How do I best become informed on Feminist views to debate them?

Uzzer_lozer19 · 2021-10-31T10:28:46+00:00

You can't really as feminist views have so many different types, views and subfactions that no one person could really know. Basically try to research the main feminist icons from the past 150 years and their views and quotes. It would be hard for a feminist to disagree with their own history.

I'd also prep for allegations of "mansplanning", "gaslighting", "gender pay gaps", "maternity disputes" all of the usual things that get thrown about when they don't have a valid defence

Ghriszly · 2021-10-31T12:49:47+00:00

Debating feminists isn't worth it. They will never admit when they're wrong and twist your words to make it seem like you said something different.

I once got into an argument saying vaginas come in different sizes and you can feel it. They twisted it around to say I just had a small dick which is why I couldn't feel it. Not even close to the argument I was making.

Try to show people on the fence about feminism how wrong it is. Don't bother with people who are already feminists. They don't care about reality

BrotherhoodofMen01 · 2021-10-31T15:07:42+00:00

In my humble opinion, the worst, most discusting femanists are Men who call themselves femanists unironically. If you're a Man, and say "I'm a femanist, because I believe in true equality. Therefore I want Women to be held accountable the same as Men in all walks of life." That's okay. But for a Man, who clearly hates himself, to spout the femanist lies and still think himself a Man. No, not happening.

It made me cringe a few years ago, when our male polititions. (In the U.K.) were wearing t-shirts with the legend, "This is what a femanist looks like" on them. I thought, and you want to reprasent us. No, don't think so.

Felarhin · 2021-10-31T15:13:07+00:00

99% of the time you'll be blocked or asked to leave if you say anything that they don't want to hear. Don't bother.

accidental_me · 2021-10-31T14:15:37+00:00

https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/40167523-the-feminism-book

But let me warn you, if you know the facts, it's exhausting, so much hate and lies. And if you don't know, you might start believing it and fall into a deep rabbit hole.

alclarkey · 2021-10-31T16:37:13+00:00

Just learn the stock phrase: "Do you have a source for that?" and you'll be all set.

UnconventionalXY · 2021-10-31T13:44:55+00:00

Debate is about reason and objective rationality: you can't debate with someone who only responds from a subjective emotional perspective.

63daddy · 2021-10-31T17:47:21+00:00

Take any topic and the view criticism of that topic or why it’s not true. Also learn about logic fallacies and how to spot them. Feminists tend to rely heavily on logic fallacies in their arguments.

For example you can Google what the gender wage gap actually measures and how feminists misrepresent it. You can read how the feminist Koss “study” on college rape didn’t actually measure rapes, but is construed as if it did.

You can learn about policies feminists lobbied for which blatantly discriminate against men. If you want to see a feminist really steam, have 5 examples proving her wrong when she claims feminism is just about equality.

MisterBowTies · 2021-11-01T02:22:00+00:00

The problem is most aren't looking for logic, that is why they stress feelings. No matter what facts, statistics or logic says their feeling can still be accurate. Ie, it doesn't matter if what a man said was realistically offensive what matters is how the woman who overherd the conversation she want involved in FELT

BrotherhoodofMen01 · 2021-10-31T11:54:52+00:00

I don't try and argue with femanists. I try wherever possible to not engage with them, but I'm unfourtunate enough to be that situation, i say. I will listen to your views when as many Women are dying in the workplace as Men. When women are advocating they are under represented in the mines, the oil fields, the building industry, the deep sea fishing industry and not just the cushy offices and board rooms. You want equality, then do the dirty dangerous jobs, and die equaly with Men. When that happens I'll listen to you.

That usually shuts them up.

Iceman_Hottie · 2021-10-31T17:53:57+00:00

I made a comment that will help:

https://www.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/qhesvk/comment/hied1t8/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3

It has links to my other comments, the second one has a lot of good references. Ask away if you have any questions, I'm happy to help.

animeweebgrill · 2021-10-31T19:23:00+00:00

Well I’m a feminist we can debate respectfully if you want, there aren’t any mens issues that I specifically doesn’t support or advocate for.

Some include, the unfair amounts of child support ( a think both parents should support the kid equally financially wise not only the dad mo matter who has custody)

Raising awareness about men dealing with abuse and rape

Mens mental health

Male genital mutilation

Being forced to go to wars ( idk the correct term eng isn’t my first language)

But I also advocate for issues that effect women heavily (where I’m from specifically)

DouglasWallace · 2021-10-31T19:52:03+00:00

As much as feminism (that is, feminist organisations and active feminists) gets in the way of men and boys having their rights and dignities, feminism isn't really a men's rights issue. It is a toxic ideology that is a side show.

So it depends on why you want to learn about feminism and what kind of debates you anticipate being involved in.

If it is because you want to become an active anti-feminist, purely fighting against feminism, then (depending on your knowledge level) you might want to start with a genuine understanding of history; then read The feminist lie: it was never about equality by Bob Lewis; read up some of Belinda Brown's exposés; and progress to Their Angry Creed: The shocking history of feminism, and how it is destroying our way of life by Herbert Purdy. By that time, you will start to have a feel for what feminism really is, and will probably be in a position to seek your own research path (if not, message me).

If, however, you want to support men then while you could do that kind of studying, you would be better off understanding the issues that the men's rights movement is addressing. They differ in detail from one country to the next but at the surface level, they are much the same. Have a look at past videos from the International Conference on Men's Issues, picking out by title what seems to be of interest. Read The Boy Crisis: Why Our Boys Are Struggling and What We Can Do About It by Warren Farrell; The End of Men by Hanna Rosin, and The Abolition of Man by C.S. Lewis (and old book and frighteningly relevant). And keep an eye on at least two or three men's rights sights but don't get dragged into the same stuff over and over again - keep progressing in your knowledge.

You talk of 'protecting yourself'. That depends on what you mean and may depend on the country (and State) you are in. You'll learn some of the protection as you go along, but the very best way is not to just protect yourself but help to protect all men and boys. It is a manly thing to do, standing up for others, and once you are informed you will be in a position to help society in general as well as yourself.

MahuManeuver · 2021-10-31T23:08:00+00:00

1) the main thing you have to know is feminism is a critical theory. 2) modern feminists you might debate will not observe the rules of polite debate. If you make good points and start to prove your overall thesis they will deploy the “lived experience” card. Which you cannot ever contend with. 3) Camille Paglia is a goddess. Read her and you will have deep knowledge of the feminists.

j0k3ricu · 2021-11-01T08:25:00+00:00

I would say start with Jordan Peterson's (JP) interview with Cathy Newman. What is the difference between equal opportunity and equal outcome. Capitalism and communism. JP explains it well. Also Bret Weinstein's interview to understand, why woke culture is popular and why is it dangerous.

Remember this basic rule

Rights give people Agency for acting out free will. Feminist deny having any Agency over their actions. They claim they were forced to do x,y,z.
With rights comes responsibility. If they want freedom to have sex with whom ever they choose, then they are also responsible for the good and bad choices. " I was forced" comes up.
Accountability to their actions. Bachelor's in Gender studies is not going to make them millionaires or head of management. Feminist usually claim, their action should not have impact on the outcome. Feminist ask for equal outcome by mandating biased, prejudicial, sexist and racist unequal playing field.
If you dissect every feminist claim with above three rules women will not be the victims. They will complicit or down right perpetrators. There are very few genuine claims made by feminists.

Also watch and research on Hoax papers (jre). & Why 80% of studies are wrong by Veritasium . Because most of the studies feminist quote are BS

International_Risk82 · 2021-11-01T09:35:00+00:00

Debating with them isn't worth it. After debating with a few of them as well as sharing the same house with one, I've come to the conclusion that they simply don't want to hear truth nor facts. One here on reddit even went to all my posts and trash talked me when she couldn't win 😂. Spare yourself the trouble and just steer away.

ShivasKratom3 · 2021-11-01T03:01:12+00:00

I mean I dont think they will change your mind. You should know their views of course so you consider both sides of the story and see where you stand

But the problem is feminist is a vague term. It means "equality between men and women" or even just "equality". But "justice" both describes democrats and republicans. Both say they stand for justice. "Peace" is the same thing nazis and communists say. Obviously one is wrong cuz the term is defined in 100 ways.

Feminism isnt one homogeneous group. There are good feminists and bad. Ones with mostly good but some bad views. Ones that beleive different things than each other but still call each other feminists. And even ones basically saying the same thing but just different enough they dont actually consider each other a feminist.

So theres no one thing you can learn or read. Additionally old literature can differ from new literature There isnt one philosophy. Theres not one way to handle it. And in the end arguing just upsets you and upsets them. They usually dont want their mind changed and you probably wont change yours. So just read some popular modern and old books and media to understand some different beleifs

TwittyTwat · 2021-10-31T11:47:43+00:00

So you've decided you disagree with feminist viewpoints before you've even read them? And you wonder why this sub is seen the way it is?

EnvironmentalWar4627 · 2021-10-31T11:50:45+00:00

The best way is to assume every time a woman says something you don't like, it's feminism. Then you can just blame feminism for your issues with women instead of actually dealing with it.

GodBirb · 2021-10-31T20:33:37+00:00

Maybe, instead of trying to make up arguments to beat feminists, you should teach them. Or maybe you’ll even learn something from them if you’re open to it. A lot of feminists are good willed people and the true feminist movement is beneficial to everyone. That being said it does have flaws. Try to point out those flaws in a meaningful way, rather than a snarky comeback comment. Otherwise nobody learns anything and you just divide people even more.

Title	How do I best become informed on Feminist views to debate them?
Author	-_RD_-
Upvotes	87
Comments	65
Date	October 31, 2021 10:16 AM UTC (4 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/qjmn5f/how_do_i_best_become_informed_on_feminist_views/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/how-do-i-best-become-informed-on-feminist-views-to.1080814 https://theredarchive.com/post/1080814

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