How do I get my 7 year old son to stand up to a bully?

Sadbeary · 2016-04-04T14:02:41+00:00

My boy is 8, and like yours, he is a giant for his age.

I tell my kids one thing about bullies: If you start a fight, you're going to be in trouble at school and at home. If someone starts a fight with you, you finish it, give them everything you've got. You'll be in trouble at school, but you won't be in trouble at home.

donerkebabplease · 2016-04-04T12:15:29+00:00

One of my boys was going through this, he's 18 now and hasn't been bullied since I told him the following when he was 7 years old

Bullies prey on the weak, you need to not show weakness, all that will take is one swift punch in the face. It doesn't matter if you get a little beat up, all you need to do is make him think twice about picking on you. If that bully knows there a chance he will get hurt when he picks on you, chances are he won't pick on you.

A few days after giving him this advice along with a few of my own experiences dealing with the same, he stood up to the bully and got into a fight with him. He didn't win the fight, but he never got bullied by that kid again, he also helped me advise my other son (who's now 6) the same a few weeks ago using his own experience with bullies.

Boesman12 · 2016-04-04T09:37:45+00:00

The fucked up part about retaliating against a bully of any sort is that you usually get the short end of the stick. So the problem is not your son retaliating, it is that he will get punished ( blamed ) for his actions. But you have the issue that if you don't retaliate at some point it will continue.

One way to get around that is for your son to challenge this bully to a fight that can somehow be regulated. Let's say this happens again at school and he can challenge him in front of his peers or a teacher, or if it is at a party to challenge him in front of a parent.

This has to be done in such a way that everyone knows that the challenge is him not being the aggressor but, him being fed up of being bullied and wanting to put a stop to it. You can organize your sons dojo for such a fight and have the sensei oversee it.

Edit: We had a teacher at school that gave us boxing gloves and then refereed himself.

Talking to such a childs parents will only make it worse because often they get bullied at home by their parents.

Anyway, good luck. It sucks to have child that is being bullied and you feel so fucking helpless.

BluepillProfessor · 2016-04-04T15:16:42+00:00

The best way to handle a bully- whether it is a schoolboy taunting you or a wife refusing to put out just to see the pain in your eyes- is to remove the reinforcers for the behavior. If you are stoic and refuse to give your tormenter the pleasure of seeing how he/she is hurting you, the bully almost always stops- and often suddenly decides he/she your friend.

The other way to stop a bully is to knock him on his ass. I was bullied by a 4th grader when I was in the 3rd grade. He and 5 of his friends followed me home and tried to beat me up. Luckily I liked playing marbles at that age and had a cloth bag on a long string packed with steely's and boulders.

Now I won't say I was as dramatic as Negan with his barbed wire wrapped bat, but as you might guess the configuration I was holding was a pretty devastating weapon. The older kid lunged at me and I swung my blackjack and knocked him right off his feet. He fell backwards yelling: "Owww, my eye, my eye" as he rolled around in the dirt. I completely cold cocked the next kid to get in range. He lay on the ground not moving and his buddies backed off. I slowly backed away and ran the rest of the way home.

Never had a problem with those boys again. Go figure.

Ryanami · 2016-04-04T12:50:48+00:00

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Sepean · 2016-04-04T13:43:46+00:00

There's always a bigger fish.

Yes, I know the origins of judo, the advantages of fighting back and all that, but the issue here is a social one.

If your son has the bigger group of friends, is more popular, is a positive person who can get people on his side, and has good social skills, then the bully will either get on his side or find an easier target. What he needs isn't the right fight venue or the right martial art (though I happen to like judo), but high social standing and a group of friends that would make the bully's life hell if he crossed the line again.

2016-04-04T14:51:39+00:00

This is exactly why so many more are raised to be punk ass bitches.

What I would suggest is that you get your wife on your side so that you and your wife provide a unified front from which to tell your kid that standing up for yourself is okay.

2016-04-04T12:02:05+00:00

Pondering the universality of this problem sure doesn't make it any easier to bear does it? It's painful for a father to watch.

I can recall my own father, after I came home with a split lip after an ass kicking (deserved no doubt) telling me "Il, your whole life your mouth is going to get you into trouble. I'm taking you to learn how to box." He was right of course and there was more than one time I was glad he made me learn.

You won't like my advice I expect. You are doing the right thing to give your son the skills he needs and I would definitely keep that up.

Don't recommend you taking on the role of provocateur yourself and trying to "pressure him into fighting back hard." Mock fighting you will not "toughen" him up, you'll just make a bad situation worse.

Keep doing what you are already doing and when he's had enough, he will fight back. Be sure he knows, that you know, that sometimes he is just going to have to break the rules and do it and that you are ok with it.

The only solace I can offer is that most situations like this are temporary. Also, be glad it's not your daughter being bullied by other girls. That's a FUCKING nightmare to deal with I can tell you from experience it's much, much worse.

The_Litz · 2016-04-04T12:13:29+00:00

I have a boy of 7.

A concern from my side was that he would become a bully at school as he is prone to temper tantrums and he is slightly above average in size.

Turns out he was harassed by two class mates. The confusion with fighting back comes from us as parents. From age two he is taught to use words and not strike out and hit if he is unhappy.

To then tell them it is ok to hit a bully is confusing. They have to start distinguishing when to stand up for themselves physically and when to stand up for themselves by talking.

My advice to him was that anyone that bullies him or his friends can be hit if they carry on after being told to stop.

I teach him to be assertive, not asking someone to stop doing what they are doing, but telling them to stop. Big differance.

Hope it helps and you get this sorted.

UEMcGill · 2016-04-04T16:17:16+00:00

Here's a great article from Ian Ironwood about exactly that.

Unfortunately this may be a time you need to intervene. Ian's blog has several great suggestions, but the gist of it is, challenge the system.

Bureaucracy is self serving and self protecting. On the one hand they want to keep you in the dark, so you get answers in the form of policy and government-speak, "Oh we have a policy of non-intervention and a program teaching anti-bullying". Did they tell you what they do specifically? No. They want to bullshit you and keep you in the dark; it could be on purpose, or just a function of the culture.

So how do you combat this? Pull the curtain back to expose the wizard as a fraud.

Ask for a written policy from the superintendent for how they are supposed to handle bullying in the school, specifically how they deal with the accused.

Report it to the school. Ask what they are going to do about it. Then wait.

My state has a freedom of information act and this is definitely the domain of that kind of thing. Once you've planted the seed, do a FOA on the entire system. Ask for emails from the Superintendent, to the principle that discuss bullying specifically, ask for emails from the principal to any teacher about bullying, ask for training policies from all those involved (teachers, counselors, VP's etc). Try to phrase it around your kid specifically and any communication about your specific case. Avoid using the other kids name because it may trigger student confidentiality.

One thing you can bet on, they likely don't know the FOA rules and laws, and were lazy sending emails back and forth with out thought that it maybe evidence against them. Contact the proper jurisdictions lawyer (in my case the town lawyer) about what the proper legal response it.

Your goal here is two fold, one you want evidence for the possible next step, two you want to expose the dark underbelly of the bureaucracy to the light. Exposes them opens them up to criticism and excesses or negligence they maybe hiding. I bet money they will try to tell you that they don't owe you that, so a letter in writing from the town attorney will back you up.

The last part is, threaten to sue, then sue. The best part is using a process called 'qui tam' (Thanks again to Ian) will let you do this by using the DA. So no commitment from you.

I did this with my town about a vacant house the town refused to site for violations. I armed myself with knowledge and found out, that they were obligated to fine the owner or put a lien against it for every week it was in violation, $500 for each infraction. The town was letting $4000 a week go by my estimation. I called the mayor, I called the zoning department, I called the town attorney. I waited and 2 weeks later I filed a FOA. I followed up every conversation I had with a confirming email. I found a back and forth email chain that said basically, "We're doing nothing, and UE McGill is a blow hard" I went to the next town meeting and asked what they were doing about the problem. They said they were pursuing talks with the bank, and I threw it right back at them, "I have an email that says I'm a blow hard and to just ignore it"

2 weeks later the house went up for auction. The mayor personally called and apologized.

Don't but heads with people, use the system to your advantage.

Oh and on a personal note, I beat the ever living shit out of a bully after the school kept telling my mom, "we can't do anything" and he never bothered me again. I'm not one to condone violence, but I do believe in self preservation. Tell your son, there's no such thing as a fair fight, and once you commit, you do 100%.

War2kali · 2016-04-04T23:17:58+00:00

I agree with all the responses basically saying he needs to fight back but not start anything, pretty simple.

My only question is if this kid is such a punk and his parents show no control, why did you let your son go to this kids birthday party alone?? Don't let your kid spend time with classmates or people that don't treat them right. Politely decline the birthday party, the play dates, the long walks on the beach, and any other crap idiots invite your son to. His time should be spent with friends or potential friends.

ReddJive · 2016-04-05T16:45:23+00:00

For my son he was just afraid of getting into trouble. At 7 (he's 12 now) he had a bully run in.

Told my son I will never be made if he finishes a fight. I will be pissed if he starts one.

Well. The school knew the other kid intimidated and antagonized others but since he never started fights piss poor things got done.

Well the bully pushed my son to his limits and got a face full in return. School calls me in explains the situation. I explain how they failed to handle the whole thing and let it get to this point.

Principal understand but says they may have to Suspend my son any how.

I tell her they do that I'm taking him to Disney world.

We had a great surprise vacation.

For some reason I can have this attitude with complete strangers but hard with my wife.

2016-04-05T16:54:49+00:00

My son is good kid. He says he's not allowed to use judo outside of the dojo, the teachers say you can't fight back, they other kid will get hurt if he throws him on the asphalt, blah blah. That's part of it, and the other part is probably that this other kid is just more psycho. So often my son ends up taking it.

Fuck the teachers. What are they doing to stop the bully? Fuck the dojo. What sort of dojo doesn't allow you to use judo in self defence? Do they know what's actually going on? Tell him to make that guy never come near him again. Beat the shit out of him and then stand over him on the ground and tell him the next time he comes near him he won't be able to walk away. You are training this kid to be a beta, listen when women tell you they love you while they fuck the guy that bullied you in school and are still at it, as they are special unicorns, the government and banks have only your best interests at heart and all that BULLCRAP.

And if the kid goes crying to the shitty parents he has, BACK YOUR KID. Show him your dad has his back and is a real man. Be prepared to lose them as friends. However I predict that the most likely outcome is that the bully will want to be your kid's best friend and be in awe of him.

The bullying will continue and get worse, and other lesser chicken shit bullies will join in unless your son fucks this guy up. I don't know what country you come from, but in my country, if someone hits you, you hit them back. A bully won't bully someone that they can beat if they know they are likely to get a few broken teeth each time. They only bully the ones that sit there and take it. I've never met a bully who wasn't a coward. Those same bully types are the ones who many girls flock to later on, so even when I was younger I had very little respect for those girls.

When I was 4 and went to school for the first time (I lived in a remote area) I had never seen other kids before. My mum told me to "be nice" to everyone. The first day after school I had the shit kicked out of me by a guy. I came home crying. My dad said "what happened". I told him. He said "what did you do". I said my mum said to "be nice" to everyone so I did nothing. He got mad with my mum and said "what the fuck did you tell him that for ?" Then he said "If anyone hits you ever again, hit them back twice as hard". The next day, another kid hit me - obviously word had gotten round that I was the designated school punchbag. I hit him back and knocked him to the ground - I was a big strong kid. He ran away crying.

I've followed that motto religiously since and it hasn't let me down yet - even once getting in a fight with 3 guys in an inner city slum area because one of them stole something from me (that was bloody stupid - was lucky to survive that one). Anyway that side of alpha was never my problem, and if your son is kicking ass in the dojo it sounds like it's not his problem either.

Diff888 · 2016-04-04T23:57:08+00:00

"This weekend he was at that kids birthday, and when my wife picked him up he was in a corner crying because he'd been beaten (and this kid's divorced POS parents weren't doing anything about it)."

Wow. Just fuckig Wow. Your son is in the corner crying? Forget you, think about him.

Fuck the consequences. Fuck your "Judo" teacher (why even take it). Your son is in the corner crying at a party and you need to ask what to do? Jesus H Christ. He needs to fight. He needs to punch this kid. He may win he may lose, but if he doesn't fight back, and soon he'll be a cunt the rest of his life.

I have 2 boys and 2 girls . Both boys handled bullies. Just like I did when I got punched I the stomach at baseball and my Dad laughed at me and said punch him the face next time.

What have we come to as a country?

2016-04-04T13:04:16+00:00

I was bullied in high school, and I wish I had advice on this. It was a great lesson. No one else gave two shits about what happened to me, so long as they weren't liable.

For me, it was groups, and I wish I had just fought and taken an ass whooping, preferably with the main guys throat in my hand while I'm receiving it. No one really told me about prison rules back then. Would have probably saved a lot of bullshit.

The coping part is easy. You know none of it will matter. The kid won't damage him permanently, and ultimately, nothing will matter. I know the one thing I didn't take from it was a sense of self defeatedness, or lack of worth. I would say ensuring he doesn't take this as an attack on his character or potential should be the key, becuase, lets face it. That's really the only thing he needs from this long term.

It's never about the fighting IME. It's about the mindset. He will know how to kick and punch, but if he freezes when put under a little pressure from the lizard brain, none of it matters. The stepdad inadvertently taught me that one later in life, no thanks to him.

I know there's almost no advice in here, it's just someone who was there as a kid, who came out the other side. I know that my mom taking my side when the school tried to treat us as equal aggressors was biggie. It's not like he won't have tons of examples of this in the future, and would be good to detach his choices from the acceptance of outside peoples judgement.

If he does fight though, the advice I would give is fighting to win. Fight dirty, fight to end it, fight to ensure that he never tries to fuck with you again. Bruce Lee's 'way of jeet kune do' was a great read for the fighting mindset, and what kid doesn't like watching Bruce Lee?

Luckily, you don't have to win the fight to achieve any of that, just enough blood to drive him to softer targets.

cj_aubrey · 2016-04-04T10:48:56+00:00

I would go with the following process

1) Talk to other dads and find another kid that wants to learn to fight. Get gloves and pads.

2) Find a boxing, muay thai or kickboxing coach or class to teach them. I bet a 20 year old from the local muay thai gym would do it for $30/session once per week.

3) Have them drill strikes, blocking, movement for a few weeks on pads and a bag.

4) Get them gum shields and groin guards and have them start sparring. Start off by calling it blocking practice and have them each throw one punch at a time at 20% power in turn. Then two punch combos. Then 40% power. Then any combo they want. Then 2 minute rounds. Then 70% power.

5) Explain that there's only one way to deal with a fucking bully.

ImprovingMan · 2016-04-04T17:06:43+00:00

This is a tough one. For kids, the big hurdle is psychological. Even if your kids is a well-trained fighter, he may not be wired to fight back yet. That might even be a good thing. It means he is a good kids and is being socialized correctly. He might need to navigate this one himself and learn from it. Plus, if your son fights back, it sounds like this bully's mom will paint your son as the aggressor. This kid needs a lot of help or he will grow up to be an angry anti-social adult, with real adult consequences.

I was big for my age, and not really physical or aggressiv. In the 5th grade there was another kid that liked to push me around and intimidate me. He was held back for a year and had a lot of issues from home. He was just a kid acting out. Anyways, there were a few times he punched me in the face and I didn't fight back. I always regretted not standing up for myself. After that I decided to get more physical. I started playing sports and doing martial arts. In high school this kid re-surfaced and was no longer bigger than everybody else and was sort of an outcast. I was on my way to being 6'5" and was one of my school's stand-out football players. I was confident from the years of martial arts and had a very good social life. The other kid didn't turn out so well. I could have went after him for revenge and absolutely destroyed him. But he was just a messed up kid without many friends. My dad explained that the kid that bullied me wouldn't amount to much and that he didn't have the life tools to succeed because of his family structure. As much as I hated him, I actually felt sorry for the kid and how he was turning out.

I am not saying that your son shouldn't stand up to this kid but just that he might not be ready yet. The important thing is to keep raising your son the right way and he will figure it out. He might get fed up and physically retaliate, or he might navigate his way around it and have it fuel him as he grows up. Either way it will be okay. I guess what I'm saying is to think about the big picture.

2016-04-04T18:03:19+00:00

tell him that "sticks and stones can break my bones but words can never hurt you", so just "turn the other cheek", and "standing up to a bully makes you just as bad as the bully".

/s

2016-04-04T18:41:21+00:00

Tell him to use his judo smartly, a nice hip toss into side control, pin the bully down and either just hold him or give him a wet willy until he quits struggling. I don't think the muay thai clinch would go down well with his teachers.

2016-04-04T18:57:07+00:00

Why treat this any than any other teaching opportunity?

You correctly instruct the child: when dealing with bullies ask (ask them to stop), then tell (tell them to stop), then defend (make them stop). Advanced rule is: if a bully uses force, there is no asking, only telling; if they use, or appear to be about to use, excessive force there is only making them stop.

Reward the child when he does well. Show disappointment when he does not. Tell the child what he should do the next time it happens and reward/withhold as appropriate.

TheRedStoic · 2016-04-04T19:40:04+00:00

This will sound cold, however you're a father, and you want the best, so maybe I won't be downed to Oblivion.

don't talk to the parents
don't talk to the legal guardians or caretakers (including teachers)
do ride on social proof. However:
target that proof against his parents

The only way he'll respond is if you break the trend setters. (his family). I don't know if you have neighborhood watch, parental council sessions, school board access, whatever, but you need to cut his family out based on their kids performance. He's already fucked, fuck him more. Who cares? Another failed statistic.

When it happens next, don't go after the kid, go after what kind of parenting could possibly result in this kind of child. Play the concerned victim. Play every single tune you can to seem helplessly confused at their parental failure. Bring any other demonstrable examples of children being bullied by this little shit into play.

Speak to neighbors of the kids family, other students parents any shared cohorts, etc. Your son isn't alone, bullies isolate, but they don't fixate.

If you get enough social repercussion the parents will be harmed, then they'll punish/restrain their child. It's not your problem how. Just that your son doesn't let it build up pressure until he hulks and almost kills the little shit. "speaking from childhood experience"

Hurt the source to create change. It's the shortest line between two points.

The second option is help/encourage your kid to build an entourage. That'll scare the bully away many times. Not a strong recommendation, never bothered trying.

The third option is to purposefully, and perilously invite the problem kid to chill with your son. Let him know implicitly to go to town.

He won't say anything because there's no proof and it'll harm his social standing. And I'm sure your son carries bruises from training anyway, (if not, let him pick up a new physically punishing hobby beforehand) you've got evidence.

Edit: oh, if you go for option 3, make sure his parents find out from you, break it up when the kid has had enough, then display total concern for both kids.

BluepillProfessor · 2016-04-05T02:50:03+00:00

How to deal with a loud mouth bully: Hi Meg, how was prison

EGOtyst · 2016-04-05T03:38:18+00:00

also, sounds like he might not be wanting to fight because of the party line fed to him in martial arts class. It is normally a good thing for the teachers to teach, of course. But, maybe you could have a 1-to-1 convo with the teacher and try and get him to let your kid "release the dogs" so to speak.

IASGame · 2016-04-05T12:06:12+00:00

I often wonder how bully kids get away with crap without interference from society that would get adults in trouble with the police or whatever. Namely, physically assaulting a peer (another kid in this case, or another adult in the thought experiment) and repeatedly doing it in other instances.

If the bullied kid tries to get the situation dealt non-violently by whatever counts as the respective authority he/she may even be mocked for it.

Instead of taking justice into own hands, beating the other guy up, as would apparently be possible in this particular situation because the bullied kid is actually not weaker or not that much weaker. Which has a not that small risk of getting one of the kids really hurt (particularly if you are talking about judo throws into an hard floor).

I agree with teaching (and encouraging) kids to defend themselves, particularly as there will always be situations where the relevant "authorities" aren't around, but otherwise I think they should also be encouraged to make use of the system - as they will need to when they are adults.

2016-04-06T10:52:56+00:00

"He says he's not allowed to use judo outside of the dojo"

WHAT?

2016-04-06T10:54:38+00:00

Okay, im probably going to have fucking flashbacks from childhood of hell for days now, but holy shit, get that kid to stand up for himself.

fuck the dojo rules, and if he gets suspended for fighting, make sure its public and AFTER he gets hit first.

Then take him out for a party on his days of suspension.

The school system is jacked against anything, so don't sweat it. Lawyer up if you have to later. The BOE is a group of cowards that will always back down to public insurrection.

2016-04-04T12:41:31+00:00

Your son may be big and strong but aggression is not his nature. It wasnt mine, I had to learn the hard way as a kid that hitting first works wonders.

Role play. Seems you have told him about defending self from bullies and showed him techniques but now is time for you to act out the part of bully and he plays out his part

fdsdfs89 · 2016-04-05T09:09:50+00:00

First off, get him in a dojo that doesn't teach bullcrap like not using martial arts to defend yourself. That is the entire point.

ColdEiric · 2016-04-06T05:57:14+00:00

Tell him why and when you fight. Tell him which cases you're allowed to fight. Watch American Sniper with him, if you need to. Watch the scene where Father sorts the people in three different groups.

My son is good kid. He says he's not allowed to use judo outside of the dojo, the teachers say you can't fight back, they other kid will get hurt if he throws him on the asphalt, blah blah.

Are these teachers low-T 'men' and 'strong, single women who strangely can't find a man', idiots who do understand when a fight is the solution, or are they teachers who has learnt understands something other than merely their subsidized education? Because if they're the former, your son is confused, because his teachers say one thing and you say another.

I've begun teaching him to punch properly and how to do a muai thai clinch and knee the guy in solar plexus and perhaps a few more tools will help, but maybe he needs some more encouragement? Does anyone have some good pointers on this? Could the disappointed dad help, or toughen him up with some mock fights where I pressure him until he fights back hard?

This is merely how he would fight.

Has he learnt yet why and when it is moral and necessary and expected for men to fight, even when the cowardly pussies say you shouldn't? Does he know why and when would you fight and attempt to beat a shit out a man? Because if he hasn't, your son will be as wise as a career beta.

massimoliani · 2016-04-04T10:34:02+00:00

Why is your kid going to a party where a guy beats him up?

Your son isn't fighting back because it's fight OR flight. He chooses flight. That's all there is to it.

Title	How do I get my 7 year old son to stand up to a bully?
Author	Sepean
Upvotes	16
Comments	78
Date	April 4, 2016 8:43 AM UTC (10 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MarriedRedPill
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/marriedredpill/comments/4da8wx/how_do_i_get_my_7_year_old_son_to_stand_up_to_a/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MarriedRedPill/how-do-i-get-my-7-year-old-son-to-stand-up-to-a.200144 https://theredarchive.com/post/200144

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