What does crying actually do for men?

matrixislife · 2022-12-12T12:12:11+00:00

When feminists regularly show up with mugs etc saying "male tears" it shows how much they don't value men being open in an emotional sense. Despite the hilarious alternative meaning to the phrase.

Men being emotional is a sop to the concept of toxic masculinity: "if you were more emotional women wouldn't get harmed so much" yet the usual consequence to a man being emotional in a relationship is the end of said relationship. So it's a non-starter for fixing problems, it's a scam.

The only real option to fixing men's issues is as you say, to take up a political approach to it. Which is absolutely not what other political groups want us to do. Tough.

Another great post, cheers :)

webernicke · 2022-12-12T15:06:28+00:00

I'm batting around this idea that most advice men get re "Toxic Masculinity" is simply window dressing on the ultimate, primordial and unbreakable rule #0 of Toxic Masculinity: "Men can never be weak."

Because a lot of the ways that feminists ask men to challenge toxic masculinity can be done without negative (or maybe even with positive consequences) as is seen with the benefits of crying in this slideshow.

That is, assuming that you do it without also appearing to be weak.

Men can emote more (as long as they don't appear weak.)
Men can get in touch with femininity (as long as they don't appear weak.)
Men can be vulnerable with their female partners (as long as they don't appear weak.)
Men can be Nice Guys and gentleman (as long as they don't appear weak.)
Men can be house husbands, "kept men" or engage in other gender role reversals (as long as they don't appear weak.)

I think that a lot of the debate around Toxic Masculinity is undergirded by this dynamic -- that men are recognizing on some level that none of these superficial challenges to toxic masculinity really absolves them of the ultimate rule of toxic masculinity, and that the women and feminists calling for these performances either don't realize or don't "count" that ultimate rule as problematic.

I've heard attempts at deflection of this before from women in the form of something like, "Well nobody likes weak women either!" Maybe, but men get uniquely and unilaterally punished for daring to appear truly helpless.

And I think it's reflected in the points about how male tears don't actually fix anything. Women and feminists want men to challenge their Toxic Masculinity in what appears to be a self-serving desire for men to make themselves more relatable to women. But God forbid that men are actually signaling that they are in a non-life threatening (and sometimes, even then) position where they might need real help (i.e. they need to be rescued, not that they need to be handed a tool while they fix the problem themselves.) This, especially if women are implied to be the ones to have to swoop in, is verboten and a source of visceral disgust.

Receiving help is the birthright of women, apparently.

griii2 · 2022-12-12T11:04:41+00:00

I've seen this great word - emotionsplaining.

Like when Trevor Noah explained that men suffering from the lack of intimacy should hug their male friends. https://www.reddit.com/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates/comments/y8nszt/men_intimacy_the_right_to_sex_between_the_scenes/

Final_Philosopher663 · 2022-12-12T12:53:06+00:00

Very nice post!
And one thing, if women really valued our tears so much , believe me we would be crying all the time. Not blaming women for being who they are as I am not blaming men for trying to "man up" and not cry or let the emotions overcome you.

Blauwpetje · 2022-12-13T20:32:34+00:00

Increased sex appeal?????

TheLWMA · 2022-12-12T21:01:50+00:00

It would be great if men weren’t told that they’re doing “emotional labor”.

Moist-Quiet-647 · 2022-12-14T10:20:23+00:00

The point of crying is to broadcast distress and incite help. Male losers quickly learn that nobody cares about them so they don't cry.

I'm in that case. It's not that I don't want to cry, it is that I can't cry anymore. I've literally lost the ability to cry because there's no point.

Boys don't cry not because they shouldn't, but because it is useless.

CoffeeWorldly9915 · 2022-12-13T02:46:31+00:00

I theorize that the "feel better" chemicals that get released from crying aren't much useful in the torrent of testosterone (perhaps oxytocine related), so men developed a less active reflex and only cry in rather extreme situations.

(Also google "why men cry less", reading keywords are "testosterone" and "prolactin".)

My theory is that hormones that are known to be released while crying (like oxytocin) have a dampened "uplifting effect" against testosterone, whose production especially decreases whenever oxytocin production increases according to available studies, and that is known to be an important mood regulator for men. My theory is that the male body has learned to check for the following optimization: "will the increased oxytocin production's uplift effect be able to offset the discomfort caused by the subsequent testosterone decrease in this emotional context?" And the resulting answer depends entirely on how much bad one feels, such that an initial range of sadness (say 0-70) will yield a negative balance, but a secondary range (say 70-100) will yield a positive balance and a resulting crying impulse.

TheTinMenBlog · 2022-12-12T10:28:19+00:00

Advocacy for tears and men’s talk is a wonderful thing.

As it is through such candid conversations that many people can learn who they are.

And it is by showing such vulnerably that relationships can be strengthened, or new bridges of understanding built.

Talking helps us understand ourselves; what we’re feeling, what what we want, and who we are. It is not something to be afraid of.

But so too, we should not view this talk and these tears as the complete solution to what men and boys are experiencing, or a miracle cure to their distress.

As whilst they can be good for emotional healing, they do nothing to heal the social, political, economic, legal or structural problems that may shape a man’s distress.

It won’t save the homeless men on the streets. It won’t stop others from dying young.

It won’t build the refuges, reopen the youth clubs, or form the committees we desperately need.

It won’t give fathers equal rights, men’s health equal funding, or survivors equal shelter.It won’t end knife crime.

It won’t stop the wars. It won’t keep our boys in school.

Tears are good. But they are not a full solution. They are just a means of dealing with the problem.

So what do we do to keep pushing the discussion?To ask for more, to widen perspectives, and to tell the world – tears are not enough…

~

Images by Patrick Utersee, Daniel Since, M Mathews, Camila Carvalho, Frank McKenna from Unsplash.

Source:

Fathers4Justice

Domestic Abuse

Domestic Abuse Refuge

The Guardian, Boys in Education

Adventurous-Hawk-235 · 2022-12-30T22:44:54+00:00

"It's not that I have a problem with men showing emotions, I just don't find it attractive, dignified, or worthy of respect."

Senator_Pie · 2022-12-13T01:30:31+00:00

I'm curious about that stat in slide 7 referencing how much refuge is for men. It seems a bit misleading because there's a lot of refuge open to both genders.

I'm assuming that number is for male-only refuge and that number for female-only refuge is much higher. How necessary are these male-only refuges? I've no doubt that they're beneficial. I just don't know how beneficial they are.

Title	What does crying actually do for men?
Author	TheTinMenBlog
Upvotes	206
Comments	23
Date	December 12, 2022 10:28 AM UTC (3 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates/comments/zjv2n1/what_does_crying_actually_do_for_men/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates/what-does-crying-actually-do-for-men.1144171 https://theredarchive.com/post/1144171

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