and fears that you will leave her. It's not going to happen overnight, but at some point it's going to be pretty obvious that you have lots of options and the best option available to her is to do whatever it takes to keep you around.

It takes a while. If you are countering 8 years of not being in control, it's going to take a while for her view of you to change.

Roughknot · 2014-08-06T22:12:33+00:00

I just didn't give a fuck. I figured my marriage was over anyway so she can either choose to come on board with alpha me or go our separate ways. So my advice is don't live with fear, don't walk on egg shells.

[deleted] · 2014-08-06T15:06:14+00:00

[permanently deleted]

iab_mabden · 2014-08-06T13:46:39+00:00

all I get is resistance from her.

Initiate and escalate until you get the hard no. Then demonstrate true OI (outcome independence.)

Read "The Married Man Sex Life Primer" and "The Mindful Attraction Plan" by Athol Kay.

When making the jump to light speed, you need to mix alpha and beta behavior, so she does not get overwhelmed in the process.

[deleted] · 2014-08-06T16:49:11+00:00

Marriage is one of those things where when you operate on the premise of not losing your marriage, you're already doomed.

I mean, no, marriage isn't perfect. The point to it- raising a kid- ain't a cake walk. Its not the hardest job you'll ever do but it is absolutely the most emotionally draining. You will come to a point where you hate your wife. She will come to a point where she hates you. What makes a marriage endure- what makes those 90-year-olds who still smile at the prospect of eating another goddamn cup of pudding with the raisin they married 70 years ago- is a willingness to bury the hatchet because you like that person more than the argument. 70 years ago people were raised knowing that if they just walked away from marriage that they'd be shamed by the entire community. Unless you were obviously, physically beaten and battered or your arguments were just that public and loud people generally didn't stand for people who violated that kind of contract.

Today? We don't have that. We have a touchy feely hug box participation trophy. We're told to do what makes us happy, and to do it to the extent that we try and isolate ourselves from anything we perceive as bad. And yes, for all of you who choose to lurk, men absolutely abuse the modern system as much as women do, the ways men abuse the system just don't typically involve child support and loosing half your finances to your ex.

If you want to assert dominance you need to operate on the premise that it may cost your marriage. Not every woman wants to be second in command. If you keep doing what you're doing you're probably going to screw up in both objectives. If you do it badly enough you'll end up with jail time and a restraining order. Not to recommend a shit test but if she's actually interested in you rather than the idea of you, she'll stick around.

....and no, if you're physically aggressive, resistance is the natural response. Gimmi a break. If she likes it, that's one thing, but I'd hold off on such things until you had some sense that she's receptive to it. Doing it out of the blue after building a reputation as the nice guy either tells her you're a con artist or one creepy motherfucker.

KyfhoMyoba · 2014-08-06T20:02:24+00:00

What you stated here is like the clearing I've been looking for. I have hit a point of "dread" when I first started to change and she though I was pulling away. Where I went wrong is I told her I wasn't.

[deleted] · 2014-08-06T23:01:44+00:00

Sounds like you might lack the bravado to be convincing to her that you are a worthy alpha; You need to show dominance: earning, financial management managing groups or group outings, if you have kids get authority over them make them see you as the primary authority figure, don't admit failure or ignorance and keep practicing frame that makes you look strong. When we say fake it 'til you make it you need to understand you can only fake it for people that don't have a grasp on who you are, so don't fake it for your wife she'll put up more resistances get credibility with her by your actions, not words. show dominance over your domain take up space (reasonably), fix some shit, move some stuff to the higher shelves and tighten lids.

Finally how do you get that bravado? It took sports and competitive video games of all things to develop it in me. To bring it out I've got to coax it a bit. It seems like new age hippy junk but my method to summon my deep authoritative tone which gives me confidence is to sing, altogether it makes bravado. You don't have to sing well just find out what your singing voice is like and get some stuff that will give your voice a workout, I use Tom Waits, Harry Belafonte, and different so called crooners and blues men but you should find what works for you and singing may not work for you but it's a good confidence boost for me to hear improvement as I practice and notice how strangers respond to me after I've warmed up a strong speaking voice. Driving to work or just going to pick up take out is enough to get a song or two in and you can do it in private; just try to learn the lyrics otherwise stumbling through can really hammer your confidence.

sternje · 2014-08-07T00:16:41+00:00

Ever see American Beauty? Become Lester. Stop giving a fuck what she thinks. Pot is optional.

[deleted] · 2014-08-07T00:36:13+00:00

Thanks for the advice Bros. I'm learning a lot. I'm going to work on setting up group outings, work on myself, and not give in to shit tests.

__ROOSTER__ · 2014-08-07T02:44:07+00:00

I'd also read How To Be An Alpha Male

It's pretty good , if you like SGM you'll probably like it.

Don't force any of it. Let it all happen naturally as you improve yourself.

You're declaring yourself Captain of the ship and setting a new course. Get her on board with the new way of doing business and the new course. Make her your first mate.

[deleted] · 2014-08-07T02:52:33+00:00

That's an awesome way of thinking of it.

FloranHunter · 2014-08-07T07:11:32+00:00

This would make more sense in /r/asktrp.

GayLubeOil · 2014-08-06T18:16:56+00:00

First off know that without actually meeting you all of our advice is conjecture. You could either take this advice with a grain of salt. Or you could invite Muscle Bro GayLubeOil into your home at which point he will forage for protien.

Try asserting dominance over your wife in a joking low stakes way. Get a sharpie. Yell suprise tatoo artist. Then hold her down and give her Tupac tattoos: thug life across the belly. Later when she complains tell her that she needs to respect your dream of being a tattoo artist. If she is used to being submissive and enjoys it then shes more likely to give in to sex. Thats the guiding theory of my relationship anyway.

PlanB_pedofile · 2014-08-06T21:09:42+00:00

There's plenty of replies in here but I'll throw you a bone.

Don't tackle too much at once.

Give this a try on the "doing what you want" category.

Instead of saying "where would you like to eat?" Turn around and say "Let's eat at..." make the preemptive strike. If she doesn't like your decision, rebuke with "okay we'll go to this instead" which is your 2nd choice. (Always have a plan b and c) If that still gets a wrinkle out of her nose then turn and ask "what do you have in mind?" If it's sensible go with it. Chances are it's in one of your top 10. If it's too off the wall reply with "okay, we can go to my plan A or your choice" in which she'll solidify or falter to your plan a.

If her option is pure delusional, explain "that place is way too expensive and out of the question. So either my plan a or my plan b" she'll have to commit to one of those choices but if she's a child and is holding stead fast on the delusional choice, then you need to be firm and reinforce your plan a and she'll have to suck it up.

This may start a temper tantrum in which you just have to treat her like a 4 year old. While you got to do what you want, just eat the shit of her temper tantrum.

Eventually by simply asserting "we're doing this" and actually doing it, will get her to being a little more submissive as you step up more into a leadership role with her as the vice captain.

That "happy wife happy life" is bullshit! Happy husband makes a happy wife.

Title	Swapping Dominance
Author	[deleted]
Upvotes	54
Comments	67
Date	August 6, 2014 12:44 PM UTC (11 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/TheRedPill
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/TheRedPill/comments/2cs6he/swapping_dominance/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/TheRedPill/swapping-dominance.18992 https://theredarchive.com/post/18992

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