What do conflict and arguments look like with a HVM versus a LVM?

circescircus · 2020-07-29T20:04:27+00:00

A HVM won't pretend you're stupid or that he is stupid. In a LV relationship, women often pretend to be dumb/make themselves small because they fear rocking the boat. Men take advantage of women who pretend to be obtuse, by pretending to be obtuse themselves (to the woman's detriment). And then if there are strong feelings on top of that, it makes the intellectual and moral dishonesty almost impossible to address and correct at some point. Because if the whole relationship was built on a lie, no conflict resolution strategy can resolve that. Even marital therapy can't.

In a HV relationship, I've learned that arguments still happen, but they're very infrequent. When they do happen, it feels unpleasant but you don't do low blows, or try to "win", or make a single argument into a zero sum game. There is this self-awareness in both partners, commitment to reality, honest communication and respect for each other, that makes conflict resolution much much easier. In a HV relationship, people don't pretend like they don't know what they are doing and they don't pretend to be dumb.

It's never a total cake walk having any kind of relationship with any person, but you really shouldn't be arguing or fighting a lot. When you do, it's because of stress or some kind of problem, you both might be tired or have intense emotions. There isn't resentment, bitterness, or a love/hate dynamic.

RedzerBoop · 2020-07-29T21:23:14+00:00

Lvm - Name calling. Stone walling. Silent treatment. Storms out. Denies. Lies. Gaslights. "You're over sensitive", "you're making a big deal out of nothing".

Hvm - no idea. Never had one.

thepastamancer · 2020-07-29T21:47:30+00:00

My current partner, who I hold in very high regard, listens to me when I have a problem with his behavior. It's an extremely rare occurrence. But when it does happen he doesnt try to argue or prove me wrong, he listens to understand and empathize and then makes a short, sincere apology. And then, and this is the key, I see a change in the behavior. Doesnt have to be an instantaneous 100% change, just a clear and reasonable attempt that improves with time and doesn't come with a bunch of excuses. Always, what I want and need are treated as important. That doesn't mean that I'm given everything I want instantaneously, just that I'm taken seriously and treated with respect. I have always felt respected and valued by my partner.

ChristianGirl93 · 2020-07-29T19:32:08+00:00

Okay: engagement, timeliness and time spent is key. LVM: doesn’t say what is wrong, acts cold towards me, turns family against me, and stops talking to me because he is upset. 5 days later brings it up out of nowhere- still doesn’t address the issue and breaks up because it’s something he is going through and can’t live up to what I want from him (basic connection) and later find out that it may have just been him checking my phone because I said a coworker was cute when I wanted to set said guy up with my best friend in my text to her.

Timeliness: fair Time spent: enormous Engagement: zero Communication: atrocious

HVM: I’m clearly upset that he is acting weird towards the waitress, being nice but somewhat concerned. He keeps things cool and dismisses it. We get in the car. He tells me first thing, when you were in the restroom, they kept being shady; we were the only 3 couples here. It took them forever to get a refill and they kept asking where you were and it got me annoyed. Me, yeah but you still shouldn’t let it bother you, they may have been having a rough day and your tone could have been better. I’m sorry, I’m just exhausted and I was hoping you were okay and didn’t get sick or something. No, it’s fine, let’s go get better pizza when we make it back to the apartment. Changes radio station.

Timeliness: accurate and appropriate Time spent: 5 min max Engagement: 100 Communication: 100

onlyamelia · 2020-07-29T19:48:01+00:00

In my experience everything escalates with a LVM. There is no conversation, even when it feels like there is some dialogue it’s dismissive.

subtlecuttlefish · 2020-07-30T00:01:45+00:00

LVM-ex:

Avoidance of issues. He would see discussions, conflict, problems etc as a bad thing. That in itself becomes a problem, because you need to be able to communicate effectively. As a result, I was the only one who brought things up, and whenever I did feel that we needed to talk about finances or housework or relationship stuff he would frame it as me always having problems because I wanted to talk about it.
Tone policing - "It's The Way You Brought It Up". I always brought things up in The Wrong Way. He would then get distant and upset for hours, and would also mean we didn't talk about the original thing. So I'd get more frustrated and the original issue still existed. He would never come back to this issue, so I'd have to bring it up again, now with additional frustration. This led to endless circular arguments.

(Just to clarify!! During heated arguments I do not raise my voice, I do not call people names, or threaten to leave and I would never, ever use, threaten or imply physical violence. I just get visibly impatient and annoyed. The most I can say is that The Wrong Way was critical overtones, which is something I've addressed)

Passive aggressiveness. He'd agree to something and then tell me he wasn't comfortable with it after all, saying he'd only agreed because he didn't want to upset me. Bruh. It would not have upset me to hear your actual feelings and opinions. I'm upset now that you just went along with it??
Poor emotional boundaries. He couldn't tolerate me feeling upset, sad, frustrated or disappointed (hence the passive aggressiveness, avoidance and tone policing).
Proposed solutions were an infringement of his freedom and would never work. Every practical solution I suggested got either rejected or passive-aggressively implemented under protest.
Nothing ever changed.
As a result...we argued a lot over the same issues because things never, ever got resolved. There was a constant feeling of underlying resentment from him which I now realize was because I was expecting him to act like a mature adult which he saw as controlling smh.

HVM I'm currently seeing:

We have a really calm discussion where the point is to understand and clarify the issue.
If either of us needs to take a break to calm down or just think stuff over they can do that with the other person's full support and understanding. Then we can check back in with the other person later.
A real willingness to discuss - if he notices an issue he proactively talks to me about it. If something didn't get completely resolved, he follows it up. Previously I was the only one actively doing these things.
Viewing problem solving as a good thing. He's happy to talk about stuff! It is a good thing - the problem is then solved and you can both get back to enjoying yourselves!
Each person takes responsibility for their own shit. Although he cares about my feelings, it doesn't derail him if I disagree with him. We can both be our own independent selves in an argument and nobody feels threatened.
Good emotional boundaries. He is extremely clear and direct about what he can and can't do.
Actual. Lasting. Changes. It's beautiful. We discuss something and come to a new understanding? He consistently acts on it, of his own accord.
As a result... conflict is infrequent (because things get resolved) and no big deal.

Personality plays its part in what it looks like as well. The guy I'm seeing now is pretty calm and logically minded. He's also a bit more reserved with feelings so doesn't lead with that (although he is very sensitive to my feelings and does have a lot going on behind a stoic exterior). I have a lot of HVW/HVM friends. One tends towards being more anxious so needs more reassurance and doesn't always approach things in the most rational way. One is initially resistant to any kind of criticism so needs a bit of gentleness to get past the defensiveness. We all come from different backgrounds, and so your approach might need to be modified slightly. But the uniting factor with all of them is that discussions are always productive and respectful no matter how their character manifests.

It's also worth, as an HVW, taking a good honest look at yourself and making sure your conflict resolution skills are not doing anything to contribute to unhelpful dynamics. I had a few exes tell me I could be quite critical when I raised issues - when I reflected I realized that was a pattern for me (it was how my family did it) so that's something I've worked on a lot with positive results :)

watchyourspeed · 2020-07-29T19:31:45+00:00

It's like night and day. HVM approach issues with their partners with empathy and the goal of resolving the conflict in a way that will facilitate the relationship moving forward. HVM are willing to take responsibility even if they might have an explanation for their actions (mental health, work stress, etc). The key difference I've noticed with my HVM boyfriends (lucky enough to have had two, including my current partner) v. LVM boyfriends (too many to count) is that we can still connect even during the conflict. Current boyfriend approaches every issue with love and concern for my well-being, even when I might not approach it the same way at first (I am a pretty high strung woman and have a lot of work stress which sometimes leads to me being snappy and avoiding addressing problems...working on it!). He clearly hates to see me upset or stressed in any way and just wants to talk it through so we can fix whatever is coming between us. HVM communicate effectively and listen to you when you talk rather than just waiting for you to stop talking so they can have their turn.

Eat_Pant_b0ss · 2020-07-29T21:54:39+00:00

Well for starters, with a HVM conflicts don't even feel like conflicts. You might disagree or run into an issue but there aren't "fights" the way you experience them with LVM. This is why I hate the phrase "every couple has fights" because it lead me to believe what I was experiencing was normal and it is NOT. Healthy couples do not have "fights" hardly ever, if at all. There's no yelling from anyone, no insults, no one crossing your boundaries, no disrespect at all. A HVM may disagree with you but he will NEVER be aggressive or demeaning. Not only will he never even raise his voice at you, but he will not do any "level headed bullying" where LVM stay "calm" in order to give the illusion that they're reasonable, and suggest that the fact that you're being driven to shouting and tears with their casual insults and unfeeling disrespect means you're the one who is crazy and overreacting. A HVM loves you through a problem, he doesn't need manipulation or cruelty to force you into submission because submission is not his goal. A LVM bullies you through it.

blissandblossom · 2020-07-29T20:05:52+00:00

LVM = Narcissistic abuse

Icchy24 · 2020-07-30T05:00:11+00:00

My ex - whenever I used to bring up something he did that upset me, he would take it as an attack and turn it around. Or sometimes hit me with the "BUT IT WASN'T MY INTENT"

My current - when i bring up something he did that upset me, he would apologize, and a MEANINGFUL apology, not just a "my bad". An argument is a discussion instead of whos right and whos wrong. Literally just today we had a disagreement and he knew i was upset, and he made sure to tell me that he's not insulting my intelligence, listened to my points very carefully, and acknowledges im right when i am. It wasn't a me vs him.

Struggleis4real · 2020-07-29T22:19:36+00:00

Conflict resolution is beneficial in many scenarios. HV people actively listen, respect, and resolve issues with collected reasoning. Compassion and empathy make a huge difference in these conversations.

The biggest takeaway I’ve noticed in my relationships is the mindset of “teamwork” to resolve and move forward with a shared objective, and not “I must win, therefore I must put you down to get ahead” thinking.

MitsumiKatoSato · 2020-07-29T19:51:21+00:00

A HVM will be understanding during disagreements. He won’t exacerbate an already tense situation or get carried away by his emotions because he knows that this type of behaviour won’t solve the issue at hand.

The types of conflicts and disagreements that you might have with a HVM are also very different than with a LVM. When you’re in a relationship with a LVM, you’ll find that your arguments revolve around fundamental relationship needs (such as respect, honesty, loyaulty). In contrast, disagreements with a HVM will be more trivial and won’t put a long-term strain on the relationship (for example, a stressful situation caused by forgetting to pack a certain item on vacation or a disagreement involving where to eat).

StarSweeper86 · 2020-07-29T20:49:01+00:00

I just want to echo blissandblossom's comment about LVM = narcissistic abuse.

The LVM I was seeing up until recently would always pull these narcissistic tactics whenever I would bring up an issue. These are just a few of the things:

I was told I was too pushy/demanding when I brought up the issue of him not spending enough time with me.
He gaslighted me, and pretended to not know what I was talking about. Or he would start making excuses/bringing up his own problems in an attempt to distract me from the issue in hopes of derailing the discussion.
Silent treatment - I used to write long paragraphs to him and he would either not respond, or reply with "Idk what to say to all that". This eventually led to me finally blocking him.
He never apologized for anything that he did to upset me. Instead he would say things like "I'm sorry that you got upset by what I did", implying that it was my fault for getting upset and not his fault for the actions he did that made me upset in the first place.
He could not stand to be wrong. It was never his fault, but rather I was in the wrong for looking at things from a different perspective than his.

I was lucky enough to date a HVM before him, so noticing these red flags was was a lot easier. With my HVM, arguments never even seemed like arguments. We were a team working together to solve an issue so that both of us felt better. It was very effortless by comparison to the LVM, and I felt like my feelings mattered. He was able to express empathy and concern. We never yelled or shouted. We just worked together to reach a solution.

We also had a pact to never go to bed angry with each other, meaning that we would make sure to resolve things so that neither one of us would lay there for hours losing sleep over being hurt or upset.

watchyourspeed · 2020-07-29T19:33:55+00:00

Steelmanning vs. strawmanning!

raiu86 · 2020-07-30T00:36:06+00:00

May I suggest you read something by John Gottman. He has written many books about healthy conflict within relationships.

Title	What do conflict and arguments look like with a HVM versus a LVM?
Author	mierduh
Upvotes	37
Comments	34
Date	July 29, 2020 3:53 PM UTC (5 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/FemaleDatingStrategy
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/FemaleDatingStrategy/comments/i03102/what_do_conflict_and_arguments_look_like_with_a/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/FemaleDatingStrategy/what-do-conflict-and-arguments-look-like-with-a.719299 https://theredarchive.com/post/719299

Comments