"Yeah I know men are more likely to be a victim of homicide... because of other men." Any good rebuttals for this?

DavidByron2 · 2021-06-13T16:00:38+00:00

It's hate speech.

The idea that a victim doesn't "count" if "their own people did it" is the language of war and hate. Normal people would see that the emotional suffering and physical pain of a victim doesn't depend and certainly isn't cancelled out by the sex of their assailant and to suggest so is irrational. But to the hate monger all of the hated class of people are the same individual somehow. They all share guilt for the same imagined crimes. Like Jews all having to pay for "killing the Chirst" or the way feminists say if men in the past hurt women then men in the present must pay for it.

Only hate filled people think this way.

An example of women hurting women is FGM. Usually little girls are forced into it by their mothers and aunts. Ask the person if they think FGM is no big deal because it's only females doing it to other females.

bluehonoluluballs · 2021-06-13T19:28:41+00:00

It’s because women aren’t as physically capable of violence as men are. It’s not because they are morally superior or anything. The highest rates of domestic violence is lesbian couple’s.

Bojack35 · 2021-06-13T16:04:24+00:00

Just common sense. It doesn't matter what the identity of the perpetrator is a victim is still a victim. Only idiots who view all identities as monolithic and seek to blame all of one group for some of their actions think otherwise. Like saying a woman raped by a woman doesnt matter or a black man killed by a black man doesn't matter.

Assuming it's a feminist trying to say how all mens problem are mens fault. I have never heard a proper response to me pointing out that the majority of child abuse is committed by women yet nobody would think a female victim of child abuse isn't an issue because of her gender. Or that we should hold all women accountable for a minority of them committing a certain crime.

Ody_ssey · 2021-06-13T16:20:54+00:00

"So you agree your fear is paranoia because men are attacking men?"

Men-Are-Human · 2021-06-13T21:39:39+00:00

Nod and say "just like with black people". Watch the backpedaling.

MuchBigNice · 2021-06-13T21:18:21+00:00

It’s direct victim blaming. Simple as that.

Just because the person who murdered me shares some feature with myself, I do not feel any better or less impacted by being murdered.

It’s like if a woman were raped at a festival by someone who was also at that festival, and someone responded with “Whelp why should I care, you were both at the festival, it’s obviously your fault this happened”. Except even slightly more ridiculous, because well, I didn’t choose to be a man.

LateralThinker13 · 2021-06-13T15:54:22+00:00

Men aren't killing anyone. Criminals are killing.

babno · 2021-06-13T22:01:47+00:00

Women are more likely to be slut shamed or harassed by women. Therefor not an issue right?

2021-06-13T17:14:40+00:00

Id most probably reply with something like,

"defending crime eh? I bet everyone loves you for your flawless moral compass"

Hour-Mission7829 · 2021-06-14T01:20:33+00:00

That argument feminists use is a logical fallacy called red herring.

SokalDidNothingWrong · 2021-06-14T03:07:52+00:00

Men who commit violent crimes are FAR more likely to target men than women.

Women who commit violent crimes are more likely to target men than women.

It's quite correct to say that male violence (against men mostly, but also against women) is a huge issue, but that the feminist analysis is extremely narrow and reductionist, and anyone capable of understanding multiple factors would be very leery of giving it too much weight.

Reddit1984Censorship · 2021-06-13T15:56:18+00:00

I dont think thats an argument that needs rebuttal is is just how it is.
It can easily be argude it is because men are left out by society, single motherhood and so on.

NathanTheDreamer · 2021-06-13T18:40:27+00:00

I know this is an unpopular opinion but doesn't that basically confirms that men are at a disadvantage in society? Excluding crimes like tax frauds and such, the main reason for crime is poverty. Like, you wouldn't rob, steal and kill if you came from a wealthy background most of the times.

Of course I'm not saying only poor people are criminals, but a majority of violent crimes are committed by people in some kind of difficult situation. So yeah, if more men commit violent crimes maybe it's because they find themselves in the shitter more often?

tthrrowaawayy · 2021-06-13T19:40:33+00:00

Ask her if she thinks this issue shouldn’t be acknowledged more because it’s male on male crime ? Then ask why she’s assuming what you’ve experienced, what if a woman has made you feel unsafe or harassed you before? Even if you personally haven’t experienced that it’s still a point to bring up. It shows just how dismissive she’s being about the topic.

andejoh · 2021-06-13T20:34:04+00:00

It that society is misandric and undervalues male lives. Men are more likely to kill men. That's true. Women are also more likely to kill men than they are another woman. That is also true.

Greg_W_Allan · 2021-06-13T22:50:54+00:00

The majority of the victims of violence committed by males are boys and men AND the majority of the victims of violence committed by females are boys and men.

Metraxis · 2021-06-14T00:37:04+00:00

Does that make them any less dead? No? Then it's irrelevant.

AssistantT0TheSensei · 2021-06-14T01:05:41+00:00

The best way to look at it is to ask the lady if she believes all humans are equally deserving of safety, compassion, etc. If she answers anything but yes, she's unreasonable and not worth arguing with.

After establishing that all humans are deserving of compassion, point out that violent crime is committed by the most aggressive humans, most of whom are men, some being women. Make the distinction be between aggressive and reasonable humans, rather than men and women, because that's the actual case. Men aren't more likely to be offenders; men are more likely to be aggressive, and aggressive people are more likely to be offenders. The measurement of a person should be their personality, not their genitals.

yadoya · 2021-06-14T10:51:05+00:00

Most female neonaticides are committed by women, so that's OK.

CyclopeWarrior · 2021-06-13T20:31:27+00:00

That's just because you try to take them on in an area where men excel at. We are great at physical violence and when in need will resort to it. If you want to talk back to people who say that you need to bring up the situations that women excel at as the culprits.

LateralThinker13 · 2021-06-14T05:45:20+00:00

Do a substitution. Replace men with blacks. Or Palestinians. Or lesbians. Whatever she values. Use a substitute group to get through her bigotry. Or just block and walk away.

mhandanna · 2021-06-15T11:16:01+00:00

Feminsits are all about the victim, and not victim blaming..... unless it is a male victim of violence etc

Akai455 · 2021-06-13T20:05:22+00:00

Men are given less support both financial and psychological. They have less government policies to help them. They are discriminated against in jobs and school. Ect, etc. You can keep going on.

Destitution fosters crime. They are using the same logic of the alt right. "Black people are 13% of the population but cause over 50% of crime, therefore black people are criminals" is the stance of the alt right. But we know that's not true. And it's because of the disproprtionate destitution experienced by blacks that causes the disproportionate crime rate.

However dont expect anyone to listen long enough to get through a nuanced explanation of the crime difference. Just remember that these people are as fascist as the alt right. But call us the fascists.

MartyMc1888 · 2021-06-14T10:14:32+00:00

I tried using the following reasoning when having the same discussion with my partner. A lot of violent men are nurtured by single mothers who made terrible choices not just for herself, but for her kid. Therefore, the man's behaviour can be put down to a woman not doing her job. That was rebuttaled with, but the man left the woman and child so it's the man's fault, still.

There is no rebuttal that won't be counterpointed by some other excuse for how it's all our fault. Save yourself the headache.

CrazedKnightCK · 2021-06-19T00:06:22+00:00

It's just toxic as fuck to say this ... It does not cancel the fact that mostly men are targeted ...

pruplehoneybee226 · 2021-06-13T23:10:41+00:00

men are the ones killing, and kidnapping people. very rare is it a women.

azazelcrowley · 2021-06-14T16:34:07+00:00

Are they suggesting men are inherently inferior to women, or are they simply ignoring that environment plays a role?

The stat that men are most of the victims of crime demonstrates that the environment is hostile to men. That it is perpetrated by men isn't relevant to that, it's merely the mechanism.

For instance, suppose we set up a situation where any woman who assaulted another woman were given 5000 dollars.

Is this "Womens fault", or the fault of those who designed this situation?

Title	"Yeah I know men are more likely to be a victim of homicide... because of other men." Any good rebuttals for this?
Author	DragoonurHD
Upvotes	62
Comments	39
Date	June 13, 2021 3:52 PM UTC (5 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/nyz9ko/yeah_i_know_men_are_more_likely_to_be_a_victim_of/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/yeah-i-know-men-are-more-likely-to-be-a-victim-of.826330 https://theredarchive.com/post/826330

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