Nursing mom - zero libido

whinemoreplease · 2015-06-26T18:16:48+00:00

The one thing you don't comment on is whether you feel her concerns are valid or not. That's really important and I can't decide for you whether her concerns are valid or not.

If my wife said

she has told me that she doesn't know what is going on but she feels like she has ZERO libido.

and

she thinks that if she had more rest from the kids and housework and she was more caught up

and I believed she wasn't trying to bullshit me, then it's a sign that there's a problem somewhere that she isn't able to handle on her own.

The whole entire sex thing would be out of the window because there are issues that I (as a leader/man/captain/whatever) need to take care of. For the most part, I expect my wife to be able to handle her own things, but sometimes it sucks and I need to step in -- be the heavy hitter. Real life and shit. I know that I won't be happy if she's feeling shitty because she won't be able to put 100% effort into making me happy. Again, this is only if I believe she's being honest (which I do for the most part, but sometimes it's just complaining).

If she's going out of her way to bullshit me, I've done something which has fucked up her respect for me -- not acceptable anyway, but again, something I need to take care of. This goes back to the mantra of, am I a man worthy of respect? If I'm being bullshitted, obviously something has changed. (I have also been wrong about whether I was being bs'ed or not -- wisdom is the accumulation of past failures).

With that said, it sounds to me like there's something underlying that your wife can't take care of on her own that you need to step up for. But me, I'm a problem solver - I don't like simple problems. I expect my wife to take care of her simple problems. But the big ones that she can't handle solo, yeah, I'm going to step in and take care of it. And after that, lets get back to the good stuff. Blow jobs are much better when people are enthusiastic.

angels_fan · 2015-06-26T16:45:32+00:00

I don't think men can ever comprehend the demands a new mother has, especially with other small children.

Coupled with the hormones going haywire and post pregnancy body, you can't game a new mother the same as you would normally. New moms have different rules.

From what it sounds like, she isn't being a shrew and she's really trying to keep you happy. As a good captain, learn to recognize when your FO is overwhelmed and try not to add to that.

If she is too overwhelmed for sex, try and figure out how you can offload some of her burden.

RPAlternate42 · 2015-06-26T19:11:38+00:00

Preamble

I'm going to say some things that deviate from typical RP talking points. This dread for nursing mothers and dread for pregnant women issue is a grey area and rife with debate in MRP. The reason is that TRP doesn't really have a standard way of dealing with this situation; plates aren't usually nursing babies or pregnant... and TRPers aren't typically married.

The Facts

Nursing mothers generate a great deal of oxytocin towards the baby when they breast feed. Nature designed child-mother pair bonding this way: she looks down and sees baby while the oxytocin surges from the nursing, baby looks up and sees mommy while the dopamine surges from being fed.

In this way, babies have a tendency to replace the father in terms of (attraction.) She literally may be completely invested in baby and it's out of her control. Her front brain can get her hamster spinning in your favor by telling herself that she should be having sex with you and desiring you (YMMV on how strong your frame is) but her monkey brain will always win... and it is telling her to feed baby, make food for baby and feed baby.

The monkey brain doesn't yell very often, but when it does, it wins.

The Cost of Survival

We can't sit in here and debate things like AWALT and evolutionary drive and bio-social sexual strategy and then decide to arbitrarily disregard the two things all sexual strategy is designed for:

Making babies
Protecting babies

With this in mind, you need to realize that we are designed to have 1 baby at most once every 9 months (more or less.) Since her entire biological system is designed around making, supporting, and protecting a baby, her body is going to actively fight any attempts to bring in another baby before the one she has is guaranteed to live. Nature has designed a survival fail-safe in mothers to prevent an over-extension of resources.

Mammals typically have at least 1 less-offspring per litter than they have nipples. This guarantees at least a backup.* Twins are statistical noise.... triplets more so.

A human woman could whelp out some Irish twins and be fine from a baby-feeding standpoint, but it's not ideal and the biology wants to prevent that as much as possible.

You Won the Game!

You made all these changes to get your wife to desire you, to haves sex with you to want to fuck you and to fix the marriage. Mission accomplished. She has now rewarded you with the winning prize in the world's genetic game: your genes get to be passed on. You succeeded in accomplishing natural selection through sexual fitness.

The long and the short of it is your sexual landscape is going to be a little under-watered while she is nursing.

Comfort, Compliance, and Dread

I personally believe that there is some leeway you must give up in order to guarantee success of your offspring. Nursing is taxing and the timing makes for poor sexual output even if she relents. I think that nursing is the time for comfort (beta traits.) You are not just the Alpha... you are the Oak. Oaks are big, strong, protective and provide resources to aid in shelter, food, and fuel and they weather storms despite their stiff natures... this is why we use this term.

While she isn't showing her sexual desire for you... I can guarantee its there. Making babies means sex and she is holding the physical manifestation of your sex in her arms.

This doesn't mean that you stop doing what you've been doing... in fact this is the time all the RP training can shine. You will still be sexually forward; you will still initiate sex with your wife, and if she turns you down, you will still have an abundance mentality and outcome independence and you will still not settle for Starfish sex (you are apparently a little run down... I'm going to go do (X).

Remember, Dread is what she makes. If you are trying to make dread in her, you are validating through her and you are playing the game incorrectly.

Summary

You can still be the sexually driven Alpha male you are trying to be, but you also have be her Oak.

As with all things, treat the situation within your frame of happiness and be on the lookout for situations like this leading to a backslide into her previous behavior where she may segue the nursing into a dried-up sexual desert.

this does not mean she is doing anything wrong, it means she is filling the container you are providing her.

^{^*Farm} ^{^pigs} ^{^are} ^{^interesting} ^{^because} ^{^they} ^{^can} ^{^range} ^{^from} ^{^6-16} ^{^nipples.} ^{^Farmers} ^{^actually} ^{^selectively} ^{^breed} ^{^pigs} ^{^to} ^{^have} ^{^more} ^{^nipples} ^{^because} ^{^those} ^{^pigs} ^{^are} ^{^better} ^{^suited} ^{^to} ^{^carry} ^{^larger} ^{^litters,} ^{^increasing} ^{^pork} ^{^production.} ^{^In} ^{^the} ^{^wild,} ^{^under} ^{^natural} ^{^stresses,} ^{^nipple} ^{^count} ^{^averages} ^{^6,} ^{^fetal} ^{^count} ^{^averages} ^{^6,} ^{^but} ^{^neo-natal} ^{^count} ^{^averages} ^⁵ ^{^or} ^¹ ^{^less} ^{^than} ^{^nipple} ^{^count} ^{^and} ^{^juvenile} ^{^survivals} ^{^average} ^³ ^{^or} ^{^50%} ^{^of} ^{^the} ^{^fetal} ^{^count.} ^{^Because} ^{^pigs} ^{^lack} ^{^the} ^{^frontal} ^{^brain} ^{^we} ^{^have,} ^{^they} ^{^succumb} ^{^to} ^{^their} ^{^wild} ^{^desires} ^{^all} ^{^the} ^{^time} ^{^which} ^{^means} ^{^a} ^{^sow} ^{^may} ^{^have} ^² ^{^litters} ^{^a} ^{^year.} ^{^A} ^{^stressful} ^{^sexual} ^{^situation} ^{^leads} ^{^to} ^{^a} ^{^diminished} ^{^number} ^{^of} ^{^surviving} ^{^offspring} ^{^due} ^{^to} ^{^the} ^{^lack} ^{^of} ^{^resources.}

brick_howse · 2015-06-27T13:22:10+00:00

Breastfeeding mother here. Maybe I could chime in with my experience/perspective to see if it might help... My husband could have written this post not too long ago. It's a shit place to be.

Definitely rule out (abnormal) medical causes. Breastfeeding decreases libido, especially if the menstrual cycle has not returned. But, it doesn't necessarily make it non-existent. In our case, I had postpartum thyroiditis (which causes low energy, weight gain, AND low libido, amongst other things). Postpartum depression and/or anxiety is also a concern... either or both can start any time in the first year postpartum (her expressing that she feels overwhelmed is a red-flag). Barring actual medical issues, she may just need more help (either from you, from family, or from other moms) and time for herself (going to the gym, taking a shit alone, etc).

In any case, it can be really hard for a postpartum woman to see the forest for the trees... many just assume it's "normal" to feel awful (due to lack of sleep and incessant demands) and try to power through because there are little people depending on her. She may need some help/prodding to get the self care she needs to be an effective spouse and mother.

For me, pressure to have sex shuts me down. It didn't used to be this way, but it is now (maybe it's a hormonal thing too?). My husband played his cards well here. Once my medical issues started resolving, he basically took sex off the table while simultaneously driving me mad. Example: he would grab me by the back of the neck or pin me against the wall and kiss the shit out of me at a time when sex was not an option (while making the kids' breakfast or on our way out the door, etc). And then he'd walk away and carry on like NOTHING HAPPENED. Repeat for several days with no mention of sex. Killed two birds with one stone; took off all the pressure and made me feel sexy as hell. I know there's probably a name for what he did, but I don't really care... it worked like a charm.

TrainingTheBrain · 2015-06-26T16:36:23+00:00

Go dark on a woman who has a brand new baby? What the fuck dude why be a dickhead?

From what I see she's insecure with post baby body, her hormones are fucked up from the breastfeeding, and her husband is being a child who wants mom's attention.

Do you, take care of shit around the house without the covert contract of being rewarded with sex for it. Take care of the baby and other kids when you can. That will turn her on and when you carry her to bed just so she can sleep, she'll see that you aren't constantly nipping at her for sex like a small dog.

Edit If I walked in on my wife just sitting there when I asked her to wear something sexy, and she says I couldn't find anything I felt comfortable in I'd tell her You're right, I'm not comfortable in this either and then I'd take my shirt off then hers, until we were both naked and under the blankets.

Just take slow actions, own your shit, and understand that MRP evolves with the situation. She's fucked up from pregnancy and needs you to be the oak who takes it and fixes it. Lead her to the woman she was pre 'dead libido', spark the flame that produces the fire of tingles.

thegr8b8m8 · 2015-06-29T00:33:24+00:00

Hormones are what drives your sex drive. Ever saw a dog with his balls gone? I'm just saying that this could be something that is legitimate to do with hormones and outside of redpill philosophy.

thisisme0007 · 2015-06-26T17:17:08+00:00

You didn't say how old the baby is.

I read someone say that lingerie is her gift to you and you should not buy it for her. I wonder if telling her to put on something sexy is similarly the wrong thing to do.

JonnyJaded · 2015-06-26T17:56:48+00:00

My wife was LL while she was BFing and didn't get her period back for 8 months. I LOVED her gigantic BFing tits (34 B to 34 DD) and didn't know what to do with myself. I was a dog without a bone. It sucked. I was pre RP and made the same mistake you did (telling her to get slutted up, etc) she never did. I got butthurt. Rinse/repeat. Now I know that I should have handled it differently. Covert contacts are a very real possibility in this stage. I would concentrate on being a better Dad, and in doing so remove SOME affection (unless its a comfort test). Her household chores are still on her but remember that you must adjust with the times. PD is definatly a possibility so monitor for that. Good luck.

RPcoyote · 2015-06-26T22:29:19+00:00

It also depends on where you were prior to birth. If you had a strong frame and got her to do the things you want with regularity and to follow your lead to the bedroom as often as you needed/wanted to (say 3-4x /week or more) - then you may have a better shot at getting some level of sex during early nursing period. If on the other had you just unplugged while she was puking still in her 2nd trimester, and had been a drunk captain for many years, sex was at a low quality trickle (that's me ...) 1-2/ month, then you have to be a lot of more careful with the right approach and patiently generate interest - as per comment by /u/brick_howse

iloveairplane · 2015-06-26T22:41:58+00:00

Thanks for the responses.

First off - I am one of the best "beta" caretaker/providers out there, that is how I got into this marital rut in the first place. However - I never concerned myself with covert contracts from the beginning - I've always been upfront about my sexuality and nearly "nexted" my wife in the past because she was turning me down. I have read NMMNG, MMSL, and other books as well as read the entire side bar and SGM and I've been a member of multiple forums related to Redpill. I lift, I practice awesomeness, I have good frame and good OI, I pay the bills, I go out with the guys, I have women actively IOI me in front of my wife and she has felt the need to tell me about a few women she wants me to stay away from....said they had an eye for me.

I don't feel I am being a dickhead or an alpha asshole. I feel I know how to turn up the beta when necessary and reward good behavior from her.

I do feel that she is being sincere with me and while I won't do choreplay (been there done that - she doesn't swoon over me doing chores) I can tell that she is overwhelmed. But I also thought she was being sincere years ago when she was drip feeding me sex and telling me that maybe it was because I wasn't doing enough this and that. (BS)

Based on feedback - I'm going to stay engaged emotionally, back off the sexual initiation, get her some help (i.e. hired nanny help - not me) and add some teasing where she can't get me sexually. I'll check in with her and manage the situation over the next week, then I'll get back to you guys.

sjmdcnm · 2015-06-27T20:34:32+00:00

Our first child is now 5 months and my wife is breastfeeding exclusively and has not had her period. In her words she feels dead inside in regards to sex. I tell her that even though she feels that way mentally that her body responds appropriately (self lubrication). She even encourages hard/deep sex though body language (pulling me towards with thrusts and obvious increased enjoyment). I don't think she is even aware that she is responding in this way. It is also very difficult for her to cum. Either oral or manual stimulation doesn't quit get it there in a timely manner and we break out the Hitachi Magic Wand. Even then its considerably more difficult than before pregnancy. She is reaching orgasm sooner as time goes by but it still longer than prior to pregnancy. I offered to make it quick and and just take care of my needs and she said that was ok. I can finish in minutes if she doesn't want hers. We did that one night then she wanted the same another night. When I was done I asked if she wanted hers and she couldn't make up her mind so I said that's a yes and took care of her. We are back on the road to normalcy but it is a wild ride. She had a mini melt down over the dishwasher today. The dishwasher tab didn't get dispensed and was left behind at the end of the wash and she felt the dishes were not clean. Since the baby's stuff was part of the load she felt overwhelmed. After 10 minutes of insanity and discussing the logical resolution she apologized and all is well. After pregnancy she has had several of these mini melt downs but it always end in her apologizing for her behavior. I could write forever but we are going out tonight so I will leave what I have written for now.

Sorry for the wall of text.

BluepillProfessor · 2015-06-26T20:23:05+00:00

she thinks that if she had more rest from the kids and housework and she was more caught up - that she might be more up for sex

I seriously doubt it. Sounds like she is demanding Choreplay to me.

when I asked her to get up to bed with something sexy on she began to feel pressure and anxiety about sex and she doesn't want that.

Can anybody else hear the hamster wheel squeeking?

Should I consider that she is trying to be honest with me

No doubt she is trying but she has no more clue about what actually turns her on than you do, apparently.

Listen up bro! You are making this into a project and putting pressure on your wife that is absolutely not necessary. Sex God Method explains this better or (for a reasonably priced option that is about 1/8 as good try a female written book called "Just Fuck Me!"). Sometimes women just want you to fuck them hard and fast and get on with your day.

So no you should not ignore her after a nice heartfelt (BETA!) session like this. You did it, not her and it wasn't all bad, comfort, nursing mom and all.

Ignoring her would be a covert contract. Make your covert contracts overt! Set a limit, a hard boundary for sexy time and then do it. When it is time I would manhandle her, get in, get out, and leave her dripping. That is the time to take care of the choreplay. Not before.

If she turns you down at the hard (pun intended) boundary that is when you withdraw your time and attention. Not capriciously but because you honestly don't have time for a sex denying screechtard.

If she wants a more complete sexual experience she will have to be a bit more into it next time.

But what are you doing that is Alpha? What mountains are you climbing and what battles are you winning? Do you lift?

Finally, read up on Last Minute Resistance (LMR). That is what this was and there are ways to plow through it.

TLDR: Just fuck her and stop talking about it.

exbp · 2015-06-26T17:23:23+00:00

Breastfeeding is genuinely a time of low-libido for women because nature is saying not to get knocked-up right now, many even have no period while they are feeding. So I'd be understanding if she's off her normal game and tired.

However, when you say

I tell her to go upstairs and get something sexy on and she doesn't and says she wanted me to hear that she is just exhausted and not interested in sex - she thinks that if she had more rest from the kids and housework

Then this is starting to sound very much like hamster-thinking: "Gosh if I just had Chad doing the dishes more I'm sure I'd be horny as hell for him." We all have fallen into this BS trap. The nicest version of it I can think of is "You are not enough to overcome my tiredness and mixed-up hormones". So you have to decide if that's mostly short-term circumstances you have to wait out, or a long-term problem in her desire for you. If she suddenly got a call for a Girls Night Out would her energy magically reappear? If Brad Pitt was grinding her on the dance floor right now would she be sopping wet? If either answer is yes then its on you.

Title	Nursing mom - zero libido
Author	iloveairplane
Upvotes	5
Comments	40
Date	June 26, 2015 4:25 PM UTC (11 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MarriedRedPill
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/marriedredpill/comments/3b7icp/nursing_mom_zero_libido/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MarriedRedPill/nursing-mom-zero-libido.201614 https://theredarchive.com/post/201614

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