Casanova goes against the model of being less invested in a girl than she is of you. Why did this work?

Tombstone31 · 2014-07-21T22:07:44+00:00

"Be less invested" is good, beginner advice. To be more advanced, one has to understand the dynamics of social value. A woman will gauge a man's dating value largely by how he respects himself and whether he acts like he "deserves" the woman, for lack of a better term. The easiest and fastest way to accomplish this is to be less invested. But there will absolutely be situations where that simple method will fail you. For starters, it's extremely important to express sexual/romantic interest. Another example is when a VERY attractive girl expresses interest in you - if you're not used to dating girls that are on her level, good luck acting like you're less interested than she is. And finally, it's also possible to take a woman who's not interested and get her interested by being EXTREMELY interested in her - women love feeling desired, so long as it's by a "high value" man. So the trick then becomes, how do I show that level of interest without coming off like she's out of my league?

There are a million small things that go into that, but it's all about establishing both that you want her and that you think you can get her. That's the level Casanova is operating at.

etcomro · 2014-07-21T20:14:50+00:00

I think Zan Perrion said it best, "To be interesting, be interested"

melodicstory · 2014-07-21T22:08:40+00:00

Because women are different and want different things.

Some women see a high level of interest as unattractive. Other women need to see a high level of interest before they decide whether to go for it or not.

When you look through this board at all the tips and strategies and stories, remember most of all that there is no set of rules that will work for every woman. We are human, and we are different.

torquesteer · 2014-07-21T22:09:03+00:00

I think there is a difference in be "interested" in a woman and being clingy/needy.

I think you can show a woman that you really want her and think she is beautiful without being needy/clingy.

SirByron · 2014-07-21T23:07:57+00:00

Interest =/= investment

Once again conceptual contradictions are needlessly introduced by overlapping language interpretations / the limitations of language.

The counterfoil of effective interest is the subtle but ever present subtext that I could lose interest. Show interest but lace it with that hint of doubt...are you really as interesting as I think you are? Achieve the interest and keeps her qualifying / proving herself endlessly to you. Showing interest does not mean you're investing emotionally.

Be a Ladder. She has to climb rungs and you are out of reach.

DaygameCoach · 2014-07-21T22:56:25+00:00

I have not read those memoirs. Casanova is given as an example of Ideal Lover in Art of Seduction (robert greene). I would see if you can read about that seduction type and see if it puts things into perspective. I am running that seduction type--it is a rare type.

throwawaybitchs · 2014-07-21T23:35:43+00:00

Like most biographers from adventurers, there will be exaggerations, especially in regard to conquering enemies and women. Pretty much any story involves an omega male climbing the ladder to alpha, laying waste to his enemies, with the woman standing by his side, and in the end, a shower of praises from friends and family. Its much the same with modern day Casanovas who begin this journey seeking validation from women, and then turn to men, often with grandiose tales.

Anyway, to address your question, there is a paradox here. On the one hand, you have to make the approach and make your interest known, but you can't show too much interest. You even have to show disinterest, utilised with tactics such as false time constraints, negging and push/pull, etc, etc.

The paradox can never be truly resolved. In the beginning, you have to state interest, but as you go along, you have to show disinterest too. Its a tango.

IpickupGrandmothers · 2014-07-22T12:43:47+00:00

It sounds as though you're viewing social dynamics through rigid, inflexible rules. That can be the case sometimes, but people who really understand what's going on know when to "break the rules". Well, they're not really "rules". They're just general guidelines to follow until you know enough to make decisions on a case-by-case basis.

But to answer your question, think of it like this. What if your fantasy celebrity crush called you right now and told you, "I had a dream about you, and that we fell in love and had a beautiful relationship. Please, please please please let me suck your cock like I was placed on Earth just to do that".

All analogies have their flaws, but bear with me. How would you feel if that happened to you?

The idea is, Casanova is SO high value that he can just do what he wants. It's like if a king holds out his hand to a working-class woman and says, "come with me, you are now a princess. This is how much I adore you."

High interest isn't bad in itself. High interest that stems from neediness is what's bad. I haven't read anything about Casanova, but it sounds like there's also a large degree of state transference. The point is, if you're high value, then you can do a lot of things that a novice can't.

hamletmachine72 · 2014-07-22T00:00:28+00:00

Because it was the 18th century?

joshsway · 2014-07-22T14:47:17+00:00

Totally different society etc.

philosarapter · 2014-07-22T15:30:14+00:00

I'd imagine it has to do with the take-away. Humans are more likely to fear losing something than they are to fear not winning something. Its called the "Loss Aversion Bias". I'd imagine Casanova builds up the girl's self-esteem and good feelings for a time, and then suddenly goes cold. The girl gets used to all these boosts to her confidence, and when they go away, she's driven to try and get those feelings back. If he continues to pull back, she'll keep trying to get that previous treatment back and in the process, will become more and more attached. Then when she is more attached then you are, turn the good vibes back on and you got yourself a girlfriend.

This is the same psychology behind the 'freeze-out', except played out over a longer time scale. This is a good strategy for women you interact with often.

SillyAmerican · 2014-07-22T17:54:39+00:00

Casanova had a slight advantage with this particular method due to the time period he lived in. He was not able to text, email, call a girl and talk to her. His exposure to these women was only in person. that definitely plays a factor.

2udaylatif · 2014-07-25T03:08:00+00:00

The Art of Seduction by Robert Greene

He believes that most women aren't used to such lavish attention and it will melt most women for a short period of time.

psyocal · 2014-07-22T00:56:01+00:00

From what I've read, Casanova was a very unattractive man. This leads me to believe that he had to choose a more methodical approach in his game. His seduction was slow as he would often fly under the radar. He also had a way with words, writing letters to his lovers-to-be. I'm also sure he paid attention and learned how to pleasure women during his many conquests. Back then the female orgasm was believed to be non existent. So when word got around about a 5 foot 5 man was able to deliver unimaginable pleasure, many women were already seduced before ever meeting him.

Title	Casanova goes against the model of being less invested in a girl than she is of you. Why did this work?
Author	Diece
Upvotes	43
Comments	19
Date	July 21, 2014 7:30 PM UTC (12 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/seduction
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/seduction/comments/2bbn1s/casanova_goes_against_the_model_of_being_less/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/seduction/casanova-goes-against-the-model-of-being-less.1373959 https://theredarchive.com/post/1373959

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