A Nice Guy Lies

Reddit View
February 28, 2018

I got back into reading NMMNG today for the first time in ages. I'm 25 and I actually read the book at 17 or 18 because I was being conditioned from a good friend in his 30s. I am starting to read the book again now because I do not want my marriage to spiral out of control. I came across a section of NMMNG today that I don't know how to interpret.


Most Nice Guys pride themselves on being honest and trustworthy. Ironically, Nice Guys are fundamentally dishonest. Nice Guys will tell lies, partial truths, and omit information if they believe it will prevent someone from focusing on them in a negative way.

I am going to ask this dumb question because I am sick of hearing it and not knowing how to reply. My wife loves to play the "Oh do you think that woman is attractive?" game with me. To her it's not a game (shit test) but at the same time I don't know how to answer. When I got married I didn't just become oblivious to other women around me. Women aren't just gray blobs of goop walking around. I always find some clever way to give a roundassabout answer that is no but after reading this I feel like I should just be flat out honest. I'm tired of lying to not hurt her feelings because I know damn well that if the right circumstance came along she'd be on some other guy's jock. I'm not afraid of saying tough things but I've got this mindset in my head that is "some things are better off not said."

Am I wrong to think this way?

Post Information
Title A Nice Guy Lies
Author yesbuthereswhy
Upvotes 11
Comments 105
Date 28 February 2018 03:23 AM UTC (3 years ago)
Subreddit askMRP
Link https://theredarchive.com/post/204762
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/askMRP/comments/80stz2/a_nice_guy_lies/
Similar Posts

Red Pill terms found in post:
shit testgameNMMNG

[–]InChargeManRed Beret8 points9 points  (4 children) | Copy

Translation: "Of course that woman is attractive, I'm going to make you dance like a monkey to prove that I'm the alpha in our relationship."

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points  (3 children) | Copy

It's like a direct line into his flight mechanism. "Do you think that woman is attractive?" BAM he's passive and on defense. I wonder how many other dog clickers she has on him.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

It’s a great question and something I reflected on yesterday while reading. The I’m fat question doesn’t phase me one bit. I’ve told her to stay in shape which worked just fine. She’s been slim and she’s staying slim because I’ve told her she can’t be overweight.

[–]BluepillProfessorMod / Red Beret1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

dog clickers

I honestly believe THAT is the point of all this "talk" and "communication" that they teach.

When I say marriage counseling is like giving the therapist and the wife- almost always 2 women- baseball bats to beat the shit out of the man while therapy is training the man to isolate and tightly squeeze his balls so the blows are more effective- I am really not joking.

I think that is exactly what they are doing.

They are deliberately and often consciously empowering the woman by forcing the man to reveal his dog whistles. Then she has more options and buttons to push.

No thanks.

Every weakness you reveal to your woman, every concern, every fear, every uncertainty ALL OF IT WILL BE USED AGAINST YOU WHEN YOU ARE MOST VULNERABLE. All of it will be thrown back in your face at the proper time and used as a weapon by the wife. If you reveal your weaknesses she will use them to control and ultimately destroy you.

That is what the Biblical story of Samson was trying to warn us. He lied over and over again to the hot girl who kept coming back to his bed. Then he revealed his one weakness and they enslaved him, and burned out his eyes. It's a pretty damn good allegory for what women do if you let them. After a term of enslavement as a married man, they continue the slavery after divorce and many men can't even look at another woman. Almost like their eyes are burned out.

[–]mrpCamper0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

It's like a direct line into his flight mechanism.

This is totally correct and I never thought of it like that before.

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (7 children) | Copy

To her it's not a game (shit test)

Yes, yes it is.

I'm tired of lying to not hurt her feelings


Standard rules apply.

[–]ex_addict_broRed Beret2 points3 points  (5 children) | Copy

Not as special snowflake as he thought

[–][deleted] -2 points-1 points  (4 children) | Copy

Not special, just naive.

[–]ex_addict_broRed Beret0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy

The correct approach would be to STFU and listen, especially when older, more experienced guys are trying to teach you something and even more specially, when you came here green as cucumber, blind to your own mistakes, not calling an obvious shit test a shit test, describing the EXACT behaviour described in NMMNG or whatever book you're reading now.

Possibly what brought you here is your subconsciousness. You felt something is off. You found yourself in that book, but you needed someone to point this out to you.

And someone does that.

The correct stance is to shut the fuck up, read, absorb and implement. Even better stance is to say "thanks, I needed that" or something along this.

But no. You choose to disagree.

Because what you think is it is all about you, isn't it.


[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy

You’re way too invested in this dialogue.

[–]A-day-one0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

You’re being defensive. It’s a shit test but you didn’t think it’s a shit test.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Women shit test. Men are direct. I thought women had to announce themselves?

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Got it

[–][deleted] 7 points8 points  (0 children) | Copy

What’s wrong with just saying “yeah, she’s pretty.”

She’s trying to make you dance and I think A&A is part of that dance, in this situation, though it works as well.

She knows the woman is hot. So do you. So don’t fucking dance. Cut her stupid game off at the knees. If she tries to have faux anger over it or legitimately becomes jealous, laugh at her and don’t engage. She’ll apologize later.

[–]SteelToeShitKickerRed Beret10 points11 points  (6 children) | Copy

Hmm. I don't know if she's my type. <pause> You think she can suck dick like a pro? <strokes imaginary beard> Because that's definitely worth another 2 points. That would make her a solid 8.

Hehehe. My wife never asks me these questions, because she knows I'd answer them, graphically.

[–]maxofreddit1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Best answer... agree an amplify... into a threesome.

“Yeah, she’s pretty cute... when did you wanna invite her over?”

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points  (4 children) | Copy

I like this approach. You say your wife doesn't ask you questions because she knows how you'll answer. Maybe my wife needs a dose of her own medicine so she won't ask me these questions any longer. Thanks.

[–]nastynickdrRed Beret5 points6 points  (1 child) | Copy

Start giving less fucks. Its a shit test. Whatever you say is good, as long as you are not serious/affected by it. You dont need to come up with a super witty answer. Say anything with a smirk. Stop walking on eggshells. Stop being afraid of her reaction. Stop being afraid of her emotions.

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy

You’re absolutely right. I tell her she can’t be fat without a second thought so if I can say that then I should say whatever the hell I want whenever she asks. I need to stop acting like I’m afraid of losing her from saying the wrong thing. There is no wrong thing to say.

[–]Alphaphux2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy

DNGAF - internalise it

[–]SteelToeShitKickerRed Beret0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

The wife knows what I like, I have never been shy about telling her that. If she were to ask, I'd answer as a connoisseur, a perverted connoisseur. Extra points if your response makes her think about the targeted woman performing a sex act upon you.

I actually enjoy giving the wife some discomfort, it's funny. I may get pinched or punched, but she always has a twinkle in her eye when she does it.

[–]Reach180Red Beret4 points5 points  (9 children) | Copy

The take-away from No More Mr. Nice Guy should be that you don't fear her looking at you negatively, not that you need to blurt out the factual truth.

You don't need to be factually correct about something like this. She's not querying for information about your taste in women. She's pinging you to see if she's got your balls in her purse.

This is banter. Play the game.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (1 child) | Copy

Hey OP, my wife was going on and on one day about Aquaman and how sexy he looks. Then, she looks at me and says, “What superhero do you find attractive?” I smiled, stayed in the same universe, and said, “Who do I find attractive? Wonder Woman, because I’d make her my bitch in the bedroom. She’d like it, just like you like it.” She glared at me and I just grinned. She’s never brought it up again.

Edit: the sex was good that night too by the way.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

That is a solid response!

[–]fuckmrpRed Beret8 points9 points  (1 child) | Copy

Her: Oh do you think that woman is attractive? You: Why did she say something about me?

Her: Oh do you think that woman is attractive? You: Do you? Should I ask her to come over?

Her: Oh do you think that woman is attractive? You: Can we take her home?

She'll probably get sick of it and stop asking but maybe, just maybe, you get to disappoint two women one night.

You can be honest, you can lie or you can do what servers your interests.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

You can be honest, you can lie or you can do what servers your interests.

Yeah at the end of the day that’s all true. I think somewhere down the line I got uncomfortable with saying outrageous things. I’d rather go back to who I was and just condition her to knock that shit off.

[–]ReddJiveRed Beret2 points3 points  (16 children) | Copy

I am reading some of these comments and I wonder if OP has the Frame to pull off AA or even AM. Most guys run these tings like scripts the PUAs used to run.

Doesn't work as well. What the PUAs found is taht they have to have some depth to themselves. Over time PUAs realized that the process they were undergoing was improving themselves as men. Red Pill kind of developed from that.

/u/nastynickdr is the right answer. Being cocky funny isn't going to work if you can't handle whatever she's going to throw at you. It's a shit test, unless you've had that talk about a threesome. Handle it as such.

A simple look. Brush it off and say "Are you done?"

AA, AM, LMNOP is not going to help unless your frame is made of vibranium. And OP's isn't otherwise he wouldn't be wrapped around the axle about it.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (12 children) | Copy

Thanks for the analysis. I appreciate the input and you’re probably not too wrong to suggest what you’re saying. I don’t have the audacity to say half the things that have been suggested but that doesn’t mean I have to let her keep shit testing me.

[–]Two_kids_in_a_coat0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

If you can’t pull off AA then just be honest. She can ask dumb questions all she wants. If she doesn’t like the answer then it’s her problem not his.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

I need to look up those two terms to better know what those are.

[–]Two_kids_in_a_coat1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Agree and amplify.

[–]Alpha_Engineer992 points3 points  (6 children) | Copy

“Of course she’s fucking hot...” smirk

My beta days, no way I could pull off a type of comment like this. Now, it’s so easy and fun. Self amused.

My wife actually points out hot chicks to me all the time now, it’s amazing how the dynamics (myself) have changed.

Stop worrying what she thinks.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (5 children) | Copy

Did you ease into audacious remarks or was it a gradual transition for you?

[–]Alpha_Engineer990 points1 point  (4 children) | Copy

It was a very gradual and very slow transition for me. I was king of the nice guys, very beta husband, I had her so high on a pedestal.

I didn’t have AA comments or amused mastery in me. But after unfucking myself, lifting, going through the sidebar, I became happy, centered, for the first time in my life.

AA just comes natural for me now.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy

Okay great I’ll take a practical approach towards my goal. Where can I find the list of acronyms? I am not familiar with AA.

[–]Alpha_Engineer991 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Sidebar ====>

[–]wildnight98MRP APPROVED0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

If you are reading Reddit on an app, you have to go to Community Info to find the “sidebar.” You need to read it. The whole thing.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Thanks, I have not read the entire thing. I am still working on it.

[–]Alphaphux1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Say "which one?" Really get her to point her out. Then when she has just stare at the other woman and get a real eye full, bonus points if you can catch her eye and get a little smile

[–]The_LitzRed Beret1 point2 points  (3 children) | Copy

What is your answer going to be if she asks you if you think she is fat?

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

Oddly enough I had no problem telling her she can’t be fat unless she is pregnant.

[–]The_LitzRed Beret0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Then you do not fear her reaction, which means you can say what you like/feel.

My wife doesn't ask me directly if I think a girl is pretty, she states it as a fact, so-n-so is such a beautiful woman, obviously waiting for my reply. I usually just AA her but point out a tiny tiny flaw and tell her it is a deal breaker for me. 'Yip she is pretty, but I would insist she stops wearing high heel shoes if we date, my dates have to be shorter than me.' or ' I never noticed, should we put her on the replacement list? '.

The replacement list is an ongoing joke we have. I have a list of woman that will take her place in the event of her dying.

As for the dreaded fat question, my wife is getting a little chubby. So as she was weighing herself the other morning I just told her 'Remember, I don't date girls over 70kg' with a grin. She knows that I know that she has gained weight.

Slightly off topic, there are times when it is ok to 'lie'. It is covered in the 48 laws of power. The basic premise is that you agree with the crowd, but your believes are different. It prevents you becoming an unnecessary target. Works well in the work environment where sometimes STFU is the only option. But it is always from a position of power.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I don’t know why I put that in a special category. I’m going to move it right over to the weight idea because I have zero shits to give. I will look into the 48 Laws of Power. I haven’t picked this book up yet.

If you want your wife to lose weight make sure you’re working out too. I have found that to make it way easier when I say she has to be fit. I like to lead by example in that department and so far it’s working really well for me.

[–]Two_kids_in_a_coat1 point2 points  (3 children) | Copy

There is no freedom like complete honesty. Shrug and tell her the truth. She’s not stupid. She knows the answer already so why pretend otherwise? If you can’t be honest with something easy like that then how many other aspects of yourself are you to cowardly to show? Will it always be roses by being truthful? Of course not, but you’ll be respected as a man. Will she leave you because she asked a stupid question and the answer pissed her off? No. Will she leave you because you have no backbone, are afraid to make waves and bow to which ever way the wind is blowing? Yep. Boring as fuck and not respectable.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy

I agree, you’re completely right. I just took a look over the 48 Laws of Power and one that struck me with my current situation is Law 46.

Never Appear too Perfect

A perfect man would say that his wife or LTR is the only beautiful woman and that he’s attracted to no one else. We all have vices and flaws so to hide them is deceitful and does more harm than good. A “Nice Guy” hides his true feelings because he is afraid of what others will think. It’s very likely that because I’ve conditioned my wife with my beta answers that the next time I am shit tested she will lose it because she expects the same reply. I’ll watch her lose it and I will not change my reply regardless of how she feels.

[–]Two_kids_in_a_coat0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

After after you reply make sure you don’t DEER. You’ve been BP so that’s where the real battle will be, that’s where most men lose.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I just got done reading a post and NMMNG and I know this is a problem with me. I need to get away from this mentality. It never works and always puts me in a worse position.

[–]RuleZeroDADRed Beret1 point2 points  (6 children) | Copy

"I wouldn't kick her out of bed for eating crackers."

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (4 children) | Copy

I have no idea what the hell this means.

[–]RuleZeroDADRed Beret0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy

It's a thing old dudes say to their wives when asked if they find another woman attractive.

Low grade AA. Non-threatening, and cheesy enough to avoid conflict, and puts the point across that you'd fuck that other girl.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

Haha okay, well my wife is ESL so I’m almost positive she would have no idea wtf that means.

[–]RuleZeroDADRed Beret0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Burying the lead.

Where is she from? You do know in some cultures feigning jealousy and starting fights is a form of foreplay?

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy


[–]straius0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy


[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (3 children) | Copy

In the few times that has been brought up by my wife. “She’s an X out of 10, she has nice Y, thumbs up/down”

More often though if I find a woman exceptionally attractive I volunteer that information, and specify why she’s a standout.

A woman has a choice. She can become irrationally jealous of a woman you’re likely never going to even meet, over something you can’t really control. Or she can take that information on board, about what you find sexually attractive, and do something useful with it.

I wouldn’t participate in a competitive comparison (Is she prettier than me?) that’s non-productive, and sort of a back handed insult (as if my affection is somehow completely hinging on looks). And by wouldn’t participate I mean give her a dissatisfying answer such that she never wanted to ask the question again.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy

Okay so basically you just shrug it off as if she were asking you if you liked a movie or tv show. I like your last part. I’m not out to piss my wife off and I think now with what I’ve learned here is that the end game isn’t to get her to stop. I just need to give her an answer and move on because it’s no big deal. Thanks for your input.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Well the way I think about it; What I find sexually attractive, ought to be important to her, she should want to know, certainly I should be open and honest with her if she asks, and it shouldn’t be a big deal.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

Yeah it should be important to her so she has to respect you. If you look good, dress sharp and appear that you can lay other chicks than she should come around. I think for me my biggest help was a change in attitude, working out again and getting more responsible because I lacked in all three departments.

My wife actually loves when I clean the house or do dishes. It makes her want to jump my bones for some odd ass reason. From what a lot of people say around here it’s how you make her feel that makes her attracted to you.

[–]BluepillProfessorMod / Red Beret1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

Oh do you think that woman is attractive

The answer is "yes" or "no." You can also compare her specific features to your wife. You can easily neg the shit out of this Shit Test and get her pissed off. Soon she will stop doing it.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I’ve never thought about it that way but yeah it is like a dance. I feel like most guys, including myself go through it, so I’ll take the advice and just answer honestly. I have no problem telling her when her ugly friends that she thinks are pretty are ugly so I should have no problem when they actually are pretty.

[–]Rian_StoneMod / Red Beret0 points1 point  (17 children) | Copy

Walk me through the consequences of being 100% honest with your answer.

Yes, the AM/AA responses deflect this and have her think you're socially adept, but think about why you feel the need to do so

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (16 children) | Copy

Really I just don’t want any fights. Those are the negative consequences I see. The positive consequences are her no longer shit testing me or at least thinking twice because she knows I’ll have no chill in me.

[–]Rian_StoneMod / Red Beret1 point2 points  (4 children) | Copy

Really I just don’t want any fights

Women are conflict averse because they lose fights everytim. Are you a woman? Do you lose fistfights against 130lb people who watch the view?

The positive consequences are her no longer shit testing me or at least thinking twice because she knows I’ll have no chill in me.

Read this again, realize this is fucked up. This is you, being a manipulating nice guy, and a bad one at that. Why are you expecting anything at all out of her? Did you miss the part on covert contracts? At least make it overt so you can eventually bullshit yourself into thinking you'll enforce athis boundary

Hey babe, I'll make you a deal. I'll tell you that you're more attractive than her, and make it believable, because lets face it, you're not. You wouldn't have asked if you didn't agree with me. So I'll do that, and then you can stop nagging me from time to time, and lie to me, and tell me I'm chill and aloof. Deal?

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy

I didn’t think about it like that. In light of that, perhaps my mindset should be to just not lie. I’ll say the truth or whatever I want at the time and if she doesn’t like it I won’t care. I can’t expect her to stop asking those questions because women are painfully insecure and nothing will stop her from comparing herself to other woman.

[–]Rian_StoneMod / Red Beret1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy

you can do that, you can pressure flip (do you really want an answer to that?)


the point I'm making is understanging the underlying principle behind it

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

Could you clarify understaffing the underlying principle?

[–]Rian_StoneMod / Red Beret1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy

read the previous comment

[–]ellifino1 point2 points  (10 children) | Copy

Read up on conflict avoidance. You'll realize you will purposefully avoid fights, while she would like to start them. You've drained her of all the feelz in the relationship by avoiding conflict and "hitting the ball into the net" like someone else said. That's boring as fuck, and she needs some excitement. I'm a conflict avoider, so I am understanding this still.

She needs the feelz and mild drama. If you don't give it to her, she will create it herself with arguments. She may get mildly pissed by your answer, but the mild bitchiness is not the enemy. That's your friend. The enemy is being so damn boring that she blows up for no reason, then you DEER the shit out of it, and your relationship is 1 step forward, 3 steps back.

Understanding you are BP and moving slightly to RP, you AA this, in a manner to where it catches her off guard, she gives you "the look", then you smack her ass, grin, and STFU.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (9 children) | Copy

I understand the point now. You can’t not have fights because women need to feel something.

[–]PersaeusRed Beret0 points1 point  (8 children) | Copy

This and if you demonstrate your afraid of a little girl , what kinda odds is she giving you to protect her and her brood when the warlord comes into the village.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (7 children) | Copy

Thankfully she doesn't have any doubt in my willingness or capability to protect her. I've done muy thai and lifted on and off for years and I always have a gun on me so that's not really an issue. I've always strayed away from saying, "Oh yeah she's pretty etc" because I just didn't want to hurt her feelings. What I didn't realize is that by not trying to hurt her feelings it hurt me because it reflected that I have weaknesses. I did it with good intentions and I think a few guys in here get it but that's not the point. It's going to be a tough thing to internalize but I'll get it in time.

[–]PersaeusRed Beret0 points1 point  (6 children) | Copy

She’s way tougher than you give her credit for, and I think RZD comment about some cultures playing on mock jealousy may be pertinent

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (5 children) | Copy

I'm not sure how she would have learned that because she didn't start dating until she left Brazil and went to Canada. I don't know Canadian culture nor do I know who her influencers were. I know she can be very tough at times but lately she's been very submissive. I've been unknowingly strumming the right notes for the past month and part of what brings me here is that I would like to keep this melody going.

[–]PersaeusRed Beret0 points1 point  (4 children) | Copy

You can take girl out of the hood , but you can’t take the hood out of the girl

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy

Haha, well she didn't grow up in the slums so I can confidently say that doesn't apply to her.

[–]rocknrollchuck0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

"Yeah, she's sexy! Do you think she'd give me her number if I asked?"

[–]broneilbro0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy

When I was in my frame years ago my wife asked me what I thought about so and so. Girl was cute and I went up and struck up a convo and got her number...walked back and she was shocked I did it...

Years later, I'm a recovering BEta bitch.

[–]PersaeusRed Beret0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy

I’m always amazed how far we can fall

You can kill a man, but you can't kill an idea.

© TheRedArchive 2021. All rights reserved.

created by /u/dream-hunter