Princeton's student newspaper to the wrongly accused: 'Drop Dead'

johnsmith66 · 2013-05-06T15:46:25+00:00

This article perfectly summarizes the problems with Feminist ideology. There is a reason that William Blackstone recommended courts use the "clear and persuasive evidence" standard. We cannot intentionally sacrifice the lives of the innocent in order to also punish the guilty. This idea is lunacy.

Feminists, however, are bloodthirsty for revenge, and their bloodthirst has clouded their judgement. They think that it is acceptable to punish the innocent in order to also punish the guilty. This idea is madness, and anyone who supports intentionally punishing the innocent in this manner is a psychopath.

MRAreader · 2013-05-06T14:51:42+00:00

Read the actual article. The dissent was really strong.

AonRobbin · 2013-05-06T16:04:25+00:00

Can someone explain to me why with sexual assaults on campus people would go to the college rather than the police? I mean, if it's a serious crime surely you'd choose to involve trained authorities over some random college kids more used to dealing with exam cheats

Ma99ie · 2013-05-06T18:29:16+00:00

Rememeber, "Feminism helps men, too."

fia_bui · 2013-05-06T16:00:49+00:00

The bottom line is that private institutions shouldn't be conducting these kind of "trials" at all. They're not even remotely equipped to do so and I'm amazed they're allowed to take the law into their own hands in such a fashion.

2013-05-06T20:08:21+00:00

I would like to point out that every single response to this article has been a variation on "What about the poor person who was accused of rape?"

It's as if we live in a culture where it's more important to consider the future of accused rapists than to consider how we could make this campus a place where fewer people get raped.

That's exactly right, you stupid fuck. Due process trumps the safety you feel entitled to at the expense of the innocent.

Bohica69 · 2013-05-06T14:53:45+00:00

A student "convicted" under these circumstances would have excellent standing to file a civil lawsuit against the University and the Student Union.

PeterArching · 2013-05-06T16:48:06+00:00

This epiphany is posited with no supporting evidence beyond the editorial board's serene ipse dixit.

Which makes them dipshits ipso facto.

McFeely_Smackup · 2013-05-06T16:06:29+00:00

Why is 'Drop Dead' in quotes, when it doesn't appear to be a quote?

PierceHarlan · 2013-05-06T17:21:41+00:00

As so often happens, now the crazies have come out to call us "rape apologists": http://www.dailyprincetonian.com/2013/05/06/33521/

Collective82 · 2013-05-06T20:02:51+00:00

Maybe guys should use this against women to quickly kill it. Anytime something good works for men and not women like intended its quickly removed.

cuteman · 2013-05-06T21:49:54+00:00

Why do so many people think punishment and vegence is more important than protecting innocent people? And Individuals accused of a crime are innocent until PROVEN guilty. Of course the evidentiary requirements for proof are trending downward thanks to Obama's 'dear colleague' letter but even those who still survive the gauntlet and are proven innocent can't seem to catch a break in situations like this.

Nerdloc · 2013-05-07T12:41:02+00:00

I want to agree with the majority because Men's Rights Activists (see: Justice Roy Bean) are pretty much the worst, but ZH's position is actually pretty convincing.

I don't think I've ever seen a single article posted on here without someone popping into the comments section and bashing MRAs. It's almost as if... Nah, why would someone lurk this subreddit for the express purpose of trolling? It's inconceivable!

Cardplay3r · 2013-05-06T18:31:32+00:00

While I agree with the general message and cotwa in general, I must offer this critique. From the article:

The editorial's upshot -- that it is worth the risk of punishing some innocent students in order to nab more guilty ones -- turns on its head the long-settled consensus of civilized people that it is far more important to protect the innocent than to convict the guilty. This sentiment was most famously articulated by the celebrated English jurist William Blackstone, but its roots extend back at least to the Book of Genesis, when God was deciding what to do about the evil in Sodom and Gomorrah.

The anti-theist in me would be raging if I wasn't in a calm mood, for is it not in the same story that Lot offers his daughters to be raped by angels instead of his male guest, which is deemed as proof of his upstanding qualities? Is it not still in the same story that his daughters get him drunk and rape him in order to get pregnant with him, which is also seen as a good thing?

If you view punishing innocents as an immoral thing and try to rectify it, using bible morality will certainly not work in your favor.

I haven't even begun to talk about the pushing of a religious agenda an what it does to credibility.

sizzletron · 2013-05-06T18:47:58+00:00

It's so hard to prove rape so let's just make it easier to dismiss defense, k?

rebuildingMyself · 2013-05-07T05:37:42+00:00

Drop dead, because you're fucking up our propaganda!

5th_Law_of_Robotics · 2013-05-07T17:59:46+00:00

While the clear and persuasive standard may be appropriate in cases of theft, assault or drug use where there is often clear evidence and witnesses, such a standard is inappropriate in the case of sexual assault.

And why do we require such proof in other cases? To reduce the chance of punishing the innocent. Because they are assumed innocent until proven guilty.

So by arguing against this standard they are quite openly admitting their willingness to punish innocent men in their zeal to also catch a few guilty men.

In other words they have expressed open contempt for the basic founding belief behind our legal system.

And these are the people writing our laws on rape and DV.

Drop_ · 2013-05-06T20:58:37+00:00

This paragraph is really messed up, consider revising it.

What does the editorial board say about the innocent students who are more likely to be punished under the lower standard? In perhaps the most breathtaking, Kafkaesque assertion of the entire piece, it suggests that there is little necessity to be concerned about silly things like due process in adjudicating innocence or guilt because the case because . . . even if the innocent are found guilty, they may not be punished as harshly as the guilty. No argument is necessary to underscore the absurdity and the injustice of this rationale, which conflates the

I'm wondering when the advocacy will just be that in cases of sexual assault / rape the presumption of innocence should be eliminated entirely.

Title	Princeton's student newspaper to the wrongly accused: 'Drop Dead'
Author	PierceHarlan
Upvotes	223
Comments	87
Date	May 6, 2013 12:58 PM UTC (13 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/mensrights/comments/1dsfk4/princetons-student-newspaper-to-the-wrongly-/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/princetons-student-newspaper-to-the-wrongly.1612103 https://theredarchive.com/post/1612103

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